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TeamLawnCare
02-26-2006, 11:57 PM
I have been reading posts here on Lawnsite for over a year now and love to hear all of the opinions and experiences we all have for this industry. As I have been reading I came up with an idea that I hope to be able to kick around with everyone for a while. I'd like to call it "Project Lawnsite" I have been mowing and aerating lawns for 6 years now and just turned 18, I will graduate in June and have decided I am ready to take my business to the next level. The point of this thread is for you guys to help me have the most sucessful year, I plan on sharing everything with you we will vote on logo's, advertisements, what type of lawns I should pursue, basically everything to do with a business you will have input on. I will trust in the opinions of everyone and come to a general consensus of what we feel is best for my situation. In essence this is your oppurtunity to build your prototypical business model. Now for my background...
I have been doing various forms of lawncare for the past 6 years, mainly aeration and weekly lawn mowing. I have worked for a full time lawn care company in my area off and on as is needed and am good friends with many of the companies in my area. I started out just mowing neighborhood lawns like many and slowly progressed to where I maintained 33 accounts last year. I own...
97 Toyota Tacoma
5x10 Trailer
2 Honda 21" HRC216's
1 new Stihl Trimmer
1 new Stihl Blower
1 new Stihl Edger
1 Crap Homeowner John Deere Trimmer/Edger
1 BlueBird Aerator
1 Turfco Aerator
With all of that said lets develop a business model/plan. The one thing I have already decided was the name "Team Lawn Care" I like the use of TLC. Other than that everything is free game. Money is not too much of an issue. Should I register it as a Sole Proprieter or an LLC/DBA? Where does everyone think we should start "Project Lawnsite?"

Drew Gemma
02-27-2006, 12:06 AM
start as a sole prop then when the time is right your accountant will tell you with way to go. well to start and go professional get all the forms and paper bs needed then type up all kinds of forms and set up software then go out and pound on some doors and double the size of your business. That should keep you busy till next winter then you can start where you left off.

TeamLawnCare
02-27-2006, 07:13 PM
Ok I officially registered my name today, Now i need to start on a logo does anyone have any suggestions?

mulcahy mowing
02-27-2006, 07:20 PM
here's some
http://www.gophergraphics.com/index.cgi?page=artists
and here's mine thanks to grasscake:)
this should get you started pick the logo's you like best and then set up a poll

mcwlandscaping
02-27-2006, 07:20 PM
WELCOME TO LS, i like your idea of puting up a pole for business decions. for logo, something simple but eye catching, if its going to be on a truck, you want people to be able to take a quick glance at it, know what it is, and also remember it.

promower
02-27-2006, 07:43 PM
Keep in mind using a lot of colors in a logo can get expensive down the road in adverstising. Like MCW said keep it simple eyecatching and easy to read.

mcwlandscaping
02-27-2006, 07:53 PM
Mine is in this link http://www.lawnsite.com/showthread.php?t=133697 , part of the way down, thanks to grasscakes, just take off the bottom phone number and name part and thats the logo, the whole thing is the front part of my biz cards.

Mulcahy, after seeing yours, looks like grasscakes likes the Irish theme :)

Roger
02-27-2006, 10:24 PM
Hmmm, trying to run a business by committee. I never knew a successful business that was run by committee. Votes, general consensus, ... I don't want to put any damper on your enthusiasm, but every business needs a top dog to make decisions.

Let's see, how about starting with questions such as:

1. What is the best ZTR?
2. Should the lawns be bagged, mulched, or discharge the clippings?
3. How about giving some customers discounts because of ( )?

Since these are the easy ones to get a consensus, there will be plenty of time to move to the next step.

I do applaud your interest and enthusiasm to grow your business. If all 18 year olds were of this stipe, many things would be far better.

ALarsh
02-27-2006, 11:10 PM
I would have to say this is a bad idea also. You need to be able to identify what you need to succeed, who you should be targeting and where your business needs to go next. Nobody can tell you that but yourself.

Answers are going to be different for what your ultimate goal is for your company.

