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KillaWhale
03-21-2005, 02:57 PM
Have you guys ever seen or heard of this on Isuzus? I know you can convert Ford, Chevy, and Dodge diesels over to grease/veggie oil. I was just wandering if you can covert commerical styles over to. With gas prices continuely going up, it would be nice to have someone pay to have me work filled up.

Grassmechanic
03-21-2005, 04:09 PM
Rudolph Diesel invented the engine that bears his name in 1892. He used vegetable oil in it back then.

KillaWhale
03-21-2005, 04:47 PM
I understand that, but I guess my question is; Is there a kit to convert it over? I know diesels will burn just anything flammable, but like on the Fords and such, you have a tank, pump, etc to make it run correctly.

NelsonLandworks
03-21-2005, 07:34 PM
veggy oil is this cold, basicly unburnable. Those kits have heaters with them (along with pumps and what not) to make it burn. But to be honest, a diesel is a diesel, if you can run a dodge, chevy or ford on veggy oil you can run an isuzu on it.

Do you know of any websites for the ford/chevy/dodge kits?

The Dude
03-21-2005, 08:24 PM
Do a google search

here is one. http://www.dieselveg.com/

NelsonLandworks
03-21-2005, 09:02 PM
from a UK comany, it's odd to see a kit that fits so many fords ;)

bob
03-21-2005, 09:23 PM
The exhaust smells like french fries! - no really it does

The Dude
03-21-2005, 09:26 PM
or fish or chicken. Depends on what the oil was used for :)

xcopterdoc
03-22-2005, 07:21 AM
http://www.biodieselnow.com/
try this site... I'm sure there is a million more.

NelsonLandworks
03-22-2005, 09:07 AM
my next truck will deffinetly be diesel

I'm not giving any more money to the towel heads over seas :waving:

KillaWhale
03-22-2005, 04:40 PM
Thanks everyone for their input and I have found good info. It looks to me that you could buy and mount everything yourself for around 800-1000 bucks and get paid to fuel up your truck. Now just have to find a good deal on a truck.

Soupy
03-22-2005, 05:13 PM
Thanks everyone for their input and I have found good info. It looks to me that you could buy and mount everything yourself for around 800-1000 bucks and get paid to fuel up your truck. Now just have to find a good deal on a truck.

How are you going to get paid to fill up your truck? I was under the impression that restaurants sell their old grease. Also I think you will need to process it somehow before using it. This will cost money as well.

I would think if it was worth it then trucking companies would be doing it. They are the ones that fuel prices effect most and in return effects everyone because most everything has to be delivered at some point.

Markf
03-22-2005, 05:28 PM
my next truck will deffinetly be diesel

I'm not giving any more money to the towel heads over seas :waving:

Nelson,
I not sure where you think the diesel comes from? I thought it was from the same guys who pump the crude and refine it into various petroleum products, diesel being one of them.

The Dude
03-23-2005, 05:46 AM
How are you going to get paid to fill up your truck? I was under the impression that restaurants sell their old grease. Also I think you will need to process it somehow before using it. This will cost money as well.

I would think if it was worth it then trucking companies would be doing it. They are the ones that fuel prices effect most and in return effects everyone because most everything has to be delivered at some point.

Actually resturants have to pay to have it removed. But there is a cleaning process involved to get all of the food particles out of it. Using veg oil is only worth it if you can get it for free.

NelsonLandworks
03-23-2005, 09:11 AM
Nelson,
I not sure where you think the diesel comes from? I thought it was from the same guys who pump the crude and refine it into various petroleum products, diesel being one of them.


Oil comes from over seas in barrels (obviously). Then it gets refined to different octain gas, and diesel.

Banks was on Trucks! the other day and and was talking about biodeisel and thats how he described it.

wriken
03-23-2005, 09:29 AM
whats the price comparison of say B20 bio vs #1or #2 diesel fuel? thanks

MudslinginFX4
03-23-2005, 10:03 AM
I'd rather pay the higher price then have to worry about cleaning the vegetable oil. While picking it up and taking it to get cleaned I could be working and making more money then the fuel cost. Also, in my Ford Owners Manual it states that anything used in the gas tank other then desiel will void the engine warranty!! It's a $7000 engine, thats a lot of fuel!

