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View Full Version : "new to the business and need ....."


nobagger
01-30-2006, 04:45 PM
What is it with all of these "new guys" bidding these "big", "huge", commercial properties? WTF:confused: my advise, if your gonna bid on commercial properties you better have all your ducks in a row. That is something I am very reluctant to reply to only because I had to learn that if I had absolutely no idea what I should be bidding then I probably shouldn't be bidding this at all. It's not rocket science but if you don't even know what your hourly rate should be then I'm guessing you might want to start getting an actual business together.

1MajorTom
01-30-2006, 04:57 PM
Because they are so new, they just don't understand the business... and in their mind, they see these huge properties as a way to "make a killing".
Almost anyone just starting out has thought, "if only I could get a few huge accounts, i'll be on my way."... but it's just not the right way to go about building a business.

nobagger
01-30-2006, 05:08 PM
Because they are so new, they just don't understand the business... and in their mind, they see these huge properties as a way to "make a killing".
Almost anyone just starting out has thought, "if only I could get a few huge accounts, i'll be on my way."... but it's just not the right way to go about building a business.
I see your point but maybe if they did some, even the slightest bit of research they will have some clue. But no, everyone who picks up a mower is a landscaper right? Whatever, this site is turning into the Kid's WB of lawn care. My point was that I personally wouldn't even think of bidding on something in this nature until I had a good idea of what it takes. In more cases than not you guys tell them this, that and the other thing instead of telling them the truth.

Jpocket
01-30-2006, 05:15 PM
Even alot of experienced guys aren't ready for properties over 5-6 acres, because they aren't used to bidding anything that big. If you've only done residential and small commecial for 15 years, you would definitly do some asking around before you take on a 50 acre complex.

In the same token I do agree with you guys, a newbie really shouldn't be doing any large properties If he doesn't know what to charge.

kc2006
01-30-2006, 05:25 PM
I see where your coming from nobagger. I was thinking of this today also. Theres alot of new people joining this site every day and the professionalizm is slowly going out the door.

When I first joined the site there was alot of knowledgable people that gave alot of good info. I think some people are realizing "hey this is my competition why am I helping them" thinking that if they don't help these newbies they'll soon fail and get out. But theres probably multiple reasons why the response quality (i guess you could call it that) has been down.

Anymore I come on here just to see whats going on and talk with people. I will post questions and I weed through and find the good info and the bad info and go from there.

jtkplc
01-30-2006, 05:35 PM
I understand your point, however, how will anyone, experienced or not, get good at bidding large properties if they never do it? On the other hand, I certainly don't think 16 year olds in their first year should try and tackle bidding a large account. But somewhere along the way even those that may be somewhat inexperienced have to take the first step with large properties, I know I did, and it paid off.

kc2006
01-30-2006, 05:37 PM
I understand your point, however, how will anyone, experienced or not, get good at bidding large properties if they never do it?

The whole point is to know your cost and know what you need and want to make.

I was lucky, I knew how to bid when I started my business, so it wasn't a hit and miss hope i make money adventure.

jtkplc
01-30-2006, 06:00 PM
I believe there are other contributing factors to bidding a large job accurately than just knowing your costs.

daveintoledo
01-30-2006, 06:03 PM
What is it with all of these "new guys" bidding these "big", "huge", commercial properties? WTF:confused: my advise, if your gonna bid on commercial properties you better have all your ducks in a row. That is something I am very reluctant to reply to only because I had to learn that if I had absolutely no idea what I should be bidding then I probably shouldn't be bidding this at all. It's not rocket science but if you don't even know what your hourly rate should be then I'm guessing you might want to start getting an actual business together.

im not ready, im not experienced enough... i know this and will not lose my butt, or drag the pricing structure down in my area because im just a sophmore....other may, but i WILL NOT :nono:

nobagger
01-30-2006, 06:07 PM
Even alot of experienced guys aren't ready for properties over 5-6 acres, because they aren't used to bidding anything that big. If you've only done residential and small commecial for 15 years, you would definitly do some asking around before you take on a 50 acre complex.