TeamLawnCare
02-27-2006, 11:22 PM
I want to thank everyone who has submitted input so far, everyone is taken into account. However with all threads their will be haters but I think some may have lost the theory behind this thread. This will be my company I will run it the way I feel is best for my situation. However the purpose of this thread is to help me develop along the way what this plan will be. I am looking for input on everything, so that I can draw on your knowledge so that I can make this first year of my business the most succesful and hopefully help others along the way. I am still awaiting anyways submitions for the logo. Is anyone good at designing and has something to throw out? I like the idea of keeping it simple but definately want it to catch the attention. Without too many colors as we want to keep printing at ease.

freddyc
02-27-2006, 11:42 PM
OK logo ideas.... I'm not creative, but here goes:

1/ Team lawncare--- a pic of a group of football players or marines pushing mowers across a nice striped lawn..tag line such as we keep pushin till its perfect.

2/ TLC---picture of a housewife with a mower or trimmer..tag line...something like... we treat your property like its our own.


Alright, stop laughing now! :hammerhead:

cgland
02-28-2006, 12:06 AM
You may be able to extract ideas such as logos, names and uniform colors, but when it comes down to "what types of lawns should I go for?" You will get a thousand and one opinions on why one is better. Only you can know which direction you want your business to go in, how much overhead you can live with, and how big you can get. Take the info you get from this site and apply it to your situation, wants, and needs. It is a cool idea though.

Chris

Roger
02-28-2006, 08:07 AM
I understand your approach of continuing to get input for ideas to run the company the way you wish to run it. But, you can more easily take the reverse approach and draw upon the many, many threads already posted on the topic for which you seek input. For example, logo -- I've seen hundreds of threads on that topic alone. The information is already here, much of it recently posted.

I know it is easy to post a new thread, seeking answers to a specific question, all neatly collected in one place. I have been reading threads for years on LS, and the same topic arises over and over again, sometimes in the same day, only a few threads apart! For the "long-time, experienced" people you wish to draw upon for information, the same question will likely will be passed over. They have seen it discussed over and over again, and discount considering yet one more contribution to your new thread.

hole in one lco
02-28-2006, 08:46 AM
well i got your slogan team lawn care dont be picked last or we play by the rules

TeamLawnCare
03-01-2006, 01:01 AM
I'm am liking the ideas so far. Still waiting for someone to submit a design for a logo. I will be meeting with a designer/printer tommorow to talk ideas. What should I make sure to speak with him about or make sure is included in my logo? I picked this name because I like the way it portrays us as a team and how they can join our team and we can use special phrases like "we will send one of our teams out to service your lawn tommorow" However I am contemplating whether to hire someone to run one of my trucks. My obstacle is that I am still in school until June, which cuts out 3/4 of my day. In order to maximize my profits would it be beneficial for me to hire somebody to run a truck from say 8-2:30 when I could take over? I know their is many factors to input such as, workers comp, payroll, insurance, the hastles of employees, more maintenance of equipment etc etc. However Say I am able to keep this truck running with a full schedule would it be more beneficial for me to hire someone or just keep it solo and maximize the profits I receive? What would you do in my situation?

K.Carothers
03-01-2006, 01:38 AM
I want to thank everyone who has submitted input so far, everyone is taken into account. However with all threads their will be haters but I think some may have lost the theory behind this thread. This will be my company I will run it the way I feel is best for my situation. However the purpose of this thread is to help me develop along the way what this plan will be. I am looking for input on everything, so that I can draw on your knowledge so that I can make this first year of my business the most succesful and hopefully help others along the way. I am still awaiting anyways submitions for the logo. Is anyone good at designing and has something to throw out? I like the idea of keeping it simple but definately want it to catch the attention. Without too many colors as we want to keep printing at ease.

I wish you the best. But what you are asking is to have everyone on this site be your exclusive consultants. Do like everyone else and read through the threads and post questions to get answers. It seems like you want lawnsite to build your business instead of doing your due diligence in finding the answers from this site, books, classes etc... This is not a turn key business.

Good luck!

kc

Soupy
03-01-2006, 02:11 AM
For quality logos start a contest here http://www.designoutpost.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=9

impactlandscaping
03-01-2006, 07:58 AM
Dude, where are all the cameras??? LOL...j/k..

Only you know what will work and what has worked for you in the past. Take everything with a grain of salt from online forums. Don't take advice from complete strangers on decisions that can make or break your business. Questions about equipment and such can be searched usually with great success. BTW- Take Soupy's advice and spend $ 100.00 or less and get a professional logo created.Best of luck...

