Illegals south of the border

[GREEN MAN]

Is anybody else worried about the illegals taking over our businesses? I don't think it's fair of these businesses to pay under minimum wage, making it more profitable for them,while hurting their fellow AMERICAN LCO's. I think Bush is on the right track, to fine these companies who hire illegals. To those illegals. Become an American citizen, it pays more.:usflag:

[WJW Lawn]

I Second That!

[HenryB]

The hourly wage in this area is $12- $25 an hour. Easily doubling minumum wage. Legal or illegal people willing to work hard can make a lot of money. I heard of a guy (illegal) making $28 an hour foreman at a big local bakery.

[jarroo's lawncare]

if they were to take over our businesses they probably earned through hard work. i myself do not have a problem with people south of the border working here. they are working thats the bottom line. they do not come up here and sit on their a$$ and draw unemployment or welfare cause they can't. lets face americans are lazy compared to these people when there is a job that americans are too good for they are not afraid to do it. i honestly can say i respect these people for their hard work and determination for a better life. everyone thinks that they are taking jobs away from us because they do it for cheaper, that is stupid they are taking them away because they will work rain,shine,sun up to sun down, and weekends and get stuff done. how many americans do that without complaining or asking for days off or calling in sick?

[Fvstringpicker]

Regardless of how hard they work, I have a problem with illegals in the country but I have a real problem with companies that hire them and a government that turns a blind eye to the fact. Nonetheless, I commend them for their work ethic.

[PJDiesel]

Regardless of how hard they work, I have a problem with illegals in the country but I have a real problem with companies that hire them and a government that turns a blind eye to the fact. Nonetheless, I commend them for their work ethic.
Ditto.

I'd like to see some facts on the "Bush supporting the fining of employers" part thoguh?
That's news to me.:confused:

[GREEN MAN]

if they were to take over our businesses they probably earned through hard work. i myself do not have a problem with people south of the border working here. they are working thats the bottom line. they do not come up here and sit on their a$$ and draw unemployment or welfare cause they can't. lets face americans are lazy compared to these people when there is a job that americans are too good for they are not afraid to do it. i honestly can say i respect these people for their hard work and determination for a better life. everyone thinks that they are taking jobs away from us because they do it for cheaper, that is stupid they are taking them away because they will work rain,shine,sun up to sun down, and weekends and get stuff done. how many americans do that without complaining or asking for days off or calling in sick?As I said, it's the businesses that hire the illegals that anger me. I didn't say anything bad about the illegals. They do work hard, and I don't knock them as a people but there are plenty of AMERICANS LCO's that are not lazy, and are willing to work too. We also have to pay taxes. These companies that hire the illegals are making big money lowballing all their jobs and not paying them what they are worth. If they paid them what they should be paid, they would have to price their jobs appropriately, like everyone else. I should say that I don't blame the illegals for wanting to make a better life for them selves, but they should do it legally. There is a reason why we call them ILLEGAL imigrants.:usflag:

[jarroo's lawncare]

whether or not they are not getting paid what they are worth they still will always have work. i had someone from south of the border working with me,for whenever he wasn't working elsewhere. i paid him the same as my other help and never offered him anything else. i asked what i owed him and he said 20 dollars, that was for 4 hours of work i give him more of course, but what i am trying to say is that their value of a dollar is greater than ours.i have also heard of a guy that hired some on a commercial electrical job used them to get it done and called immigration on them and had them taken away without paying them. i just think it is tottally unfair to take advantage of them and they should have the same privileges as americans as far as pay goes if they work here.

[GREEN MAN]

whether or not they are not getting paid what they are worth they still will always have work. i had someone from south of the border working with me,for whenever he wasn't working elsewhere. i paid him the same as my other help and never offered him anything else. i asked what i owed him and he said 20 dollars, that was for 4 hours of work i give him more of course, but what i am trying to say is that their value of a dollar is greater than ours.i have also heard of a guy that hired some on a commercial electrical job used them to get it done and called immigration on them and had them taken away without paying them. i just think it is tottally unfair to take advantage of them and they should have the same privileges as americans as far as pay goes if they work here.I agree it's wrong to take advantage of them, but that's what these companies are doing that don't pay them well. These companies are also making the customer think that we are all overpriced. Hmmm, who do you think will get the job?

[jtf40]

Ditto.

