Hydroponics anyone

[Ric]

Hydroponics is a growing style that recirculates nutrient rich water to the plants roots. Those nutrients are fertilizer so I guess this Forum might be the right one to post this in.

Anyone into Hydroponics?? My recent interest is for Growing LEGAL plants. Yes most people think of cannabis when the word Hydroponics comes up. Not so in this case.

My main interest is in propagating woody ornamental and growing a finished 3 gallon sell-able plant. The finish plant would be soil grown. However I am researching a better mouse trap for growing plants. I have already done some research and plan to do more. Many of the high tech methods used in hydroponic growing maybe able to be modified for standard soil growing. Certainly additional lighting will increase production. However at the same cost is a factor. Anyone can grow plants, but at a profit margin is the big factor in commercial growing.

Therefore are there any Hydroponic grower here at Lawnsite. I am in the process of reading "Hydroponic Food Production" by Howard Resh PhD. which I am told is the bible of Hydroponics. BTW there is a hydroponic food producer in the next county down from me who sells all his vegetable to local restaurants. However I have not been able to find him as yet.

I am open to ALL Methods of growing and would like some informed feed back.

[jimslawns]

Ric,
did I stir the "Legal" part of this?

I am however reading to gain knowledge, NO I do not partake of any recreational drugs,with the exclusion of an occasional barley and hopps beverage.

jim

[Ric]

Ric,
did I stir the "Legal" part of this?

I am however reading to gain knowledge, NO I do not partake of any recreational drugs,with the exclusion of an occasional barley and hopps beverage.

jim


JIM

I guess you certainly didn't understand my pre-sell above about how I wasn't really interested in juvenile posts about Illegal plants. I even put the word in BOLD TYPE. But there is a jerk in every crowd.

[ArizPestWeed]

Ric
Are you calling people names again ?
You remember what happened last time you did this ?
Are you the message board bully tonite ?

[tjgray]

Nope I think that title goes to me tonight :D

Ric I am glad you started this thread as I would be interested in learning more on this subject and hope that you can get some intelligent responses :)

[JRAZ]

Ric,

I visited a small carribean island country called Anguilla for the last holiday season. While I was there I had an opportunity to have dinner with Dr. Resh and got a personal tour of his greenhouse. It is a truly genius piece of work. The guy has dolphins swimming in his backyard pool at his house there. You can check out his hydro greenhouse here: http://www.cuisinartresort.com/view.php?catID=25&pID=91

I am very interested in setting up my own hydro system but have never had the time or space. Keep us posted on your progress. Dr Resh is a great person to learn from.

JRAZ

[Ric]

JRAZ

Great to get some Intelligent feed back for a change here on LS. I didn't Know Dr Resh was living in the islands or that he had hydroponic product operation at present time. In Fact My quest for knowledge of Hydroponics is but a few weeks old. His Book is a standard text book used by many colleges and used or new versions can be purchased from Amazon.com. Since my initial interests was only curiosity I purchased the $ 9.95 or 1978 used 3th edition. Alot of Technology has happened since then.

I first got interested in Hydroponic a few weeks ago when a member of this forum, posted a question on an other forum of lesser membership and more BS. Doing a Goggle I found Dr Resh to be the leading expert. However I also downloaded the "Cannabis Growers Bible" for free off the dark side of the Internet. Of COURSE I wouldn't say this on the WWW if I had any intentions of growing Cannabis. The CGB was no where as complete of information as Dr Resh book, but was a basic starting point. It at least gave me some hydroponic terminology and a overview that made Dr Resh's book more enjoyable.

THE BUBBLER is the easiest and least expensive way to get started in Hydroponic growing. All you need is a bucket with a lid and a standard fish tank air pump and air stone. Fill the bucket so when the plant roots are placed through the lid, they just touch the top of the water. The air stone below, bubbles splash water on the roots along with the all important Oxygen. Of course a mild concentration of water soluble fertilizer is used in the water. This might be just an over simplifying the process but it is not rocket science at this point. Anyone could try this as a hobby and in fact I am now trying it myself. I did however spend $ 160.00 for a Hanna multi meter to read PMM to get my Solution concentration right.

