How big is too big?

[liquidforcedude7]

Hey guys I was starting to think the other day as I started to look at ztrs, How big is too big or too overkill. Like my neighboor cuts his 2.5 acre yard with a push mower because he like the way it looks. It takes him several hours but he says he doesnt like it when LOCs "come in with their big equipment and are gone in a half an hour." Theres like a 30% that I might be picking up a 12-14 acre account next summer and if next summer like 80% chance the next, but its not all just wide open mowing like 40% of it is somewhat tightand would be dificult on a big ztr. It will pay enough that I can afford to buy a big ZTR and leave it down there and only use it at that account, and I could stil make decent money after the purchase. But Ive got 2 commercials as of now, One is soo tight I have to use a 21 on the whole thing but it doesnt take too long so idc. And the other is like 2.5 acres and could use a decent sized ztr. I have Like 5 residentials but have spoken to several more that have somewhat comited to me for next year. These yards arent that big, I could maybe get 3 passes in with a 60", But would yall get a big mower and use it on small yards even though that would be bulky and over kill or do you buy all sized mowers to fit the yards.

[Jason Rose]

It's all what you can use in your area... ANd how much money you can invest in equipment... It's much more practical to have ONE machine that's "in the middle" than to have to own one small, one medium and one large (say a 36" a 52" and a 72"+) Suuuuuuure it's MORE FUN to have more equipment but is it practial? Remember too that 52" machines weigh around 1,200 pounds, 60" machines are around 1,800! That's a whole lotta weight! On large acreages it's not noticable, but squeeze that on a smaller lawn for a few weeks and that weight of the larger can really wear the turf (turning ect.)

Me, for instance... I use a 50" ZTR 90% of the time. I can get it on just about every property, large and small. Sure the big ones it would be "cool" to have a 60" machine with more Hp. and a larger catcher, but it would have to sit on the trailer collecting dust when I couldn't use it. Iv'e tried the smaller and more compact Walker. 48" cut, pretty close to what I had, did a nice job for my smaller props. but when it came to anything over 5K or so I was spending waaaay too much time to do the same job I was doing before with my 50" and it looked fine both ways. I switched back to the 50" and sold the Walker...

Using ONE mower to do an entire property from start to finish is where it's at if you are SOLO. It just takes longer to go back and forth switching from a small Z to the large one, since the large one can't do the tight stuff and the small one takes too long to do the big stuff... Jockying them around on the trailer, and so on...

All this being said... I am kicking myslef for selling the Walker... Now I want another one, but with a 42" deck. I know a guy that has one and a 21" and rarely even has to use the 21" because he can squeeze about anywhere. For the 2 thousand dollar BEATING I took to sell it I could have bought the 42" deck easily, sold the 48" and even bought another deck (like a 52" or a 42" mulcher) and came out even.... grrrrrrrrrr! Ok, just venting... lol.

[QualityLawnCare4u]

I sold my 717 with the 48" deck and I wish everyday I had kept it over my 60 The 48 would cut anything I had from 4 acres to 1/10 of an acre and fit anywhere. The 60 has actually taken me longer on several yards. Big is not always better. Now if you are cutting all wide open properties then a 60 or 72 is fine. Like the above poster said, an "in between" is the best bet.

[Cooper725]

With the accounts that I have (a mixture of medium residental 1.5 acres to commercial 8.5 acres) I have a 61' ferris ztr and a 54' simplicity, I love using the ZTR but I cant use it on all my lawns while I can with the 54'. If I were you I would go for something in the range of a 50' or a 54', not to big and not to small. $$ comes into play too, my 54' was about $4,800 and The Ferris was about $8,000, so like the pros said above, bigger isnt always better.

[liquidforcedude7]

Yeah I dont want to get a 52" and then be cutting wide open for hours on end but I dont want anything bigger that Ill need another for my residentials. I think im underestimating 52"s though, I have to keep reminding myself that its a whole foot wider than my tractor. I know dealer Location is a huge part of what mower you buy But would yall go across town to another dealer of the same brand just so you didnt have to deal witht the one 2 minutes from your house ??? srry double question. Ive got a toro dealer like walking distance from my house but the guy is and ass hole to you if you dont show up in an f-350 with a huge enclosed trailer. How long are you usually in contact with your dealers is it just a come in and buy thing and thats that or do u have to take it to them to get it serviced and everything?

