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E-man
03-12-2001, 09:59 PM
I was wondering if any of you did drug testing on new hires we were thinking of doing it this year as a safty measure for our company. We will need to hire more employees this year but dont realy know how to go about it. any information would be greatly appreciated. btw this site is great i have learned alot from you guys.

joshua
03-12-2001, 10:05 PM
e-man i'm in the same boat as you, i have to hire 1 new guy and i know, i have 2 people trying out for it and i know both of them smoke weed. i really don't want someone like that so i'm thinking of just finding someone else. i don't think it would be worth it and would look bad for the business. i think you would have to make a policy showing that you do this for all employies but i'm not sure, most companies say there manditory its a great idea. call your better business agency and ask them for any advice.

GeoffDiamond
03-12-2001, 10:25 PM
I will say this first. I am a ultity construction co/ snowplow co.

We do drug testing on all new hires and random test of current workers. Not only is it a good policy, but a law because of our employees have CDLs.

To get good employees ya have to spend more money

Geoff

John Allin
03-13-2001, 06:55 AM
It's tough getting started, and you'll get one or two "surprises" - but the effort is worth it.

Worst part is the first time you can somebody because of it. You'll be shocked by who it is and they will argue big time that "their buddies were doing it and they were just in the same room"......

Best move we ever made here. Customers love it. Most employees like that we do it. Insurance company endorses it.

Stonehenge
03-13-2001, 07:49 AM
JAA -

Random or at new hire?

plowjockey
03-13-2001, 07:51 AM
Champion America http://www.championamerica.com has a simple onsite tester in which you just place the substance (most delicate way I could put it) into a cup and read the results on the outside. The cup works in only five minutes or so it is stated. They are relatively inexpensive for the peace of mind that goes along with a clean workforce at $19.85 ea. The name in the catalog is "Drug Check 5".

Bruce

Evan528
03-13-2001, 05:58 PM
As long as they dont smoke weed on the job or come to work high I dont give a damb what they do on there spare time! The first time they come to work stoned though there outta there for good!

lawrence stone
03-13-2001, 06:34 PM
These drug tests (intrusion of privacy IMHO) are completely unreliable.

Take an OTC painkiller and you have got reefer madness.

Eat a bagel and you are booting smack.

Use some nasal spray and you are a crank addict.

In these days of full employment a potential employee
will tell you to take your stinky $8/hr no benefits job and
place it where the sun doesn’t shine.

The biggest scam is that an alcoholic that can stay dry
for a day will pass with flying colors. But since this screwed up society condones the usage of that poison and
the evil federal and state government condones its usage to keep the tax money flowing. They don't want to and/or can't turn the tap off.

site
03-13-2001, 06:38 PM
It would sure narrow down the list of candidates who apply to work for us. I'd say about 90% would fail. I have some loyal hard working smart employees who smoke weed on their own time. They know if they get caught at work that they'll be out of a job. However, anyone driving the CDL truck has to be clean at all times.

kermit
03-13-2001, 06:52 PM
Wow paranoia is rampant in the LAND OF THE FREE, don't you guys have a constitution or something? I thought facism had been defeated! Unless your employee is drunk/high on the job whats the big deal? It is no wonder you guys are having a hard time finding help. What an employee does on his/her own time is their business,as long as they are doing their job. I pay them for the hours they work, the other hours of the day belong to the employee. The workplace should be enjoyable, how will that happen with your prison like atmosphere? As a final thought, let he who is without sin cast the first stone.

Fantasy Lawns
03-13-2001, 06:55 PM
what one does at home it that person business ...on the job it's mine ....it's almost impossible to hire a guy at our service rate and expect anything better than a lawn monkey ...sad to say but true ...

The one's running a crew is much different but we pay them more & expect more from them ..in any case we do make it clear that if an "accident" occurs a piss test will be needed for insurance or wc claims

lawrence stone
03-13-2001, 07:06 PM
Originally posted by kermit

As a final thought, let he who is without sin cast the first stone.

What kermit meant to say was:

Let he who is Stone cast the first sin.

Pauls Mowing
03-13-2001, 08:00 PM
At my day job as a locomotive engineer, I am subject to ramdom sampling drug tests, from my employer, another railroad whose tracks we use on a daily basis, and the FRA. (Federal Railway Adminn.) While there are differences of opinion on rights,and what I do on my own time, I want my crew clean when they report for work. And they expect me to also be clean. I have enough to oversee everyday, without worrying about my crew on drugs. I would encourage you to use this as a tool. It will keep you safe as an employer and keep your employees safe. It does work.