Smalltimer1
03-23-2005, 10:26 AM
I'd rather pay the higher price then have to worry about cleaning the vegetable oil. While picking it up and taking it to get cleaned I could be working and making more money then the fuel cost. Also, in my Ford Owners Manual it states that anything used in the gas tank other then desiel will void the engine warranty!! It's a $7000 engine, thats a lot of fuel!

It was my understanding that Biodiesel wouldn't void the engine warranty. ;)

MudslinginFX4
03-23-2005, 12:00 PM
It was my understanding that Biodiesel wouldn't void the engine warranty. ;)


Is bio diesel different then vegetable oil? I don't really know much about this topic because I simply go to the gas station and fill up my truck and leave. I will grab my owners manual later and post what it says, maybe I was thinking running gas in the diesel engine will void the warranty, lol. :dizzy:

hosejockey2002
03-23-2005, 12:11 PM
Is bio diesel different then vegetable oil?

Yes, it is. Pouring used vegetable oil into your fuel tank would be almost like trying to run your truck on used motor oil. Biodiesel is refined from either used or virgin vegetable oil (usually soybean) and is refined specifically for use as diesel fuel.

Smalltimer1
03-23-2005, 12:15 PM
Biodiesel is different from straight veg. oil. Biodiesel is currently a blend of conventional diesel fuel that is mixed with a veg. oil type substance to create the specific blends (B1, B2, B5, B10, B20, etc.). From the research that I've done, it is recommended starting off with a low grade blend such as B2 or B5 and working your way up so it conditions your fuel system and reduces the chance of stopping up an injector or filter.

Since you're here in Raleigh, you should drop by Weaver labs here at NCSU and check out the research going on with Biodiesel. Those guys can give you a better definite answer than I can.

There is a biodiesel station at the BP off Roxboro Rd. in Durham. They have B20 right now. Don't know the price yet though.

NelsonLandworks
03-23-2005, 12:15 PM
Is bio diesel different then vegetable oil? I don't really know much about this topic because I simply go to the gas station and fill up my truck and leave. I will grab my owners manual later and post what it says, maybe I was thinking running gas in the diesel engine will void the warranty, lol. :dizzy:

Haha, i'm sure that'd do it too.

Who said you have to use used veggy oil? Just call up Sysco and oder some of thier 10 gallon "buckets", I bet it's less then diesel (when you break it down per gallon obviously)

It's worth looking into thats for sure.

On a Spike TV show "5th Gear" (euopean car show) they had a segment about cars being switched to Biodeisel. there's already Biodiesel stations in Europe!!

I don' tknow what they sell it for per gallon because it wasn't in US currency. I hope we make the move soon! Sounds like a cheaper, better alternative then drilling in alaska

NelsonLandworks
03-23-2005, 12:17 PM
Biodiesel is different from straight veg. oil. Biodiesel is currently a blend of conventional diesel fuel that is mixed with a veg. oil type substance to create the specific blends (B1, B2, B5, B10, B20, etc.). From the research that I've done, it is recommended starting off with a low grade blend such as B2 or B5 and working your way up so it conditions your fuel system and reduces the chance of stopping up an injector or filter.


Thanks for the good info. So if your running B50 in your truck...is that kinda like high test fuel? :blob3:

Grassmechanic
03-23-2005, 02:56 PM
I don' tknow what they sell it for per gallon because it wasn't in US currency. I hope we make the move soon! Sounds like a cheaper, better alternative then drilling in alaska

Bio diesel, gasahol, and other grain/plant based fuels will never become a low cost, long term answer to crude oil. Why? There simply is not enough available land to grow the necessary crops on. If all available crop land was put into production for biofuels, it wouldn't even put a dent in the U.S. consumption.

Smalltimer1
03-23-2005, 03:24 PM
Bio diesel, gasahol, and other grain/plant based fuels will never become a low cost, long term answer to crude oil. Why? There simply is not enough available land to grow the necessary crops on. If all available crop land was put into production for biofuels, it wouldn't even put a dent in the U.S. consumption.


Another myth to bust.

With today's biotechnological advances, it IS possible to keep up with demand using new methods of production. That is what is being researched here at NC State University. Don't count your chicks before they hatch.

One of my friends has built a mini biodiesel production device for his senior design project--it works, and the end product is being used in University equipment.

Grassmechanic
03-23-2005, 03:55 PM
Well then, bust it. just don't shoot off your mouth, back it with some facts.

NelsonLandworks
03-23-2005, 03:59 PM
If all available crop land was put into production for biofuels, it wouldn't even put a dent in the U.S. consumption.

