collection agencies

[bobbygedd]

anyone use a collection agency? i've spoken with 2 recently. one wants $10 a month flat fee, and will collect on up to 21 bad debts a year, with no commisions. this service also claims if they get no response after 60 days worth of collection attempts, they will mark up the clients credit report. another service wants 25% of all recovered bad debts. no pay if no recovery. i am no longer interested in personally persuing owed money. it's stressful, agrivating, time consuming, and i found out, the way i've been doing it, i've broken so many laws, i'm lucky i got away with it. i may be putting down the shovel. anyone use them? is it worthwhile? what is the success ratio? my way, it's 100%. but, i'm tired of it

[paponte]

Mr. Roberto, based on how many accounts you will have to place in collection will make your decision. I've never heard of charging by a monthly fee, usually everyone is % based. Either way you will find that even after paying the %, it still works out to be cheaper than your time spent persuing the money yourself. Also if they can't collect, you don't get charged. payup

[Markf]

Bobby,
I did a search and www.olddebts.com seems to be popular with the members. We are about to try it ourselves. Did they become a sponsor?
Mark

[bobbygedd]

Mr. Roberto, based on how many accounts you will have to place in collection will make your decision. I've never heard of charging by a monthly fee, usually everyone is % based. Either way you will find that even after paying the %, it still works out to be cheaper than your time spent persuing the money yourself. Also if they can't collect, you don't get charged. payup
do you use one? also, my time collecting, doesn't cost me anything. i'm just very tired of the stress involved. i take it too personal. i'd rather just not even have to deal with it. one day late, i'll make a phonecall, and cancel service. if they pay up, within 30 days, i'll resume service. if not, 30 days later, they are sent to collections. i don't need the headaches

[Trinity Lawn Care, LLC]

I have not used any agencies yet, but I am planning on make olddebts apart of my collection process in 06'.

[rodfather]

Smart move bg...use your time more wisely to market and grow your business. Let the collection agencies go after the few deadbeats you might have. So is the shovel gonna get mounted over the mantel in the living room or auctioned off on eBay lol?

Give me a shout next week.

[bobbygedd]

ok, next week. as far as the shovel, i still may need it, but not for collecting anymore

[mmacsek]

BG, Will you be using a local agency or a national one? Thanks Matt

[Richard Martin]

Yep, olddebts.com is my recommended collection agency.

[paponte]

do you use one? also, my time collecting, doesn't cost me anything.

Yes I do, I actually have a PI that I use as well as an agency. The scond part is where you are wrong. Count up the hours you spend on chasing money, plus phone calls, stationary, postage, late fees, etc. and you will see how much it is REALLY costing your company. As a business owner, your time is always worth something. :)

[bobbygedd]

i'm sorry, i disagree. though my time is worth "something", it's not of monetary value. if such is the case, how much are you losing, as we speak? how much did u lose today? how much do you lose, during the off season, if it doesn't snow?

[rodfather]

Paul is like me in that regards...only thing that is lost is "opportunity" IMO.

[paponte]

i'm sorry, i disagree. though my time is worth "something", it's not of monetary value. if such is the case, how much are you losing, as we speak? how much did u lose today? how much do you lose, during the off season, if it doesn't snow?

I'm not losing a dime. I am not working, it's after 5pm, and it's also the weekend. The only time you will see me on here during business hours are if I am not working, or if I am doing office work. If you want to take your personal time from your family and friends and "work for free" that is your prerogative.

Again I will reiterate that your time IS worth money, whether you like it or not. If your time weren't worth money, there wouldn't be such a thing as payroll.

One thing you can't recycle, is wasted time. :)

[bobbygedd]

how much money is your "time" worth? let's just say, it's a tuesday, you're sitting there watching t.v. are you getting paid? if not, how much $$ are you losing? now, let's just say, instead of sitting there watching t.v, you are at court, collecting a debt. are you losing the same amount? less? more? if time= money, then every lawnboy in america is losing a fortune during the off season. how on earth can you relate, not making money, into, losing money? if that's the case, then why lose so much money by quitting work at 5 pm? why not work till dark, and really make money? if time= money, and sat + sunday are a factor, hell, work saturday, get that time and a half, and take sunday off. nah, time, don't = money. if it does, please break it down to real numbers for me. this monday, from 9-5, how much will you lose?

[paponte]

Roberto, there are MANY days I put in 14+ hrs, there are MANY weekends I end up working. If jobs have to get done, you do what you have to do. You will not find me sitting home watching tv during the week, like I said unless I am not working. If you cannot be on a job making money, then you are infact losing money.

You cannot compare the "off season" for simply one reason... YOU ARE OFF!! hence the name. In most parts of the world, landscaping is a seasonal occupation. I'll tell you what... once the season starts and you are busy, I want you to just sit home for a week. You have one of two choices in order to do that. #1, you pay someone to do what YOU would normally do = paying out money (cause that person's time IS worth money to him). Or you sit home and count how much you lost for the week. I mean how else can I really spell it out for you? You want numbers?