Paul

plowjockey
03-13-2001, 08:18 PM
First, let me say that I conduct myself in a clean and sober manner.
I expect nothing of an employee more than I demand from myself.
If an employee can't deal with that they can go down the street to that next $8.00 an hour job.
That is how it is plain and simple, when we talk about rights then we also have to take into account that this is my business and I as a business owner have the right to set the employment guidelines.

Bruce

turfman99
03-13-2001, 08:20 PM
Drug testing is required by most workmen's comp carriers as a condition of employment.

We post DRUG TESTING in our add's for employees. If they do, they just don't bother to apply. We have not had a problem.

Stone makes a couple of good points. If your tokeing on the weekends, you can be straight all week, and still show hot in the test. Reefer has a long residual period since it's fat souble.

Coke, meth and other opiates are water souluble and rather quick to leave the blood stream. May or may not be there 24 hours later. Just like alcohol.

This society of ours condones, promotes and glorifies alcohol consumption. You can get drunk off your ass three nights per week and make it to work the next morning and not test positive. You ever smell someone who's been on a bender the night before. If I can smell it, your going down for a test. I was an EMT for a number of years, and alcohol is a far more destructive drug, and it's a drug, than any other controlled substance.

A some point in every ones life, there is more to life than getting high or drinking beer until you puke. As I have got older, that is more than true. As a product of growing up in the 70's, I was no angel by any means. But there is a time to grow up. And the effects of weed are there even if you have not sparked up for a day or so.

Chances are, and my work experience bears this out, that if they are getting high after work, on the week ends, then they are probably getting high at work. I had three employees last year that were terminated for reasons other than drugs. Other employees finanlly came to me and said one was getting high on the job and they feared for there jobs, because they worked with him.. I point blank now ask and tell my employee's, don't get high, because the owner can spring a random drug test any time. They don't, because we now have a different caliber of employee as a result.

Think about this as well, if you hire employees and pay them to drive vehicles as part of their job, and they are involved in a serious accident, the police can require blood test as part of the investigation.

If they are found to have THC in the blood, you now have a leagally imparied employee/driver and they are going to hang your ass so far out to dry, that you will never stand the chance of owing your own business again and will probably have to work at McDonalds nights to pay off the civil judgements, if your lucky enough not to be Bubba's cellmate at the Graybar Hotel.

Pretty simple decision I think...

Sign up for my free e newsletter at http://www.landscapebusinesshelp.com

kermit
03-13-2001, 08:46 PM
Like I said before, land of the free my butt! What in the world has happened to your constitution? Don't you people care any more? I guess you'll be goose steping and singing your new national anthem....Deutschland deutschland uber alles....

Stonehenge
03-13-2001, 09:39 PM
Kermit -

As your new leaders, I'd think you folks north of us would show a little respect. That's OK, though. We have your name on our list, we'll remember this when we take over ;) We'll recognize you by the long hair, bell bottoms and T-shirt with the peace sign on it, right?


Boy, if I didn't know better, it looks like there's a lot of people dating mary jane here.

site - if you don't care what they do on their time, but expect them clean when they're driving your trucks, how do you enforce/check/verify that? That'd seem pretty hard.

When I was in college I had a friend who'd smoke before he went to work, he'd smoke during his lunch break, and he'd smoke a couple times when he got home. Those were all on 'his' time.

And for others of you posting here - do you realize that potential customers may be reading this??? The knowledge some of you have seems so good that it can only come firsthand. I don't know if I'd advertise that here.

