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bobbygedd
08-10-2005, 06:23 PM
i'd like to know, what MAKES YOU THINK, that YOU ARE WORTH, $60, $70, $80 an hour? you are, afterall, only cutting the grass. ok, so you are running a business, and need to pull a great profit after expenses, what in the world makes you think, that your "pay" should be much more than that of a janitor? doctors, lawyers, accountants- PROFESSIONALS, SHOULD BE ABLE TO NAME THIER PRICE. BUT, A LAWNBOY? cutting grass is an unskilled proffesion. it requires no college degree, or, even any type of education. there are no trade schools for mowing lawns, there are no entry requirements. so why the hell should you believe, that YOU are worth anything more than minimum wage, or a buck or two more?

Redneckn
08-10-2005, 06:29 PM
Because they are doing the job I dont want to do.
That actually come out of my rent. When I lived at the farm, I had some high schools boys that came out and mowed my yard most of the time. They mowed, weeded 2 huge rose beds, weed-ate, and power washed my main drive way every other week and got 20 bux each. And they were happy to be doing it.

I did provide the Craftsman tractor, the John Deere line trimmer, and Craftsman power washer though.

fga
08-10-2005, 06:32 PM
cuz most people don't want to cut grass. they're our customers :) sort of like supply and demand. we supply work they dopn't want to do, and demand a price :waving:


if someone's job, was eating ice cream, they'd surely pull in a lesser "per hour" wage.... then the simplest lawnboy.

Drew Gemma
08-10-2005, 06:33 PM
my education, operating cost, market demand, the fact that this country is almost entirly service based, the fact that this country is lazy and people will pay anything so they can do nothing! Plus the fact that we remain booked for most of the year without advertising and we name are price and were not broke yet! So did someone give you that rant Bobby or is that just you insight?

aklandscape
08-10-2005, 06:36 PM
They have a brand new 2005 crew cab pick-up, brand new enclosed trailer, 3 ztr's , all the other tools they need. That's like $100,000 worth of stuff. How will they pay for it if they don't charge that much. I guess they don't know about low overhead. I personally drive an old ford pick-up(good shape) new open trailer and pay for my tools as Iget them. Low over head.

Scotts' Yard Care
08-10-2005, 06:39 PM
Basically we're worth what the market will bear and what the competition
will allow. If we have a lot of people in the business the prices go down until those who can't compete go out of business thereby limiting the number of competitors. Prices start rising and we all make a little more for our efforts. The trick is to hang on until the market adjusts itself and the efficient are still standing. But you guys know that as well as I do.

hole in one lco
08-10-2005, 06:41 PM
you low ball cause you need the money. I dont so i get what im worth .............

hole in one lco
08-10-2005, 06:43 PM
They have a brand new 2005 crew cab pick-up, brand new enclosed trailer, 3 ztr's , all the other tools they need. That's like $100,000 worth of stuff. How will they pay for it if they don't charge that much. I guess they don't know about low overhead. I personally drive an old ford pick-up(good shape) new open trailer and pay for my tools as Iget them. Low over head.
if you cant pay cash you cant afford it

Scotts' Yard Care
08-10-2005, 06:48 PM
They have a brand new 2005 crew cab pick-up, brand new enclosed trailer, 3 ztr's , all the other tools they need. That's like $100,000 worth of stuff. How will they pay for it if they don't charge that much. I guess they don't know about low overhead. I personally drive an old ford pick-up(good shape) new open trailer and pay for my tools as Iget them. Low over head.

This is the same way we work and it sure gives me a comfortable feeling. I like the machines and system we have and it allows us to compete in an area
with 35 landscapers listed in the Yellow Pages alone and never mind the word of mouth guys who don't advertise.

HometownLawn
08-10-2005, 06:59 PM
i'd like to know, what MAKES YOU THINK, that YOU ARE WORTH, $60, $70, $80 an hour? you are, afterall, only cutting the grass. ok, so you are running a business, and need to pull a great profit after expenses, what in the world makes you think, that your "pay" should be much more than that of a janitor? doctors, lawyers, accountants- PROFESSIONALS, SHOULD BE ABLE TO NAME THIER PRICE. BUT, A LAWNBOY? cutting grass is an unskilled proffesion. it requires no college degree, or, even any type of education. there are no trade schools for mowing lawns, there are no entry requirements. so why the hell should you believe, that YOU are worth anything more than minimum wage, or a buck or two more?

Because the people arent paying for your degree, they are paying for image enchancement to their home, and people will pay large for that. Just like they pay large for other image enhancements such as detailing cars, haircuts, fingernails..etc.

Also..for convience. The same reason you pay that extra buck at 7-11 for milk when you could drive your lazy butt down to the grocery story and get it cheaper...they dont want to do the work, but they will pay someone else to do it.

WildWest
08-10-2005, 07:01 PM
People who do an excellent job for what they are paid, will soon be paid excellent for what they do.

Because there is such a thing as a bad lawn mowing job and a GOOD JOB.

Because it's hotter than snot and most people want to be in their A/C.

Because most people would rather spend their time doing something else.

