View Full Version : how to set 23 hp kaw rpm's
07-12-2006, 05:39 PM
Anybody set their max rpm's on a 23 horse kaw? Do you have to first set hte minimum? How do you make sure its not the throttle cable causing the problem and not the rpm setting (however you change that.)
I have heard a number of guys here say you should check and make sure your max rpm's are still at 3600, but i dont know exactly what to do. Dont wanna make a mistake and blow my engine up. Saw instructions for a 17 kaw from kawasaki's websight, but they dont show a 23.. maybe its the same? Any help is much appreciated.
ps.. just picked up a tiny tach. Max is at about 3490-3510. Min is about 1780-1810. Thanks.
07-12-2006, 05:58 PM
If your engine is a FH series check this thread for the high speed adjustment; http://www.lawnsite.com/showthread.php?t=153100
The low speed is below....
07-13-2006, 01:24 PM
hi thanks for the reply.. I have seen these pictures in my manuals, but my engine adjustments dont look the same. I am going to see if i can borrow my girlfriends camera and post them here for you to see. Hopefully tonight.
07-13-2006, 06:45 PM
If you post the model and serial numbers I can look your engine up and see what it is.
07-15-2006, 10:25 AM
hi sorry about the slow responses, i have been in an out lately. my engine is a 680v-as20, and looking over this picture again i see that it does cover all the AS engines, just the first one is the 17 hp kaw.\
Regarding the pictures, i think mine is the third one?? I have a Donaldson canister filter over my carb not the dual element filter it's showing in the second picture, so mine is a governed low rpm, so 1550?? I know mine has a governor, but dont all of them?
Obviously i have not had a lot of experience with engines, nor my mowers in the past. It was kind of an "i hope nothing goes wrong" mentality. Not the best state of mind for running a serious business, which is what i am now trying to do. Anyways thanks again for the help and i will try to stay more on top of this message board.
About the high Rpm link u gave me. My control panel does not look like this, and i dont know where to insert a "6mm pin" in mine, or do i even need to worry about this. I know i need to be careful w/ the high rpm adjustment so i dont blow my engine up.
07-15-2006, 10:39 AM
Lift up on the plate that the throttle, choke cables are attached to.Use a big screwdriver wrench etc.Of course it goes without saying,have a tach handy to measure the RPM'S correctly.
LawnScapers of Dayton
07-15-2006, 12:04 PM
I believe you need to be sure that the throttle is set to the fastest before setting the plate. There are 2 10mm nuts you have to loosen then move the plate up....
07-15-2006, 05:04 PM
Crap!! ok, so i went into my dealer to pick up my service manual for my hustler, which by the way does not really talk about this, being that its more engine specific. I'm sure it may come in handy later, like when i blow up my mower..
I did the low idle, which is just a screw on top of the carb. That was easy, once i had him show me exactly which screw i was turning. Then i did the high rpm w/ the plate adjustment after loosening the two mounting bolts. Now neither is working correctly. Now i get 4000 only, and no ability to control it w/ my throttle control, so i just shut it down after it ran like this for about 5 - 10 seconds.
I know it can be dangerous to run it over the specified rpm's, so what now? Is it the governor. Did i break a link somewhere (none that i can see). I really would like to fix this myself after spending all this time. WTF??!!?? The low idle adjustment screw is now not even effected by the little lever that used to come up and hit it, because it no longer returns that far to hit the screw. It doesn't even move.
07-15-2006, 05:55 PM
Been messin w/ it for a while, and it just wants to go wide open now, w/ no control at all. I'm thinking governor, but since i didn't know where the low idle set screw was before today, i could be wrong. Any ideas?
07-15-2006, 06:13 PM
Sounds like you may have went too far with the plate. The pic. below shows the hole you want to put a pin in with the throttle at wide open position, Then loosen the two 6mm screws just enough to move the plate. Then start the engine and move the plate while watching your tach., When you reach the RPM you want tighten the two 6mm screws remove the pin and you should be good to go.
07-15-2006, 06:56 PM
Just took off air filter and housing where it attaches to the carb so i can see the inside of the carb. Should i see anything moving when i move the throttle up and down. When i move the choke i see a "metal flap" move open and close. Should this (choke valve?) move when i move the throttle?
I'm thinking something should move inside the carb when i am moving the throttle. Just trying to see if maybe the problem rests here rather than further inside the engine
07-15-2006, 07:22 PM
With the engine not running the governor pulls the throttle shaft in the carb. wide open so you wont see anything move while operating the throttle cable. Check the pic. Below..... If you didn't, Do as I said in my last post and try to adjust again.
07-15-2006, 07:38 PM
Just read your last post. Few notes.
- I could see "metal flaps" opening and closing as i moved the throttle w/ the engine off that were on the engine side (to the inside) of the choke valve. Should this not happen?
- I did not line up the holes the first time bc my dealer told me it wasn't necessary.. maybe part of the problem.. am going to retry after this post.
- Reinstalled air intake w/ old gasket still on.. bad?
