Ether In Deisels

[REVPRO]

I Know It Is A Bad Idea To Use Ether In Deisels, I Was Just Wondering Why Some Machines Come With A Factory Set Up Ether Shot System. One Of My Buddys Insist's That Once You Start Using Ether On A Machine It Will Always Want It To Start No Matter The Temp. Just Looking For Some Other Opinions As, I Still Have Trouble Starting My Asv, And Ether Seems To Be My Last Option.

[jd270]

it dosent hurt if the motor was designed for it but you shouldnt use it with glowplugs or heating grids

[SOMM]

for true jd

[REVPRO]

Does It Ruin The Glow Plugs?

[jd270]

the either will explode before compression

[fixer67]

I Know It Is A Bad Idea To Use Ether In Deisels, I Was Just Wondering Why Some Machines Come With A Factory Set Up Ether Shot System. One Of My Buddys Insist's That Once You Start Using Ether On A Machine It Will Always Want It To Start No Matter The Temp. Just Looking For Some Other Opinions As, I Still Have Trouble Starting My Asv, And Ether Seems To Be My Last Option.

You buddy is right. Ether will turn even a brand new engine into a "dope addict" Check the voltage at the glow plugs. A bad connection or bad relay can cause the glow plugs not to heat up right. Most glow plug dash lights work off a time delay and that delay may not be long enough with a bad connection. Try holding the power to the glow plugs a little bit after the light goes out. One or more of the glow plugs may be bad and not heating up right or at all.

[UNISCAPER]

Our company policy is if an engine won't start on it's own (no juice) we down it and find out what is wrong....

[Mowingman]

Yes, as diesel can certainly get addicted to either. Any diesel should crank right up if everything is working properly.
I used to run a fleet of old worn out tractor trailer trucks that were really hard to get started. We used to say if you just wave the can of either in front of the headlights so the truck could see it, and think they were going to get a shot, they would start. You really did not have to spray any in the air intake.
I would use either only in an emergency as a last resort.

[ksss]

Can any explain the mechanics of how a diesel engine gets "addicted" to ether? I have never heard of it, nor do I believe it. I have never owned automobile that ran on gas and have been owning diesels since I was a kid. I have never known a diesel to get addicted to anything. If its cold outside we use ether as needed. I have never had a diesel that refused to start without it. Assuming of course its running right.

[REVPRO]

Fixer 67 Your Right After, A Little Further Investigation The Contact In The Ignition Key Is Getting Bad And Not Allowing Full Voltage To Pass Thru. I Too Would Like To Know How A Desiel Becomes Addicted To Ether. I Have To Beleive My Buddy As He Was A Cummins Mechanic For Along Time.

[Mowingman]

I have no idea how they get addicted to it, but I can tell you from many years of experience that the most certainly do. I believe the old Detriot 6V and 8V diesels were the worst, but Cummins is a close second.
In am pretty sure that part of it has to do with compression getting low in the cylinders.

[bigz1001]

I Know It Is A Bad Idea To Use Ether In Deisels, I Was Just Wondering Why Some Machines Come With A Factory Set Up Ether Shot System. One Of My Buddys Insist's That Once You Start Using Ether On A Machine It Will Always Want It To Start No Matter The Temp. Just Looking For Some Other Opinions As, I Still Have Trouble Starting My Asv, And Ether Seems To Be My Last Option.

I agree with your main question, if ether is so bad, why do several companies offer an ether injection system? We recently purchase a new loader at work, when specking it out our maintenance superintendent specifically said not to allow it, however CAT offers it as an option. We just use air pressure to help get equipment started in the winter. We don't allow ether on the property.

[REVPRO]

What Does The Air Pressure Do? And How Do You Use It?

[bigz1001]

What Does The Air Pressure Do? And How Do You Use It?

They have air starters, use compressed air to turn them.

[jd270]

as long as they are designed for it it is fineour 555g crawler has it and all of our tractors have it ..actually all of the farm equpment we have use eiither injection units on them we have a 4430 with over 11,000 hrs on the motor that has had either used on it all its life ....but you do want to make sure the motor is turning over before you use it

[fixer67]

Fixer 67 Your Right After, A Little Further Investigation The Contact In The Ignition Key Is Getting Bad And Not Allowing Full Voltage To Pass Thru. I Too Would Like To Know How A Diesel Becomes Addicted To Ether. I Have To Believe My Buddy As He Was A Cummings Mechanic For Along Time.

I am glad I could help. I am not really sure how an engine becomes addicted to ether but I have seen it happen first hand on both gasoline and diesel engines. I thank it may scar the cylinder walls or something. I know that ether addiction is a fact but I too would like to know just was the ether does to the engine to cause the addiction

[C&KLawnCare]

They get addicted , Because the ether wipes the oil off the cylinder walls , what little bit is their in start up to begin with , Thus rings wear out . Plus whene ya have nuts that dont know what a whiff is and go spraying , 1/4 a friggen can in the intake , It fires before the piston even hits TDC , I have personly tore down 3 diesels that was adicted to it in 80 degree weather and all the rings fell out in pieces , As a poped the pistons out . It can bend /brake con rods , Blow headgaskets, Break cranks, Rember a diesel needs compression to fire the fuel, You start taking that away little by little its going to need that crap to start if it was sitting in a forrest fire.

[xcopterdoc]

Yur right on C&K... the ether wipes the oil from the cylinder walls, causes scoring or the cylinder/sleeve walls and broken rings. In extreme conditions, it causes detonation, which means the cylinder fires before its supposed to. Causes holes in pistons, blown head gaskets, bent connecting rods. On engines with ether injection, the system is designed to only give a small amount. No ether injection system is idiot proof! None of the machines I work on have ether injection or glow plugs. They start and run all over the world, 12 months out of the year. We have 3 cylinder to 18 cylinder diesels. Clean fuel and air filters, injectors, injector pumps, properly adjusted valves, thats the key to it all. Also a diesel with an injector or fuel pump problem will become an "ether bunny". Excessive fuel wash in the cylinders will cause rapid ring,sleeve/cylinder wear... now it wont start too good.. so you give it a lil "crack"... which causes even more wear... and so it goes....

[hosejockey2002]

So, it appears, that in a nutshell ether will screw up a diesel engine to the point where the only way you can cold start it is to spray ether into it? Sounds like addiction to me.

[fixer67]

So, it appears, that in a nutshell ether will screw up a diesel engine to the point where the only way you can cold start it is to spray ether into it? Sounds like addiction to me.

Not only diesels engine but gasoline engines as well

[bigz1001]

They get addicted , Because the ether wipes the oil off the cylinder walls , what little bit is their in start up to begin with , Thus rings wear out . Plus whene ya have nuts that dont know what a whiff is and go spraying , 1/4 a friggen can in the intake , It fires before the piston even hits TDC , I have personly tore down 3 diesels that was adicted to it in 80 degree weather and all the rings fell out in pieces , As a poped the pistons out . It can bend /brake con rods , Blow headgaskets, Break cranks, Rember a diesel needs compression to fire the fuel, You start taking that away little by little its going to need that crap to start if it was sitting in a forrest fire.

This makes sense as I recall with the ether injection on CAT equipment it had a safety to make sure the engine was already turning over before it was injected.

[evan price]

What happens is, lets say you have one or two bad glow plugs, or a weak contact in the glow plug relay, or an intermittent bad contact somewhere, the motor might be 75% likely to start no ether, but those few times, it won't start because the glow plug system is marginal. So you start firing snorts of ether in the intake. The ether burns out the glow plugs. So, now, a motor that was using ether every now and then winds up needing it all the time to start. Presto, another ether addict is born. 90% of the time all you need is basic stuff like making sure fuse links and wiring is good for the GP circuit, that last 10% means changing glow plugs. Easy problem to resolve if you catch it early.

[Redneckn]

we take a rag soaked with gas and hold it over the breather on our old tractors.. a mechanic told dad to only use that so now if dad sees starting fluid sitting around he'll get all worked up.. and if he sees you going towards his tractors with it, he usually throw something at you and start to say relatively mean things...

[muddstopper]

Try using pentrating oil instead of either. WD40, Breakfree, etc will work similar to either. It has a lower combustion rate than either but more than diesel. It also acts as a lubricant so it doesnt wash the oil off the cylinder walls.