E-man
03-13-2001, 10:25 PM
Thanks everyone for the replys I definately will make this a part of my management plan as for certain drugs not being noticed sometimes, I'd rather be safe than sorry
Kermit, as for castingthe first stone I would say the majority of business owners (including me)in America are sin free on this matter anyways

kermit
03-14-2001, 12:09 AM
E-man,sorry I didn't realize youall didn't inhale. Kind of hippoccritical to by drinking beer while putting down dopers. By the way you guys down south sort of proved that prohibition didn't work in the twenties, why would it work now? We made lots of money running goodies during prohibition and make even more now. Didn't any of you see the movie traffic? Lighten up,and maybe you won't have a signifigant portion of your population in prison on stupid raps like possesion of a joint.The only people benefiting from the war on drugs is the enforcement industry.We are slowly but surely coming to realize that the war on drugs(by which we mean the drugs we don't like. The corporate drugs like alcohol and tobacco don't count,right?) was lost a long time ago. People are getting this stuff whether or not we like it. Lets tax it and control it to keep it away from kids the way we do with alcohol and all start acting like adults. Why do you guys want to control employees when their not at work? Do you tell them where they can live and who they can screw? Bet it would make them more efficient and be better for productivity! I'm disappointed that freedom meens so little to some on this forum.

John Allin
03-14-2001, 03:38 AM
Stone,
In answer to your question... we do it as manditory "post accident" (if they go to the hospital or a doctor on our Panel of Providers) and "random" at our choosing.

Post accident because if they are impared when injured, I don't want to pay for it - and random because if they stagger in we want the right to test them. Policies state we can do it pre-employment if we want, but we've never done it. I want the right to do it, though, as I really would like to keep what I've built these past 23 years.

Turfman99 has some very good points, however I can see some arguement for what the others have to say about this subject. However, today's lawsuit happy world has loads of people looking for a reason to get some free money - and when/if your business has any kind of significant net worth, your own sense of selfpreservation will probably kick in and take over, forcing you to begin to take steps to keep it instead of setting yourself up to support some poor schmuck that was in the right place at the wrong time (like the driver or pedestrian that gets involved with your driver in an accident).

lawrence stone
03-14-2001, 08:21 AM
Kermit what is country has become is just a bunch or drones
the will put up with an intrusive and costly federal government for their own selfish needs.

What we have in this land is social engineering through the laws and especially the bloated tax codes that only a CPA can understand (sometimes).

JA makes a valid point about self-preservation. But at the same time we cannot be complacent. Frankly our government
needs a major overhaul that the "system" will not let happen.

Our founding fathers must be turning in their graves especially with the last 8 years of the Clinton administration. Our evil federal government is must more oppressive that the British government was in 1776.

But there is no call to revolt and/or reform the federal government for most of us is fat and doesn’t want to lose our MATERIAL possessions by making waves. The feds have and will confiscate your wealth without a conviction.

I blame this complacency for we have lost now at least two generations of our youth to the public school system. Back in the 1960's before the introduction to the teacher union
youth protested in the streets to end the "war".

The youth of today is completely dumbed down to the lowest common denominator by these tenured socialist union thugs
(public school teachers). They (youth)don't even know the bill of rights. Do to political correctness these "teachers" are
responsible for the feminization of society. They would rather play with their game boy all day while snorting smack.

To prove this fact that the youth of today are illiterate just go read some of the messages in the commercial lawn care forum.

turfquip
03-14-2001, 08:57 AM
If a guy smokes before work, during lunch then again at night then that must be some lousy herb.

The idea of sharing a bottle of wine and a splif with an attractive young lady in front of the fireplace after a good meal is totally disgusting and repulsive. NOT!

POOF...back to reality.

Schools are teaching our kids to rat out their parents. Social engineering like Stone said. Sherriff's departments are cashing in on seizure laws...this drug war is here to stay...replete with corruption that goes all the way up to our officials. Often they themselves use these very substances. All the while filling our jails with non-violent self abusers.

[Edited by turfquip on 03-14-2001 at 02:06 PM]

Island Lawn
03-14-2001, 10:34 AM
Was it Thomas Jefferson that said a revoltion every 10 years, or so, was good for democracy?

This is a good example of the "Prohibition Problem" I mentioned on a thread on the Off Topic forum.
http://lawnsite.com/showthread.php?threadid=11567

[Edited by Island Lawn on 03-14-2001 at 03:44 PM]

turfman99
03-14-2001, 08:42 PM
Kermit my man,

With all your social programs and your good systems in the Great White North, what the hell is up with your economy?? If everything is so damn peachy up there, why is the exchange rate about 40% ?? I think I am going to the GWFN for vacation and get a better value for my AMERICAN dollars!! I guess the social freedoms and all that other crap just kicked your economy in the ass big time.

