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View Full Version : Toro Warranty and Service "Not good"


louviljlj
06-23-2006, 10:11 PM
I bought a new Toro Proline 48" Walkbehind. Mowed about 2 hours with it but was concerned becuase of vibration. Found all three spindles appear to be bent where the pully is attached on top. When you spin the pulleys you see a very extreme wobble of the top spindle. I noticed when I looked under mower that the grease was coming out of the middle spindle bottom bearing and it was grinding when I would spin it. Brought it to Toro Service Center for warranty repair but they would only replace the bearing not the spindle because they were saying it is normal for it to wobble. Anyone know how much wobble is acceptable and is this normal. I had a hard time understanding why they would take the spindle apart to put new bearing but not replace the shaft which must be bent. The one the bearings went out on was the worse wobble of all three. The service center told me not to bring it back to them and seek service elsewhere because I questioned why they wouldn't replace the bent spindle and called them incompetent.

TWUllc
06-23-2006, 10:47 PM
Take that back to wherever you bought it from. Only 2 hours on the machine?

sildoc
06-23-2006, 10:58 PM
I have had no problem with service or waranty work from toro. I do admit there is a difference in dealers. I would contact toro directly and light a fire up there ass to get it fixed. 2 hours would put a sour taste in my mouth as well.

6'7 330
06-23-2006, 11:04 PM
This is why when choosing a mower, or any equipment one must think about the after buy dealer relationship. We switched over to Toro in 05, nothing but great service. That is the reason we switched to Toro and did not go elsewhere to stay with Exmark,our dealer takes care of us.As others said, get in touch with Toro, get a fire lit under the dealers ass.

Tharrell
06-24-2006, 08:22 AM
I don't want you to get the wrong idea because I'm going to say something you may not like to hear. No matter what, don't call someone incompetent or threaten them with words. You never get what you want and it makes everything worse as you can see. You may feel like they are incompetent and they may be incompetent but, you lose an avenue of recourse when you burn a bridge like that.
You could very well be in the right but, your attitude and actions have overshadowed that now.

Budget
06-24-2006, 10:46 AM
In a nice way i would ask them to show me another unit of the same model do the same thing. If you still get wall ask the guy for his full name so you can make a complaint. I have worked my whole life in the service industry and always trying to make the customer happy, that part of the job if you don't like it, go find a job that you do. As a facilities supervisor you have lay down the law and i have used that line many times. A few walked but in my book they couldn't hack it anyways...

viper00085
06-24-2006, 03:58 PM
most all spindle pulleys on all units look bent/wobbling when spun. its kind of normal, its just that these are not machined pulleys so they all look weird when spun. But the vibration was a def give away along with noise that something was up with a spindle. The way we check them, is to remove the belt and then spin each one with a big drill motor i made for this purpose that i can put diff sockets on, I can spin em up pretty fast and here what noises they are making. The shop was right in just repl brgs if the shaft and housing were not damaged. Got to remember, we dont wty anything, toro does, so we try to do what they tell us to. the dealer merely represents them, so ifthey put a $200 spindle assy on there and toro rejected the claim, that dealer is out some big money. Just like your business, we dont operate and do services to loose money and go out of business.

being a serv manager for several dealerships, i have seen some people come in with great attitudes even when they were in big trouble with down units under wty and those are the people we love to help (I love being a hero!!). I always tell everything come in , be nice, we know your hurting and in trouble, and we will work with you. the ones that come in and chew us out for a unit we did not make always hit my sore spot and dealerships remember this. oh and all dealers are not the best people in the world, i have worked for some wierd ones and yes then its time to try some where new!! :-)

louviljlj
06-24-2006, 09:09 PM
I didn't state all the facts. I contacted toro about the problem and they told me to bring to the service center. I dropped off and told them what was wrong and tried to show them what was wrong and they said I didn't need to they would take care of it. A week later they called and said nothing was wrong with the mower and I could come pick it up. I said thats not right the bottom bearing shield had failed and the bearings were grinding and they need to check it out again. The guy explained to me saying it was normal because it has a zerk fitting for greasing. It has no grease fitting they are sealed so he needs to look at it himself and not depend on service tech to say its ok. The wobbly spindle just seems odd to me when you spin it by hand it is off about a 1/4" from center I just can't believe that is acceptable. He said they would replace all three spindles since it is brand new. He called a week later and said it was ready, but when I got there he said Toro told them to only replace the bearings. When I talked to toro they said the dealer told them they were fine so thier is some confusion going on here. I am just using common sense here but I would have replaced the spindle when a customer has only used the mower for a day and the bearings go out and it is wobbly. I went to another dealer and he said the shaft is bent but he is backed up for two weeks so I just took it home till Toro tells me what to do.I live 50 miles away so it is not easy for me to be driving this thing around but I need to figure out what is going on before I waste my time again. I can mow with the mower but I am not satisfied with the quality of spindle so if this is normal I wouldn't have bought it.

louviljlj
06-24-2006, 09:26 PM
This is what I see when I look at the spindle from the top I see the pulley and protruding from it the spindle screw with a nut on it. When I take the belt off and spin it the spindle top part screw is wobbling about a 1/4" off center looks really bad. The pulley is wobbly but that screw part extending from it and doing what it is doing just seems wrong. The spindle should be machined right? I can understand the pulley being not perfect but the shaft should be doing what it is doing right? If I am wrong and this is ok then please let me know. The vibration is still and issue even with the new bearings I have getting a really high bass pitch noise, even with headphones on it still hurts my ears "is this normal?"

Tharrell
06-25-2006, 05:44 AM
I'm going to assume that your spindle is similar to my Bob-Cat. When you take your blades off, the whole bolt comes off, right? Could the bolt itself be bent? My bolt slides up from the bottom and the nut goes on top.

topsites
06-25-2006, 08:44 AM
I don't want you to get the wrong idea because I'm going to say something you may not like to hear. No matter what, don't call someone incompetent or threaten them with words. You never get what you want and it makes everything worse as you can see. You may feel like they are incompetent and they may be incompetent but, you lose an avenue of recourse when you burn a bridge like that.
You could very well be in the right but, your attitude and actions have overshadowed that now.

I agree 100 percent, whenever I run into this incompetence, the best thing to do is keep things quiet and at least on an even keel while you're there, let them finish and just keep this all to yourself as you always have the option to never return. Never returning is by far the best revenge, it doesn't give the same kind of instant satisfaction, but it really is better as an answer. Last but not least, before I get in an argument whenever I think they fixed it wrong, I do at least give them the courtesy of trying it out, you can always try it out right outside their store, and if it works...

As for the wobble, no, neither of my 48" prolines do it, both of them the belt runs around smooth as silk BUT there is some vibration that comes with wear and tear, I can not afford to replace bearings every time one develops the slightest vibe, on the other hand there is no axle or center shaft in these things... If you suspect it is the axle or whatever center piece, consider replacing the blade bolt, if that isn't quite straight then that might do it. You might also check the blades for balance, and grease coming out of the bottom, you didn't somehow try to grease these sealed bearings, did you?

See this:
I'm going to assume that your spindle is similar to my Bob-Cat. When you take your blades off, the whole bolt comes off, right? Could the bolt itself be bent? My bolt slides up from the bottom and the nut goes on top.

Correct, close enough, same thing.

sildoc
06-25-2006, 11:35 AM
I had a similar experience with a small vibration. I made sure the blade was ballanced and it was still there. I changed out the spindle bolt and that fixed the problem. I now regularly change them out once a year. They cost 3.50 from the hardware store or 7.00 each from toro. No difference. I have a feeling that over time of torquing the bolts on they start to twist some and slightly warp. It is a cheap fix.

louviljlj
06-27-2006, 10:56 PM
I guess in a nutshell does anyone have a Toro Walkbehind that they can look at and tell me if when they remove the belt and spin the spindle pulley by hand is it normal for the spindle shaft to wobble excessively? The bearings were grinding and you could hardly spin the blade after having only used the mower for 2 hours. The mower is brand new only had it for a few days. The bottom shield failed and the grease came out that is what caused the bearings to fail. It was not wear and tear it was a defect.

sildoc
06-27-2006, 11:10 PM
I guess in a nutshell does anyone have a Toro Walkbehind that they can look at and tell me if when they remove the belt and spin the spindle pulley by hand is it normal for the spindle shaft to wobble excessively? The bearings were grinding and you could hardly spin the blade after having only used the mower for 2 hours. The mower is brand new only had it for a few days. The bottom shield failed and the grease came out that is what caused the bearings to fail. It was not wear and tear it was a defect.
Mine wobbles but excessively, No. Now I know I have sealed berrings so if they are leaking that is infact a need of repair. Like I said in a previous post the bolt that holds on the blades on is bent a bit it will create a good vibration and a lot of wobble.