ALarsh
03-01-2006, 08:37 AM
Still waiting for someone to submit a design for a logo.

You can't expect us to spend our time trying to design you a logo. This has cost all of the rest of us money to get designed and you have to remember that we are not graphic designers.

I would suggest you go spend your money at designoutpost.com

TPnTX
03-01-2006, 09:46 AM
Guys you can always just log off. If you don't have any input don't crowd his thread wth useless negativity in terms of his idea. WTF, who cares if he doesn't pay for a logo.

Logo -
Here this took me every bit of 5 minutes. Surely somebody can come up with something better.

http://i26.photobucket.com/albums/c105/tpntx/TLC/TLCLogo.jpg

mulcahy mowing
03-01-2006, 03:58 PM
larsh take a chillpill!!

Remsen1
03-01-2006, 05:13 PM
Awesome Logos at Gopher Graphics. If you pick one that was already made then it is cheaper and they'll put your name on it and do small modifications such as change colors or invert colors etc. You'll get high quality files (PDF, TIF, and JPG and whatever you like) when it is complete which is nice when it comes to submitting to the various different printing companies. I got my logo from them and have had signs made for the truck, business cards and all of my ads. It has saved me time and some money for editing fees since my images were high quality and needed no re-working to make them look nice.

ALarsh
03-01-2006, 05:23 PM
Guys you can always just log off. If you don't have any input don't crowd his thread wth useless negativity in terms of his idea. WTF, who cares if he doesn't pay for a logo.

Logo -
Here this took me every bit of 5 minutes. Surely somebody can come up with something better.

http://i26.photobucket.com/albums/c105/tpntx/TLC/TLCLogo.jpg

I'm just saying that he shouldn't expect much from lawn boys making graphic designs.

It really shows that the logo took 5 min. I could make that in word art in under 1 min. Anybody that uses that logo to represent their company has to be crazy.

DLCS
03-01-2006, 07:50 PM
I'm just saying that he shouldn't expect much from lawn boys making graphic designs.

It really shows that the logo took 5 min. I could make that in word art in under 1 min. Anybody that uses that logo to represent their company has to be crazy.


Just because you have a fancy logo doesn't mean you will have more business. I know guys who just have their name painted on their trucks and these guys are multi million dollar companies. Who cares how long the logo took to make, my concern if its something that passerbys will remember down the road. I want them to remember my name, I really don't care how fancy it is or how long it took to make. Next time you are out and about take a look at the trucks of larger contractors that have been in business for years and have made it(not just lawn companies). Alot of the bigger contractors in my area have just their name on their trucks not anything fancy but it does stand out which is the goal.

DLCS
03-01-2006, 07:54 PM
I'm just saying that he shouldn't expect much from lawn boys making graphic designs.

.


FYI, not everyone here started out as a "lawn boy". I'm sure there are some with graphics backgrounds here as members.;)

TPnTX
03-01-2006, 08:47 PM
Larsh you smart ass it's a start. A place to start. If you don't want anything to do with this guys idea why don't you take a hike. You sound like like a grumpy old fart, are you? Put up or shut up I guess. A I'm real impressed with your gifts on the PC. My 5 mins you can do in 1 min. Big wooo.

TPnTX
03-01-2006, 09:04 PM
Come to think of it most people I've known who talk so much smack don't have much to show. Since your so gifted and talented show me. Apparently your not in a rush or short on time. So instead running your head and going out of your way to impose negitivity why don't you impress us with your self proclaimed artistic abilities.

ALarsh
03-01-2006, 11:08 PM
All I did was offer my advice to go to www.designoutpost.com

This would be my "self proclaimed artistic abilities":
http://cclawnservice.com/Personal/LawnFolder/Door%20Hanger/front%20copy.jpg

http://cclawnservice.com/Personal/LawnFolder/Door%20Hanger/back%20copy.jpg

DLCS
03-01-2006, 11:17 PM
All I did was offer my advice to go to www.designoutpost.com

This would be my "self proclaimed artistic abilities":
http://cclawnservice.com/Personal/LawnFolder/Door%20Hanger/front%20copy.jpg

http://cclawnservice.com/Personal/LawnFolder/Door%20Hanger/back%20copy.jpg


...and what is so difficult about designing that logo. Anyone with a little ability can create that design. Get rid of the background picture and whats left? Really all TPnTX was trying to do was help the guy out, your smart comments were not needed. BTW TPnTX logo looks great.

