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View Full Version : Doesn't Overseeding Leading to Problems ???


Lost Pine
08-11-2005, 02:47 PM
I hear a lot on this site about reseeding and overseeding in the fall for lawn
maintence. I rarely get requests for this and I know that it goes on a yard -
yard basis, but doesn't all that seeding lead to crowded or overgrowth in a yard ???

TScapes
08-11-2005, 03:00 PM
Depends on the variety of grass. The dominant variety here is Fescue, mostly the Tall variety. As it goes, fescue only grows vertically, not laterally. Thus you are always filling in the spaces to make it more dense. With proper fertilization and mowing height, tall fescue appears to be lush and thick. But if you separate the plants, there is space.... thus the need for seeding.
We also overseed warm season turf with rye so the turf keeps its "green" appearance year round.

Lost Pine
08-11-2005, 03:14 PM
Depends on the variety of grass. The dominant variety here is Fescue, mostly the Tall variety. As it goes, fescue only grows vertically, not laterally. Thus you are always filling in the spaces to make it more dense. With proper fertilization and mowing height, tall fescue appears to be lush and thick. But if you separate the plants, there is space.... thus the need for seeding.
We also overseed warm season turf with rye so the turf keeps its "green" appearance year round.

Rebel II is a Fescue isn't it ?????

Dreams To Designs
08-12-2005, 12:28 PM
Rebel is a patented and named turf type tall fescue. That just means it's a fescue that's been tweaked by the Loft's Seed Co, to grow well as a lawn grass. Fescue is one seed, one plant. It is a clumping grass and doesn't spread by stolons or rhizomes. It is best to overseed a fescue lawn every fall, as any dieback will leave a gap for a weed to germinate. I spec a mix to be 10% Kentucky Bluegrass and the remaining a blend of turf type tall fescues, usually 3 different types. The 3 types for varied disease or drought resistance and a little bit of bluegrass to fill in the gaps that will always occur. Some seed distributors do make a prepackaged mix like this. I believe Lesco sells the mix called 059434 - TRANSITION & BLUE SEED MIX.

Kirk

Lost Pine
08-12-2005, 12:41 PM
Rebel is a patented and named turf type tall fescue. That just means it's a fescue that's been tweaked by the Loft's Seed Co, to grow well as a lawn grass. Fescue is one seed, one plant. It is a clumping grass and doesn't spread by stolons or rhizomes. It is best to overseed a fescue lawn every fall, as any dieback will leave a gap for a weed to germinate. I spec a mix to be 10% Kentucky Bluegrass and the remaining a blend of turf type tall fescues, usually 3 different types. The 3 types for varied disease or drought resistance and a little bit of bluegrass to fill in the gaps that will always occur. Some seed distributors do make a prepackaged mix like this. I believe Lesco sells the mix called 059434 - TRANSITION & BLUE SEED MIX.

Kirk

WoW Kirk,

If I didn't know better, I'd swear you have been to my yard!!! That is exactly the problem and answer for me. I have a large yard, 110 x 150 of Rebel II which was seeded in 1994. It's a great yard, but I have NEVER reseeded. As such, I am getting crabgrass and other weeds slowly creeping into it. I didn't know that fuscue does not spread by rhizomes. Would you reccommend that I use the Lessco #059434 mix that you talked about in ZONE 7 New Jersey ?

Many Thanks.....

Dreams To Designs
08-13-2005, 09:26 AM
Lost Pine,

Yes, I do you use that mix quite often here in Southern New Jersy. If I am not able to get the Transition Plus, I will use regular Transition and add my own bluegrass at 10% mix. If you have any dealers around you that sell Jonathan Green products. Their Black Beauty turf type tall fescue blend is gorgeous. You will just have to buy a small amount of bluegrass to mix in. If you need a large quantity, they will make any mix you desire.
http://www.jonathangreen.com/lawncare.html
You will need to eradicate any weeds now and prep the soil for seeding. If the soil is compacted, aerate. If not, you can go right to a slicer seeder and starter fertilizer and by spring you will have a thick dark green lawn again. You will have to use a crabgrass preemergant and fertilizer in the spring and maybe a second application of crapgrass preemergant depending on your area in the early to mid summer. Fescue is drought tolerant and will recover well if stressed, but does best with an irrigation and fertilization program.