In the same token I do agree with you guys, a newbie really shouldn't be doing any large properties If he doesn't know what to charge.
Yeah JPOCKET but how much of an acurite bid can you gain from asking in here. Not a slam to anyone but you and only you should know what you need to make, your operating expenses etc. How are we supposed to know the sq footage of xyz company or a 3 acre plot. Does it have 95 trees on it? does it have 60 degree slopes? For all we know these crackerjack's could be trying to use a 21" on 5 acres. I just would hope that if you are lucky enough to be in this business for 15 years you should have a clue as to what you need to bid.

HOOLIE
01-30-2006, 06:18 PM
Pretty much any commercial prop I've ever bid on (even the rinky-dink ones) requested at least two commercial references. So I wonder how some of these newbies bids are even considered. Maybe it's different elsewhere in the country.

nobagger
01-30-2006, 06:43 PM
Pretty much any commercial prop I've ever bid on (even the rinky-dink ones) requested at least two commercial references. So I wonder how some of these newbies bids are even considered. Maybe it's different elsewhere in the country.
Yeah I don't understand that either. I have put in a lot of commercial bids in over the past two years and many did require refferences. I can honestly say that if I put in 200 commercial bids maybe, and I mean maybe 3 have actually called us. 98% we have to go after.

jtkplc
01-30-2006, 06:58 PM
but how much of an acurite bid can you gain from asking in here. Not a slam to anyone but you and only you should know what you need to make, your operating expenses etc.

I agree with you 100%. The first and ONLY time I've asked about "how much would you charge for..." was a complete disaster. It was when I was new to this site and I wondered how much help I could get. I quickly realized that this wasn't going to help me out, way to many variables and sense no one could actually see the property, the responses could have acutallly been harmful to my success if I would have listened. I had numbers all over the place, some so far out of sight it was rediculous. If I would have went with any of those numbers there is no way in the world I would be in the position I am today with a 2-year contract with them. I hope other new-to-the-business members to this site will learn as quickly as I did about what you can realistically ask on here and what you can't.

cantoo
01-30-2006, 08:58 PM
The first year we bid on a commercial property we spent considerable time figuring out what we would need to make on the job. We compared it to other properties we did and multiplied it as needed for the size and number of locations. The property was for our Township. I then approached one of the concillors and said that we wanted to bid the work but didn't want to screw up the bidding for other companies by bidding too low. He suggested that if we didn't care if we got the work or not to figure what we needed then double it and see how we make out. We did that and were surprised to find out that we were not the highest bidder but we were almost 4 times higher than the lowest bidder. Of course we didn't get the work that year and the lowest bidder who got the job barely made it thru the year. The next year we dropped our bid by about 25% only two companies bid the work and we were able to get the job and when the taxes were figures out we were less than a couple of dollars per cut cheaper than the other company. We've been cutting it for over 5 years now and we don't have to bid anymore as long as we keep our yearly increases close to the cost of living increase. Every year they consider doing the properties with their own equipment and every year we manage to barely hold onto the contract. This tells me that we are very close to the maximum amount they are willing to pay for these properties so we left no money on the table. These are also very easy properties to cut and give us great exposure.

McClain
01-30-2006, 10:03 PM
What do you think we are doing? does it bother you that we can find the business?

nobagger
01-31-2006, 06:14 AM
What do you think we are doing? does it bother you that we can find the business?
It doesn't bother me particularly, because in my mind you "new guys" will bid something way out in left field or bid something so low that you will end up paying xyz company to mow for them. But our point is you should know what the hell you are doing before you go after these type of properties. And yes I think it's a waste of your, and my time to keep asking these types of questions. And I want to clarify something, I'm not talking about the guy who honestly has been doing this for a few years and wants to get into some smaller commercial props. it's the kids or the brand new guys that just started two days ago. But no matter how long you have been doing this for you still need to know a few basic things to become successful and one is know how much and what things are costing you. Go take some small business classes, my God their free most places through SBA's around the country. And I honestly doubt that you new guy's are finding all of this business, I think its more like the prospective clients have no idea who and what you are.