Paycheck for working the week... $1000.00
Paycheck for sitting on the couch... $0
saying that your time has no monetary value... priceless payup

[bobbygedd]

so, basically, if you wake up one day, and decide "i'm not working" then the 24 hr period spent not working, is not a monetary loss? now, if you instead, wake up that day and say, "i'm going to court, to collect money." then, all of a sudden, you are losing money? how much money is LOST, when you , instead of saying, "i'm not working today", you wake up and say, "i'm going to court today." does this money actually dissapear from your bank account? or is it like, money that never really exsisted?

[paponte]

No Bob, you can't say it like that. Thats like saying "well I woke up and said I'm not going to court". If you are scheduled to work a day, and you have to go to court instead you will lose money.

I will end my posting with this. If you are chasing your money around yourself, either one of two things will happen. #1 you will eventually get paid for your time you spent on the service your collecting for, and not get paid for the time you spent collecting. Or #2 not only will the person not pay you for the time you spent collecting, but they decide they are going to stick you for the money the originally owe you too. If you really believe that your time isn't worth anything, then it is unfair to be charging your customers for their service. :)

[bobbygedd]

well then by your logic, you should be able to drive to your clients home, sit on the curb for 30 minutes, and bill them for it? after all, you DID spend your TIME there. ah, i give up. typical long islander. besides, i'm out of beer

[Brianslawn]

Bobby,
I did a search and www.olddebts.com seems to be popular with the members. We are about to try it ourselves. Did they become a sponsor?
Mark


they got money from 2 out of 20 so far. also just got checks from 2 other deadbeats wanting to settle out of court. bobby... youre in jersey. hire the italian collection agency. :gunsfirin

[Branchland]

I've had no luck with olddebts yet but still keeping my fingeres crossed.

[paponte]

I've had no luck with olddebts yet but still keeping my fingeres crossed.

They are a joke. They don't do anything, because they are getting paid either way. I tried them once, they charge you for letters which is bs, then when the letters don't work they work off a % of what is collected. They don't so anything. They let me know that they could not find the company I was persuing. Called a PI, and he had everything on the guy in about 1/2hr. :)

[bobbygedd]

hmmm, what are the actual requirements, to go into the debt collecting business? any licensing requirements? i'm liking it so far. so, some schmuck gets beat out of his payment, and i get a % if i recover? sounds easy.

[Dallas Turf]

Bobby,
Glad to see you back.:drinkup:
I think you will see more results from the one that charges a percentage as they have to collect to get paid.

The one on retainer might not be as productive as they get paid nomatter what.

[Markf]

Branchland,
How much time has elapsed since you gave olddebts.com the go ahead to collect?
Mark

[Branchland]

I looked at the site today and see that they've sent 3 of the 4 letters. The business that I'm going after sent a letter to them disputing the charges. Olddebts wants me to send them the information about the debt. I'm still trying to be positive.

[Soupy]

Bobby, You don't count time off as hours worked. But you do count every single minute as time spent on the job or running your company as hours worked.

Lets say you bill 2 customers $100. They both took one hour to drive to them, estimate, and perform work. The work used identical equipment and had no material cost.

Logic would say you profited the same off both customers. But lets say customer "a" paid in cash on the spot by handing it to you while you passed by on your mower.

Now, customer "b" has ignored several invoices and phone calls. You have added another 15 minutes doing these task. Then you decided to go to court and file a claim. You take a couple of hours doing this and he finally pays and hands you a check. Now you have to go to the bank and cash that check.

Even though you spent your so called free time collecting from customer "b". Would you say you profited the same even if the stamps, envelopes, paper, phone calls, and court fee's were all free. You spent about 4 hours to make the same $100. I would say those 3 extra hours cost you a bunch.

Anytime you are conducting business you are working. Those hours should be accounted for at the end of the year and divided by your net pay to determine your hourly profit.

One more example just to be sure it sinks in. Let say you pay yourself a paycheck at a rate of $20/hr. Do you just pay yourself for the 30 hours out on the route for a total of $600? Or do you pay yourself for the 10 hours spent doing office work, maintenance, purchases, trips to the bank, etc. For a total of 40 hours with a $800 check. Either way you worked 40 hours, but method one were you spent your so called free time doing non billable task you really only made $15 an hour and $200 less then method 2.

[Branchland]

As of yet no money. The letter the debter sent to olddebts for me was pretty ugly. Let me start from the beginning.

I was plugging a yard last fall in a neighborhood and this guy stopped and asked me to price plugging his yard. After I got done with the first yard I went by his house and priced his. He told me to go ahead and do it. $65.00. After I get done with his he pays with a business check. We talk for a while about what he needs to do to his yard and that he's from up north and has never had a yard. Any way that is the jist of it.

A week later I go to the bank to make a deposit. A few days later I get his check in the mail for NSF. So I try calling him to only get his ansewering machine. I leave a nice message telling what happened and to please call me. Well I do this several times over the next few days. Never does he call back. I sent him a few overdue invoices in the mail. He still didn't call.

So then I go to olddebts. After the third letter was sent he mailed a letter to them for me. Saying that his company is in debt consuling and that they are breaking the law coming after him and yada yada yada. In the e-mail they sent me they asked for a copy of what proof I have and for me to wright a letter in response to him. I typed a nice detailed letter with all the information he should need and with a copy of the bad check.