louviljlj
06-27-2006, 11:17 PM
I have called Toro numerous times and get the run around with them. Thier is no communication between the consumer service and any other department. I have called and asked to get someone to call and tell me how the spindle shaft can wobble and not be bent. This mower is brand new and I am getting frustrated that they will not email me or call me back. If they have defective spindles going out on thier products then they need to take some interest in this. I got a 2 year warranty that is worth nothing.

louviljlj
06-28-2006, 08:27 AM
I work with pumps and motors all the time and with machines that have through spindles. I am not seeing how having a bent bolt on the bottom can cause the top spindle shaft to wobble. I went ahead and took off the blade and spun it by hand again and it made no difference. These spindles have no zert points. I would think that only a very slight wobble would be acceptable of the shaft. The way I see it is the only way the shaft can wobble is their has to be a bent spindle or the beargins have excessive clearance in them either way something is wrong.

MarcSmith
06-28-2006, 09:09 AM
Just thining out loud...is it possible to have a really out of balance blade? Yes I know its a new machine. but a blade that is severly out of balance would trash the bearing and then create the wobble.

If they put a new bearing in and the housing and the spindle shaft are in good shape, the amount of side to side play should be minimal

is there too much belt tension?

Take the blades off the machine and then fire it up. and see if you still get the wobble with out the blades....Once new bearings are installed...

Again, just thinking out loud...

louviljlj
06-28-2006, 12:30 PM
I called Toro again today and finally got someone to answer some questions.
The guy was pretty arogant and asked me if I could mow grass with it and I said yes and he says well than whats the problem. Well the problem is the mower is brand new and I want it to be right especially since it cost over 3,000 dollors. Customer service with Toro is a dead end they explained to me that it is to the dealer/service center what will be fixed on your mower and they have nothing to do with it and do not make outside calls to them. I think I will stick with John Deere from now on because this has been a real hassle. I felt like I should have at least gotten a whole new spindle unit when I only had the mower for a few days and not have just gotten bearings put in. Least that way I would have known for sure I had taken care of the problem.

jcltyson
06-28-2006, 01:48 PM
Speaking of Toro customer service..... I bought a Toro 60" ZTR & was very happy with it. Still am. I wanted to buy a pull behind areator and was concerned about the weight the ZTR could handle. I e-mail toro customer service and got back a response stating 'zero lbs' could be towed. I went back to them with the question why do you offer a towing hitch kit to add to the unit if you can't tow any weight? I got a call in a few days from customer service and you would have thought I spit in his eye.. Very arrogant and unprofessional... As my small business was growing I was going to add a larger, more powerful ZTR to my service. That made the difference. Instead of staying with Toro (as I wanted to) I took this as a sign and bought a big, fast, high HP Hustler and never looked back. I enjoy both of my mowers but after experiencing this and hearing what some others are going thru, well this is a classic sign of a company 'getting to big for their britches'.

ed2hess
06-28-2006, 06:04 PM
You might be better off just going ahead and mow it will get worse then it will be easier to fix.

MarcSmith
06-28-2006, 07:03 PM
You might be better off just going ahead and mow it will get worse then it will be easier to fix.

yeah then whe he tries to take it back for warranty service after 20 hours of use they'll say customer abuse and kick you out the door even faster....:dizzy: :dizzy: :dizzy:

you really can't win...warranties are about like Home owners insurance....IMO not worth a whole helluva lot unless its a catastrophic loss....

The killer fro you is the distance between you and the service center....

it almost makes you want to take the spindles apart frig up the other bearings on the other spindles adn then take it back and ask them to fix it udner warranty.

too bad there isn't a lemon law for the mowers. three times for the same repair and you get a new one...

rob7233
06-28-2006, 08:06 PM
If you're not using the mower and sitting around waiting for a satisfactory reply from Toro, Just go back to the dealer and state you want a refund on it since it won't perform as intended/promised. Afterwards, go visit a John deere dealer if you want but not before you visit Hustler.

ed2hess
06-28-2006, 09:29 PM
[QUOTE=MarcSmith]yeah then whe he tries to take it back for warranty service after 20 hours of use they'll say customer abuse and kick you out the door even faster....:dizzy: :dizzy: :dizzy:
QUOTE]
There would be a lot of tell-tale evidence if he hit something big that knocked out 3 spindles. It hardly seems likely that kind of thing can happen. I would have tried to measure horzontial and vertial movement with a scale before talking with the plant. I would measure it at the pulley. I would look to see if the spindle mounting bolts are all tight. I would check to see if all the pulley and idler seem to be aligned vertically. I would check to be sure that the idler spring is free and if it is an adjustable idle be sure it is tight.