Because we're professionals, and while it may not take a degree, it still take know how, care and respect for someone else's property.

There's plenty of people who just want their lawn mowed.... I don't really want those people for customers, I want the people who LOVE their yard and house to look beautiful, when I drive away, I want to take a final look and know that I just MANICURED that yard!

Mowing someones lawn that really doesn't care and just wants it cut, isn't going to pay much, after all, they're just having their lawn mowed because its long, not because it doesn't look good! No Thanks, I'll take the customer that
WANTS theirs looking fine and will pay WELL TO KEEP IT THAT WAY! payup

jbell113
08-10-2005, 07:21 PM
i'd like to know, what MAKES YOU THINK, that YOU ARE WORTH, $60, $70, $80 an hour? you are, afterall, only cutting the grass. ok, so you are running a business, and need to pull a great profit after expenses, what in the world makes you think, that your "pay" should be much more than that of a janitor? doctors, lawyers, accountants- PROFESSIONALS, SHOULD BE ABLE TO NAME THIER PRICE. BUT, A LAWNBOY? cutting grass is an unskilled proffesion. it requires no college degree, or, even any type of education. there are no trade schools for mowing lawns, there are no entry requirements. so why the hell should you believe, that YOU are worth anything more than minimum wage, or a buck or two more?

Lets see what makes me think Im worth 60,70,80 an hour. I dont think cutting grass is worth that much. I will however try to figure what I think it is worth monthly....then try and figure the fastest way to do it in order to gain a larger profit margin in a shorter amount of time. Its usually between $25 and $40 an hour most of the time.

Woody82986
08-10-2005, 07:44 PM
We provide a service that obviously many americans want or need. I don't think we are price gouging... at least I do dont think I am. I charge a fair amount for what I do. Its usually around the $50 per hour. I am worth more than minimum wage because unlike a minimum wage job, I have to provide my own equipment, and overhead expenses. A minimum wage worker only needs to show up and provide man power for a set amount of time. We obviously wouldnt be making as much if we only had to show up with no expenses. Not to mention, if we only made minimum wage, gas alone would suck that $5.15 per hour right out of our hands. I don't know exactly how many gallons per hour I run through but you have to figure that from the time you leave your house to the time you pull back in, you are running something that runs on gas whether its your mower, trimmer, blower or truck. Thats why I am worth what I make per hour... because it costs me $20 per hour just to operate.

Lake Claire Lawn Ranger
08-10-2005, 07:56 PM
i'd like to know, what MAKES YOU THINK, that YOU ARE WORTH, $60, $70, $80 an hour?
It doesn't matter what I think I'm worth as long as I can keep the customers believing I'm worth those rates. :p

grassman5
08-10-2005, 07:56 PM
i'd like to know, what MAKES YOU THINK, that YOU ARE WORTH, $60, $70, $80 an hour?


Where did you come up with that much per hour? Are you making that all the time, some of the time or maybe a few jobs make that for you?

What exactly you do that makes that much? Please enlighten me so I can make that much money per hour. I am always willing to learn to make more money.

Green-Pro
08-10-2005, 08:01 PM
i'd like to know, what MAKES YOU THINK, that YOU ARE WORTH, $60, $70, $80 an hour?


Um, just because? I only want to have to work a few hours a week :waving:

OnMyOwn
08-10-2005, 08:08 PM
I set the price...the client pays it! What a neat arrangement!

6'7 330
08-10-2005, 08:23 PM
i'd like to know, what MAKES YOU THINK, that YOU ARE WORTH, $60, $70, $80 an hour? you are, afterall, only cutting the grass. ok, so you are running a business, and need to pull a great profit after expenses, what in the world makes you think, that your "pay" should be much more than that of a janitor? doctors, lawyers, accountants- PROFESSIONALS, SHOULD BE ABLE TO NAME THIER PRICE. BUT, A LAWNBOY? cutting grass is an unskilled proffesion. it requires no college degree, or, even any type of education. there are no trade schools for mowing lawns, there are no entry requirements. so why the hell should you believe, that YOU are worth anything more than minimum wage, or a buck or two more?


The right question should be What makes you think your worth anymore then the Cain fishing pole you used to cast this troll?

yrdandgardenhandyman
08-10-2005, 08:52 PM
i'd like to know, what MAKES YOU THINK, that YOU ARE WORTH, $60, $70, $80 an hour? you are, afterall, only cutting the grass. ok, so you are running a business, and need to pull a great profit after expenses, what in the world makes you think, that your "pay" should be much more than that of a janitor? doctors, lawyers, accountants- PROFESSIONALS, SHOULD BE ABLE TO NAME THIER PRICE. BUT, A LAWNBOY? cutting grass is an unskilled proffesion. it requires no college degree, or, even any type of education. there are no trade schools for mowing lawns, there are no entry requirements. so why the hell should you believe, that YOU are worth anything more than minimum wage, or a buck or two more?


They don't want to pay? They can take they own bad self and take care of that lawn. :)

lawncare4u
08-10-2005, 09:51 PM
Why are you asking a question like this?you're the one that is always posting stuff and braging about how much you make off of your jobs!!!!Take a back seat on this post!!