MMLawn
03-01-2006, 11:28 PM
Larsh you smart ass it's a start. A place to start. If you don't want anything to do with this guys idea why don't you take a hike. You sound like like a grumpy old fart, are you? Put up or shut up I guess. A I'm real impressed with your gifts on the PC. My 5 mins you can do in 1 min. Big wooo.


Actually he just a 16 year old high school kiddie that only comes on here to start crap and you summed him up in your first line. He should of been banned long ago. You won't many post where he has ever given any helpful words.....but you will find a ton like this one.

Course at 16 he doesn't have any advice to give except how walk around the neighbor and beg to cut daddy's buddies lawns. Don't even sweat this KID :laugh:

ALarsh
03-02-2006, 12:00 AM
Must be doing something right...

http://cclawnservice.com/Personal/Chevrolet%202500/New/IMG_2633.jpg
http://cclawnservice.com/Personal/LawnFolder/Equipment/IMG_2594.jpg

I'm done w/ this thread. :dizzy:

MMLawn
03-02-2006, 12:09 AM
Must be doing something right...


I'm done w/ this thread. :dizzy:


<b>Yeah, according to YOUR OWN POST you just run to daddy..</b> :laugh:



My dad covered the $18K for me until I get the ranger sold. I'm paying my dad $18K as soon as the ranger sells.

Rained all day today. Will take those pictures when it clears up.

ALarsh
03-02-2006, 12:31 AM
Just to clarify something:

I'm glad you took that out of the context to look like my dad paid for the truck. Congratulations. :clapping:

The ranger sold and I paid him the $18K. I loaned it from him for about a week while I was completing the transaction. After all, I'm sure you have never loaned money before, never. Thanks

Its amazing how these threads can change.:dizzy:

cgland
03-02-2006, 12:34 AM
And you want to take business advice from these idiots???:dizzy: :hammerhead: Go ahead!:laugh:

Chris

TPnTX
03-02-2006, 12:43 AM
So your just a kid? Alarsh go to your room. I almost feel stupid for engaging him....almost.

Hey kid. Tell me the differnce in your logo and the one I did in 5 minutes. Haha oh my god this is funny. You are so stupid. hahaha.

This is what you call artistic. I cannot stop laughing.
http://i26.photobucket.com/albums/c105/tpntx/TLC/smartass.jpg

TPnTX
03-02-2006, 12:48 AM
no seriously here is mine. It's taken me hours not minutes to get where I it is. I like a lot and I really don't care what anyone else thinks. I used Publisher and it cost me nothing.
http://i43.photobucket.com/albums/e362/TPShow/DetailLogo.jpg

K.Carothers
03-02-2006, 12:48 AM
I think this thread is done.

:sleeping: :sleeping: :sleeping: :sleeping: :sleeping: :sleeping: :sleeping:

TPnTX
03-02-2006, 01:04 AM
[And you want to take business advice from these idiots???]

Oh Thanks Chris....

TeamLawnCare
03-02-2006, 01:09 AM
Well thank you guys for officially hacking my thread... Now that it's over can we please get back to my predicament. I spoke with a graphic designer today about designing a logo and he said he would exchange his services for one of my aerations. So i'm pretty excited to go back and see what he has to offer on saturday. Maybe I will post a few and allow for some consideration. I am still open to any ideas that come along from any fellow lawnsite members. As for my situation of hiring someone or just maxing out as a solo while still in school (this was explained early in the thread before the hacking) Does anyone have any input on this subject?

K.Carothers
03-02-2006, 02:15 AM
Well thank you guys for officially hacking my thread... Now that it's over can we please get back to my predicament. I spoke with a graphic designer today about designing a logo and he said he would exchange his services for one of my aerations. So i'm pretty excited to go back and see what he has to offer on saturday. Maybe I will post a few and allow for some consideration. I am still open to any ideas that come along from any fellow lawnsite members. As for my situation of hiring someone or just maxing out as a solo while still in school (this was explained early in the thread before the hacking) Does anyone have any input on this subject?

Spend some time with the search button.