I'd like to see some facts on the "Bush supporting the fining of employers" part thoguh?
That's news to me.:confused:

Yea - PROVE THAT !!!!!!!!!!:usflag:

[topsites]

I agree it's wrong to take advantage of them, but that's what these companies are doing that don't pay them well. These companies are also making the customer think that we are all overpriced. Hmmm, who do you think will get the job?

Yeah well lets not forget the customers who hire them outright.

[FATWEASEL]

Originally Posted by PJDiesel
Ditto.

I'd like to see some facts on the "Bush supporting the fining of employers" part thoguh?
That's news to me.


Yea - PROVE THAT !!!!!!!!!!

------------------

:confused: I believe that's been on the books for quite a while.:hammerhead: That's nothing new. I DO hope you knew that hiring undocumented immigrants was illegal. :usflag:

The government (INS) usually went after businesses that employed hundreds of illegals like produce farms, textiles, and the poultry industry before this became such a big stank. I believe (hope) you'll eventually see a crackdown on the small business and local level as well.

Don't get me wrong, I feel like MOST Hispanic workers are some of the hardest working people in our industry and they should be paid like any other hard worker...no more, no less. BUT...paying out cash and living by the "don't ask, don't tell" policy hurts everyone in the end.

For example:
The figure that I see floating around the most is that there are AT LEAST 11 million ILLEGAL immigrants in the US. ILLEGAL means they don't pay income taxes. Of those ILLEGAL immigrants, lets say that half are of working age. THAT is probably a VERY conservative number considering most ILLEGALS come here to work. The average cash payout for ILLEGALS in the green industry and construction is $10 to $12 per hour around my area. I'm sure some make alot more and some make alot less. Lets split the difference and say $11/hour.

Just to keep it simple, let's say $11/hour times 40 hours (low) times 50 weeks per year. That's $22,000 per year CASH. $22,000 times 5,500,000 people is $121 BILLION!!! Now take JUST the federal taxes that are missed...NOT Social Security, NOT Medicare, NOT state tax (if applicable). On $22,000 the federal taxes on a single person in 2005 would be $2935 not counting deductibles. $2935 times 5,500,000 is over 16.1 BILLION DOLLARS that's not collected on JUST federal taxes.

Throw in Medicare and social security also and a LEGAL worker is going to pay $4618 to the government. If you want to talk about FAIR, this guy would have to be paid $14 per hour just to take home the same amount of money as the ILLEGAL guy. How many employers are willing to do that??? NOW tell me who's getting screwed over?

Those figures work the same way when applied to the solo LCOs out there that pay their taxes like they should on income earned. ASS-UMING the same percentages (would change depending on true income and tax bracket) and the same operating costs as far as equipment and maintenance goes....the LEGAL guy might need to charge $40 to mow a yard whereas the ILLEGAL guy only needs to charge $31.40 to take home the same amount of money.

This is where the average guy first sees the effects of ILLEGALS in the workplace. There's PLENTY of other issues at hand but mine are tired of typing.:sleeping:

[JCP Crafts]

They won't be 'illegal' if Bush and most of the politicians have their way.They will be our guest workers.
And whoever says they pay their own way by working hard is full os sh%t.Who pays their hospital bills when they don't,who pays the school tax for their children to go to school,etc....
My question to all of you that thinks this is a good thing....Do you honestly believe that when they are granted ,the right to stay here legally.....That they will continue to work for peanuts and continue to do the dirtiest of jobs when they will be able to collect all the other benifits that will be granted them as a LEGAL citizen.
Remember this...when they do become legal,they are not going to work for less than LEGAL citizens anymore because they simply will not have to anymore to survive.They will demand that they get treated equally and payed the same as others cause they will not have to take the discrimination that they have to accept now for being illegal.

[nfarr]

The hourly wage in this area is $12- $25 an hour. Easily doubling minumum wage. Legal or illegal people willing to work hard can make a lot of money. I heard of a guy (illegal) making $28 an hour foreman at a big local bakery.


Absolutely, as long as the worker being hired can present documents that are required and they appear legit. They can be payrolled and taxes withheld. They can establish credit, buy cars and homes, etc.