Brianslawn
08-10-2005, 10:03 PM
1. gas is like $2.50 a gallon.

2. It cost me a grand to get a state commercial contractors license for landscape jobs $20,000+. plus a few hundred each year to renew.

3. this does take skill and few around here have the skill.

4. after i cut their grass, i can also fix their truck, house, and computer, and build just about anything.

how bout you bobby. what makes you worth so much?

Howie's Lawn Care
08-10-2005, 10:06 PM
I don't care how much it costs to operate, this is the service industry. They'll pay chemlawn $40.00 or more to fertilize, then they can pay $25 to have their lawn mowed. The chemlawn guy is done in no time and put less effort and sweat in to it, but they have no problem paying the $40.00. It wouldn't affect my work if I went to school for lawn mowing! And not everyone can make a lawn look good, trust me. There is this bum that mows yards in my neck of the woods, and he does a horrible job. He doesn't even edge, even with a trimmer. I mow three condos side by side and he told these people he would mow them for $15.00 total! How the hell do you make enough to live doing that. He must work fast-food or retail in the winter. Anyways, you have to make cash money in the summer season to keep things going in the winter when business is slow.

cborden
08-10-2005, 10:20 PM
In my opinion, we are worth whatever we can make an hour. If you are not worth the money you are requesting, the customer will simply find someone who is. I charge fifty dollars a man-hour and I normaly run a three or four man crew, depending on the day of the week. The guy who just delivered my pizza make $12.75 an hour plus tips, he doesn't have taxes, payroll, workmans comp or $90,000.00 in equipment to worry about. We are worth whatever the market will support.

Mo Green
08-10-2005, 10:26 PM
i'd like to know, what MAKES YOU THINK, that YOU ARE WORTH, $60, $70, $80 an hour? you are, afterall, only cutting the grass. ok, so you are running a business, and need to pull a great profit after expenses, what in the world makes you think, that your "pay" should be much more than that of a janitor? doctors, lawyers, accountants- PROFESSIONALS, SHOULD BE ABLE TO NAME THIER PRICE. BUT, A LAWNBOY? cutting grass is an unskilled proffesion. it requires no college degree, or, even any type of education. there are no trade schools for mowing lawns, there are no entry requirements. so why the hell should you believe, that YOU are worth anything more than minimum wage, or a buck or two more?

The way I look at it is.....time is money. My time is very valuable to me......since we never know when our time is up. That being said.......if someone wants to have someone else cut their grass so they can spend their time doing whatever it is they want to do.........they better pay me well. payup payup payup
The time I spend cutting their grass is time I can never get back.

rodfather
08-10-2005, 10:38 PM
Come to my shop and equipment yard and see why. Then we will have a nice lunch and go to Turfdude's place. Period

bobbygedd
08-10-2005, 11:11 PM
The right question should be What makes you think your worth anymore then the Cain fishing pole you used to cast this troll?
why don't you shut the hell up?

Ric
08-10-2005, 11:27 PM
why don't you shut the hell up?


BooBy

Does the true hurt????

bobbygedd
08-10-2005, 11:29 PM
BooBy

Does the true hurt????
no, but a crack upside the head may

MMLawn
08-10-2005, 11:32 PM
He's not even using good bait on this troll

FrankenScagMachines
08-11-2005, 12:16 AM
i'd like to know, what MAKES YOU THINK, that YOU ARE WORTH, $60, $70, $80 an hour? you are, afterall, only cutting the grass. ok, so you are running a business, and need to pull a great profit after expenses, what in the world makes you think, that your "pay" should be much more than that of a janitor? doctors, lawyers, accountants- PROFESSIONALS, SHOULD BE ABLE TO NAME THIER PRICE. BUT, A LAWNBOY? cutting grass is an unskilled proffesion. it requires no college degree, or, even any type of education. there are no trade schools for mowing lawns, there are no entry requirements. so why the hell should you believe, that YOU are worth anything more than minimum wage, or a buck or two more?


Bobby you answered your own question.... You want to know why I charge more than a janitor makes, then you say that I need to pull a profit after expenses. Pretty much sums it up right there... I'm not in it for the excercise and I have to cover my costs and then profit enough to get by on.... That is why I have to be making $60-70 an hour...

olderthandirt
08-11-2005, 12:26 AM
Actually I think I'm worth around the 4-5 hundred dollar an hr range but I'll settle for a little less. Why because I want to and can!

Soupy
08-11-2005, 12:34 AM
I don't think anyone thinks they should profit $60 per hour cutting grass. I don't know anyone who does either. I know lots that charge $60 per hour for their services though.

greywynd
08-11-2005, 12:46 AM
ok, so you are running a business, and need to pull a great profit after expenses, what in the world makes you think, that your "pay" should be much more than that of a janitor?

Well, also, take into account the Janitor that you are using for comparison. Let's say he gets paid $15/an hour. His/her benefits average out to another $5/hour. The liability insurance that his employer has equals another $5/hour. The overhead for the storage space/office/whatever that the janitor uses is another $5/hour. (Electricity, taxes, building maintenance.) Supplies? Could be anywhere from $1-2/hour to $5-10(or more). Uniforms, say $5/day, so $0.50/hour.
I know that I'm only guessing, but that janitor is now worth $35-45 an hour, and I'm sure there are other costs that I'm missing.