Team Gopher
03-02-2006, 08:08 AM
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Hi,

Thanks for thinking of us with the logos. I am glad to see all those free logo templates we have collected over the years are still helping everyone out.

<table width=100%>
<tr bgcolor="#C0C0C0"><td align=left><a HREF="http://www.gophersoftware.com/?ref=1">Download and try Gopher Free for 30 days.</a><BR>Our software can help you.</td><TD align="center"></td><td><a HREF="http://www.gophergraphics.com/forum/cgi-bin/ikonboard.cgi?act=ST&f=1&t=1713&st=&&#entry9482"><img width="468" height="60" src=http://www.gophergraphics.com/images/talk-radio-2.jpg ALT="Gopher Business Talk Radio"></A></td></tr></table>
<center>Free Web Templates (http://www.gophergraphics.com/forum/cgi-bin/ikonboard.cgi?act=ST;f=15;t=898). Make your own logo Free (http://www.gophergraphics.com/forum/cgi-bin/ikonboard.cgi?act=ST;f=1;t=1453).</center>

Remsen1
03-02-2006, 11:44 AM
Well thank you guys for officially hacking my thread... Now that it's over can we please get back to my predicament. I spoke with a graphic designer today about designing a logo and he said he would exchange his services for one of my aerations. So i'm pretty excited to go back and see what he has to offer on saturday. Maybe I will post a few and allow for some consideration. I am still open to any ideas that come along from any fellow lawnsite members. As for my situation of hiring someone or just maxing out as a solo while still in school (this was explained early in the thread before the hacking) Does anyone have any input on this subject?

Don't jump too soon to give away work. Please, check out Gopher, I'm telling you, you won't regret it as it can't hurt to look. The aeration you're giving away is a much higher value than the amount you would spend choosing a graphic from gopher.

TeamLawnCare
03-02-2006, 11:15 PM
Don't jump too soon to give away work. Please, check out Gopher, I'm telling you, you won't regret it as it can't hurt to look. The aeration you're giving away is a much higher value than the amount you would spend choosing a graphic from gopher.

I love gopher and everything they stand for I am looking into purchasing their scheduling software however my friend is a very well known graphic artist and has been known to do a lot of popular items for big companies so I told him if he made a logo I liked I would do the aeration which is only about a $35 job in my opinion I really have nothing to lose and if I dont see what I like then I will definately hop on the Gopher. However as of now I feel I need to stay loyal to his business and see what comes of it.

Soupy
03-02-2006, 11:23 PM
I love gopher and everything they stand for I am looking into purchasing their scheduling software however my friend is a very well known graphic artist and has been known to do a lot of popular items for big companies so I told him if he made a logo I liked I would do the aeration which is only about a $35 job in my opinion I really have nothing to lose and if I dont see what I like then I will definately hop on the Gopher. However as of now I feel I need to stay loyal to his business and see what comes of it.

You want business advise?? No aeration is only worth $35. It cost a minimum of $30-35 to rent an aerator and that is for 4 hours only. Then you would have to pick it up, use it (not easy), then clean it, and take it back (customers know this). If I was you I would set your minimum at least $60. I don't care if your only aerating a patch of turf the size of a welcome mat. None the less... in this situation and you guys are friends? then I see no harm in helping each other out.

TeamLawnCare
03-02-2006, 11:35 PM
You want business advise?? No aeration is only worth $35. It cost a minimum of $30-35 to rent an aerator and that is for 4 hours only. Then you would have to pick it up, use it (not easy), then clean it, and take it back (customers know this). If I was you I would set your minimum at least $60. I don't care if your only aerating a patch of turf the size of a welcome mat. None the less... in this situation and you guys are friends? then I see no harm in helping each other out.

I'm sorry but you have got to know your market. Here in Utah anyone and everyone knows how to aerate a lawn it is a huge service that boy scouts do for fund raisers and such. There is a lot of money to be made in it however for this size of lawn $35 is very competitive. I own two aerators that I picked up for $700 and I know I can easily net 10k off of these two machines this year if I set my prices right.

Soupy
03-03-2006, 12:38 AM
I'm sorry but you have got to know your market. Here in Utah anyone and everyone knows how to aerate a lawn it is a huge service that boy scouts do for fund raisers and such. There is a lot of money to be made in it however for this size of lawn $35 is very competitive. I own two aerators that I picked up for $700 and I know I can easily net 10k off of these two machines this year if I set my prices right.