Kirk

Lost Pine
08-16-2005, 04:03 PM
What part of South Jersey are you in Kirk ..?

Dreams To Designs
08-17-2005, 10:33 AM
Camden County, but I design all over the state. I am currently involved in quite a few projects in the Mullica Hill area. If I can be of any more help, feel free to contact me. My web site address is located in my profile and you can email me from there also.

Kirk

Lost Pine
08-17-2005, 12:03 PM
Camden County, but I design all over the state. I am currently involved in quite a few projects in the Mullica Hill area. If I can be of any more help, feel free to contact me. My web site address is located in my profile and you can email me from there also.

Kirk

Thanks Kirk,

Well I can't contact you or email you for 30days as I'm a new member.....Lawnsite rules....Also, I checked your profile and NO website address....can you help ????

Dreams To Designs
08-18-2005, 08:09 AM
dreamstodesigns.com I thought that was in my profile, sorry.

Kirk

Lost Pine
08-18-2005, 08:24 AM
dreamstodesigns.com I thought that was in my profile, sorry.

Kirk


No Problem................

TURFLORD
08-19-2005, 07:11 PM
Rebel is a patented and named turf type tall fescue. That just means it's a fescue that's been tweaked by the Loft's Seed Co, to grow well as a lawn grass. Fescue is one seed, one plant. It is a clumping grass and doesn't spread by stolons or rhizomes. It is best to overseed a fescue lawn every fall, as any dieback will leave a gap for a weed to germinate. I spec a mix to be 10% Kentucky Bluegrass and the remaining a blend of turf type tall fescues, usually 3 different types. The 3 types for varied disease or drought resistance and a little bit of bluegrass to fill in the gaps that will always occur. Some seed distributors do make a prepackaged mix like this. I believe Lesco sells the mix called 059434 - TRANSITION & BLUE SEED MIX.

Kirk
It's nice to see someone else knows this as well. I tell people this and they look at me like I'm an idiot or a Mets fan.

turfcobob
08-22-2005, 11:59 AM
Lost Pine...Overseeding is a process whereby you can seed new seed into an existing lawn or growing enviroment...This is done by cutting thru the organic material on top of the soil and into the soil so the seeds go right to the soil for better germination.

As far as overgrowing don't worry the "survival of the fittest" rule kicks in here. The strongest plants survive.

I will generally overseed when I am trying to fill in a sparse lawn or change a lawn from say bluegrass to tall fescue without tearing up the lawn. Caution..Like someone said the fescue will only make one plant per seed and does not spread. So when I get someone to switch to Fescue I tell them it is a three year process. I overseed every fall (early so it will be mowed twice before winter) Over three years I can get a good fill of fescue and change a lawn over..

Some folks want to change to the tall fescue as it is more drought resistant and needs considerably less water than the bluegrass.

I have even had some folks on acreages go with the "Pete Dye Look" that is planting ole K-31 fescue and let it grow tall to 24 inches and wave inthe wind. Looks cool if you have the room for it.

Anyway overseeding is a good practice to renew, refresh, fill or change a lawn. Just be sure to do it right and use good equipment when you do it.

Turfcobob

DMAN
08-22-2005, 02:23 PM
Kirk,

I was interested in following your advice on obtaining a seed mix with the 10% blue mix in it and i have found only one supplier that carries it and it is not close to my area. I was wondering what would be the easiest way to blend the seed yourself to make that mix. I can get the 3 varieties of fescue though. I generally use 50 lb. bags of seed for my jobs and was going to try to blend it myself. Any tips would be greatly appreciated.