As a toolmaker I make $24/hour, but the company figures that 'shop rate' is $75 an hour to allow for all the overhead costs and make a profit.

So, even though a lot of these guys charge 40, 50, 60 or whatever an hour, they are likely only putting 10-20 an hour into their pockets. (Of course there is all the non income generating time, doing quotes, maintenance, down time, travel, etc.)

topsites
08-11-2005, 12:49 AM
First AND last, my Ad in the yellow pages makes the math a simple supply and demand equation, even Opec knows this.

My rate is $45 hour, not $60. That's AFTER 3 years full-time, I started out at $15-$20. Besides, I charge by how long it takes ME and I can assure you most of my yards don't take no hour AND I don't charge for an hour if it doesn't take that long... The LARGEST majority of my yards = $30.
But since you wanted to know:

1) Toro proline 30197 - No better combination of cut, quality and price can be found in a wide-area walk-behind mower.
Cost: $3,300 with velke + striper
2) Echo srm-260s + stihl 420br OR stihl 550 bp - cost: $400, each.
3) Truck + Trailer cost: 3,000
4) Keeping YOU on a schedule, meeting YOUR lawn's needs not by MY schedule but by how often YOUR lawn needs cutting, first time, everytime.
5) Business checking and Business VISA means I cover materials upfront while you may be able to deduct the expense as you can write the check to the name of my company for 'improvement to real estate.'
6) NO cost for using YOUR equipment. Matter of fact, you don't NEED it - You SAVE money by not buying it, not maintaining it, AND not using it since your time surely is NOT free. ONLY after 3-4 years of me doing the grass-cutting does it become more expensive vs. you doing it yourself.
7) Over 2,000 yards under my belt.

Let's not mention 93 octane + synthetic racing blend, oiled pre-cleaners and commercial grade stuff which runs faster, harder, longer and BETTER.

Now my yards don't look like your lawnboy, but if you don't want to pay my rates then call someone else and lets stop wasting time because I can find a new customer before you can find another lawnboy, the race is on.

topsites
08-11-2005, 12:55 AM
They have a brand new 2005 crew cab pick-up, brand new enclosed trailer, 3 ztr's , all the other tools they need. That's like $100,000 worth of stuff. How will they pay for it if they don't charge that much. I guess they don't know about low overhead. I personally drive an old ford pick-up(good shape) new open trailer and pay for my tools as Iget them. Low over head.

Now THAT is their problem, not the customer's...
All my stuff cost under 20k, not my fault they had to buy ALL the latest and greatest, sounds like we're on the same track thou.

topsites
08-11-2005, 01:01 AM
Bobby you answered your own question.... You want to know why I charge more than a janitor makes, then you say that I need to pull a profit after expenses. Pretty much sums it up right there... I'm not in it for the excercise and I have to cover my costs and then profit enough to get by on.... That is why I have to be making $60-70 an hour...

Correct, the exercise is free, that's our bonus.

...Come to think of it, how much do you have to pay nowadays at them health centers to exercise ...?

Brianslawn
08-11-2005, 01:04 AM
I don't think anyone thinks they should profit $60 per hour cutting grass. I don't know anyone who does either. I know lots that charge $60 per hour for their services though.

on cutting grass i can gross avg $80/hr solo. double with one of the guys. my net is prob $60+/hr solo, plus what i make off other crew after their labor and expenses.

TScapes
08-11-2005, 07:50 AM
i'd like to know, what MAKES YOU THINK, that YOU ARE WORTH, $60, $70, $80 an hour? you are, afterall, only cutting the grass. ok, so you are running a business, and need to pull a great profit after expenses, what in the world makes you think, that your "pay" should be much more than that of a janitor? doctors, lawyers, accountants- PROFESSIONALS, SHOULD BE ABLE TO NAME THIER PRICE. BUT, A LAWNBOY? cutting grass is an unskilled proffesion. it requires no college degree, or, even any type of education. there are no trade schools for mowing lawns, there are no entry requirements. so why the hell should you believe, that YOU are worth anything more than minimum wage, or a buck or two more?


As everyone is saying, "This is a service industry and I am providing a desirable service for a price."

As for what makes me think that I am worth the big money..... simple, I am a professional. I don't provide a basic service. I provide the very best service money can buy. The more money you, the customer, pays me... the higher the standard of service you will recieve. If you want to have your property win national acclaim for your landscaping, then we can divise a plan to reach that plateau. It's basic principle, money speaks. If someone wants a benz, they pay for a benz. If they want a lemon, they pay for a lemon. You can't go to a mercedes dealership and expect to shop on a "budget".