[nfarr]

And whoever says they pay their own way by working hard is full os sh%t.Who pays their hospital bills when they don't,who pays the school tax for their children to go to school,etc....
My question to all of you that thinks this is a good thing....Do you honestly believe that when they are granted ,the right to stay here legally.....That they will continue to work for peanuts and continue to do the dirtiest of jobs when they will be able to collect all the other benifits that will be granted them as a LEGAL citizen.
Remember this...when they do become legal,they are not going to work for less than LEGAL citizens anymore because they simply will not have to anymore to survive.They will demand that they get treated equally and payed the same as others cause they will not have to take the discrimination that they have to accept now for being illegal.

Stastically, first generation immigrants( legal or not ) are some 80% more likely to become millionaires than native born USA citizens, More likely to start business and never rely on public assistance. The fastest growing segment of entreprenuers in our county are hispanic owned businesses. This is because, as you state, they wont work for less than citizens and typically wont allow themselves to be treated poorly for ever. The largest chain of Taco bell restaurants in No VA is owned by a Vietnamese immigrant that used to clean a local mall and sleep in the cleaning closet during the day because he could not afford an appartment. A detailed article in the Wash Post spotlighted him a couple years back.

Priority for VISAS has always been given to workers in desired industries such as medicine, technology and agriculture, ie guest workers. If we could get US citizens to work for a reasonable wage and do the difficult jobs, there would not be any jobs for illegal aliens. I have been self employeed for three years and finding good, legal workers, for entry level wages has been the most challenging part of what I do. Personally, I would not knowingly hire an illegal because even though our laws dont seem to have any enforcement teeth, I believe the best way to prosper is to do it legit or not at all. I have had to fire several employees when I found out they were not legal.

[nfarr]

Yeah well lets not forget the customers who hire them outright.

I have had several hispanic employees and it is amazing how often someone will stop and ask me if they will work after hours or Sundays and then try to hire them. They assume that they are illegal and will work for nothing.

[firefightergw]

How about this for a thought. Businesses do pay federal tax on illegals that they pay in cash.

Example:
Let's say a small business grosses $100K in a year. Out of that $100K they pay $22,000 in cash to an illegal worker. The business would not be able to deduct the $22,000 off their taxes because it is suppose to not exist. Therefore, the business will end up paying income tax on it instead of the worker.:hammerhead:

[Freddy_Kruger]

Listen, the title of this thread is Illegals South of the Border. But! if the illegals are south of the border they're not illegal.

[firefightergw]

Listen, the title of this thread is Illegals South of the Border. But! if the illegals are south of the border they're not illegal.

They are if they're Canadian.;)

[Freddy_Kruger]

They are if they're Canadian.;)
Touche':hammerhead: :canadaflag:

[me1223]

IMO people shouldn't be worried about people "taking" their jobs, because chances are they aren't "taking" your jobs, you may be more demanding as far as money and benefits go, also the process to legally immigrate is not geared towards people who are willing to work hard for money, it is geared towards people who are educated and already have money. There is no reason that a person should be disqualified from a position simply because of where they come from. I sincerly doubt that there would be the service industry there is if it wasn't for illegal immigrants because they take the jobs most people don't want and are willing to be paid less for them. If you have a problem with it, don't shop or use the services of illegal labour, also promote tightening your southern border to keep them out, and streamlining the immigration process so that those who are willing to work are able to come in legally.

[Freddy_Kruger]

IMO people shouldn't be worried about people "taking" their jobs, because chances are they aren't "taking" your jobs, you may be more demanding as far as money and benefits go, also the process to legally immigrate is not geared towards people who are willing to work hard for money, it is geared towards people who are educated and already have money. There is no reason that a person should be disqualified from a position simply because of where they come from. I sincerly doubt that there would be the service industry there is if it wasn't for illegal immigrants because they take the jobs most people don't want and are willing to be paid less for them. If you have a problem with it, don't shop or use the services of illegal labour, also promote tightening your southern border to keep them out, and streamlining the immigration process so that those who are willing to work are able to come in legally.
I don't see why we need immigration Periode.

It's a disgrace to actively recruit all the educated people in Zaire or wherever. They get a doctors degree and we take them away form their country with money. Should leave them all there to help the people that paid for their education. Thats for the educated.

For the No skill labour what do we need them for either? I would rather see the price of food go up because we have to pay decent wages for minimum wage. If you pay less than that like I think they do in the states to mexicans then thats almost like slavery. Plus having all those beggars around must increase the crime rate.

We have 10% unemployment in canada and its been like that forever, we DO NOT NEED ANY DAMN IMMIGRANTS.

(american tourists are bad enough:))