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NNJLandman
02-15-2006, 06:33 PM
Got myself a problem guys, what should I do? Got a call from a person I did a cleanup for last year to do it again, I go over meet with him tell him $285.00, last year it was about $300 so i told him $285-300, I knew i had the job but i thought itd be good business to give him a few bucks off. Whenever I give a cleanup estimate I give them a price for the labor to do the cleanup and tell them the cost of vacumming the leaves is extra. Anyways weather complications hold the job up, I send all the cleanups i didnt get to a letter explaining there delay etc call if you still want service, He calls yea go ahead....weather again FINALLY we get a beautiful weekend, he calls me on a saturday say today would be a good day to do it, but I already had things scheduled figured I would do it the next day, go there sunday no one was home nice day out...had help...PERFECT(took us 4 hours $60/hr x 4 = $300), couple days later get the leaves vaccumed out for $250...final bill $550.00. Send it out, get a check for $275.00, I send him a notice about his balance, and i get a nasty call saying, i never ordered you to go ahead with the work, your a joke, I'm not paying you etc....so here im out $275.00 HE ONLY PAID ME HALF. What do i do, i was so pissed i was ready to get a load of leaves and put them back where i took em from, should i go to the police and put in a theft of services report....I need some help. Thanks

Jeff

impactlandscaping
02-15-2006, 06:46 PM
Ok Jeff, let's figure some things out here..You told him $ 285-300.00, and he said OK, but the weather kept delaying the cleanup. You get a nice day, go do it in 4 hours, 4 hours at $ 60.00 per hour is $ 240.00...Then, you need to charge extra for the vac service, and he's not around to OK it, but you do it anyway. He flies off the deep end at a 550.00 bill, expecting a 285-300.00 bill. If you had no written agreement and a change of work order for the extra charge for the vac service, I think you are out $ 215.00. Regardless if you worked for this guy last year or not, you need a written agreement stipulating exactly whta will be performed and at what rate. Did you charge him $ 550.00 for everything last year, or just the $ 285.00...that's what is losing me here...:confused:

sheshovel
02-15-2006, 07:49 PM
I'm sorry but I have to agree.When you tell someone you'll do a clean up for a certain price and give them that price..it should include removal of the leaves ...
to me that is part and parcel with the "clean-up"
You can't tell somebody something will be xtra then it doubles the price of the clean-up.If it is going to be that way you need to inform your customer before doing the work and get approval.

TURF DOCTOR
02-15-2006, 08:04 PM
On there side, 4 hours at 60 bucks is 240, you quoted 285 that's what the bill should read,on last year's bill you stated $300.00.

grass_cuttin_fool
02-15-2006, 08:05 PM
Got myself a problem guys, what should I do? Got a call from a person I did a cleanup for last year to do it again, I go over meet with him tell him $285.00, last year it was about $300 so i told him $285-300, I knew i had the job but i thought itd be good business to give him a few bucks off. Whenever I give a cleanup estimate I give them a price for the labor to do the cleanup and tell them the cost of vacumming the leaves is extra.

Ok, if it were me, the price I gave would be for the entire job. Then I would break it down for my personal books or records. Most customers only understand 1 price.

Anyways weather complications hold the job up, I send all the cleanups i didnt get to a letter explaining there delay etc call if you still want service, He calls yea go ahead....weather again FINALLY we get a beautiful weekend, he calls me on a saturday say today would be a good day to do it, but I already had things scheduled figured I would do it the next day, go there sunday no one was home nice day out...had help...PERFECT(took us 4 hours $60/hr x 4 = $300),

As someone else stated that 4 x $60.00 is $240.00



couple days later get the leaves vaccumed out for $250...final bill $550.00. Send it out, get a check for $275.00, I send him a notice about his balance, and i get a nasty call saying, i never ordered you to go ahead with the work, your a joke, I'm not paying you etc....so here im out $275.00 HE ONLY PAID ME HALF. What do i do, i was so pissed i was ready to get a load of leaves and put them back where i took em from, should i go to the police and put in a theft of services report....I need some help. Thanks

Jeff

Honestly I would just eat the vacuming and take it as a lesson learned, when giving a price for a clean up to either itemize a qoute, or if you give a price, give it for the total bill. And maybe if a price or qoute is over 30 days old, then touch base witht he client and let them know whats going on

wayne

cwlawley
02-15-2006, 08:14 PM
I would eat that money as well. Dumping a trailer of leaves back on his yard would really be quite funny though.