As for me personally, I bring an education, a lengthy career of experience, national accolades and a desire to be the best, all to the table when a customer hires me. I lay it all out there. I never brag about my accomplishments or creditials, but if someone asks me why they should hire me over billybob and his family, then I let it speak for itself. You are right, anyone can mow grass. But that sir, is what separates me from the competition. I don't JUST CUT GRASS! I provide a one stop shop for all your horticultural needs.

bobbygedd
08-11-2005, 08:42 AM
but the fact remains, as a rule, anyone in an unskilled profession, does not make big money. why do you think you are WORTH big money? cus you work hard? cus you sweat alot? janitors work hard, the counter girl at mcdonalds works hard, the garbage man works hard, the person stocking the shelves at the supermarket works hard. do THEY net $30-$40 an hour? yesterday, i CLEARED $119.16 per hour, that was CLEAR meaning after payroll, operating costs , all overhead was calculated. do i REALLY DESERVE to be making this kind of scratch? i'm basically an idiot, dropped out of school in 10th grade, became a public nuisance, and i've been keeping coors light in business ever since. so, you got some costly tools, big deal, a $10,000 lawnmower, IS STILL only a lawnmower. it can't take a chest x-ray, it can't do laser surgery, it's only a damn lawnmower. how bout this....should an entry level business owner doing lawns, be making as much as a veteran? i have friends who are cops (believe it or not). after years and years, these guys are making $30 an hour, plus the perks. but, they risk thier lives everyday to protect us. we, are just cutting the grass. who the heck decided we should be making the money we make? are we worthy?

Mope Head
08-11-2005, 08:47 AM
I've got a buddy who's business is "crime scene cleanup". Basically he cleans up the gore after a death. Lots of his business comes from hotels. For some reason a lot of suicides tend to go to hotels, I guess to avoid putting their families, etc through the shock of finding them. Anyway, he's called out after the cops and the coroner are done. He charges several hundred just to show up and the price climbs RAPIDLY depending on the job. Generally, he just names a price and the hotel management says "How quick can you do it?" They just want things back to normal. If someone balks at the price he just says "Fine, no problem, call me if I can ever help in the future." and starts to leave. He ALWAYS gets the job.

Bottom line, if you're doing something no one else wants to do bad enough, they'll pay your price.

DUSTYCEDAR
08-11-2005, 08:50 AM
are we worthy?
hell ya
pay up sucker payup

fga
08-11-2005, 09:07 AM
i reading all these posts, even mine......

can we be accused of price gouging???

tstrong
08-11-2005, 09:53 AM
I normally don't bite on Bobby's trolls, but in this case I'll make an exception. Your premise is flawed because you're comparing business owners with employees.There is no business owner here that pays an employee $60,$70 or $80 an hour to mow lawns, so the work itself is not intrinsically worth those amounts of money.

But to get anything done there has to be a system in place to deliver it.That system is a business.In lawn maintenance there are 3 levels of profit taken out, 1. pay to an employee or employees, 2. cost of equipment /materials and other overhead 3. Profit (or loss) to the owner after all expenses are deducted. Obviously solo operators get both # 1 and # 3 so their net margins are higher.

So the work itself is not worth $60, $70, $80 an hour, but the cost to deliver it is.

bobbygedd
08-11-2005, 10:27 AM
I normally don't bite on Bobby's trolls, but in this case I'll make an exception. Your premise is flawed because you're comparing business owners with employees.There is no business owner here that pays an employee $60,$70 or $80 an hour to mow lawns, so the work itself is not intrinsically worth those amounts of money.

But to get anything done there has to be a system in place to deliver it.That system is a business.In lawn maintenance there are 3 levels of profit taken out, 1. pay to an employee or employees, 2. cost of equipment /materials and other overhead 3. Profit (or loss) to the owner after all expenses are deducted. Obviously solo operators get both # 1 and # 3 so their net margins are higher.

So the work itself is not worth $60, $70, $80 an hour, but the cost to deliver it is.
but why does this SYSTEM, yield a net paycheck to the owner which works out to an enormous amount of money? he is still only cutting grass. what makes him think his system should be devised to generate himself such an enormous paycheck? shouldn't it be toned down, and put into perspective, so that his pay is reasonable within the standards of a sweaty unskilled laborer? lets say your target is $60-$80 per man hour, you are targeting a salary in there for yourself, which probably equals around $40-$50 an hour. what on gods earth makes you think you deserve to be paid that kind of money for cutting grass?

Pro-Scapes
08-11-2005, 10:33 AM
i'd like to know, what MAKES YOU THINK, that YOU ARE WORTH, $60, $70, $80 an hour? you are, afterall, only cutting the grass. ok, so you are running a business, and need to pull a great profit after expenses, what in the world makes you think, that your "pay" should be much more than that of a janitor? doctors, lawyers, accountants- PROFESSIONALS, SHOULD BE ABLE TO NAME THIER PRICE. BUT, A LAWNBOY? cutting grass is an unskilled proffesion. it requires no college degree, or, even any type of education. there are no trade schools for mowing lawns, there are no entry requirements. so why the hell should you believe, that YOU are worth anything more than minimum wage, or a buck or two more?