Frankly gentlemen, it does not really matter a hell of a lot about the laws that are made, just that we have to obey them and pay the taxes to conduct our business. There is not a damn thing any one of us can do or say to change that fact.

Stone makes some very legimate points about the school systems and how our teenagers have become drones. I recognized this about 10 years ago, and have taken a very active and proactive role in my kids education and in supplementing their education with heavy doses of common sense education. It had paid off, and my kids can't wait to work for me or another place to make their money and become contributing citzens.

I know of one dude who had an on the job accident and went to be tested, they called him back and said something was wrong, the numbers were greater than they had ever seen. He said yeah, probably its the best s--- ever. They determined it to be as powerfull as a heroin fix. He hit it in the morning before work and be blasted most of the day and then hit it again driving home, and agian and again. Man dude was a mess.

So if your getting high before work, it's ok because its on your own time???

By the way, if you ask most medical professionals , they say that Mary jane is much less destructive than John Barleycorn.. My friend the cop has never seen a clown high on weed beat his wife like the drunks do, . So we have the basic debate about illegal drug use and legal drug use
( alcohol)?? Cops busted a meth lab in town last night.. not that unusal any more.

Adrenilin is a drug and that's what most people find a way to do. Several alternatives to getting high chemically:

Drag racing : 110 miles per hour in 11 seconds going straight.

Skydiving: Guys say this is a total rush.

Catching your first born child.

Elk hunting : call in a 1000# pissed off bull elk to 30 yards and get him before he gets you.

Watching my daughter graduate from high school.

Catching a 50 # salmon in 10 foot seas off the coast.

Enjoying a beach sunset with your significant other.

Different strokes for different folks.

lawrence stone
03-14-2001, 09:48 PM
Originally posted by turfman99


Adrenilin is a drug and that's what most people find a way to do. Several alternatives to getting high chemically:

Drag racing : 110 miles per hour in 11 seconds going straight.


Man are you out of touch. A new Suzuki STREET bike right out the crate runs in the high 9s.

Here is a link to the local track I used to race at (I have been in retirement since 1995).

Back in 1994 I was a semi-finalist at the race described
below. The scum managment a Maple Grove raceway only give my
15 mins. to get ready before that round so they would not have to pay a fine by running after a 8pm Sunday curfew and
my engine was so hot (13.5 to 1 pistons with a shaved head)
that I could not cover the dail in.

http://www.numidiaraceway.com/eventarch/bracketf/2000/index.html

Butch's bike is only 1260cc. It runs every week in the mid eights on a little 18" motorcycle tire (vs. a 15" car tire).

kermit
03-15-2001, 12:50 PM
Turfman 99
Thanks for agreeing that we have a better social system here in the REAL land of the free. As to our economy it's doing fine, thanks. Our govt. keeps our dollar artificially low to give us an advantage in exporting goods to our biggest trading partner,YOU. While we have lost some jobs to the third world areas in your country, I now see that those same jobs are being lost by you to Mexico, Oh well, they were unskilled, lowpaying jobs anyway. Here in the shadow of our nation's capitol we have No worries of being shot, or raped or, well you get the idea. Can you say that about living in your nation's capital? From what I hear Washington isn't fit for man nor beast. We pay more tax but get more services. I don't know anyone here that doesn't have a job who wants one. More of us own our own homes(no we don't live in igloos) than in your country and if you care to check more of us live in cities than you folk.
Come on up some time and we'll show you what clean air and water are like. Plus we'll show you a good time at much less cost than you will pay in your own country. While you're here you can check out what a clean,safe city looks like and we promise you won't get shot or mugged! Sound good, come on up.

turfman99
03-15-2001, 07:59 PM
A better social service system?? Oh I suppose if being on the dole is your gig..

Thats why the majority of the physicans in your frozen wasteland have fled or are fleeing your wreck of a health care system for the USA where they can make more than mininmum wage and provide a decent level of health care, more than tounge depressers any way.

No street crime and muggings ?? Thats not what we hear from the streets of Vancouver ?? Child prositutes, gang crime by Asian controlled Mafia, contract killings on the street. Vancouver being the entry point to North American continent for the majority of the China White ( that would be heroin) that comes in to the US. Your country is no different that ours or any other developed country.

As for more of you living in cities, well that shows that you cannot take the country life, I sure as hell don't want to live in the city.