NNJLandman
02-15-2006, 08:54 PM
Listen last year he didnt have any problem with the bill, I charged him $300 plus the cost of removal of leaves. This property is all down hill to a lake meaning there is a lot of labor involved, tarping, his yard is a mess, tree limbs, its a real difficult cleanup. $60/hr for 4 hours = 240 then another $60 for time spent helping vacumming, which acctually took about 2 hours. In all my estimates for cleanups...I tell the customer that the vaccumming will be extra, due to gas prices and increased dumping fees in my area the price went up. Bottem line he called me and said he wanted it done, after everything was in writing. Im gonna tell him that the guy who sucked them up is pissed cuz I didnt pay him yet and he said that he was going to dump the leaves back on his property, maybe thatll get him to pay me. We'll see what happens, he might jus wake up one morning with a large amount of leaves in his driveway again.

Jeff

sheshovel
02-15-2006, 09:02 PM
So last year the vac cost him $120.00 and this year it cost him $250.00?
but the labor for the clean-up was pretty much the same?
Mustuve been about the same amount of leaves this year as last cuz the charge was the same correct?Your not making any sense here with your charges
I think you need to think this through a little better 1st.You asked what to do so that is my opinion.

freddyc
02-15-2006, 09:06 PM
Listen last year he didnt have any problem with the bill, I charged him $300 plus the cost of removal of leaves. This property is all down hill to a lake meaning there is a lot of labor involved, tarping, his yard is a mess, tree limbs, its a real difficult cleanup. $60/hr for 4 hours = 240 then another $60 for time spent helping vacumming, which acctually took about 2 hours. In all my estimates for cleanups...I tell the customer that the vaccumming will be extra, due to gas prices and increased dumping fees in my area the price went up. Bottem line he called me and said he wanted it done, after everything was in writing. Im gonna tell him that the guy who sucked them up is pissed cuz I didnt pay him yet and he said that he was going to dump the leaves back on his property, maybe thatll get him to pay me. We'll see what happens, he might jus wake up one morning with a large amount of leaves in his driveway again.

Jeff







It appears that he told you to go ahead based on a $280-300 number...not $550 or whatever. The amount of effort or time isn't the issue for him. Also, if you did the same exact thing for him last year, it doesn't matter either. The AGREEMENT you seem to have is for a total cleanup for $285.-300. If you put yourself in his shoes, you will see he was expecting a lower bill based on your conversation....one other question....he indicated that Sat was OK, ----did you confirm you'd be there on Sunday instead or did you just take it for granted it would be OK??

There seems to be a space between your assumptions and the agreement you made. Tell me if I'm wrong, but if I'm in his shoes, I think I'm getting taken for a couple hundred bux.

grass_cuttin_fool
02-15-2006, 09:10 PM
What was his total clean up bill for last year? You never told us that, just that the labor was about 300 plus leaf removal

wayne

sheshovel
02-15-2006, 09:28 PM
Yes he did grasscuttin read his last post above that is his last years price.That's why I said what I said Total last years.$360.00 total this years bill $550.00 and that's with givin the cust a break he said!ThaT'S WHY THE GUY DIDEN'T HAVE A PROBLEM with last years bill but does with this years bill.That's how I understand it anyway.

Stafford Landscaping
02-15-2006, 09:32 PM
On my jogs I always give a proposal with all the prices given. And things that the costermer wants beond the proposal is extra. I make sure the custermer understands that. And then I have 2 copys of the proposal that the custermer signs, one for him and one for me.
And on the bottom of the proposal it says if proposal not taken within 30 days
it is withdrawn. I know it seems like a lot of trouble to do this but it save a lot of headaces.