It's not what we charge it's what its worth. To some business guy making 80k a year behind a desk 100 a month is a drop in the bucket to not have to go out and sweat. There is alot more to a great lawn and yard than just playing jockey on a mower too. Alot of people are clueless how to get rid of that crabgrass or fungus. How many of your 50 per cut lawns know it only takes you 30 min to do... it would take them 2 hours easy and the quality still wouldnt be there. It's all about providing quality and a service they don't wanna do!

yrdandgardenhandyman
08-11-2005, 10:36 AM
but, they risk thier lives everyday to protect us. we, are just cutting the grass. who the heck decided we should be making the money we make? are we worthy?


You are right Bobby. You really need to lower your rates to $15.00/hour. Me, being the self rightous jerk I am, will keep my prices as they are and we should find out in a couple of months whose pricing is right.
Are you ready? 10,9,8,7,6,5,4,3,2,1,GO!!! payup

yrdandgardenhandyman
08-11-2005, 10:39 AM
but why does this SYSTEM, yield a net paycheck to the owner which works out to an enormous amount of money? he is still only cutting grass. what makes him think his system should be devised to generate himself such an enormous paycheck? shouldn't it be toned down, and put into perspective, so that his pay is reasonable within the standards of a sweaty unskilled laborer? lets say your target is $60-$80 per man hour, you are targeting a salary in there for yourself, which probably equals around $40-$50 an hour. what on gods earth makes you think you deserve to be paid that kind of money for cutting grass?



Bobby! Those little pills the doctor gave you? TAKE THEM!!!

PTP
08-11-2005, 10:39 AM
i'd like to know, what MAKES YOU THINK, that YOU ARE WORTH, $60, $70, $80 an hour? you are, afterall, only cutting the grass. ok, so you are running a business, and need to pull a great profit after expenses, what in the world makes you think, that your "pay" should be much more than that of a janitor? doctors, lawyers, accountants- PROFESSIONALS, SHOULD BE ABLE TO NAME THIER PRICE. BUT, A LAWNBOY? cutting grass is an unskilled proffesion. it requires no college degree, or, even any type of education. there are no trade schools for mowing lawns, there are no entry requirements. so why the hell should you believe, that YOU are worth anything more than minimum wage, or a buck or two more?
Well, the answer is very simple. I figure that I must be making what I am worth. Since I am making more than that (are we talking gross or net here?) then that is what I must be worth.

But it is not just the manual labor that is worth that. It is me as a package - Business owner, marketing, sales, purchasing, human resources, and all of that. A person who can wear all of those hats and do it well certainly deserves to net that $60 per hour as a minimum while in the field.

Pro-Scapes
08-11-2005, 11:11 AM
but why does this SYSTEM, yield a net paycheck to the owner which works out to an enormous amount of money? he is still only cutting grass. what makes him think his system should be devised to generate himself such an enormous paycheck? shouldn't it be toned down, and put into perspective, so that his pay is reasonable within the standards of a sweaty unskilled laborer? lets say your target is $60-$80 per man hour, you are targeting a salary in there for yourself, which probably equals around $40-$50 an hour. what on gods earth makes you think you deserve to be paid that kind of money for cutting grass?

Are you complaining your making too much? Because you set up your efficient system and increased your profit margins and take home why should you make less becuase you made a smart business decision. When I bought dell computer stock years ago and made easy money seemingly overnight I didnt say WOW that was too easy I shouldnt of made that. I said cool smart choice and laughed all the way to the bank. You should get paid based on many factors. How long would it take the home owner to do it themselves? Whats your cost to operate? But very importantly is what will your market tolerate.

it's the same with everything. We pull a bit less down here than you do up there but our cost of living and fuel and just about everything else is less including insurance and utilities.

But if I can get a job for 135 a cut and it takes us an hour and 15 min with 2 guys why should I drop my price because we have worked out an eficient way to do it? Going rate would be 150 but since he has 10 properties I give him 10% off. almost zero drive time drives my costs down so I can offer him that incentive and he will stay with me.

i_plant_art
08-11-2005, 11:24 AM
bobbygedd-

actually there is a trade school for landscaping ..... i have a friend who went to school there. http://www.williamson.edu/

6'7 330
08-11-2005, 11:32 AM
no, but a crack upside the head may
Now that wasnít very nice. As Ricís friend Mike Tice has said, a crack up side the head isnít bad, but a caber shoved sideways up the ass could smart some.

Lumberjack
08-11-2005, 12:16 PM
An old street adaqe.... There are no 1000.00 hookers , only 1000.00 johns..

south jerz
08-11-2005, 12:29 PM
Bottom Line: that "grass cutter" is a businessman. Say some former pooper-scooper starts a pooper-scooper business that takes in $10k gross a day, a couple grand in profit to the owner. But aren't his guys are only shoveling ****? Yeah but he organized the best ****-shoveling brigade you will ever see. Whether he is still out in the field scooping or not is irrelevant.

The CEO of McDonald's makes many millions every year. Does he make it from flipping garbage hamburgers? I think not.

IMO there is no glory in grass-cutting, but there isn't any glory in a lot of other very profitable businesses. I'm in it for the bucks, I don't care what anyone thinks about the industry. If I make more $ than some guy as a lawnboy, and he wants to think he's something special because of his job, he can go right ahead. Wouldn't trade places any day.