Not only that, we'd force the fast food industries to charge 11 dollars for a medium french fry!

Smalltimer1
03-23-2005, 07:41 PM
Well then, bust it. just don't shoot off your mouth, back it with some facts.


You're the one with the loose lips......

Here's some info:

http://www.google.com/search?q=biodiesel&as_sitesearch=ncsu.edu&Search=Google+Search

Most of it is about the fleet going to BD but some of it talks about the research, I don't have time to debate it now, got to get to the shop...... :dizzy:

AEW
03-23-2005, 11:21 PM
I'm not giving any more money to the towel heads over seas :waving:


towel heads....


Is that against the rules here?

NelsonLandworks
03-24-2005, 07:47 AM
towel heads....


Is that against the rules here?


If it isn't it probably should be. I"ll change it, sorry about that if it offended anyone

edit: I wasn't able to edit the post, normally i just click "edit" which is right next to "quote" but it's not there. any ideas?

Grassmechanic
03-24-2005, 08:10 AM
You're the one with the loose lips......

Here's some info:

http://www.google.com/search?q=biodiesel&as_sitesearch=ncsu.edu&Search=Google+Search

Most of it is about the fleet going to BD but some of it talks about the research, I don't have time to debate it now, got to get to the shop...... :dizzy:

See?? This is exactly what I'm talking about. There is NO MENTION of any of the BS research that you spew. I want the exact study, I'm not going through 100 webpages looking for it. You better have more than that!

Eclipse
03-24-2005, 06:26 PM
FWIW - I have read in several different sources that there is not enough farmable land in the us to meet the US demand of diesel fuel. This is not to say we could not put a dent in foreign oil consumption, but we could not provide our own supply if we farmed every acre available.

Unless they figure out a way to grow more bushels/acre, which they have been doing for years, I don't how how we can change this.

I have an article laying around with some fact/figures that would put this into perspective. I will see if I can dig it up.

Smalltimer1
03-24-2005, 07:00 PM
See?? This is exactly what I'm talking about. There is NO MENTION of any of the BS research that you spew. I want the exact study, I'm not going through 100 webpages looking for it. You better have more than that!

Obviously you lack the motivation to search for it. I have other things to be doing, I gave you a resource, why don't you use it? Give a man a fish, he eats for a day, teach a man to fish he eats for a lifetime.

I have names, numbers, and email addresses of people who are doing the research, but at their request, they do not want their names floating around the net. I'll email them next week and set up a conference with you so you will hear what you want, not that it would help your level of understanding.

I take it that you'd agree to participate?

KillaWhale
03-24-2005, 07:38 PM
Hey Guys, I did not mean to start a riot. I was looking at the cost of diesel to what it would cost to go through this process. I believe that you could get paid to fill up you tank. If you were to collect from higher restaurants or ones that use canola oil to cook with because it has a lower gel point. Therefore most the large particles would have sunk down and you drain over half the tank or more. I would also have an on board filtering system similar to the one described at www.greasecar.com (http://). I think in the long run you could make enough to cover some the maintenance costs for your equipment. Thanks everyone for there input.

Smalltimer1
03-25-2005, 12:26 AM
Hey Guys, I did not mean to start a riot. I was looking at the cost of diesel to what it would cost to go through this process. I believe that you could get paid to fill up you tank. If you were to collect from higher restaurants or ones that use canola oil to cook with because it has a lower gel point. Therefore most the large particles would have sunk down and you drain over half the tank or more. I would also have an on board filtering system similar to the one described at www.greasecar.com (http://). I think in the long run you could make enough to cover some the maintenance costs for your equipment. Thanks everyone for there input.

That is exactly what they are working on at NCSU. They are trying to develop a device small enough to put used veg. oil in and purify it, blend it with diesel, and end up with biodiesel, and be able to fit in a garage, where you can do it yourself at minimal cost. They are currently working the bugs out of it. It looks like a rat's nest of 5 gallon tanks and hoses, but once the procedure and measurements are right, they will work on the aesthetics.

hosejockey2002
03-25-2005, 01:41 AM
Speaking of starting a riot, I just noticed your forum name, Killawhale. If you did kill a whale and boil him up for oil, just think of how much fuel you could produce for your truck. Wouldn't that make the environmentalists scream, boiling whales to make diesel fuel.... :laugh: :laugh: :laugh:

Grassmechanic
03-25-2005, 10:00 AM
Obviously you lack the motivation to search for it. I have other things to be doing, I gave you a resource, why don't you use it? Give a man a fish, he eats for a day, teach a man to fish he eats for a lifetime.