There are many variation on the bubbler and I heard some say a small child's swimming pool might be place in the ground for heat dissipation and a floating foam tray for the plants might work good.

Now my main interest in all of this is to increasing production of Woody Ornamental at a economic cost factor. so I am not going to be a hydroponic purest. Nor can I be since the end product is soil grown. Like I said before, I am looking for a better mouse trap. I am looking for help in the form of information and ideas.

MODERATOR Please delete the inappropriate post in this thread. It may just be an educational thread.

[Garden Panzer]

I would think the average person on LS would have no clue as to what HYDRO is about....I'm waiting for someone to ask how you get a mower in a hydro tray!!! :sleeping:

They don't deserve the knowledge....let them rot.

:sleeping:

[Ric]

I would think the average person on LS would have no clue as to what HYDRO is about....I'm waiting for someone to ask how you get a mower in a hydro tray!!! :sleeping:

They don't deserve the knowledge....let them rot.

:sleeping:


Panzer

Since you are more than likely the most Hydroponic Knowledgeable person on LS, I am sorry you feel this way.

Since Lawnsite has the most members of any Green Industry forum, I brought my questions here. Not that you have not already given me Great Input. It was your original Question that got me started as you already Know.

[Ric]

Ric,
did I stir the "Legal" part of this?

I am however reading to gain knowledge, NO I do not partake of any recreational drugs,with the exclusion of an occasional barley and hopps beverage.

jim


Jim

I just re read you post and may have gone off on a tanged un justly. All I saw was "LEGAL and Drugs" and got paranoid. I am far from perfect but will stand my mistakes. Please accept my apology.

[genoaustin]

I was always harrassed for being the hydroponic guy at a company I used to work at. When one of my workmates was at a Bible study meeting ( I guess they were talking about the evils of drug use), he had to defend me that I did not grow MaryJane, because he had seen the tomatoes and basil. I was amazed at the amount of Basil you could get from one plant.

One thing to note is that the 2 or 3 part nutrients used in hydroponics is not the same as "miracle-gro" or some other plant food. The Hydro systems supply all the micro-nutrients. The "miracle-gro" will keep it alive for a while, then the plant will give out. Some people choose to mix Miraclegro with epsom salts and calcium chloride. :alien: http://www.hydroponicsonline.com/FAQ.htm#nutrient%20solution I

This is a link for a school-child project making a hydroponic plant reservoir from a 2 liter bottle and feeding it via wick. They are growing a ornamental plant in it.
http://www.hydroponics101.com/sw52597.asp

Here is a system I have made that lets you pump nutrient to 11 plants at once, then drain back to a tank. (This is called the ebb and flow cycle)
http://www.hydroponicsonline.com/11plan01.htm

[Garden Panzer]

Nice links! :waving: That small ebb system would be great fun!
The small resie would be easy to clean out every week... I like the shelf method, uses rain gutter to drain...shelves stack plants high, lights hang, lot's of training- but they grow inward....I'm into trays now- but if I ever had another house built I'd install raingutter in the house to grow my house plants- up by the ceiling...set it to run to waste and use grey water septic...just a pipe dream...
Good to meet another hydro guy!
:waving:

[Ric]

genoaustin

Great input Thanks. I had found one of the website with Goggle however I still have a lot of reading to do. Nutrients are very important and Dr Resh has an excellent section on that in his book. Home or Hobby growing is better off with the retail hydroponic blends, because of the certainty. However commercial growers need to keep costs down and can better afford to mixing their own. Fact is Hydroponic grown plant if set up correctly can not be over watered. However improper Nutrient mix can burn them in a New York Second. Part of my hobby experimenting will be to find that fine line for each of the plants I try growing. Yes TRY GROWING.:D

Now at this point I am thinking about rebuilding my Mist House thanks to Hurricane Charley. I am thinking about the possibilities of incorporating a modified Hydroponic system with a reservoir that recirculates nutrient rich water through the mist heads from above. the Pumps and nutrient costs are not of big concern. However all the plumbing that collects the return water is. Now please remember anyone can grow plants, But can they do it economical enough to make a living. I have grow plant at a profit but would like that better mouse trap like everybody. The truth of the matter is I may can the whole hydroponic idea latter on down the road. But for now I need all the input I can get. Maybe that far out Idea has some merit. The big question is. Can the increase in cost increase production to the point of a better return???