There is really no limit to the hourly wage a lawn-mowing contractor can make. One could make tens of thousands of dollars an hour if he had the ability and drive to do it. Even if you believe justmowit's success can be attributed purely to Hispanic labor, what if he set up new branches in markets all along the southern US border. He could pull in millions profit a year. It's happened in all other businesses, why not lawn mowing? The growth of a company should allow prices to go down, not up. Because the profitability or unprofitability of each worker and each account matters a little less once you start making the big bucks. If you have 1 one-man crew and that guy sucks, you're done. If you have 5 one-man crews and one sucks, not the end of world right?

bobbygedd
08-11-2005, 01:07 PM
bobbygedd-

actually there is a trade school for landscaping ..... i have a friend who went to school there. http://www.williamson.edu/
PAY ATTENTION SON, I SAID GRASSCUTTING

Mope Head
08-11-2005, 01:34 PM
PAY ATTENTION SON, I SAID GRASSCUTTING

Those programs are generally called something like "Landscape Management", which includes, among other things, GRASSCUTTING. :D

In this case it's "Horticulture, Landscaping and Turf Management"

http://www.williamson.edu/programs/hort.htm

bobbygedd
08-11-2005, 03:40 PM
Now that wasnít very nice. As Ricís friend Mike Tice has said, a crack up side the head isnít bad, but a caber shoved sideways up the ass could smart some.
now, THAT wasn't nice. as my friend mike crowbar always says, there are lines you shouldn't cross

6'7 330
08-11-2005, 04:35 PM
now, THAT wasn't nice. as my friend mike crowbar always says, there are lines you shouldn't cross

Odd you should mention mike crowbar, my friend the blacksmith is always taking pity on mike crowbars relatives. He feels he provides an humanitarian service, straightening them out after they somehow get bent all round and round in this very peculiar curly cue. :waving:

jtrice11
08-11-2005, 04:36 PM
i'd like to know, what MAKES YOU THINK, that YOU ARE WORTH, $60, $70, $80 an hour? you are, afterall, only cutting the grass. ok, so you are running a business, and need to pull a great profit after expenses, what in the world makes you think, that your "pay" should be much more than that of a janitor? doctors, lawyers, accountants- PROFESSIONALS, SHOULD BE ABLE TO NAME THIER PRICE. BUT, A LAWNBOY? cutting grass is an unskilled proffesion. it requires no college degree, or, even any type of education. there are no trade schools for mowing lawns, there are no entry requirements. so why the hell should you believe, that YOU are worth anything more than minimum wage, or a buck or two more?

I dunno, you-tell-me?

bobbygedd
08-11-2005, 04:40 PM
i think it's insane that someone can make this much $$$ from cutting grass. i mean, cutting grass, think about it, little boys do it, 80 yr old men do it. it requires no brains whatsoever. i love it.

jtrice11
08-11-2005, 04:46 PM
Yes its true that actually cutting grass takes little brains at all. But painting a wall doesn't take any brains either. Running a business, maintaining a 500 unit complex, dealing effectively with employees, payroll, insurance etc....I'd like to see a little boy do that.

Remsen1
08-11-2005, 05:00 PM
I haven't read all the replies yet and I imagine somebody has already said this, but maybe you're right maybe we're not worth much more than our expenses plus a minimum wage, BUT that is irrellevent, when you work for somebody whose time IS worth $40, $50, $60 $100+ per hour and they'll be damned if their going to spend 3 hours cutting their grass when their time is worth so much. It just so happens that we can cut their 3 hour yard in 45 minutes. This also makes US worth more than minimum wage cause we bring the tools to get it done in 25% of the time.

There are also customer who THINK their time is too valuable to be cutting their own grass so that makes us worth more too.

bobbygedd
08-11-2005, 05:03 PM
Yes its true that actually cutting grass takes little brains at all. But painting a wall doesn't take any brains either. Running a business, maintaining a 500 unit complex, dealing effectively with employees, payroll, insurance etc....I'd like to see a little boy do that.
but a solo op doesn't do all that, yet, he still makes $60-$80 per hr

Mo Green
08-11-2005, 05:16 PM
So Booby, tell me, what makes one man's time more valuable than another's?

Why should CEOs of major companies make millions each year? Just because he has a college education?

Why is his time so much more valuable than mine?

You know, as a firefighter, I risk my life to save midgets like you all the time. To me, my time, as well as every other firefighter, is far more valuable tha any CEO in the world. So explain to me why he makes more than I do??????

bobbygedd
08-11-2005, 05:24 PM
you can be replaced alot easier than him. by the way, i'm not a midget, i'm a "little person"

jtrice11
08-11-2005, 05:25 PM
but a solo op doesn't do all that, yet, he still makes $60-$80 per hr


haha, bobby maybe you should lower your prices so you can sleep better at night.

