Patio off of house?

[steveair]

Hello,

I have a proposal submitted to a client for a small patio/landing off of a sliding glass door at the back of the house that will step down to the patio.

My question is, what kind of construction details do I need to consider having a landing built againt the house that is going to be filled with stone. I was planning on using techo block to construct the landing with a paver area that will be about flush with the bottom of the sliding door sill. It will only have one step between the top and the patio.

I am figuring it as a deck, needing a moisture barrier to protect the rim joist from the moisture that will be right up against it. Also, some sort of spill guard to keep water from creeping in between the new landing and the house. I will have to remove/trim some vinyl siding to accomdate the landing as it will be wider than the sliding glass door. Currently, there is no siding directly under the door, just bare wood (ther rim joinst) with a 'make shift' staircase the builder installed.

I have an experienced carpenter to assist me, and give me some advice, but am seeing if there are any other considerations that we may have both missed. I'm also going to to give a call to the town building code office to make sure they don't have any other funny requirements.


steveair

[paul]

We use solid block along the house keep it about a 1/4" away from the house and replace the wood with pressure treated wood using a good caulk around it.

[steveair]

Paul,

when you say solid block, do you mean you set regular building block with mortarted joints along the back edge? Would it be possible/ideal to build a wall out of the techo block with the fae towards the house instead, and then maybe have a plastic liner/fabric lining the inside so moister doesn't seep out over time?

Also, you say 'replace the wood with pressure treated. I assume you mean attach a piece to the existing rim joinst under the door that is the same width as the joinst, then seal it up.

steveair

[paul]

Steve, we have solid wall units here made by Versa-lok we turn then in so flat side is along the wall, and yes use treated lumber on anything buried untill you are below foundation wall

[steveair]

thanks,

I'm familiar with the solid units. They would probably be the best bet, but techo does not have them in their line.

Most jobs I've done, I've always had a 'step down from the house' so that the pad is just at the bottom of the sill. I just want to make sure I don't rot these peoples house apart 5 years down the line. I like the idea of having the landing flush with the door so that you don't have to walk out the door and take a 'blind step' so to speak.

steveair

[FIREMAN]

Steve , condurso's sells anchor wall stone.maybe you could call and check thier stock..ED

[Stonehenge]

We use V-Lok as well, sounds like a similar process to the one Paul uses. We have no wood at all - we remove any that's against the house, down to the vapor barrier.

We trim the vinyl and install J-channel around the new siding lines (which is a lot like building a house and then putting in the basement). Requires some finnagling (sp?). Then we put up some aluminum trim coil that either matches or coordinates with the siding. This trim coil (painted sheet aluminum) extends into/beneath the j-channel, meets the door sill, and covers everything down to the foundation. Then it's caulked - all along the j-channel, and over all the nails you used to put up the trim coil. Then the V-Lok block goes in. Once the perimeter or 'frame' is built and the interior is filled with block, we sweep sand over everything to fill the voids/grooves/holes in the V-Lok.

[steveair]

Hello,

thank you all for the help. I really never thought about building a wall along the back side of the stoop. I already gave them a estimate, but luckily added a nice 'fudge' factor that will easily cover the cost of the extra time and material. I may change it a little bit, but at least I know I am on the right track.



And fireman, thanks for the tip. I also believe grinnel makes a solid unit also, which is basically the same as the anchor block. Hopefully I can get them though. The solid blocks always seem to be on back order or unavailable. Maybe I can get some color rejects for a good price at the factory though.



steveair

[Henry]

Steveair,

I see we're not too far from each other and I am giving a proposal for the same type of job. That house wouldn't happen to be in Wayne would it?

[steveair]

Henry,

no, the job is in Flanders. It would be funny though to find out two people here on lawnsite are bidding on the same job. We may have to have a 'clause' in the rules and reg section to prevent this type of thing:) I bet, in the future, its bound to happen eventually.

I actually am bidding against a company called 'harolds landscaping' down there. The homeowner said my drawing/plan blew them away, as they only had a hand drawn sketch on grid paper. My pricing was about the same, maybe even a little more, but they were impressed by the drawing. They are a much larger company than me, lots of fancy trucks/machines, lots of help. It always makes me feel good to go head to head with the big boys and get the job.

Say, I just got an estimate to look at a walkway/patio up in bloomingdale/kinnelon. Thats up in your area. Haven't been any jobs out like that in the last week have you?



steveair

[steveair]

Hello again,

Been a while for this post but wanted to bring it back up again.

I am quickly approaching the job and had a few more questions on constructing the stoop out of block.

My first question is do any of you bring the stoop to the same level of the door or do you always drop the stoop below the door and create a step?

From what I have learned, it is code to always leave the stoop below the door sill and have a step (I mean you have to step up from the level of the stoop into the door). I guess the main reasoning behind this is that in the winter, if snow piles up, and the door swings outwards, then you have some clearance and the door will still open.

I really want to eliminate this step, and have the stoop almost flush with the bottom of the door. It is a sliding glass door, so I can't see it being a problem for snow. I don't like the idea of having to step down as soon as you leave the house, especially as it leads to a patio that will be used for BBQ's and what not and people will be carrying all sorts of stuff in and out of the house. I always find this step to be kind of 'blind'. Basically, I want to construct it as most wood decks are, just about flush with the bottom of the door. Any comments on this?

Second, do you always build the stoop solid? or can you first construct the perimeter of the stoop and then fill in and compact with stone. I've seen it done both ways, and have seen jobs where it was filled with stone rather that solid block and it seems to hold up well over time. What are anyone's thoughts on this? I will be using pavers on the top platform of the stoop.

Finally, what about footings? Is a footing below the frost line necessary for this type of construction. I've seen enough done without them, but wonder if all of you excavate deeper for the stoop base.

Thanks for any responses.

steveair

[Rex Mann]

Steveair,

We build steps/stoops all the time using just retaining wall units.

We do not install a footer. the wall units are desinged as a flexible system. We excavate to our normal depths. We build the stoop then fill it in with crushed limestome.

The step out onto the stoop is a personal choice. I do not like to put it flush. Always like to leave some room for heaving and snow. However, you can use this step as the floater to loose any extra inches or pitch. Also, you can make the tread/platform of the step larger to make it easier to turn around with an armload of BBQ and close the door. Very easy to do because you are using pavers.

Rex

[steveair]

Hello,

Needed to get some pics of this the other day to show a potential customer who is thinking of doing the same thing.

Just wanted to say 'thank you' to everyone who helped me out on this one.

I ended up using pieces of everyone's ideas, and it turned out great.

Don't think it would of turned out anywhere as nice without all of your help.

http://albums.photopoint.com/j/View?u=1437001&a=13884411&p=55660448

http://albums.photopoint.com/j/View?u=1437001&a=13884411&p=55660459

steve

[Henry]

Steveair,

I haven't seen this thread since I last posted to it but no, I didn't bid on any paver jobs in Kinnelon area.

Speaking of bidding on the same job. Back in the summer I went to look at planting job with my brother in-law who has a lawn maint. biz. The HO wanted to plant some junipers on a steep hill to prevent erosion. 3-4 weeks later a friend (also in lanscaping) asks if I would look a wall job with him. Same house. The following week I get a call from the same lady.

Anyway, they apparently couldn't find a scrub to build a 6' high wall cheap enough so their a/g pool sits at the bottom of a hill full of jersey palms and weeds.