[NattyLawn]

Ric,

Were you planning on growing indoors, outdoors or in a greenhouse? If indoors, were you thinking of using HID lighting?

Geno and Panzer,
What do you think of the taste of the hydro grown basil, veggies, etc, compared to their organically grown counterpart?

[Ric]

Ric,

Were you planning on growing indoors, outdoors or in a greenhouse? If indoors, were you thinking of using HID lighting?

Geno and Panzer,
What do you think of the taste of the hydro grown basil, veggies, etc, compared to their organically grown counterpart?

Natty

I am growing out doors in a 30% shade house or at least did before Charley. Supplemental Lighting is one of the many options I my looking at. However cost being a factor in commercial growing HID are a little too expensive on electrical consummation to consider as viable. I have found Full Spectrum natural sun light 32W Florescent Bulbs that put out 3300 lumen's per 48 inch bulb. These are special order items. Certain Turf Grasses require Orange light while most other plants require violet blue green light. I feel any additional lighting should be as closes to natural as possible since this would only be run for maybe 7 to 8 hours per day in addition to natural sunlight.

Now Water and Electric don't mix. The farther away the bulb, the less lumen's. Therefore I would need to design this structure with adjustable water and lights. Of course the water on the bottom just under the lights. Maybe this could be individual 4 to 8 foot sections that had both water and light and could be raised as the plants grow. Florescent lighting is inexpensive to operate. But if you have acre of lights it could add up.

[Williams Services]

Ric,
I'm a rank amature when it comes to this kind of thing but if I recall correctly, doesn't the Plant Propagation Principles and Techniques (Hartman & Kester) contain some info on hydroponics? Even the recovery systems, for certain irrigations.

[Ric]

Ric,
I'm a rank amature when it comes to this kind of thing but if I recall correctly, doesn't the Plant Propagation Principles and Techniques (Hartman & Kester) contain some info on hydroponics? Even the recovery systems, for certain irrigations.


Williams

Yep your right but I haven touched that book in many years. In fact I can't find it right now. If I remember right there wasn't a whole lot about it other than low volume water usage. However I am losing my mind as the years roll by. About a month ago I re read a paper I wrote about redox potential three years ago. I am still trying to figure out what the guy who wrote it was talking about:D

[genoaustin]

Ric,

Geno and Panzer,
What do you think of the taste of the hydro grown basil, veggies, etc, compared to their organically grown counterpart?

Natty,

We loved the basil. We had so much, though, from the 4 plants I was growing, that at harves time we made a gallon of Pine Nut Pesto, packed it in ice cube trays, and froze it. Then we zip-locked bagged it. For months, we had incredible pasta, fish, whatever. We experimented how it would taste on everything. Pesto Herb Butter on a good steak was cool.

Geno

[NattyLawn]

Thanks for the reply, Geno. I was just wondering because of the water and nutes being directly on the roots. I read and through word of mouth have heard the flavor isn't as good beacuse of this. Did you flush with plain water beforehand?

[NattyLawn]

Thanks for the reply, Geno. I was just wondering because of the water and nutes being directly on the roots. I read and through word of mouth have heard the flavor isn't as good beacuse of this. Did you flush with plain water beforehand?

I meant did you flush before harvesting the basil.... :sleeping:

[genoaustin]

I meant did you flush before harvesting the basil.... :sleeping:


We washed the produce because it was still growing in a real outdoor environment, so dirt, rain, and bugs were an issue. Or do you mean run with water only in the ebb n flow? We did not do that.