Mo Green
08-11-2005, 05:28 PM
you can be replaced alot easier than him. by the way, i'm not a midget, i'm a "little person"
I don't think so. There are colleges across the country filled with little CEO wannabes. Those jobs are not as difficult to fill as you may think. On the other hand, not just anyone can do what I do.

bobbygedd
08-11-2005, 05:31 PM
I don't think so. There are colleges across the country filled with little CEO wannabes. Those jobs are not as difficult to fill as you may think. On the other hand, not just anyone can do what I do.
come on brother, be real. i've seen firefighters, i know some personally. let's just say, they aren't the sharpest tools in the shed

jpmako
08-11-2005, 05:44 PM
come on brother, be real. i've seen firefighters, i know some personally. let's just say, they aren't the sharpest tools in the shed

Now don't go bashing Firefighters. I too am a Firefighter, the difference is that I volunteer. Meaning when I could be out making $$$ I sometimes pack it in to go help my community. True not all Firefighters are that smart but then again neither are alot of landscapers or the bulk of the general public for that matter.

As for why I deserve to be making $60 - $80 an hour.
Well it is not the equipment or the trucks it is knowledge that brings in the big $$$. We are not getting paid so much because our mower looks nice or our trucks are clean. We are however getting paid Big money because we have the experience and the know how to efficiently operate a lawn care business. If you know how to maximize productivity you are worth every penny that you are making payup .

Just my 2 cents

Jason

jtrice11
08-11-2005, 05:51 PM
There are colleges across the country filled with little CEO wannabes. Those jobs are not as difficult to fill as you may think.

are you kidding me? Try gettin' one. CEO's are hand picked long before they actually get the job. When a CEO's position becomes vacant, the company usually knows exactly who they want to replace the current CEO, but they put on the dog and pony show to make it look good to the public.

lawnguyland
08-11-2005, 06:53 PM
True not all Firefighters are that smart but then again neither are alot of landscapers or the bulk of the general public for that matter.

Jason

Sooo many stooooopid people! Everywhere. Too stupid to mow their own lawn. Too stupid to pay ME lots of money to do it.

One reason people will pay us well to cut grass is they believe there is a lot of RISK associated with it. Risk of being too fat and lazy and stoooopid! Risk of sunburn, risk of being tired, risk of getting dirty, risk of inhaling fumes, risk of getting scratched or stung or ivied or toe cut off. Risk of having to get off the couch. Lots of danger involved, plus people really are too stuipd to do it themselves. Try to imagine some of your customers with a weedwacker or pushing a mower! Ahh ha ha ha, they'd be helpless. RISK RISK RISK.

:blush: I win.

Lake Claire Lawn Ranger
08-11-2005, 07:51 PM
One reason people will pay us well to cut grass is they believe there is a lot of RISK associated with it. Risk of being too fat and lazy and stoooopid! Risk of sunburn, risk of being tired, risk of getting dirty, risk of inhaling fumes, risk of getting scratched or stung or ivied or toe cut off. Risk of having to get off the couch. Lots of danger involved, plus people really are too stuipd to do it themselves. Try to imagine some of your customers with a weedwacker or pushing a mower! Ahh ha ha ha, they'd be helpless. RISK RISK RISK.
Stop it! You're scareing me :eek:

cborden
08-11-2005, 08:09 PM
come on brother, be real. i've seen firefighters, i know some personally. let's just say, they aren't the sharpest tools in the shed


If we're talking about sharp tools bobbygredd, I feel I'm doing fine. I've been a career firefighter for eleven years, I own a restaurant, a courier service and a contract mowing company, with 145 clients. I find it interesting that it is always your type that need us. Always ready to slam us, but damn glad to see us when the crap hits the fan.

cborden
08-11-2005, 08:12 PM
Sorry there bobbygedd, got a broken finger on my left hand and put a "r" in your name, but we're not the sharpest tools in the shed anyway.

bobbygedd
08-11-2005, 08:28 PM
Sorry there bobbygedd, got a broken finger on my left hand and put a "r" in your name, but we're not the sharpest tools in the shed anyway.
easy my man, easy. i was only trying to get under mo green's skin. i'm thankful we have people like you, who, in an emergency , risk your own lives to save ours, without any hesitation

Howard Roark
08-11-2005, 09:41 PM
easy my man, easy. i was only trying to get under mo green's skin. i'm thankful we have people like you, who, in an emergency , risk your own lives to save ours, without any hesitation


I'm thankful for firefighters too, I'm just sick and tired of the egos that come with them all. Are firefighters needed? Sure....just ask any of them, they'll tell you.

I do, however, know several humble gentleman and lady firefighters who are the LAST to mention what their career is. If you're one of them, you've figured it out.

Mo Green
08-11-2005, 09:50 PM
Are firefighters needed? Sure....just ask any of them, they'll tell you.



I think you can say that about any profession, not just firefighters. But I will tell you one thing, anyone who is a firefighter loves their job.....that's more than I can say for other professions.

I only brought it up to use as an example, not to pad my "ego".

Evergreenpros
08-11-2005, 10:13 PM
If you are a price taker you will get market price. If you are a price setter, you set your own price.

If you insist on only providing lawncare service you will get market price. If you put a face to that service, a name, something extra you will set your own price. You have turned a common service into a unique service. So talk to those customers, smile, wave, call them by their name, wash your truck, clean up yourself, smile at the neighbors and say hi to them, be unique, don't be like everyone else. Most importantly, be proud of what you do, it will show.