Pay me now or pay me later...

[PurpHaze]

Took these pictures two days ago when a "flood" occurred in the front of the new stadium complex that is a little over one year old. A 3" main line from the interior of the high school came into this area. However, it was not to be used because the irrigation water for the complex was coming from a 6" POC out on the athletic fields. This main line spur was supposed to be capped off 200' to the south in a dirt area that became parking lot. Looks like it wasn't done. We turned on an isolation valve that'd been shut down since the construction to do some R&D on new areas and the rest is history. It ran for 25 minutes before we discovered the flood and now they're worried about the concrete being undermined. During the Christmas break (no traffic) they're going to have a contractor come in and dig up the parking lot so we can cap this main off where it should have been already capped. This would have cost about $3.56 to cap off a year and a half ago now it's going to cost thousands. :rolleyes:

[MarcSmith]

Ouch....it doe not look that bad. but the problem is thet you can't see the real damage..... I wonder if they could use the ground sonar to try to determine the extent of damage....

Have to snap some more pics as they dig to see how big a canyon was created..

[PurpHaze]

Ouch....it doe not look that bad. but the problem is thet you can't see the real damage..... I wonder if they could use the ground sonar to try to determine the extent of damage....

Have to snap some more pics as they dig to see how big a canyon was created..

I'd be interested too and I'll try to be there when they do it. 120 GPM x 25 minutes = 3000 gallons. :blob3:

[MarcSmith]

What are doing up so late/early????

[PurpHaze]

What are doing up so late/early????

I have to be at work at 6:30. Woke up out of the blue at 4 and knew I couldn't go back to sleep. Wife's 50th birthday today so maybe that's on my mind. Got her an AARP card. :D

[MarcSmith]

thats mean...I pulled a suprise 40th for the wife earlier this year....after assuring here i was not going through any trouble for her....

[Dirty Water]

You better cone that area off until its fixed, that could develop into a nasty sinkhole.

[PurpHaze]

You better cone that area off until its fixed, that could develop into a nasty sinkhole.

We all know there could be a problem underneath. However, with this being football season I doubt if the district wants anything to indicate that there are any problems with their new "jewel" of a stadium. That part of it is out of my hands and I have documented the situation.

[PurpHaze]

Speaking of holes created by irrigation breaks here's a couple of pictures taken this week of a broken 1-1/2" quick coupler line. This line was marked by me prior to the start of trenching for new sewer leach lines. The contractor apparently hit the line and repaired it himself. Then when the backfilling process was done care wasn't used to properly backfill/compact under the line. The line bowed from the weight of backhoe wheel packing and pulled out of his repair coupling long after he was gone. The break created a 3-1/2' deep hole sinking all the leach field lines backfill and generally creating a slick muddy area approximately 50'x125'. That area has now been taped off to allow drying and more backfill will have to be brought in to bring the area up to standards. :dizzy:

[PurpHaze]

Should of added that the repair (ss coupling and PVC compression coupling) was completed and our grounds guys brought out sand to backfill the hole. The sand was wetted as it was packed in increments and that area is now solid as a rock. They did a great job of following my instructions because I did not want a repeat of the break to occur.

[MarcSmith]

I was surpised about the use of the compression coupler rather than one of the slip fixes...I never had much luck with the compression couplers.

[PurpHaze]

I was surpised about the use of the compression coupler rather than one of the slip fixes...I never had much luck with the compression couplers.

Our experience has been to use slip fixes on non-pressure lateral lines and use compression couplers or dressers (depending on line size) on pressure lines. Many years ago we had some failures with slip fixes on pressure lines and went this way. I know the manufacturers say the slip fixes can be used on all lines but we just prefer it this way. :)

[PurpHaze]

An interim solution has been made. Partner and I went out today and found a spot where we could isolate the problem area.

First picture shows the new isolation valve in place. The 2" line had to be rerouted so it could be energized while the remaining main line could be shut down. What doesn't show is that there is another 3" 90 below the original tee for the 2" spur which allows the 3" main to continue to the parking lot area.

The second picture shows the relationship of the isolation valve to the stadium entrance that is in the background.

[Dirty Water]

http://www.lawnsite.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=43861&d=1131071954

It looks to me like that valve isn't going to do any good with the 2" line going aronud it? Is there something I'm not seeing beneath the 3" 90?