[QualityLawnCare4u]

My JD dealer is 38 miles away. We also have a toro dealer that is a first class SOB. I would not buy a toro from him if he was a grand cheaper than anyone else in my area and I like toro,s. SO yes I would drive across town to get friendly, good service. Also I think you would be pleased with a 52", should fit MOST places, or would for me.

[daveintoledo]

this is exactly why i got the 48 inch toro 450 z, its small framed, but fast and leaves a great cut. Lots of old people in this area complain about the big commercial units on there lawns, i got a few accouts because i started with a lawn tractor and they where more comfortable with it, the guy with the z tore up the ground around all the mature trees, all over town... operator erroer....i still do some of there lawns with the lawn tractor, and do the rest with the toro z, , keeps the referals coming in....

[logan]

In my area, most companies use a 52 on residentials. Some use a 60 inch without much problem. We are flatlanders though and don't have many hills on obstacles that are going to be too much for a 60 inch. That's why I just got one.

[ToroLandscaper]

I personally think 52" is just about the best......great for tighter areas and quite good for wide open areas...What brand of mowers are you lookin into......one more thing go with the BIGGEST ENGINE OPTION......For enstance if you get a 52" from toro go with the 27 Hp they also came out with a diesel 23Hp but i would almost rather have a 27Hp and especially for the price diffenence

[liquidforcedude7]

Were looking at Hustlers mini z 52" and Toros 450 and 500.

[liquidforcedude7]

Ok Just spoke to the owner of the Big property that I might and im a "backup plan" for now, last year the guy doing it was doing a terriable job so I spoke up and was like "this place looks like crap Ill do it for you" and then he got fired the old guy and got somebody else to do it and he said that if this new guy starts to slack like the other old one did that hed be calling me up.
So basically what itll be coming down to is when I turn 16 I can either buy a pretty nice used truck and still have a crappy tractor or have a sweet lawnmower and not so nice a truck. I figure if I can get 4 or 5 more big yards this winter that I could justify a ZTR money wise.

[DistLawns]

I'm mostly a one man show, I mow everything with a 52 exmark hp, I absolutely love it. If the yard has alot of area that I cant get with that mower, then I charge alot more and push mow the little areas.

[Tadams]

You're only 15 right? I personally don't think that you should be on a ZTR. I also don't think that you will get any commercial props because of this. The only people that are going to let you mow their lawns are the people that know your parents and they think they are doing you a favor. What are you going to do about liability insurance, license, and taxes? Most commercial properties will not let you do anything on the grounds without insurance.

[liquidforcedude7]

Honesly I dont think age matters if you provide good service. Im not making 4k a year so I dont need to pay taxes, My commercials are friends of my family. Nobody really cares if you lisenced and insured, and I have a pretty close relationship with all of my accounts since there my neighbors (since I still cant drive), so I mean if I break a window Ill pay for it, no biggie, there not going to sue.

[Cooper725]

lol, it will be a biggie when you put a rock threw a window and it enters somebodys livingroom and destroys something $$$$ (God forbid you hurt someone). In this business insurance is the way to go. Buddy of mine went 2yrs with no coverage and was saying that if your careful you dont need insurance. Last august he hit a rock flew through a window and nailed a computer screen at a bank next door to the site he was mowing. Cost him over $700.00. Guess what, now he is insured. So the statement "so I mean if I break a window Ill pay for it, no biggie, there not going to sue" is ok till you have to spend all your hard earned money for a month on one stupid rock.