We did choose a nutrient mixture that was tailored to green leafies, like lettuce. There are other mixtures for plants that are going to flower, then other mixtures for plants that have set fruit to bulk up the fruit. If we were to grow Basil and Tomatoes in the same mixture, then the compromise may have affected the quality. In fact, my SO just said that she thought our tomatoes didn't have the acidity of store-bought, and lacked something in flavor. So there you go. Tomatoes have 3 distinct growth cycles, and you have to tailor to them pretty hard. Basil was much easier since we only cared about vegetation.

If you really want to get indepth, you can continuously monitor the nutrient mixture, and plot micro-nutrient usage during growth, and replenish as the nutrients are used at the different stages. It should improve the flavor, since the plant puts minimum time into energy gathering, and maximum time into leafing and vegetable production. I am sure that the Mary Jane guys have to go crazy over this aspect, so that the product is as good or better as conventionally grown stuff. :angry:

I used to live in Upstate NY, and I heard many times that "Hothouse" tomatoes from Canada were almost entirely Hydroponic to maximize their investment dollars. If that is the case, then a lot of people are eating hydro tomatoes (in the winter and spring) and don't even know it.

In Texas, it seems like the veggies come from South America.

Geno

[heritage]

JRAZ

Great to get some Intelligent feed back for a change here on LS. I didn't Know Dr Resh was living in the islands or that he had hydroponic product operation at present time. In Fact My quest for knowledge of Hydroponics is but a few weeks old. His Book is a standard text book used by many colleges and used or new versions can be purchased from Amazon.com. Since my initial interests was only curiosity I purchased the $ 9.95 or 1978 used 3th edition. Alot of Technology has happened since then.

I first got interested in Hydroponic a few weeks ago when a member of this forum, posted a question on an other forum of lesser membership and more BS. Doing a Goggle I found Dr Resh to be the leading expert. However I also downloaded the "Cannabis Growers Bible" for free off the dark side of the Internet. Of COURSE I wouldn't say this on the WWW if I had any intentions of growing Cannabis. The CGB was no where as complete of information as Dr Resh book, but was a basic starting point. It at least gave me some hydroponic terminology and a overview that made Dr Resh's book more enjoyable.

THE BUBBLER is the easiest and least expensive way to get started in Hydroponic growing. All you need is a bucket with a lid and a standard fish tank air pump and air stone. Fill the bucket so when the plant roots are placed through the lid, they just touch the top of the water. The air stone below, bubbles splash water on the roots along with the all important Oxygen. Of course a mild concentration of water soluble fertilizer is used in the water. This might be just an over simplifying the process but it is not rocket science at this point. Anyone could try this as a hobby and in fact I am now trying it myself. I did however spend $ 160.00 for a Hanna multi meter to read PMM to get my Solution concentration right.

There are many variation on the bubbler and I heard some say a small child's swimming pool might be place in the ground for heat dissipation and a floating foam tray for the plants might work good.

Now my main interest in all of this is to increasing production of Woody Ornamental at a economic cost factor. so I am not going to be a hydroponic purest. Nor can I be since the end product is soil grown. Like I said before, I am looking for a better mouse trap. I am looking for help in the form of information and ideas.

MODERATOR Please delete the inappropriate post in this thread. It may just be an educational thread.


Hi Ric,
Are you thinking this could be a good way to propigate plants, and avoid a lot of the potential problems associated with soil borne fungi? Can you still use Auxins when rooting the cuttings in Hydroponics? Glad to see you start a post on this topic. Mabey more folks will read about what elements go into a hydroponics solution, and understand that plants need more than just N.P.K.

I like to see people like yourself "Thinking outside the box"

Pete D.

[Ric]

Hi Ric,
Are you thinking this could be a good way to propigate plants, and avoid a lot of the potential problems associated with soil borne fungi? Can you still use Auxins when rooting the cuttings in Hydroponics? Glad to see you start a post on this topic. Mabey more folks will read about what elements go into a hydroponics solution, and understand that plants need more than just N.P.K.

I like to see people like yourself "Thinking outside the box"

Pete D.


Pete

Thanks for the kind words. Most nursery that do cloning will use a sterile medium in their linner trays to limit soil born fungus. Pot soil is general covered with Black tarps for two reasons. First to keep it dry and workable when potting. Second to solarize it and kill bad microbe. Of course you are also bring up one of the main reason we don't want to grow just plants from the same family. A blight could wipe out everything in stead of just a part of your inventory

Certainly growth hormones of all kinds can be used in initial Hydroponic propagation the same as they are used in soil mediums. However from what little experience I have had with Hydroponic propagation the hormones appear to be more of a thick gel.

Now in addition to applying hormones at the beginning of cloning, They are also added to the nutrient rich water in a more liquid form. Now from what I have learned so far, it is the nutrient rich water that makes or breaks a hydroponic production. I have done a quick study of Dr Resh's recommended nutrients to know I can reproduce them at a much low cost than buying them at homeowner retail for a larger scale operation. In fact the nutrient cost I feel would be less in hydroponics when compared with Labor cost added in.

Right now I am like that newbie who asks, "What like of mower should I buy" I am still looking heavy at hardware first. To get a finished product that is soil grown I must start with a soil Medium in my linner trays. or at least some kind of medium that can be stepped up to soil with out shock. How I accomplish this is the BIG question and I wish it was simple. However if we didn't dream outside the Box Technology would never advance.

[genoaustin]

Ric,

I can't recall that Resh book, I had it a long time ago... But does he talk about what issues will occur when you take a 'ponic plant and dirt plant it? I can imagine that there will be some root stress as it adjusts to the "harder to access" nutrient medium. Further, depending on which method of plant support you use, the root-stem connection could be weak, and not able to support the plant in a realistic outdoor environment.

My 1 peso,

Geno

[Ric]

Ric,

I can't recall that Resh book, I had it a long time ago... But does he talk about what issues will occur when you take a 'ponic plant and dirt plant it? I can imagine that there will be some root stress as it adjusts to the "harder to access" nutrient medium. Further, depending on which method of plant support you use, the root-stem connection could be weak, and not able to support the plant in a realistic outdoor environment.

My 1 peso,

Geno

Geno

Su dinero es importante. Mucho Gracias.

If you read some of my formerly stated concerns you will see I really don't know the answer to this and I am asking. At present I am thinking of a soil or soil like medium for linner tray when starting clones and a modified drip system. Now the big difference between this and my former convention set up is the addition of a reservoir and recycled water collection. Supplemental Lighting also may come into play. Florescent full septum bulbs are in expensive to operate. By adding 7 to 8 hours of sunlight it may increase production. However this still must be tested. What I experience it transplant shock is also up for grabs at this point. The trans plants will be only have there total medium moved to a lager pot with additional soil that both drain well and hold field capacity. Now in all plant growth; Light, Temperature, and nutrients are imperative. The medium whether soil or hydroponic style also plays a Big part in production. The question still how will these well watered linner do at first when transplanted to a conventional system.

[Garden Panzer]

Build the raingutter system and use 3 gallon quasi open pots with lava rock...
It's cheap by the truck and you don't even have to "convert" from hydro to soil....
PLUS the clients will like the idea of the lava rock in the garden, leave the conversion to them to deal with....you'll sell them some transplant mix, too.

[jimslawns]

Ric,

No Problem.

Just Humor. :)

[Ric]

Build the raingutter system and use 3 gallon quasi open pots with lava rock...
It's cheap by the truck and you don't even have to "convert" from hydro to soil....
PLUS the clients will like the idea of the lava rock in the garden, leave the conversion to them to deal with....you'll sell them some transplant mix, too.


Panzer

I was on the phone with your Penna. buddy (messinger) when I first read your post. He and I both agree this is a real good idea worth looking into. However Lava rock in Florida is quite expensive at $ 90.00 a yard and would take all the profit. Therefore I would have to go with Limestone @ $18 a yard and which is almost as porous. However a pH factor may come into play. Thanks for the great idea.

Remember any one can grow plants, but can they grow them economically??

[Williams Services]

Ric, I was talking with a friend tonight after church and he's from LA. He said that LSU has a huge hydro facility. What was interesting to me is the way that they were growing them ... the 'maters were growing horizontally, on a fiberglass mesh, with a film of water running down the mesh. 'Maters were huge and easy to get to, from what he said. When I asked him about support, he said they had used screens.