Darron

Dreams To Designs
08-23-2005, 01:25 PM
Darron

I have poured out the bags into barrels and mixed in the bluegrass. Not the most scientific method, but it works. Depending on the quantity of seed you need, many producers will do a custom mix. Who did you find that had the fescue/bluegrass mix? Lesco does have a mix called Tuf Turf, is is similar to their Transition mix with 10% bluegrass added. Jonathan Green also has their Drought Tough mixture which is 90/10%, fescue/kbg. The fescue seed is much larger in size than the kbg, so it is not to hard to get a good mix. 50 lbs of fescue + 5 lbs of kbg.

Kirk

DMAN
08-29-2005, 11:27 AM
Kirk,

I have found that Lebanon carries a 90/10 mix. It is their highly regarded Winning Colors fescue blend. The 90/10 mix is called Winning Colors Plus. It is shown on their website lebturf.com. Out of the brands you mentioned, which one do you think is the best? Also, do you recommend overseeding with fescue for established lawns that are blue/ rye ? I have never used tt tall fescue for overseeeding but here in PA i have been dealing with alot of disese problems this year and i have heard alot of good things about fescue for lawns . Will the fescue stand out in a blue/ rye lawn after overseeding? I guess that is my main concern.

Darron

Dreams To Designs
08-30-2005, 12:03 PM
Darron,

The seed is not going to make as much difference as your prep work will. The Black Beauty gave me the best and longest lasting greenup and darkest color. The main issue with fescue is one seed, one plant. The clump will grow larger, but never spread or start additional clumps. That's where the blue comes in, to fill in the bare spots that inevitably occur. If you already have a mix of blue and rye, what does it look like. Is a complete renovation in order, or can you bring it back with overseeding? The fescues will be fine bladed and color will depend on the seed. With some research, you should be able to find a fescue blend that is compatible with your blue/rye lawn.

I am just on the other side of the bridges in Southern New Jersey. Most of the landscapers I deal with have switched to a tt tall fescue blend with excellent results. Your climate is very similar, but your soil conditions may vary. Check with your local suppliers and get their input also, but take it with a grain of salt. The local Lesco dealer here does not think he should stock the Tuf Turf blend because bluegrass is too finicky for our climate, but that is why there is only a little bit for fill. If you'd like, feel free to contact me.

Kirk
http://www.dreamstodesigns.com/

timturf
08-31-2005, 04:31 PM
Kirk,

I have found that Lebanon carries a 90/10 mix. It is their highly regarded Winning Colors fescue blend. The 90/10 mix is called Winning Colors Plus. It is shown on their website lebturf.com. Out of the brands you mentioned, which one do you think is the best? Also, do you recommend overseeding with fescue for established lawns that are blue/ rye ? I have never used tt tall fescue for overseeeding but here in PA i have been dealing with alot of disese problems this year and i have heard alot of good things about fescue for lawns . Will the fescue stand out in a blue/ rye lawn after overseeding? I guess that is my main concern.

Darron

That's a very good blend!

sparechange
09-11-2005, 03:35 PM
FYI. Outsidepride.com has a fescue blend called Combat Extreme that spreads by rhyzones. I will be trying it this fall. This is the ultimate test to see if it can stand up to a female Mastiff ad a Great Dane.

muddstopper
09-11-2005, 07:10 PM
Contrary to popular belief, most all fescues are Rhyzomatous and will spead. the amount of rhyzomes and the rate of spread is often limited to soil conditions. For that reason Fescue acts like a bunch grass. The newer hybrid varities of rhyzomes fescues, for the most part are not anymore, or not much more, rhyzomatous than the regular tall fescues. They are developed from fesuces that have shown a higher rhyzomatous percentage to plant density. Dont expect the Combat Extreme to spread like KBG or other spreading grasses.

EliteImpressions
09-11-2005, 09:00 PM
I will be in the process of doing this as well tomorrow for my own lawn. What kind of fertilizer would you recommend. I live in Deptford so Im able to go to the Lesco in Turnersville.

Dreams To Designs
09-12-2005, 06:00 PM
Lesco does have starter fertilizers. Just ask them which they suggest for your overseeding needs.

Kirk