[daveintoledo]

rock goes flying, hits a car window, driver freaks and and hits a little girl on the sidewalk, she dies, your parents will get sued for ever thing they have....its their future you will be jeopardizing

[liquidforcedude7]

I mean I agree doing without insurance isn't very smart but I cant justify it now only making 3.5 k a year. Both of my commercials arent like on the road there like warehouses set way way back and dont have but 3 windows so Im not going to mess anything up there, and my residentials, houses are spread far apart and - its just not going to happen you'd agree if you saw them. But I do plan on getting insurance if business picks up much at all.

[daveintoledo]

its like talking to a brick wall, thats right, no one here knows what they are talking about, do it your way

[liquidforcedude7]

I'm listening, I don't have insurance but I know I need it, but I don't plan on getting it unless I get a few more accounts. Lets leave it at that. Why do the big guys have to pick apart the little guys business. I was asking about what size lawnmore to get not having a debate over insurance.

[liquidforcedude7]

That would be like taking 50% of my profits and putting it in the trash can, and it goes away, unless that 1/10000 chance happens to me and it will go to use. But people who are cutting everyday there odds are more likely of something like the car accident you described happening, but when I cut 6 yards a week the odds are soo low that its not worth it. But as i get more accounts I will get insurance.

[stumper1620]

That would be like taking 50% of my profits and putting it in the trash can, and it goes away, unless that 1/10000 chance happens to me and it will go to use. But people who are cutting everyday there odds are more likely of something like the car accident you described happening, but when I cut 6 yards a week the odds are soo low that its not worth it. But as i get more accounts I will get insurance.
I'm not slamming you, but this is kinda important, Insurance is cheap in comparision to what could be the results of not having it.
If you are going to buy a new machine, would'nt you feel better knowing that along with your liability insurance you have up to 25k of equipment coverage(depending on the policy and company) If my trailer and equipment disappear tonight, I make 2 phone calls in the morning, 1 to the police for a theft report and the second to my insurance company so I can get back to work in a day or so. Your customers will not be customers if that happens to you and you can't make that second call.

[liquidforcedude7]

I forgot to add, I looked into insurance when I first started and It was like crazy expensive like $350 a month, thats why I blew it off, Is it not this much?? Maybe I was looking at a phoney site or something.

[stumper1620]

That would be like taking 50% of my profits and putting it in the trash can, and it goes away, unless that 1/10000 chance happens to me and it will go to use. But people who are cutting everyday there odds are more likely of something like the car accident you described happening, but when I cut 6 yards a week the odds are soo low that its not worth it. But as i get more accounts I will get insurance.
so what do you think insurance is going to cost you? I will guarantee you, It will be less than car/truck insurance when you are 16, business liability insurance is really one of the lower overhead cost on my books.
You can get 1 million policy with equipment coverage for anywhere from about 500 and up depending on your risk factor, experience and your business income. your income is low so your rates would be much lower there, your experience and risk factor are where you will have problems.

[stumper1620]

I forgot to add, I looked into insurance when I first started and It was like crazy expensive like $350 a month, thats why I blew it off, Is it not this much?? Maybe I was looking at a phoney site or something.
are you sure that was not a 6 month or full year cost. sounds about right for a 6 month term to me.
by the way my JD 737 with the 54 " deck is just about right for most properties, and remember it will cut a lot faster speed than your lawn tractor.

[liquidforcedude7]

Maybe it did say 6 months, as soon Is I saw how much it was I just clicked out and was like "haha Ill be doin without that", but I might have misread it.

[stumper1620]

Maybe it did say 6 months, as soon Is I saw how much it was I just clicked out and was like "haha Ill be doin without that", but I might have misread it.
well like I say thats cheap price for the piece of mind of knowing if anything goes wrong its covered, especially a 8,000 dollar mower that may disappear in the night. you never know til it happens, then you end up kicking yourself for not having the insurance.

[Cooper725]

I am not one of these big time companys, This was my first season and I picked up just 34 some odd accounts, did this part time so didnt make a whole lot of $$$. But I made enough to pay the $530.00 insurance for 12 monthes of $300,000.00 coverage. My insurance for my 2 trucks and wifes car costs more than that lol. Dude I am not giving you static, I am trying to help you out. Just saying check on insurace before you go mowing alot of lawns.