I have names, numbers, and email addresses of people who are doing the research, but at their request, they do not want their names floating around the net. I'll email them next week and set up a conference with you so you will hear what you want, not that it would help your level of understanding.

I take it that you'd agree to participate?
Motivation??? I don't have time to go through over 100 webpages of BS to find something that is not there. Your damn right I'll participate, but I'm going to do a background check to verify their credibility.

Grassmechanic
03-25-2005, 10:15 AM
from LS member BackAcre Farm:

total oil comsumption in the US (per day) - 18.5 million barrels
total oil imported (per day) - 11 million barrels

gallons of ethanol to replace 1 barrel of oil - 23.8

total gallons of ethanol needed to replace all oil used in 1 day - 440.3 million gallons

total gallons of ethanol needed to replace all imported oil used in 1 day - 261.8 million gallons

total acres of corn required to replace all oil used (140 bu/ac) - 64,283,800,000

total acres of corn to replace all imported oil (140 bu/ac) - 38,222,800,000

USDA estimate of total acreage planted for corn in 2004 - 79,000,000

Entire US acreage for corn used to make ethanol would replace .2% of imported oil.

Not exactly putting any major dent in consumption now is it?

Smalltimer1
03-25-2005, 01:38 PM
from LS member BackAcre Farm:

total oil comsumption in the US (per day) - 18.5 million barrels
total oil imported (per day) - 11 million barrels

gallons of ethanol to replace 1 barrel of oil - 23.8

total gallons of ethanol needed to replace all oil used in 1 day - 440.3 million gallons

total gallons of ethanol needed to replace all imported oil used in 1 day - 261.8 million gallons

total acres of corn required to replace all oil used (140 bu/ac) - 64,283,800,000

total acres of corn to replace all imported oil (140 bu/ac) - 38,222,800,000

USDA estimate of total acreage planted for corn in 2004 - 79,000,000

Entire US acreage for corn used to make ethanol would replace .2% of imported oil.

Not exactly putting any major dent in consumption now is it?

Biodiesel is not made from just corn, it's also made from soybeans, peanuts, and other oil producing crops.

Smalltimer1
03-25-2005, 01:53 PM
Motivation??? I don't have time to go through over 100 webpages of BS to find something that is not there. Your damn right I'll participate, but I'm going to do a background check to verify their credibility.

It is there, you're not the one spending $15,000/yr. to go to school to learn this material. I'm in the place to know, because I see it everyday. I'm just a freshman right now, but in 4 years (Engineering is a 5 yr. program) I'll probably be doing something similar to what this group is doing. The group I'm referring to in particular consists of seniors working on their senior design project (basically their final exam) and it is overseen by Ph. D.'s and other credible personnel. They are currently working the bugs out of the system, but I have seen it work with my own 2 eyes. The bugs are in the filtration and purification, but the overall production aspects are done. Your credentials, please?

Eclipse
03-25-2005, 10:50 PM
They are trying to develop a device small enough to put used veg. oil in and purify it, blend it with diesel, and end up with biodiesel, and be able to fit in a garage, where you can do it yourself at minimal cost. They are currently working the bugs out of it. It looks like a rat's nest of 5 gallon tanks and hoses, but once the procedure and measurements are right, they will work on the aesthetics.

If they are designing a product to bring to market they are wasting their time. Unless they come up with something that is really affordable.

There are already aesthetically pleasing, compact products on the market today for the home based production of biodiesel. The problem is they are a bit spendy.

The 30 gallon unit is 2ft tall and 28 inches wide, makes 10-12 gallons of Biodiesel per batch, and cost is $1700
http://www.biodieselgear.com/images/Front1.jpg


http://www.biodieselgear.com/equipment/index.htm

Eclipse
03-25-2005, 11:07 PM
Sorry for the double post.

Eclipse
03-25-2005, 11:24 PM
The maximum time of 10 minutes to edit a post is frustrating :)


Biodiesel is currently a blend of conventional diesel fuel that is mixed with a veg. oil type substance to create the specific blends (B1, B2, B5, B10, B20, etc.).

This is inaccurate. Biodiesel is not made from mixing a "veg. oil substance" with conventional petroleum diesel fuel. You are referring to a biodiesel blend when referring to B1, B2, B5, B10, ect... Biodiesel is the "veg. oil type substance" that you refer to.