PurpHaze
02-15-2006, 10:37 PM
We'll see what happens, he might jus wake up one morning with a large amount of leaves in his driveway again.

The billing issue could be a criminal or civil issue based on your state's laws. However, based on what I've seen here already via posts, if this were the jury I'd think you'd be out of luck. Dumping the leaves back on his driveway may wind you up in trouble with the law.

NNJLandman
02-15-2006, 11:17 PM
Sheshovel I dont know if you have a vengence out against me or something, I appreciate your feedback but its getting a little hostile now and you dont have all the facts, I got some information from you guys....THANK YOU, and I talked to a few local buddies....so thanks Ill be taking care of it now.

Jeff

cleancutccl
02-16-2006, 12:30 AM
You would think that more people would learn from the mistakes of others on this site, DON'T DO ANYTHING WITHOUT A WRITTEN CONTRACT, and even to be more safe, add into your contract a clause for rain delays or other mother nature related delays. With all the frivolous lawsuits out there you cannot take a chance.hammer

sheshovel
02-16-2006, 04:18 PM
Believe me I have nothing against you and I thought you provided all the facts.With the facts you provided..the fact is you chartged the guy without approval on the price and you charged him $360 last year and $550.00 this year..like I say that is what I interpreted by the facts you provided here.Sorry if you took it personaly I have nothing against you at all.

YardPro
02-18-2006, 09:46 AM
didn't read all the posts, so i don't know if someone has said this....

if he wrote on the check " paid in full" or something of that manner, they if you cash it you accept those terms... you're SOL.

BUT if nothing was written on the bill, they he is legally bound to pay you the remainder...
I have been on the customer side of this and was informed by the judge that by me giving the guy ANY payment, i acknowledged that he did the work, and i legally agreed to pay the amount...
so file small claims on the guy.

yrdandgardenhandyman
02-19-2006, 03:23 AM
..had help...PERFECT(took us 4 hours $60/hr x 4 = $300),
Jeff


How many people did you split that $60.00/hr with?

yrdandgardenhandyman
02-19-2006, 03:24 AM
didn't read all the posts, so i don't know if someone has said this....

if he wrote on the check " paid in full" or something of that manner, they if you cash it you accept those terms... you're SOL.




That's not always true.

YardPro
02-19-2006, 08:48 AM
it is in nc
if someone writes terms on a check, and you cash or deposit it, then you are accepting thier terms.
had a client once try to pull this for a retaining wall..
job price was $3100.00. they were the pita from hell..
they finally wrote me a check for $2100.00 and wrote on the note portion of the check paid in full....
i called our attourney and asked it i deposited it would i still have any legal rights to pursue the remaining money.. he told me no..

AssuredServicesCo
02-20-2006, 01:29 AM
I think you will have to learn from this experience and remain resolved to be a bit more detailed on pricing or tell them you'll do it by the hour. I've made some pricingmistakes before by jumping the gun or doing more because I believed they would probably want it done but alot of people are so rude when it comes to service workers, and that's what we are, no matter how successful we are. Be smarter than them and you will succeed.

old dog 80
02-20-2006, 06:33 PM
If your client is as confused by your pricing as I am,you probably won't work there again.If you are charging $60/ hr as it seems by your post and you had 4 hours in it(is that crew hours or single man hours?) the cleanup cost $240.
Then you are charging $250/hr for vacuuming(as you first stated-1hr of
vacuuming and $250 extra).I think I will move to your market-I can "lowball"
and put you out of business! THE BEST THING YOU CAN DO IS SET AN APPOINTMENT WITH THE CLIENT AND WORK IT OUT FACE TO FACE!

Sin City Lawn Care
02-22-2006, 06:38 PM
As funny as it would be to see someone dump the leaves back at someones property..I would have to say dont. In most parts of the country that would actually be considered Vandalism.

If you didnt have a written agreement dont even bother goin to the cops, its not a crime if you cant prove you were intitled to the $$$ for the services.

Chock it up to a lesson learned and move on.