[Garden Panzer]

$90 a yard! ouch.... I would think, IMHO, that w/ limestone one would be LOWERING PH in a hard manner...that PH up/down adds up, too. what about concrete agrigate....or even plain ol' basalt?
you could have a real cool gig, being the yankees respect hort, well some do...and you would sell direct(?) from your farm....you could also stock things like HYDRO Birds Of Par, etc...all in self contained units....wish I could do THAT!!! Dealing with the public would be cool- oh well..lol
you could also put a webcam on your trays, the local paper would write about that, too...I have wanted to do the webcam thing forever, oh well...
payup

[Ric]

$90 a yard! ouch.... I would think, IMHO, that w/ limestone one would be LOWERING PH in a hard manner...that PH up/down adds up, too. what about concrete agrigate....or even plain ol' basalt?
you could have a real cool gig, being the yankees respect hort, well some do...and you would sell direct(?) from your farm....you could also stock things like HYDRO Birds Of Par, etc...all in self contained units....wish I could do THAT!!! Dealing with the public would be cool- oh well..lol
you could also put a webcam on your trays, the local paper would write about that, too...I have wanted to do the webcam thing forever, oh well...
payup

Panzer

Why can't you do it at the local flea market? You got experience and know what you are doing. You could even build small self contained units your self. Life is too short, Do what makes you happy, because no one will do it for you.

Your getting just a little ahead of me right now. I need to learn a lot more before trying to sell hydroponic units. Yes I am thinking about offering some homeowner Hydroponics. I think small window set ups or even patio set up of spices could be a good market or at least marketing leader to bring them in. One time I even thought about doing a Flea market booth with sample plants set up so people could place pre paid orders that would be delivered.

I feel selling units with Plants already growing would be the way to go in a high traffic area. of course more low end priced items at first to get people hooked. Even growing net pods that were in a larger setup that would insert to the new unit still in the box would really help sales. Most people want instant gratification and don't want to wait.

Now about the lava rock or a subtitle at affordable prices I once again need to do more research. But I am getting a lot of good input here with plenty of great Ideas. Mucho Gracia.

Williams

Tell your Friend word for word "That L-S and U be some kind of skool I guarantee. them be a A&M type educathem skool. Them A mean Afarming type Skool. them M mean Machine repair type skool. Them be some kind of them Land Grant Skool hey. Them Women type girl student type female be some kind of most beautimust. oh lordie let be be in tiger town on Saturday night."

I took a several class at LSU. but that was awhile ago. LSU developed horse cloning among other thing. They also have a college of Aquaculture. Located right on the Mississippi River their agriculture land is all Delta Gumbo Mud. Plantation owner have grown sugar cane for well over a hundred years and have never fertilized. Unfortunately I never saw their Hydro set up.

[tjgray]

Tell your Friend word for word "That L-S and U be some kind of skool I guarantee. them be a A&M type educathem skool. Them A mean Afarming type Skool. them M mean Machine repair type skool. Them be some kind of them Land Grant Skool hey. Them Women type girl student type female be some kind of most beautimust. oh lordie let be be in tiger town on Saturday night."

I took a several class at LSU. but that was awhile ago. LSU developed horse cloning among other thing. They also have a college of Aquaculture. Located right on the Mississippi River their agriculture land is all Delta Gumbo Mud. Plantation owner have grown sugar cane for well over a hundred years and have never fertilized. Unfortunately I never saw their Hydro set up.

My sincere apologies for interrupting such an interesting informative thread Ric but your making me homesick :(

Awwww dem bayou nights :)

[genoaustin]

Geno

Su dinero es importante. Mucho Gracias.