" I got a rifle, shotgun and a 4 wheel drive and only a country boy can survive" (Hank Williams Jr.)

lawrence stone
03-15-2001, 08:21 PM
Originally posted by kermit

Here in the shadow of our nation's capitol we have No worries of being shot, or raped or, well you get the idea.


That will all change for I plan on taking a vacation in
Ottawa in July.

JML
03-15-2001, 08:22 PM
Asian Mafia? whats that about..

plowjockey
03-15-2001, 08:40 PM
Al this negativity!! WHAT'S THIS ALL ABOUT??

I thought we were supposed to be discussing business in a fiendly manner, or have I gone to the wrong site?

Bruce

turfman99
03-15-2001, 10:38 PM
I think were just having a little fun here doing some nation bashing.. running a little smack if you will. Kind of a top this type thing.. no negativity intended on my part, just stating facts LOL

No personal attacks, just some economic mud slinging, "my crime rate is lower than your crime rate" thing, mutiple denials from both sides about the drug problems in the respective countries,crack backs on the countries social service systems, yada, yada, yada. Got to act like business people 8 hours a day, you got to have a little fun
afterwards.

http://www.landscapebusinesshelp.com

dmk395
03-15-2001, 11:46 PM
I hear alot of fugitives hide out in Canada, supposedly Whitey Bulger, and some of Osama Bin Laden's people are there too.

dmk395
03-15-2001, 11:56 PM
Drug testing is a rather controversial issue in the United States and any other democracy, or elitist democracy as I like to say. However its unfortunate that the U.S. is a nation chock full of drunks, drugs are a problem too, but alcohol in my opinion is much worse.

lawnboy11
03-17-2001, 12:43 PM
I have nothing to say.

[Edited by lawnboy11 on 03-17-2001 at 01:09 PM]

plowjockey
03-17-2001, 01:06 PM
I agree on the fact that alcohol is a far worse drug as far as negative social impact than marijuana. That is why I do neither. The drug test post about "your fired" may be funny but it is not what a potential customer looking here on this site to find out what snowplowers are all about would want to see. This, while we treat it as our little group, is none the less a public forum and we all have a public personna to keep up.
Okay I'm back off the soapbox.

Bruce

lawnboy11
03-17-2001, 01:13 PM
Plowjockey- I agree with what you said about it being funny and a public forum. It was funny, but I didn't think of it in that respect. Good point, still funny though! And if they can't laugh then they're stupid anyway (more comedy). Thanks for the insight.

plowjockey
03-17-2001, 01:21 PM
LawnboyII

I was not knocking you. I well understood your comment being that I grew up in the 60's and 70's and the humor was largely that direction. (did you ever read a "Mad" magazine?) The point I was trying to make was about public perception and I realize that you are fully aware of this. This thread has raised some serious points on both directions and IT SEEMS TO HAVE BECOME A MONSTER sorry didn't mean to yell.
OK going back to my drug of choice which is coffee.
Bruce

DBM
03-17-2001, 03:10 PM
Drug testing here in Vancouver? You wouldn't find any staff. Pot is everywhere here, and I do mean everywhere. It's hard enough getting people to show up to work let alone find people who don't smoke weed. I didn't grow up here (grew up in Ontario), and I don't touch the stuff, but I'd rather have a guy who smokes once in a while on his own time than a guy who routinely shows up hungover. As for the other drugs, that's another story.
Doug

capital
03-17-2001, 07:30 PM
We recently had an employee jack knife his trailer on the interstate and total the trailer and the skid steer. When we finally got it resolved with the insurance company regarding the cost and damages I wrote the employee his counseling statement and had him in for a little chat. On his own admission the pot word came out. Now I have additional problems to resolve with my insurance company and that employee is in court shortly with us regarding his actions that night. So we are now testing our employees and all new hires. My clients will live with the fact that we are back logged on landscaping but not lethargic workers and mistakes employees make from using drugs/alcohol. In this day and age the damage from a joint or alcohol is to great a risk. The man who wants to smoke a joint or use alcohol un wisely has the option to work some place else. Just like we have the option not to hire or expose are self to their actions from delay reaction time based on what they did before they came to work.

jmartmel
03-18-2001, 06:33 AM
No way! should drug testing be allowed it's a bad road to go down, what's next dna testing to see if the employee matches a specific job or has a future disability down the road that would cost the company(just wait it will come too)! Government and business needs to stay out of peoples lives, do they need to know what prescription medicine someone is taking? Now that this is becoming acceptable to the many who are taking it lightly it will only lead to more invasion of privacy and big brother knowing everything about everyone. Even here in Canada it is starting and also dna databanking of pretty much any criminal charge out there. Wrong wrong wrong way to go. And the thing is no one seems to much give a damn or see down the road.

kermit
03-18-2001, 11:41 PM
Hey, Turfman, you'll let the cat out of the bag if you tell everybody this is all in fun! The only serious thought I actually have is that most of the posts in favor of drug testing seem to be coming from you southerners,we in the Great White North seem to be a little more laid back and have a live and let live attitude.
Do you guys really have that bad a problem where you live? Do you REALLY have to stomp on peoples personal freedoms? If I really felt that an employee was blasted I'd just send him home or eventually fire his ass. No way would I ever agree to a drug test(which I would pass)just on principle. If I'm not willing to do it myself why would I subject anemployee to it?

PINEISLAND1
03-23-2001, 04:40 PM
It may be a surprise to some, but there are many of us left that still feel that personal character matters, and also many that feel that doing drugs anytime, anyplace represents a lack of character. Just like I dont want that person coming to my door in a few years to pick up my daughter for a date, I also do not want him representing my company, on his time or mine.

If that is what you call "freedom", then feel free to exercise your freedom while employed with my competitors.

Evan528
03-23-2001, 08:49 PM
I know alot of people who smoke weed every day after work and are very responsible still. As long as you dont work while stoned and can still act professional I dont have a problem with it. Youd be surprised at how many people smoke weed that youd never even suspect!

jmartmel
03-24-2001, 03:47 AM
character? The best employee you have could maybe fail one of those tests? What then, would you fire him. We are not talking about falling down hammered or stoned on the job! What ever happened to just basing someones ability on the job they perform at work. If you need a test to tell you something about character then I think you need to get training in personal observation skills before intuding on someones privacy. I don't do drugs! just dont agree with all the intrusion that seems to be taking hold in society.

turfman99
03-24-2001, 12:52 PM
is not whether it is right or worng, its the fact that society has enacted penalities in the form of civil damage actions in courts for employees being impaired on the job.

I put it several ways... if you drink to get drunk off your ass, then you have a drinking problem. Most of us did that in our early 20's just to be cool, then there were those of us who decided hanging your head in a toliet and puking, pounding hangover headaches and total waste of time.

If you smoke pot to get high, if you take meth to amp up, then you have a drug problem. Statistics prove that over 60% of the baby boom populaiton got high at one point or time intheri lives and did make a habit out of it for a period of time. Times change and we all move on. Drinkers become social drinkers, pot smokers either continue or quit and meth and herion freaks die.

It's not whether is morally right or wrong. Its the plain fct that the laws of the US and its states, and the regulations a lot of insurance companies operate under in order to reduce losses, insititute rules that say you can not take drugs or drink and be under the influence of affected by those drugs in any way during the work day. Weed stays in your blood stream for up to 45 days after your last hit. Thats just science and thats just business. You can choose to do it or not. Lot of companies that don't drug test still around.

You can go along with what the CDL regs and those of your particular insurance carrier require or you can just mow lawns and be a one man operation and keep getting high and quit bitching. If you want to do commercial work for , or under a GC, you and your employees will be subject to the rules that GC operates under with their companies. Same with some public agencies.

Artifical alteration of your normal mental state by ingestion of any foreign substance is nothing more than an temporary escapist mechanism to help you escape from the realities of the situation and usally excerbates the problem situation. Escaping solves the problem temporarialy, or sometimes increase the damage ( domestic violence) in the process.

Whats the difference between a half rack of beer and 5 hits of No Cal sensimillia ?? Your hammered the same.

plowjockey
03-24-2001, 02:01 PM
Turfman

I agree with your statement but I also hold that I have a responsibility to the public to do all I can to insure that no one operates any of my equip. in a state of any impairment.
Freedom not with standing if one of my people hurt, or worse yet, killed someone working impaired (think of your children or your own parents for instance) while in my employ I would have trouble sleeping at night if I hadn't at least tried to make sure that this could not be happening.
We all love freedom but that does not give us the freedom to risk other peoples lives. Many of our businesses include the operation of large and or dangerous equipment and I want any of my people to be in top shape when working for me.

Bruce

kutnkru
03-25-2001, 10:53 AM
Sureeeeeeee, I spend the week at the hospital and the next thing I know there is a communist coup d'état -LOL.

I do not drug test as an employment qualification. I agree with L. Stone, that if you eat a poppyseed bagel that you are addicted to opiates etc.

I think that the majortity of us here were not Clinton's and did in fact inhale while in college or at some point in our lives. Some here may still be weekend warriors. I think it is extremely hypocritical for us to assume that many are not capable of performing on an exemplary level at the workplace because they enjoy the stimulation of certain narcotics during sex, for religious reasons, or for meditative purposes.

I also think that with the Sudafeds and Contacts showing up the same as Mary-Jo-Wanna when the tests are given, that this is an obvious scapegoat for employees to use to avoid the entrapment.

The other tendancy that employers seem to overlook is the GoldSeals that are used as a supplimental part of an employees diet because of his extra curricular activites.

I am in agreement with JAA that we as employers should make sure that we have the right to a random test after an injury or accident occurs. This to me is not an infringement on the employees right to a personal life, but part of protecting our vested interests as a Company.

Just my nickle bag(ROFLMAO-LOL)
Kris

Albemarle Lawn
08-18-2001, 12:36 AM
.

RLM
08-19-2001, 02:43 AM
As far as drug testing and workers compensation goes--it's a farce. In a resent Florida Supreme Court case, the court ruled that unless the insurance company could prove that the person or persons were under the influence at the time of the accident and that being under said influence was a contributing factor, the insurance company had to pay up.

In other words, just because one of your employees happen to catch an illegal buzz over the weekend it does not give the insurance company the option to refuse payment. The insurance company MUST PROVE that smoking a joint on Friday night was a contributing factor to the accident that happened on the following Monday.

Personally, I would rather work with someone that smoke after work than with someone who drinks after work.

Mark one up for FREEDOM!

Island Lawn
08-23-2001, 10:23 AM
4TH AMENDMENT?

If peeing in a cup for a job is not an unreasonable search, then neither is looking into your genetic code and finding other
"character flaws".

"Looks like Little Johnny might consider experimenting with pot.
We better abort this mutant!
We can't even use his mutant stem cells!"


Your $49.95 Wal Mart Urine Licker might cause you to falsely fire your best worker, possibly even face a lawsuit for doing so.
If he tests positive,
policy is policy or it is not policy!



Pothead stereotypes fit humans just as well as other steroetypes fit humans.

Reefer Madness!

Divide and Conquer!

Morals and Values? I wish more conservatives would consider the moral implications of a government striping a nation of personal freedoms while fighting a quagmire war against its own citizenship!

What will it take to win?
Look at the total costs ($ and human) to date.
No end in sight.

At this point, the war is a self-perpetuating industry. Lots of people on the gov payroll would be unemployed if peace broke out!
That might be bad for the economy/political careers!

:(

rdh
08-28-2001, 10:53 PM
i think its none of our bussiness what people do on there own time.
no testing until they screw up .
a person who enjoys a little weed after work shouldnt get fired just because he cant pass a piss test and dont screw up.

Albemarle Lawn
08-29-2001, 12:04 AM
YES, in a "Drug-Free" school zone.

At a school which is currently my largest contract at almost $1000.00 per lawn cutting.

I told him to put it away and he laughed in my face. I told him I would call the police and he said "go ahead."

So I did. The cops came and found only seeds on him. No arrest.

This turkey has been warned before. Now he's toast.

KB

powerreel
08-29-2001, 01:24 PM
:confused: ??? You let anyone under your command laugh @ you? Then call cops to do your dirty work? Why would you even let your logo be associated with that jazz? You need to learn command and control..... I would walk my sites for plants if he had seeds on him and knew beans about hort.....
We test for insurance reasons and do DOT physical, not random- if anything occurs I am good @ getting to the bottom of things.
Lot's of Hort people smoke pot, it's a plant. ;)

Stonehenge
08-29-2001, 06:15 PM
No kidding!

Laugh at me to my face and that will be the last thing you do as an employee of Stonehenge BP&L. Smoke pot on the job and you'll need to pull my boot from your ___ before you get into your car to go home.