I'm sorry to hear that.... Looks like the scouts could use some advice too. Oh well... I tried to contribute to your thread. Sounds like you know your market pretty well so I don't see what we can to offer you.

TeamLawnCare
03-03-2006, 01:03 AM
I'm sorry to hear that.... Looks like the scouts could use some advice too. Oh well... I tried to contribute to your thread. Sounds like you know your market pretty well so I don't see what we can to offer you.

My question wasnt what I should charge for aeration I just reiterated the fact that i'm not losing anything by going through my friend for my logo at this point. If it doesnt work out then I will definately hop on with Gopher. Now can we stay on topic?

Soupy
03-03-2006, 05:06 PM
I have been reading posts here on Lawnsite for over a year now and love to hear all of the opinions and experiences we all have for this industry. As I have been reading I came up with an idea that I hope to be able to kick around with everyone for a while. I'd like to call it "Project Lawnsite" I have been mowing and aerating lawns for 6 years now and just turned 18, I will graduate in June and have decided I am ready to take my business to the next level. The point of this thread is for you guys to help me have the most sucessful year, I plan on sharing everything with you we will vote on logo's, advertisements, what type of lawns I should pursue, basically everything to do with a business you will have input on. I will trust in the opinions of everyone and come to a general consensus of what we feel is best for my situation. In essence this is your oppurtunity to build your prototypical business model. Now for my background...
I have been doing various forms of lawncare for the past 6 years, mainly aeration and weekly lawn mowing. I have worked for a full time lawn care company in my area off and on as is needed and am good friends with many of the companies in my area. I started out just mowing neighborhood lawns like many and slowly progressed to where I maintained 33 accounts last year. I own...

With all of that said lets develop a business model/plan. The one thing I have already decided was the name "Team Lawn Care" I like the use of TLC. Other than that everything is free game. Money is not too much of an issue. Should I register it as a Sole Proprieter or an LLC/DBA? Where does everyone think we should start "Project Lawnsite?"

I thought I was on topic.. I offered you a great place to get a logo. You found a place on your own and thats fine. Then I offered you direction in pricing (which is a big part of being as successful as you can and also pertains in building a business plan).

You have not given us any advertisement or logos to vote on yet. As for as what size properties you should pursue??? We need to know your areas market for that one and you said you have that part covered. The best thing for you to do is keep track of time on each property and then determine which size brings in the most money. For me it is the under 30 minute lawns that fall into our minimum charge.

Just out of curiosity what would you charge your friend to mow his lawn? The one that is doing your design work.

Here is some advice that will help you obtain your goal in this thread.. Don't be rude to the people trying to help you. If you don't here exactly what you want then don't argue and demand to get back on topic when you haven't given us a good direction of what that is. In other words be nice and give more details...

TeamLawnCare
03-22-2006, 07:52 PM
Well guys I have been very busy lately with my marketing end of things but am rushing to make it as the snow should all be melted within the next two days but I finalized my logo, printed 1000 business cards for free, got 8 magnetic signs for $50, and just put in my order for 2500 doorhangers!!! I will post up my doorhanger within the next few days but here is my logo wondering what you all think...

M RASCOE&SONS
03-22-2006, 08:17 PM
:cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: I'm just saying that he shouldn't expect much from lawn boys making graphic designs.

It really shows that the logo took 5 min. I could make that in word art in under 1 min. Anybody that uses that logo to represent their company has to be crazy.

hillndale
03-22-2006, 10:26 PM
Well guys I have been very busy lately with my marketing end of things but am rushing to make it as the snow should all be melted within the next two days but I finalized my logo, printed 1000 business cards for free, got 8 magnetic signs for $50, and just put in my order for 2500 doorhangers!!! I will post up my doorhanger within the next few days but here is my logo wondering what you all think...

It Looks good to me. Simple, stands out, and plenty of ways to use the word TEAM in your advertising. I'd make "a cut above the rest" bold and take away the quotation marks.

hillndale

Freddy_Kruger
03-22-2006, 11:39 PM
here's some
http://www.gophergraphics.com/index.cgi?page=artists
and here's mine thanks to grasscake:)
this should get you started pick the logo's you like best and then set up a poll
Nice link:clapping: