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View Full Version : Pointers for cutting w/ toro 21" proline


S man
07-09-2006, 11:42 PM
I have a new toro proline 21" and love it. The thing is it cuts weird on some grass types mostly when mulching. It leaves blades uncut in the center of the path. Is there a way to cut with it and what blades are recommened.

marko
07-10-2006, 08:40 AM
I love my proline too! I bet you are mowing just a tad too fast. I have mine in 3rd, and notice when the grass is tall (or cutting some of the wider blade fescues and St. Augustine's) when I lived in Texas, that it would do this. I believe that the cause is the area under the deck is so full of clippings that it effects the quality of the cut. By mowing a little slower, more of the clippings have a chance to get chopped up and drop back down to the turf. Might want to try a gator style blade.

LawnBrother
07-11-2006, 09:21 AM
I agree with marko, slow down and use a gator style blade. You can also try removing the plastic triangular kicker plates under the deck, I did that this spring and it cut better and clumped less in the heavy spring growth. Basically it makes the deck deeper leaving more room for the clippings to move around under the deck and leaves a better cut. Just try taking them off for a day and see what happens.

S man
07-12-2006, 11:26 PM
I agree with marko, slow down and use a gator style blade. You can also try removing the plastic triangular kicker plates under the deck, I did that this spring and it cut better and clumped less in the heavy spring growth. Basically it makes the deck deeper leaving more room for the clippings to move around under the deck and leaves a better cut. Just try taking them off for a day and see what happens.

Thanks for the advice. But why do they put those kicker things on there? I have used prolines with gator blades and they do cut good. One thing I noticed is that the toro deck does collect A LOT of clippings underneath the deck. And the blade doesn't have enough lift to cut the clippings fast enough. A snapper I had had a "combo" blade and it cut the same way like the toro. So the blade must have something to do with it.

6'7 330
07-12-2006, 11:46 PM
Do you have the bbc or the zone start? If zone get a gator blade,mulches awesome.Which engine is on it? Rev those rpms up to 3600.

S man
07-14-2006, 12:16 AM
Do you have the bbc or the zone start? If zone get a gator blade,mulches awesome.Which engine is on it? Rev those rpms up to 3600.

I have the 22176. Kawi w/ zone start. My dealer told me he would take a look at it so it's going tomorrow on my off day.

btw how do those kickers come off?

Freddy_Kruger
07-14-2006, 02:18 AM
I have a super recycler on thing that makes it superior to a proline (at least I think) is Personal pace you can slow down or speed up on a dime. Some of my customers have sump pumps and the grass grows very thick but I usually don't have to slow down unless its also wet.

I still would like to try a proline but the super recyclers are awesome. The reg. recyclers aren't so awesome though, I wouldn't buy a regular recycler again.

and another thing, I bought after market blades that look like gators and they keep a sharp edge much longer the the ones that came with the machine.

Roger
07-14-2006, 06:26 AM
The kicker plates are attached with three phillips-head screws. They protrude through the deck, screwing into the plastic kickers underneath the deck. To take out the rear one, the belt cover will have to come off so that you can get access to the screw heads.

I took mine out, but for bagging. I use a high-lift blade (Oregon aftermarket blade, to replace the OEM blade) for bagging. But, in the Fall, when I use the mower to mulch leaves, I reinstall the kickers. When you remove the kickers, set them aside, don't throw them away -- you may wish to use them another time.

S man
07-14-2006, 12:06 PM
My dealer told me to keep them on if I wanted to mulch and that the "combo" blade that came on it is what to use if I want to bag and mulch at the same time. And that if you do both you have to compromise and not get the full potential of both modes. I think that's crap though after spending over 1000 on this! What if I use the gator w/ kickers? I just want this thing to mulch good and use my snapper to bag.

6'7 330
07-14-2006, 11:06 PM
My dealer told me to keep them on if I wanted to mulch and that the "combo" blade that came on it is what to use if I want to bag and mulch at the same time. And that if you do both you have to compromise and not get the full potential of both modes. I think that's crap though after spending over 1000 on this! What if I use the gator w/ kickers? I just want this thing to mulch good and use my snapper to bag.

I agree with him about the kickers,and mulching.We have the Toro proline's with kickers, and Exmark Metro 21's(same mower as the toro minus kickers don't let anybody sh!t you otherwise), no kickers.Mulching heavier grass, the Exmark will sometimes leave excess grass on one side of the mower. As to the blade, a gator will pack the bag as well as the re cycler blade that comes stock, but will mulch a hair better.

LALawnboy
07-14-2006, 11:48 PM
hey scott, i got a question about your proline. is it heavy as hell? i know this doesn't help the situation at hand but it made me think about this. i helped a friend all day yesterday with his accounts (was in a bind for time) and he has a toro commercial that is about 4-5 years old. it cuts good, but man, that thing was heavy as hell. i really noticed the difference today when i was cutting my own places. i've got a commercial lawnboy and i could barely feel it when i was turning after getting used to that toro from yesterday. not trying to hog the thread, i was just wondering if all of the toros are really heavy because since toro makes lawnboy, i thought it would be similar in weight. definitely not though.

todd

Roger
07-15-2006, 06:26 AM
LAlawnboy ... I have both a Toro Proline 21" s/p hand mower (Sizuki 2 cycle) and a LawnBoy commercial (DuraForce 2 cycle). You are exactly right about the weight difference. This factor is the primary reason the Toro gets used about 30 minutes per week, the LawnBoy gets used about 30 hours per week. Also, the quality of cut for the grasses we have here is much better with the LawnBoy, and the LawnBoy will bag damp/wet grass (side bagger).

As far as a piece of equipment, the Toro wins hands-down. It is better built, solid, wear points are better constructed (it was used as the primary hand mower for a couple of seasons, so it has seen some heavy use). The LawnBoy has several weak points (ground drive cable, rear drive wheels - already gone through one set this season, height adjustment levers on rear wheels -- I could make a long list). But, the weight and ease of handling is much different between the two mowers.

6'7 330
07-15-2006, 09:33 AM
LAlawnboy ... I have both a Toro Proline 21" s/p hand mower (Sizuki 2 cycle) and a LawnBoy commercial (DuraForce 2 cycle). You are exactly right about the weight difference.

And the models with the 6HP kawi would be even heavier, the Kawi carrys more poundage then the Suzuki. In fact the model with the Suzuki was\is the lightest proline.

LALawnboy
07-15-2006, 12:43 PM
hey roger and 6'7, thanks for clearing that up for me. and scott, sorry for hogging the thread. all i gotta say is you guys who are using the prolines, all the power to ya cuz yall's arms are gonna be huge after using that thing all season.

S man
07-15-2006, 06:43 PM
hey scott, i got a question about your proline. is it heavy as hell? i know this doesn't help the situation at hand but it made me think about this. i helped a friend all day yesterday with his accounts (was in a bind for time) and he has a toro commercial that is about 4-5 years old. it cuts good, but man, that thing was heavy as hell. i really noticed the difference today when i was cutting my own places. i've got a commercial lawnboy and i could barely feel it when i was turning after getting used to that toro from yesterday. not trying to hog the thread, i was just wondering if all of the toros are really heavy because since toro makes lawnboy, i thought it would be similar in weight. definitely not though.

todd


Hey Todd. The proline is heavier than most other mowers even with my snapper which is light compared to it. The one w/ the 4 cycle engine is a lot heavier than the 2 cycle one with the extra parts and componets. The thing with mine is that it's cutting weird and a gator blade isn't helping. What to do??????

6'7 330
07-15-2006, 06:56 PM
Do you know what the RPM'S are. Raise them to 3600 rpm. What grass types are you mowing? Here we mow cool season and the Toro\Exmark 21 does a very good job.

S man
07-16-2006, 12:46 AM
Do you know what the RPM'S are. Raise them to 3600 rpm. What grass types are you mowing? Here we mow cool season and the Toro\Exmark 21 does a very good job.

After I choke it I put it at the highest speed which is good. The grass I cut is st. aug and everything else. The thing I think is the problem is that the deck accumulates a lot of grass because of all the stuff under there like kickers self propell belt and crank protector.

6'7 330
07-16-2006, 01:43 AM
Get a tiny-tach and check your RPM'S.The 6HP Kawi 180, is very easy to adjust the RPM'S.Get em up to 3600.And the regular recycler blade that comes stock, leaves a better cut then does the atomic blade.It has been my experience the atomic leaves a lot of stringers.

LALawnboy
07-17-2006, 01:09 AM
like 6'7 said, the regular blades work well. i use the regular blades made for lawnboys and they work perfectly fine on all my yards (every one is st. aug). the toro i mentioned earlier that i was using to help out a friend the other day had the regular blade as well and it cut just fine. hope this helps.

lawnboy dan
07-17-2006, 09:51 AM
the ground speed in 2nd gear is too fast on the proline. this dosnt help the cut quality . i dont use these any more cause of this

S man
07-17-2006, 09:08 PM
I think it's true. The gator is doing the exact same cut as the regular blade. I just don't see why it leaves a strip of uncut grass in the center. Sometimes it works fine but when the grass gets a little thicker and I mean regular grass it will leave that trail. And when you make sure everything is cut when I'm blowing I see a lot of uncut blades standing up. It really makes my work look like crap. I think if I take the kickers off it will have more air and can cut and mulch better. Because there is just too many things under the deck where grass accumulate.

lawnboy dan
07-17-2006, 11:00 PM
how is the cut quality in first gear?

LALawnboy
07-17-2006, 11:27 PM
i don't know about the toros with the kickers (to be honest, i don't even know what kickers are) but on my lawnboy, if there is any grass whatsoever accumulated underneath, blades will be left standing. just make sure underneath the deck is as clean as possible. once my deck is cleaned, the cut is great.

6'7 330
07-17-2006, 11:36 PM
As I have suggested, Get a 30 dollar Tiny Tach, check the RPM setting. If It was 32 to 3400 RPM'S from the factory, a raise to 3600 would increase the quality of cut.

LALawnboy
07-18-2006, 02:02 AM
6'7, do you know about changing the rpm's on a commercial lawnboy? and also, this is a question i've wondered since i first saw one of your posts...is that you in the avatar picture?

lawnboy dan
07-18-2006, 08:30 AM
is it a 2cyc or briggs?

LALawnboy
07-18-2006, 12:38 PM
my full time mower is the new commercial with the briggs and my back up is the 2 cycle duraforce.

lawnboy dan
07-18-2006, 02:39 PM
i dont know how on the briggs but its real easy on the duraforce-just turn the white plastic round wheel on the gov vane clockwise to increase rpms.

6'7 330
07-18-2006, 04:15 PM
6'7, do you know about changing the rpm's on a commercial lawnboy? and also, this is a question i've wondered since i first saw one of your posts...is that you in the avatar picture?

I don't about the Briggs, but a service manual for it should be easy to get, the service manual could tell you the adjustment procedure.I'm not a Lawn Boy expert, but best as I can remember,The old two cycle lawn boys had a little plastic white wheel like on the governor, you adjust RPM by turning the wheel a click at a time .Yes that is me in the avatar.

Scotts' Yard Care
07-18-2006, 06:51 PM
but on the Briggs I'm familiar with the only way I've set the governor is to shorten the very light spring between the linkage and the airvane. Takes some trial and error and be sure to not over rev the engine as this could do real damage. Low RPM is probably one of the most troublesome problems on these small engines as I have never got one out of the box that was set right. The bigger engines all seem to be set at least to an acceptable speed.

LALawnboy
07-18-2006, 11:48 PM
lawnboy dan and 6'7, thanks for the help. i know what white disc ya'll are talking about so i'll give it a try.

6'7, i don't see you having any problems with collecting money looking like that. congrats. seeing that pic makes me feel like i should go work out instead of sitting here. lol

S man
07-22-2006, 01:30 AM
Todd, how do you like the lawn-boy w/ briggs I/c? I've seen one at joe's on marietta where I go. Is it the sp or push?

Bill, How do you adjust the rpms on the kawasaki? It does seem like it is running a little slower than usual.

btw I bought the REAL gator today and am going to try it tomorow and see how it cuts.

LALawnboy
07-22-2006, 02:13 AM
i love it. don't have any complaints at all. and after using a toro all day with a friend of mine, i'm even more happy with my purchase. i liked the cut of the toro, it just seemed more awkward than the LB. comparing the briggs to the duraforce 2 cycle, it seems the briggs has a little more power because it's handled thick, wet grass easier than the 2 cycle (would have bogged down a little). and yea, i have the sp model. all i use right now is 21"s so i don't want to be pushing all day.

Roger
07-22-2006, 06:56 AM
LALawnboy ... is the Briggs have a pressurized oil system? Or, it is a slinger system? And, how about an oil filter? What about air filter? Is it a two-element system, with an oiled foam prefilter, with paper cartridge behind?

I think the fuel tank is 1 gal, probably the same one we use for the DuraForce commercial models. How long does a tank of fuel last (in terms of running service hours)?

6'7 330
07-22-2006, 06:05 PM
Todd, how do you like the lawn-boy w/ briggs I/c? I've seen one at joe's on marietta where I go. Is it the sp or push?

Bill, How do you adjust the rpms on the kawasaki? It does seem like it is running a little slower than usual.

btw I bought the REAL gator today and am going to try it tomorow and see how it cuts.

Scott,

It's not hard at all to increase the RPM setting. On the side of the engine where the carb is, where the thottle and choke cable connect to a plate. There are two bolts, about an inch to an inch and a half apart. Take a 10mm socket,loosen the bolts and slide the plate to change the RPM.Tach it out about 3600 rpm.

LALawnboy
07-22-2006, 11:16 PM
LALawnboy ... is the Briggs have a pressurized oil system? Or, it is a slinger system? And, how about an oil filter? What about air filter? Is it a two-element system, with an oiled foam prefilter, with paper cartridge behind?

I think the fuel tank is 1 gal, probably the same one we use for the DuraForce commercial models. How long does a tank of fuel last (in terms of running service hours)?

to be honest, i'm not sure whether it's a pressurized or slinger system. No oil filter and the the air filter is the 2 element. and as far as gas consumption, i don't have specifics (which makes me want to find out the actual amount used) but to the best of my knowledge, i think i've gotten in between 6 and 7 hours on a tank ball park. that may be off, because like i said, i don't have specifics. all i'm going on is when i first bought the mower, i filled her up and did about 13 or 14 a little more than average size residentials before having to refill. i don't know how much this example will help, but today i used it for an hour and half to an hour and 45, and the tank is still full.

i've got a silverpro with the duraforce as a backup (used to be full time) and as best as i can remember, i was filling it up more frequently, even though it has the smaller gas tank.

sorry for the long post, i tried to get all of that out of my head in the shortest way possible.

todd

lawnboy dan
07-23-2006, 08:20 AM
the briggs on the current lawnboy comm. is of the old school desighn. oil slinger. nothing is high tech about this engine which can be a good thing. its a time tested desighn

S man
07-23-2006, 10:06 PM
Scott,

It's not hard at all to increase the RPM setting. On the side of the engine where the carb is, where the thottle and choke cable connect to a plate. There are two bolts, about an inch to an inch and a half apart. Take a 10mm socket,loosen the bolts and slide the plate to change the RPM.Tach it out about 3600 rpm.

Thanks Bill I have to try doing that. The one thing with the kawi is that it will run fast one day and run a little slower the other day and acts erratic for a couple seconds but other than that I think it's a great engine with lots of power.

btw, I put the REAL gator on saturday and saw a great difference in the cut with mulching and bagging. The old atomic couldn't bag period. It does make a grinding sound when it gets a lot of thick mulch underneath though. And the gator keeps the deck clean better than the other two when I look under it after the day it still looks clean and I see no clippings compared to the other blades.


Q, Are the old style sr's worth getting? A dealer on ebay has 30 model 20037s and 15 model 20039s. My worker is complaining about the snapper hivac he uses because it pulls weird and when bagging w/ hi lift will not pick up grass. He wants the toro which I use. :rolleyes: