Rainbird R-40 balldrives

[Dirty Water]

We recently got the maintenenance contract to maintain the medians and curb grass strips in a small subdivision.

The originall installers used RB R40's exclusively, even watering areas as narrow as 4 feet (Yes, theres some overspray :D)

Anyways, when we got there, we fixed a multitude of pipe breaks (Yeah, class pipe under a driveway without a sleeve is so clever).

About 20 of the R40's refused to spin. Is the R40 that unreliable (the system is only 3-4 years old), or is there a reasion why they crapped out?

[James234]

I've never heard of a Rainbird R40. Did you mean Rainbird R50?

[Dirty Water]

Your right, I don't know why I typed R40 :)

[Wet_Boots]

Is this an area with freezing conditions? (thinking of the broken pipes) - There might be a problem with the bypass stator, if it gets warped. I saw that one time, on a system I had taken over maintenance on, and was curious enough about the one non-turning head to take it apart. I 'un-warped' the flexible plastic part, and reassembled the head, and it still works today.

[YardPro]

here they are junk..

my #1 service call is replacing the r50's becuase they will not turn......

[Wet_Boots]

I never paid R-50's much mind, but I had a number of old ball-drive-rotor installations to service, that these heads were a good match for (low pressure operation, and sometimes a low angle of trajectory needed) the old ones. In a very limited sampling of personal observation, mostly of heads I saw installed, they seem to operate very reliably, once they are properly adjusted for rotation speed.

But still, that warped stator disc made me wonder if it was a fluke, or a symptom of future breakdowns.

Any common denominator to the systems the failed heads are in? Sandy water? Incompetent installation boobs who tried to slow down the rotation speed, or mismatched nozzle and stator? (I realize that collecting data is very much secondary to the task of making broken systems run)

[DanaMac]

Replaced many of 'em. Hate 'em!!

[Wet_Boots]

Obviously, Rainbird must have data on them, but most manufacturers aren't eager to share the details of any goofs of theirs. I did see a sheet detailing modifications to one Rainbird rotor (the T-Bird, I think) and there were plenty of changes made. I'd prefer they figured this stuff out before they release these products. I think the earliest dates of manufacture on the (still-working-reliably) R-50's I've seen are 1993. I'd still want to hear from someone who installed the heads, and changed their mind, before I write off the R-50's. There's too much possibility of installer errors, for me, sight unseen, to assume it was all the sprinklers' fault.

Certainly, the ball drive concept is a proven one, with a track record for some of the ball-drive sprinkler heads that surpasses any gear-drive sprinkler ever made.

[James234]

The early Rainbird R-50's were made in the USA. The exterior case and top were green in color. These rotors were not ready for prime time. The cases did not seal properly and debris intrusion was a constant problem. Rainbird recognized the problem and offered new seal kits for these rotors. I just got through this year in replacing the last of these in my systems.

The newer R-50's are made in Mexico and the cases are all black in color. Rainbird made a few internal modifications to the newer rotors as well such as stronger retraction springs and making it easier to adjust the flow rate and nozzle match. They are now called TDR-2/R-50 and they out perform every other rotor on the market. Most professionals dislike them because they are so widely available via Home Depot, Lowes, etc. for do-it-yourself installation by the average homeowner.

[Dirty Water]

The early Rainbird R-50's were made in the USA. The exterior case and top were green in color. These rotors were not ready for prime time. The cases did not seal properly and debris intrusion was a constant problem. Rainbird recognized the problem and offered new seal kits for these rotors. I just got through this year in replacing the last of these in my systems.

The newer R-50's are made in Mexico and the cases are all black in color. Rainbird made a few internal modifications to the newer rotors as well such as stronger retraction springs and making it easier to adjust the flow rate and nozzle match. They are now called TDR-2/R-50 and they out perform every other rotor on the market. Most professionals dislike them because they are so widely available via Home Depot, Lowes, etc. for do-it-yourself installation by the average homeowner.

These are the all black ones.

I also disagree with you on the "out perform all rotors" statement.

These are junk.

[Wet_Boots]

Do you hear the characteristic clicking from the non-rotating heads? Have you opened one up to examine it?

There is a very fundamental difference between the R-50 heads and a gear drive head, and it has to do with rotation speed. The head comes from the factory with a nozzle, and there are others you can install. If you change a nozzle, you must alter the stator setting. Fail to do so, and the heads won't turn reliably. A gear drive head achieves this automatically, but not the R-50.

Absent any confirmation of nozzle-stator settings, I would want to assume installer error. What dates are on the heads? Maybe there was a bad batch of heads, or some stretch of incompetent design. Nearly every head has had their run of bad batches.

[James234]

These are the all black ones.

I also disagree with you on the "out perform all rotors" statement.

These are junk.
The TDR-2/R-50 is impressive because it does what no other rotor on the market can do. It works at low water pressure yet still reliably provides for a 38 to 40 foot spacing pattern.

The Rainbird nozzles for this device provide top notch coverage. The rotation speed of each unit is very consistent and therefore provides very uniform watering. The rotation pattern can be set for 360º and spin clockwise or counterclockwise or with part circle operation of 25º to 350º.

Other rotors will do some of these things, but they won't do all of them in one device. The TDR-2/R-50's work great. However, check to see if you have the Rainbird "Optima" rotors. Those devices are indeed "junk". They sell for half the price but they look the same and seem to perform the same as the TDR-2/R-50's. I know that Lowes sells these but they are not the same device.

[YardPro]

Obviously, Rainbird must have data on them, but most manufacturers aren't eager to share the details of any goofs of theirs. I did see a sheet detailing modifications to one Rainbird rotor (the T-Bird, I think) and there were plenty of changes made. I'd prefer they figured this stuff out before they release these products. I think the earliest dates of manufacture on the (still-working-reliably) R-50's I've seen are 1993. I'd still want to hear from someone who installed the heads, and changed their mind, before I write off the R-50's. There's too much possibility of installer errors, for me, sight unseen, to assume it was all the sprinklers' fault.

Certainly, the ball drive concept is a proven one, with a track record for some of the ball-drive sprinkler heads that surpasses any gear-drive sprinkler ever made.

problem we have here with them is that we have a lot of sand in our water. the ball gets ovaled out and will not " flip the switch" to get the head to return the other way. they will come up and turn one way. when they reach the end of the arc, they just stop..... it's always the right side that freezes up.

[Wet_Boots]

Thank you for that information. I don't see too much sandy water (I would use 100 mesh filtration on my own well-water installations, to protect the valves) so that would account for their good track record under my own personal observation. No question that sand beats stainless steel. When brass impact heads were used for a lot of residential work, it was an upgrade to have a stainless steel spindle on the impact mechanism, but agricultural heads weren't offered with them, because the sandy water would wear them away.

Ever use any spin-down sand separators, the ones without any screens? I've seen one or two wells that had enough sand to make keeping the strainer clean a nuisance for the homeowner, and I wondered if one of those separators would do the trick.

[midnightmatte]

I can't find anyone who has the Rainbird R-50/R-50c/R-50s/TRD-2, spay nozzel's, Can someone help me out with a link? or a link for the 10.99 R50's that i've seen people talk about? ty-Matt:usflag:

[Dirty Water]

Wow, bump from a really old thread of mine.

[PurpHaze]

"Lettttt's, dooooo, the Time Warp... againnnnnnn." :)

[Mad Estonian]

Wow, bump from a really old thread of mine

I had to do a double take, I started reading and you were talking about a new maintenance contract, I was like "Huh, he's back in the biz already? Did I miss something?" Then I saw the date...
Funny, I was just reading about the ball drive rotors today in Richard Choate's Turf Irrigation Manual (I'm studying to get my Residential Turf Design Certification), and was going to do a search on them in old threads, I actually never knew they existed before today.

[FIMCO-MEISTER]

Is Weathermatic still stamped on that Choate book? Safe-T-Lawn and the R-50 are the two best examples of the ball drive. Boots has developed an addiction to their clickity clack sound.

[Mad Estonian]

Is Weathermatic still stamped on that Choate book?

Yes, pretty much all of the instruction manuals our Association uses are Weathermatic publications (that or IA). Seems a shame that they don't have a bigger share of the market. But it's tough, as much as I'm interested in some of their products you've shown, I deal with the Hunter distributor (like I've said before, things are different up here, you can't get Hunter and RB at the same place, though I can get Irritrol valves and other drip products,etc. from my people), and they treat me real well. Plus, I have no complaints about using Hunter products. So, expanding my product line is tricky. But I do find myself kind of pulling for Weathermatic, just like the Aggies, of course.

[Mike Leary]

[I] Seems a shame that they don't have a bigger share of the market. So, expanding my product line is tricky. But I do find myself kind of pulling for Weathermatic, just like the Aggies, of course.

I've used Weather-Matic for all of my so-called career..great product, tho
bean counters came in a few years ago & mucked it up with "Miss Lawn Mate"
& other marketing failures. I have hope for them. Pigtails could tell us more,
but I understand some of our distributors are bigger than W.M.:)