Two days after I sent the info in I get a certifed letter from the debter. Now I now he hasn't got my c letter to him yet by what he says in his letter. Well this letter is about the same as the first one except he's telling me to get a lawyer because he's going to sue me if I don't stop harassing him for something he do owe and if a mark goes on his credit rating.

The wife asked "what are we going to do?"

I told her we're going to keep after him til he pays. I'm not spending the money on a lawyer. I will go to court if he pursues it.

The way I see it is I'm in the right. i have his signed, dated check that he also wrote in the memo section what it was for. I have the back letter saying it's no good. Plus if he runs a debt counsouling company you would think that he would notice his checkbook not balancing because the check didn't go thru.

I'm only asking for $103.50. That's the oridgonal price plus a bouncing fee $25 and 15% late fee. If he takes me to court I'm going back and adding a late for every month.

He sure had some real professional and technical talk in his letters. Even quoting General Stautes.

Just to give yall a update. We'll see how olddebts handels this one.

[YardPro]

so, basically, if you wake up one day, and decide "i'm not working" then the 24 hr period spent not working, is not a monetary loss? now, if you instead, wake up that day and say, "i'm going to court, to collect money." then, all of a sudden, you are losing money? how much money is LOST, when you , instead of saying, "i'm not working today", you wake up and say, "i'm going to court today." does this money actually dissapear from your bank account? or is it like, money that never really exsisted?


is your week not full with work????
if it is not then it is no big deal... but if it is, then it cost you lost revinue.

or pushes work onto family or free time ( which i value much more highly than work time)..

but i do think that this is one of the most beneficial things for your business..
and i agree with your assertation of being luck, having broken so many laws...

just remember the crap YOU gave those that tried to point that out to you when you were poasting your actions here

[topsites]

Bobby,
I did a search and www.olddebts.com seems to be popular with the members. We are about to try it ourselves. Did they become a sponsor?
Mark

Yup, olddebts.com will be the next route I take when this comes around again.
Look here:
- NO time spent chasing skirt or tail after money owed.
- No aggravation, no frustration, no lawyers, no spending hours and days in court.
- If they don't pay, for a lousy 10 bucks it goes on their credit record.

Nice as can be, they do the work, we get paid, it costs per instance and the fees are reasonable (very much so).

[topsites]

Please guys don't say it doesn't cost to chase. Collections cost money, I still dream sometimes of opening up my own collection agency because you can earn upwards of 50-100 dollars / hour doing it. But much like bg, I can't take the frustration comes with it, even the Mr. Kodak trick got old after last year, and towards the end of the year I ended up letting about 400 dollars ride out because I just couldn't do it anymore.

Even if it's not costing actual money, you could be out cutting grass or even doing nothing, I think collecting should cost as much as anything else we do, especially since it's being done as a 'service' see...

And if we don't do it, soon the 400 I lost turns into 1000, then 2 and later 3 thousand / year - Yes, if you do absolutely nothing about collecting money owed, then about 10 percent of your gross is gone. grrrr....

So, send'm to olddebts.com, let them deal with it for 10 dollars I don't have to spend but 5 minutes dealing with it, compared to the hours I used to invest beforehand - HOURS, at 50-60 / hour is a lot of money. Thing is, I found out once I started valuing ALL of my time upwards of 50 dollars / hour, life improved considerably. Yes, it's all time spent the company needs to get paid for, as a service is being rendered.

Betcha real soon olddebts employees are gonna be like... Dude, why are we getting all these lawn guys all of a sudden? lol !

[YardPro]

branchland...

if he wrote you a check, then it call the magistrate.. wether he is in debt counsiling or not, a bad check is illegal, and he will be prosecuted.

[Branchland]

branchland...

if he wrote you a check, then it call the magistrate.. wether he is in debt counsiling or not, a bad check is illegal, and he will be prosecuted.


Didn't think of that. Might go do that tomorrow. Just figured I'd use olddebts since they are a collection agency.

[Branchland]

Now, I've never messed with a magistrate. What is the process? what happens?
Do I go to the one in his county/town or mine?

[mmacsek]

Branchland, I probably shouldn't reply because the laws are different in each state. I use the magistrate in my town because it is convenient for me. Also , Our magistrates are elected officials and he counts on my vote to keep his job. You usually file a judgement against the person and they are served papers that descibe the complaint and the court date. If they pay in full before the court date , the judgement is lifted. I wait until the check clears before I lift the judgment. My contract says they are responsible for all collection costs so they pay filing fees and constable fees. Hope this helps and good luck. Matt

[scraper69]

Ive tried collection agencies, with no luck. Not just because the agency couldnt collect, but i have had a couple customers actually file bankruptcy. Some of the others, just became totally uncollectable, and the agency is so slow ( or at least the collection process is) I am now just more cautious in who i do work for, and how they pay me. And if the dollar amount isnt too much, i just write it off as a "bad debt" Trying to collect old debts gets old FAST>

[BH Mowing]

Here's one to think about

http://www.wimp.com/mymoney/

;)