I would suggest you research the topic a bit more before posting misinformation.

Grassmechanic
03-26-2005, 10:37 AM
Biodiesel is not made from just corn, it's also made from soybeans, peanuts, and other oil producing crops.

Boy, you do need it spelled out for you, don't you? Here is the facts straight from the USDA website. Total acreage of all corn,wheat, soybeans, barley, sorghum, oats, cotton and rice in the US is 251.8 million acres. It still would not put a dent if all those acres were put into fuel production.

Grassmechanic
03-26-2005, 10:48 AM
It is there, you're not the one spending $15,000/yr. to go to school to learn this material. I'm in the place to know, because I see it everyday. I'm just a freshman right now, but in 4 years (Engineering is a 5 yr. program) I'll probably be doing something similar to what this group is doing. The group I'm referring to in particular consists of seniors working on their senior design project (basically their final exam) and it is overseen by Ph. D.'s and other credible personnel. They are currently working the bugs out of the system, but I have seen it work with my own 2 eyes. The bugs are in the filtration and purification, but the overall production aspects are done. Your credentials, please?
Is that all your paying? I guess the saying "you get what you pay for" is true.
I paid over 15k/yr to go to MSU in the late 70's, early 80's while you were still swimming in the milk river. I graduated with honors with a turf degree and a minor in horticulture. Also, I took 4 years of analytic and organic chemistry in college. I probably have forgotten more than you'll ever know. You have been exposed as a BS'er on this site. You have dug yourself a hole and you would be best served to stop digging. I'll give you the same advice as my dad used to give: use more ear and less lip. My apologies to killawhale for hijacking his thread, but any chance I can get to expose a phony and a liar, I will.

Smalltimer1
03-26-2005, 02:58 PM
The maximum time of 10 minutes to edit a post is frustrating :)




This is inaccurate. Biodiesel is not made from mixing a "veg. oil substance" with conventional petroleum diesel fuel. You are referring to a biodiesel blend when referring to B1, B2, B5, B10, ect... Biodiesel is the "veg. oil type substance" that you refer to.

I would suggest you research the topic a bit more before posting misinformation.

I meant to say blend, was in a hurry when I wrote it. I have written 5 research papers on biodiesel and its blend variations. I know my stuff.

Smalltimer1
03-26-2005, 03:02 PM
Boy, you do need it spelled out for you, don't you? Here is the facts straight from the USDA website. Total acreage of all corn,wheat, soybeans, barley, sorghum, oats, cotton and rice in the US is 251.8 million acres. It still would not put a dent if all those acres were put into fuel production.


BD can be made from used vegetable oil, doesn't have to be out of the field. Between straight crop to pump production and reuse of used veg. oil either in pure form, or in blend form, the production is close to demand. With Canada and Mexico also wanting to jump in on production, it can be done. Also with the new greenhouse technologies, tiered crops can also be raised. Please broaden your research.......

Smalltimer1
03-26-2005, 03:07 PM
Is that all your paying? I guess the saying "you get what you pay for" is true.
I paid over 15k/yr to go to MSU in the late 70's, early 80's while you were still swimming in the milk river. I graduated with honors with a turf degree and a minor in horticulture. Also, I took 4 years of analytic and organic chemistry in college. I probably have forgotten more than you'll ever know. You have been exposed as a BS'er on this site. You have dug yourself a hole and you would be best served to stop digging. I'll give you the same advice as my dad used to give: use more ear and less lip. My apologies to killawhale for hijacking his thread, but any chance I can get to expose a phony and a liar, I will.

You got ripped off bigtime, bet your degree was BS too!

I have backed up my arguments with facts, you choose not to believe them with your BS statistics and bluffer facts. You're the one in the hole. I have led you to water, but I can't make you drink.

I'd love to believe your supposed 'facts' but they are so inaccurate that they are incredible.

Smalltimer1
03-26-2005, 03:08 PM
If they are designing a product to bring to market they are wasting their time. Unless they come up with something that is really affordable.

There are already aesthetically pleasing, compact products on the market today for the home based production of biodiesel. The problem is they are a bit spendy.

The 30 gallon unit is 2ft tall and 28 inches wide, makes 10-12 gallons of Biodiesel per batch, and cost is $1700
http://www.biodieselgear.com/images/Front1.jpg


http://www.biodieselgear.com/equipment/index.htm

I don't think the unit they're making here is for commercial use. It is much smaller, I believe it is a 10 gallon unit. It is for the college to use in research purposes.

Eclipse
03-26-2005, 03:48 PM
I don't think the unit they're making here is for commercial use. It is much smaller, I believe it is a 10 gallon unit. It is for the college to use in research purposes.

This is not what you were alluding to a few post ago. Below is a quote from your original post that I was referencing.

That is exactly what they are working on at NCSU. They are trying to develop a device small enough to put used veg. oil in and purify it, blend it with diesel, and end up with biodiesel, and be able to fit in a garage, where you can do it yourself at minimal cost.

That doesn't sound like college use and research purposes to me?

Eclipse
03-26-2005, 04:02 PM
I meant to say blend, was in a hurry when I wrote it. I have written 5 research papers on biodiesel and its blend variations. I know my stuff.

I agree with the statement about you digging a hole.

This text is taken from a previous post of yours in this thread:

Biodiesel is different from straight veg. oil. Biodiesel is currently a blend of conventional diesel fuel that is mixed with a veg. oil type substance to create the specific blends (B1, B2, B5, B10, B20, etc.).

You clearly state biodiesel is a blend of a "veg. oil type substance" mixed with conventional diesel fuel?


And here you are again saying a purified veggie oil is blended with conventional diesel to make biodiesel.

They are trying to develop a device small enough to put used veg. oil in and purify it, blend it with diesel, and end up with biodiesel,


It doesn't sound to me like you made a mistake for being in a hurry as you referred to biodiesel on two separate occassions as being a blend of a veggie oil substance and conventional diesel. Were you in a hurry during both of the above mentioned posts?

In the future I would suggest you research a topic more before you advertise yourself to be knowledgeable about the subject matter.

TLM
03-27-2005, 07:55 PM
Go to >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>..

http://www.greasecar.com/

http://www.greasel.com/

I'm getting the system soon. More money in my pocket!!

bigz1001
03-27-2005, 09:10 PM
I am new to the concept of biodiesel, and what a great idea, especially the fact that it will work in any blend with dino-diesel. Finally the goverment could quit paying farmers not to grow crops, and we can help our fuel cost/supply situation. Say you are able to produce enough oil to cover 2% of 2 billion gallons, that would be an additional 40mil. gallons of fuel. Every little bit helps.

Grassmechanic
03-28-2005, 07:54 AM
BD can be made from used vegetable oil, doesn't have to be out of the field. Between straight crop to pump production and reuse of used veg. oil either in pure form, or in blend form, the production is close to demand. With Canada and Mexico also wanting to jump in on production, it can be done. Also with the new greenhouse technologies, tiered crops can also be raised. Please broaden your research.......
Oh Jesus, why am I arguing with an idiot?? What are we supposed to do? Quit eating so we can use all this land for making oil??

Grassmechanic
03-28-2005, 07:57 AM
You got ripped off bigtime, bet your degree was BS too!

I have backed up my arguments with facts, you choose not to believe them with your BS statistics and bluffer facts. You're the one in the hole. I have led you to water, but I can't make you drink.

I'd love to believe your supposed 'facts' but they are so inaccurate that they are incredible.

Research the cost of a top tier school.

You haven't backed up D**k! I get my facts from the USDA. I guess they don' t know D**k either! Get a clue. We all have you figured out.

dobehap
03-28-2005, 08:57 AM
The greatest energy source that is still untapped, is the sun.

Also, We need more research and development of better battery systems that could power our trucks and mowers.

Electric motors got all the torque in the world, unfortunately everything short of the plug, lasts about 5 minutes before depleeting.

bigz1001
03-28-2005, 10:20 AM
The greatest energy source that is still untapped, is the sun.

Also, We need more research and development of better battery systems that could power our trucks and mowers.

Electric motors got all the torque in the world, unfortunately everything short of the plug, lasts about 5 minutes before depleeting.

Currently solar energy does more harm to the enviroment than good, unless you are in areas that rarely see a cloudy day.

NelsonLandworks
03-28-2005, 10:19 PM
Currently solar energy does more harm to the enviroment than good, unless you are in areas that rarely see a cloudy day.

what harm does it cause?

bigz1001
03-28-2005, 10:26 PM
what harm does it cause?

Solar cells must remain energized when not in used to function properly. In a state like WV, more energy is used to maintain the cells than they provide. And then also you have to manufacture the things.