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qps
02-27-2006, 04:13 PM
Is it worth it to store diesel on site, and what kind of cost are involved, locally they provide tanks for free but you must purchase min. of 100 gals at a time...still waiting on cost per gallon, just seems like we waste to much time at gas stations during our season....

Scag48
02-27-2006, 04:58 PM
What about a transfer tank in the back of your truck? 120 gallons could go a long way with the size of equipment you're running. I'm trying to get my stubborn old man to put one in his truck but he says it's "a waste of money" :dizzy: . The only guys I've ever seen store fuel on site were very large companies that would bring in a 1,000 gallon tank. Of course, they were running 4-5 scrapers, 3 D8's, a Zaxis 600, 3 Volvo A40 trucks, and a grader, but you get the picture. Most of the other contractors who were large in size would have their lube guys fuel at the end of the day/early in the AM so operators weren't responsible. That's the kind of job I need, no grease gun, no fueling, just get to the fun stuff!

JB1
02-27-2006, 05:03 PM
not really a price savings on fuel but where you save is everybody standing aroud the station or then when you figure how much junk food and drinks you buy , you really save then.

CutRight
02-27-2006, 07:50 PM
look into a transfer tank. I dont know if theres any in your area but Tractor Supply Company has some decent prices.

qps
02-27-2006, 09:19 PM
not really a price savings on fuel but where you save is everybody standing aroud the station or then when you figure how much junk food and drinks you buy , you really save then.

They quoted a price per gallon higher than all the stations around here...maybe transfer tank is the way to go for now...

Dirty Water
02-27-2006, 09:51 PM
They quoted a price per gallon higher than all the stations around here...maybe transfer tank is the way to go for now...

Odd, I would have thought they would be selling pink, which goes for about 40 cents per gallon cheaper than road diesel here.

qps
02-27-2006, 09:55 PM
Odd, I would have thought they would be selling pink, which goes for about 40 cents per gallon cheaper than road diesel here.

I didn't get a price for off road since we use most of it in our trucks...don't need those problems from the DOT

Dirty Water
02-27-2006, 09:58 PM
I didn't get a price for off road since we use most of it in our trucks...don't need those problems from the DOT

Ah, I don't see the point of onsite fuel at all then if your going to use it in your truck.

Unless you have a nice shop and you put a 1,000 gallon tank and a pump in, that would be real nice.

qps
02-27-2006, 10:09 PM
Ah, I don't see the point of onsite fuel at all then if your going to use it in your truck.

Unless you have a nice shop and you put a 1,000 gallon tank and a pump in, that would be real nice.

In the process of building a 4000 sf building and it would more of a convience thing...

janb
02-27-2006, 11:50 PM
I... it would more of a convience thing... Don't forget the liability, permitting and issue of maintaining a tank.

BE SURE to have a good water trap (condensation / hydroscopic) and good filter, and plans to clean the tank every so often

New tanks (truck and above ground storage) are ~$1/gal - used $.50
You can also get used saddle tanks pretty cheap, a rectangular step tank would be pretty ez to deal with

Good 12V Transfer pumps are a couple hundred bucks

I currently don't have one at home, but have in my past (farm life) We kept pretty strict rules for Off-road use. We do have a creditcard 'off-road' pump on the island at local fuel station, but it gets abused terribly, last week had to wait 10 minutes for a guy to 'top off' his 2006 VW Jetta using 'vent trick' (7 total gals-off road):rolleyes: (he spilled, then wiped the car down with windshield cleaner) before I could dump 30 gal into the SkidSteer (>10 min)

Gravel Rat
02-27-2006, 11:58 PM
Its better to have a tank at home where you have the local fuel supplier to fill up and you have a slip tank in your P/U truck. Its the way the contractors do it here its safer easier and no risk of having a fuel spill on your jobsite.

If you are doing a large project then you have a site fuel truck where the fuel company comes to fill up the truck but it never leaves the site.

We call them Tidy tanks which is what you put in the back of the P/U truck.

SLSNursery
02-28-2006, 06:59 AM
For efficiency's sake, tanks at your shop are the way to go. We have a 550 for Red Diesel (off-road - no road taxes paid), a 550 for Clear Diesel (for the trucks), and a 500 for Gasoline (mostly for equipment). The 550s are Steel tanks with containment, and the Gas tank is a Convault. We picked up a 4000 gallon steel containment tank last year, but I will wait to fill that until the price on diesel adjusts down after the winter (I hope).

Here are some notes to consider:

Everthing electrical has to be explosion proof. We have run conduit from the shop to the outdoor panel in rigid steel conduit. The connections are all explosion proof at each pump. There are is an emergency shutoff at the panel and one inside the building. If you are building now, run the conduit even if you don't put the tank in yet.

Pricing is not the key to having tanks, convenience and control is. When you fill up smaller tanks (550s or 1000s) you are not really going to save too much dough. Usually you'll pay a supplier rack price, plus a markup, plus a flat delivery. I think it is $135 or so for the tanker whether it is 500 or 5000 gallons. You can do the math to see how that affects the per gallon price. If you steadily turn over smaller tanks, you'll never be too far off from the pump price. In our case, I could sit on the 4000 for a few weeks, and that just might cost too much extra. We use about 550 gallons in the trucks every 7-10 days in season. Even more when we run the bigger trucks daily.


Our savings comes because on any given day 15-25 guys aren't going to a gas station and blowing 15-20 minutes on my clock. Not to mention the horror show of credit cards, gas money used for food/cigarettes, etc. We have tried different methods of improving upon the efficiency of having the tanks right at the shop. Besides the obvious points of never having to go get fuel, we've tried to have one guy fuel everything everyday, we tried all trucks fuel every morning, etc. I think that having each truck fuel at the end of the day so it is ready in the morning works best. It takes some management and discipline, but it is easier than having them stop somewhere on the way in and fill up each day. Plus, the whole crew can prep machines, fill them up, sharpen blades, etc.

You will find that fuel wholesalers don't want to make the small drops because of inconvenience to them, but if you explain that you'll pay for the convenience it generally works out. And, if you have a vendor that will supply the tanks, that sounds pretty good.

Red vs. Clear - we run plenty of off road equipment. Screener, Grinder, machines and more. This stuff all uses the premium diesel died red so the road taxes are removed. Last year, a friendly agent from the IRS stopped in and stuck some tanks just to make sure we were following the advice I had printed on our signs. She was happy to see the rules posted in Spanish and in English and went on her way. Once you build a shop, you are on the radar.

Good luck.

TerraFirma Excavating
02-28-2006, 12:52 PM
On larger jobs, I have just had the fuel company bring a tanker truck out every evening to fuel the equipment onsite. Just have all the equipment lined up and their fuel truck driver fueled at no extra cost to me. The fuel company also gave me a bulk fuel discount because we were using large quantities of fuel. Also was only invoiced monthly, so only one fuel bill to pay. I would also have our service truck with a 120 gallon bulk tank on back filled along with the rest of the equipment. The bulk tank on the service truck was used to fill smaller equipment like skid steers, compactors, etc....

On the smaller scale, when I take the skid steer to a small job, a drum of fuel with a 12V transfer pump usually provides enough fuel for about 3 days work. I am looking at fabricating a fuel tank slung underneath the deck of my trailer, either just ahead of the axles or above the axles if space permits. This will free up the trailer deck and the truck bed. I can't decide whether to wire the 12V pump to it's own battery on the trailer or just use a cord with alligator clips and use the battery on the skid steer or compact excavator.