[PurpHaze]

It looks to me like that valve isn't going to do any good with the 2" line going aronud it? Is there something I'm not seeing beneath the 3" 90?

Jon,

What looks like a 3" 90 in the upper part of the picture is actually a 3" x 2" tee that is now capped off (just to the left of where the new 2" reconnects). Unseen below this tee is another 3" 90 angling to the left. This is what continues over towards the stadium.

[Dirty Water]

Ahh, I see the cap now...It looked like a 2" tee until I studied it. At first glance it looked like you had a valve, and then bypassed around it and I was puzzled :laugh:

[PurpHaze]

Ahh, I see the cap now...It looked like a 2" tee until I studied it. At first glance it looked like you had a valve, and then bypassed around it and I was puzzled :laugh:

The problem we encountered was that the 3" line continuing unseen to the left is the main part of the main line. It supplied a spur that goes into the parking lot on the right in the second picture and to a bus drive that used to run where the entrance to the stadium now is (where the leak was occurring). The parking lot 2-1/2" spur had to be capped off approximately 200' away due to necessary widening of the street in front of the school to handle the additional traffic from the stadium and a new housing development across the street. It is quite deep because it had to run under original parking lot and drive areas.

It was easier to install the isolation valve where it's at and reroute the 2" line because the main was shallower and had easier access. The 2" spur only goes to one valve near the site's office. There are also four other valves upstream from this new isolation valve (would be behind you as you're looking at first picture). These were installed 20 years ago but never had zones attached to them (guess money ran out) and these areas have been being watered by sprinklers on hoses all this time.

The idea behind the whole new isolation valve is to stop the "leak" at the stadium while leaving the upstream side active and complete the zones around the office. Then when time/money permit the spur going towards the stadium can be dug up and permanently capped. This will then allow the other 2-1/2" spur to be used to resupply old parking lot planters.

[Dirty Water]

I still think you might get a sink hole where you had that leak.

I don't envy your job, We already maintain one huge complex, and are building a second...I would hate to do it day in and day out.

[PurpHaze]

I still think you might get a sink hole where you had that leak.

You're probably right but that aspect is out of my hands. :D

I don't envy your job, We already maintain one huge complex, and are building a second...I would hate to do it day in and day out.

With almost 40 sites in our district we stay busy. Just gotta handle it "one day at a time, one job at a time" and not worry about anything else. :rolleyes:

[PurpHaze]

I still think you might get a sink hole where you had that leak.

UPDATE: Two small asphalt depressions have started right where the parking lot asphalt meets the concrete gutter. :blob3:

[Dirty Water]

UPDATE: Two small asphalt depressions have started right where the parking lot asphalt meets the concrete gutter. :blob3:

Sounds like I win the bet. I take both check and visa.

:laugh:

[PurpHaze]

Sounds like I win the bet. I take both check and visa.

:laugh:

Smart aleck!! I was going to take a picture but was worried about the contrast and the depression not coming out very well. I'll keep an eye on things and take a picture if it gets larger. :blob3:

[PurpHaze]

OK... it's actually a little bigger now. :D

[Dirty Water]

Theres a private golf community in Sequim. I do work on the residential stuff there, but not on the course system itself.

They had a 3" mainline blow under a parking lot. They ended up with about a 3' depression in the asphalt. They Ended up having to dig a 10'x20' area for repair. Glad I didn't have to do it.

They also had a 2.5" main blow out and wash out a bluff. Probably dumped 150 yards of sand/clay onto the driving range below. Again, glad I don't maintain that place....nightmares.

[PurpHaze]

The interesting thing about large mains is the absolute quantity of water they can put out in just a few seconds. Last year we were assisting our plumbers making a repair on a 4" domestic main at a high school. Dresser coupling slipped on transite and we just barely got out of the hole before it became a swimming pool. I tried to warn the plumber but you know how that goes... I'm just a guy that replaces sprinklers.

I took a couple of pics of a 1" domestic line break last week and there's a LOT of water with it.

[Dirty Water]

You were repairing a live 4" main?

I hate the plumber attitudes. Hate them....

[bicmudpuppy]

You were repairing a live 4" main?

I hate the plumber attitudes. Hate them....
Uh Oh, this could turn into a good spot for plumber stories. :) Never met a plumber I couldn't hate. The leak is always in the sprinkler system and it's never their fault. I told you all about the 1 1/2" residential service leak between the meter and the house that the plumber insisted for over 4 years didn't exist until I shut the house main off and documented the meter still spinning. The jerk actually did try to bill the customer for the repair including the backhoe time. It cost the customer almost $700 just for me to fix the sprinkler main and laterals and re-sod the destruction. For an improperly brazzed coupling!
Jerry and Boots ought to have some grand plumber stories.

[PurpHaze]

You were repairing a live 4" main?

Actually we were cutting in a new tee to supply us and them so that's why this was a joint effort. Plumbers bought transition couplers for rough barrel when it was actually milled end transite.

I hate the plumber attitudes. Hate them....

They always get lost when you start talking about flow requirements, precipitation rates, arcs, head spacing, wiring, etc. for a system. LOL

[Dirty Water]

My favorite thing about plumbers is their general "You don't need no stinking water flow for sprinkers, run 1/2 everywhere like we do in houses" attitude.

[PurpHaze]

I screwed ours over two years ago because of their attitude. Water bill at one of the high schools had gone up real high and they were trying to figure out what was going on. I tried to assist with an idea and was pooh-poohed so I just kept quiet. Took them two weeks of searching to finally find out that we'd opened an old domestic to irrigation cross-over valve in the front of the school to get extra water and pressure to that area's system since it is so far from the well and undersized due to all the additions over the years. (Don't panic... it's protected with a backflow.) :D

[PurpHaze]

Uh Oh, this could turn into a good spot for plumber stories. :) Never met a plumber I couldn't hate. The leak is always in the sprinkler system and it's never their fault. I told you all about the 1 1/2" residential service leak between the meter and the house that the plumber insisted for over 4 years didn't exist until I shut the house main off and documented the meter still spinning. The jerk actually did try to bill the customer for the repair including the backhoe time. It cost the customer almost $700 just for me to fix the sprinkler main and laterals and re-sod the destruction. For an improperly brazzed coupling!
Jerry and Boots ought to have some grand plumber stories.

Three times in the past two weeks we've had to do all the locating and digging on "irrigation leaks" that turned out to be domestic line problems. :cry:

[PurpHaze]

OK... Here's one of THEIR leaks. Plumbers ended up shutting down the PE locker rooms' water for over five hours to fix a 1" line. PE teacher comes out with soap on her hands demanding to know when the water would be back on and I replied, "You'll have to ask the plumbers. I'm just a sprinkler dude."

[Dirty Water]

1" Galvi, Poly, PVC, Pex?

If it was 1" Galvi I could see 5 hours. Heh.

[PurpHaze]

1" Galvi, Poly, PVC, Pex?

If it was 1" Galvi I could see 5 hours. Heh.

1" PVC tee... lines go to hose bibbs at either end of the sidewalk near the pillars. They decided to cut in an isolation valve (my suggestion since that's what I'D do) because it was caused by tree roots of the coastal redwood in the background. In all fairness the two plumbers left to do the job are relatively new to the district and are pretty nice guys. Their lead plumber can be a pain but he was only there to check out the problem.

[Dirty Water]

1" PVC tee? I'd fix it with one repair coupling, in 15 minutes...Ad 10 minutes to dig a gate valve out of my truck and thread in two male adapters.

[PurpHaze]

1" PVC tee? I'd fix it with one repair coupling, in 15 minutes...Ad 10 minutes to dig a gate valve out of my truck and thread in two male adapters.

I wasn't there when they completed the job but I think they had a few problems with space and maybe had to reroute part of it. In the hole was a 3" galvanized line that fed the gym, a 2-1/2" line that fed the broken tee and then 4" ABS drain line (for the DI in the picture) that cut across the opposite direction. And of course there were a lot of roots. We only cleared away enough roots to determine what the problem was, NOT to dig a hole big enough to do the repair work. :D

[DanaMac]

I once had a leak that looke dlike that last photo down at Ft. Carson army base. I pumped out as much as possible, and could feel what was broken. When I returned the next day to repair, the grounds maintenace crew had already taken care of it. Oooooooooohhhhh I was so happy. Stilll billed my time though.