If you read some of my formerly stated concerns you will see I really don't know the answer to this and I am asking. At present I am thinking of a soil or soil like medium for linner tray when starting clones and a modified drip system. Now the big difference between this and my former convention set up is the addition of a reservoir and recycled water collection. Supplemental Lighting also may come into play. Florescent full septum bulbs are in expensive to operate. By adding 7 to 8 hours of sunlight it may increase production. However this still must be tested. What I experience it transplant shock is also up for grabs at this point. The trans plants will be only have there total medium moved to a lager pot with additional soil that both drain well and hold field capacity. Now in all plant growth; Light, Temperature, and nutrients are imperative. The medium whether soil or hydroponic style also plays a Big part in production. The question still how will these well watered linner do at first when transplanted to a conventional system.


Hmm, well, I seem to recall that one of the reasons plants die is that their roots "drown" in water. So, if you go the soil route, you would want it to be very...porous, so the water drains out. The Ebb and Flow system pushes this by completely filling the growing container (removing all the air for a short period), then completely draining, therefore sucking fresh air into the rooting area. The roots may stay slightly wet before the cycle repeats, you just want them to be able to get O2 and CO2 along with nutrients.

If you go the crushed stone method, then that isn't a problem. I usually used a mix of Perlite and Vermaculite. One holds water, the other actively drains. Can't remember which.

Also, I recall non-recovering drip systems used with tomatoes so that the plants did not have to search for water or nutrients, but there was no expense in nutrient monitoring and adjustment. The watered down nutrient was slowly dripped onto the rooting media, and the runoff was released in some manner, either directly to the ground or to complimentary plantings.

Some of the sites I looked at recently indicated that 'Ponic water usage can be as low as 10% of the conventional plant method, due to recirculation of the nutrient solution. But you know your commercial application and what automation and such can do for you. Where do you feel your savings are going to concentrate? The automation of the process? Or being quick response to market needs, so able to demand a higher price as first to market with the hot new plant?

Do you think ornamentals are the best choice for Ponic growing? I imagine you have 20-100 different plants you would eventually grow, and each one would require a different system. Or would they all share the common supply and return?

I always loved those NFT systems in the gutter trays. The vertical or horizontal nature of the systems were so cool, so "engineering-ish"
that it made the Tim Taylor in me want to do it.

Geno

[Ric]

Geno

Yes a lot more good questions for me to think about.

My main interest would be in a higher survival rate by creating a healthier starter plant. From there I will grow convectional soil plants. Economy return will be an increased inventory and possible a little faster production time.

Maybe I will only try a part of the Hydroponic system in my propagation. Just researching it this far has given me many good ideas like supplemental lighting.

From a hobby stand point I want try every basic style growing there is. Knowing myself I will need two of each to compare. One to Mess with and the other I follow the rules.

[Garden Panzer]

O2 is key to any grower...be it in the mix or just plain ole air circ...

Any hydro freak I ever met used H2O2 in the mix on a daily basis when topping off....proper and prompt topping will allow one to see PPM's DROP instead of rise, little tip there. H2O2 is CRUCIAL! I also use air curtains, circ pumps, MAGNETS on the intake lines to trays....know why? , and I have air stones in the tray where the intake pumps....I'm all about O2.

Air circulation around your plants is key also, I also do a fairly good insect IPM....my rockwool has black plastic mulch squares over the top, this helps by creating a non fun place to live for little chewy worm type bad guys: IE FUNGI GNATS, etc... plus it allows one to apply products in a foliar manner without wetting the rockwool..... this was a tip I wish I had years ago...lol

The first indicator of trouble in a hydro system will be a LOWERING ph, one's PH SHOULD rise....so daily chores are to be PROMPT....complacency kills...

Also one would want a pump of some sort as resies need to be pumped and scrubbed once a week....I bulk mix my fert in a 1 gallon plastic jug....I run my ppm's @ 1/2 the label rate or so....I like the 800 range I know that 50 gallons at full rate is 1250 PPM so I do the math...I like to run cold as it leaves room for ERROR, higher numbers speed everything up and in the long run it's really not worth it.......( big tip )

Anyway, hydro systems can allow someone in NYC to eat fresh, clean produce....aint life grand?

:waving:

[ProMo]

heres an aticl written by our extension office they have a decent homemade set up

http://www.visitseminole.com/lls/coopext/articles.asp
?articleID=17