- Earlier after my adjustment (moved right side of plate up) then part
#92145B on your picture wasn't moving. Thus the "lever" at the top was not hitting the set screw. Could this be caused by not lining up holes?
going back out to finish installing air filter and retry your earlier directions.
thanks a lot for all the help so far. :)
07-15-2006, 07:40 PM
#92145B and #18171 are combined. just fyi.. anyway this peace was never moving enough to even come close to the set screw.. going back out to retry.. thus the uncontrollable throttle? let u know what happens.
07-15-2006, 07:55 PM
Ok just reinstalled air filter to carb etc. With plate loose and at bottom of bolts (so set low rpm's) set throttle low and turned on to set low idle first.. Engine just races to hiiigh rpm's and i have to immediately shut off. I have about 1100 hours on this engine. Is it possible it is a last straw scenerio for governor.. which by the way i do not fully understand. I know it is offset with counter weights inside the engine and connected to a spring behind the plate.. anyways. Isn't the function to not allow the engine to go above a certain rpm? Is there a way to check and see that it is set correctly by looking at it from the outside?
07-15-2006, 08:07 PM
I'll be back in a half hour with the governor adjustment.....
07-15-2006, 08:41 PM
Disregard step 1 and 2 because you didn't remove the arm and proceed to 3.
Try this exactly how it states. Don't worry if your carb. looks different ALL FH engines adjust the same way.
07-15-2006, 11:40 PM
Well, I've been working on this for about 12 hours now.. There has GOT to be an easier way to go about doing this. First of all the throttle plate is nestled down by the engine underneath the carb, right by the engine and in between the muffler. To take it off i had to remove:
the two mounting bolts
throttle link rod
large spring connecting plate to governer arm
and the long twisted rod connecting to the choke lever, which btw i think i broke
.. and the muffler
All the while the spring and choke rod are holding the whole thing together as i am trying to get the spring off of the governor arm.
After all is said and done and the governor arm is now accessible.. even if i figure out wtf is wrong with it, i will have to then figure out how to put all of this back together at the most impossible angles known to man. Do i ned to remove the air intake and the carb to get to this stuff easier or will that just cause me more problems, because everything has to link back up to it. This is crazy. I have no idea how one would go about doing this with any sort of sanity. I swear i am thinking about selling this business. With repair costs, taxes, insurance, truck costsl, gas, and customer issues.. is th is really even worth it. Getting off topic, but for whoever reads this, thanks for listening to my rant.
07-16-2006, 07:58 AM
I don't know how to tell you this but, You have takin a 5 minute or less RPM adjustment job and blown it out of proportion.
The only thing left I can tell you is once you get it back together take it to your Dealer and have them check everything out.
07-16-2006, 11:34 PM
Yeah.. i kinda figured as much. There are still some things that dont make sense to me though. If i could look through the carb and see the intake valves opening and closing, then how could the engine just race ahead when i lowered the throttle. What could cause this? The only thing i adjusted was the low idle set screw and the plate itself. Even if i had moved it too far up, when i then lowered it back down it should have been corrected right?
Anyways I have 3 mowers and i'm using my walk behinds now. It's just aggrevating that something so simple can get so confusing. I mean even to follow the dirrections mentioned in the kaw manual you have to remove the whole panel, which is extremely difficult. Are there specific tools that i should have been using other then the obvious ones i have on hand.. i.e. screwdrivers, ratchets, pliers, needle-nose pliers.
My girlfriend knows someone that can hopefully come over and give me a hand. This is something I should be able to do for all of my mowers, especially as my business grows and i have more mowers to maintain. this is simple maintenance like belts, hydros, filters .. that i should be able to do.
07-17-2006, 07:06 AM
I can't tell you what happened to your unit because I can't touch it, The RPM should have came back down when you pulled the plate back down. Why it didn't ???? I have never removed a throttle plate to adjust the governor on a engine, I have many many tools and some tools I have made for doing certain jobs. Having the right tools and the experience makes any job easier.
07-17-2006, 09:52 AM
.... then how could the engine just race ahead when i lowered the throttle. What could cause this? The only thing i adjusted was the low idle set screw and the plate itself.....
Are you _absolutely_ certain that you got your linkages back together correctly?
If you can access the throttle shaft on side of carb., have a friend hold it so throttle plate closes off throat of carb then start engine.
This action has one purpose. The only thing I am trying to convince you of, is that this mechanical stuff will behave as predicted. The only way _any_ engine can run at WOT (Wide Open Throttle) is if the throttle is, in essence, in "Wide Open Throttle" position. Makes no difference why. Conversely, with the throttle closed, I will not have to go _WAY_ far out on a limb to safely state that, if throttle is closed, engine will idle/run at idle speed.
07-18-2006, 02:59 PM
Yes i see what you are saying and i thought the exact same thing. Thats what makes me so confused. Anyway i am having someone come over this after noon to look at it. Do you think i can even get the plate back on w/ all the little springs etc. w/out special tools? It is extremely hard to get any sort of decent angle due to its proximity to the engine and mower frame. Blah.. this is irritating, and i'm sick of walking. Well hopefully i figure this out within the next couple of hours. I'll let ya kknow. :)
07-19-2006, 09:39 AM
....I'll let ya kknow. :)
Hey chief; any word yet?
07-19-2006, 12:01 PM
Hey chief; any word yet?
I think he has plenty Jim :realmad: :laugh:
07-19-2006, 01:57 PM
I wonder how low the rpm's were in the first place? This is a sh!tload of stuff to go through if it were only 3550 or something real close like that :laugh:
07-20-2006, 12:06 PM
Hardy f'n har. Here's the thing. For someone new to engines, all the dirrections out there are just vague enough to get you into trouble. First of all the low rpm's were at 1900 and the high were at 3490/3470.. 3350 when cutting. I know they drop a little under full load.. ie cutting and running and hills etc. But on flat ground.. not real tal grass not going real fast they would still drop to 3400.
Anyway the point being i was led to believe this is a quick adjustment. I'll give u that the low idle screw couldn't be simpler.. But even when i did this it didn't want to sit at 1550. I would have to lightly tap the carb to get it to drop from 1750 back down.. and it still was dependent on how fast i idled down on the throttle as to what rpm's it would idle at low rpm's. This is just one example. When the dirrections say one thing and the outcome is a number of things.
The high rpm adjustment is a "simple" shifting of the throttle plate upwards. BUT .. why wouldn't there be some WARNING somewhere that sais to make sure not to shift it further than 1/8 of an inch or you could throw the governor arm off as well as other things being that when one thing is adjusted on this plate it effects everything if you go to far.
So then the kaw manual sais to adjust the governer arm.. WHICH BTW is BEHIND the plate. Aaaah so just remove the plate. WRONG! there are a number of cables and springs connecting this plate to everything else. Once you get it off through no shortage of cussing and extremely inconvenient angles and placement of the plate itself as well as removing the muffler just to get at it.. there is no way in hell a novice could get this thing back on and have everything else adjusted right the first time trying this.
Maybe to people REAL familiar with KAWASAKI engines this would be simple.. but even the shop we called that deals w/ kawasaki's said not to try putting that plate back on.. bc it was even a ***** for them.. and btw they are not charging me bc they know the guy helping me out.
My point is this. Even with all the manuals/pictures/opinions.. with out having done this before there is a large amount of incomplete information. The dirrections must infer that someone doing the adjustment already understands all the risks/ factors/ causes and effects of moving one thing. Otherwise the dirrections i followed would have warned against taking off the plate in the first place.. and would have cautioned that to get to the governor arm you need to have a large working knowledge of engines. I didn't do anything abnormal but follow the dirrections.. thinking they would lead to a logical outcome.. when as it turned out the more dirrections i followed the more problems it created until i was back at square one and taking the whole damn thing in.. although i guess i did learn something along the way. As with many things incomplete information led to the problem.
I'm not blaming anyone or anything.. and i truly appreciate the participation of you guys and have learned a lot from this sight in general. But it is so strange to me that no one thought to mention it.. not even teh manual itself. Even the guy helping me said that Kohlers.. which is what he normally works on the dixies he services.. were a lot easier.. adn the shop said that due to the fact it was a Kaw it was a lot more difficult to get back together.
Right now the shop has my mower and is reassembling what i took apart as well as replacing a part that got damaged when i was taking the thing apart. I'll let you know what happens. BTW this was not me bitching at you guys or anyone else.. just at the situation in general.. and thanks for the replies. :)
07-20-2006, 02:41 PM
Well, if you removed the plate then I can easily see how you got into trouble. That sucker aint meant to be removed and because everything attaches to it, well you found that one out.
Atleast the RPMS were out enough to heed an adjustment. Good luck!
07-20-2006, 07:15 PM
Well, I'm sorry that you had problems understanding the service manual, You are the first in my 2,479 post that has had this problem. Service manuals are written for the most part for people that have a mechanical aptitude.
If I may, Should you come upon another repair and you do not understand the procedure or the procedure does not rectify the problem or worsens the problem, STOP right there and save yourself the grief and aggravation and take the unit to someone with the experience to perform the procedure or repair properly. Believe it or not you will save in the long run.
Hope they get you back up and running properly soon.
07-20-2006, 11:54 PM
Understanding the manual was not an issue. It was easily followed. The problem was after following the disassembly dirrections there is no way a novice can put this back together. Even the guys at the shop that work on these every day said Kawi's were a b!tch to get back together. I do my own oil/hydros/belts/deck adjustments. As well as stator replacement, charging coils. there were times when i was trying to figure out a starting problem that i would have stopped.. but i eventually figured it out, learned what i wanted, and saved some $$ in the process.
Stopping would have been a good idea in this instance, had i known what would happen when i took it off. :) From what i have gathered it is somewhat kawi specific that you can get into this problem w/ the throttle plate after removing it.
HOpefully i get it back tomrrow.. i'm sick of walking. I'm gonna talk to them then and see if there was any way i could have avoided or caused this. Honestly though, if all it takes is 1/8 of an inch adjustment too far to cause the rpm's to be out of whack (and that led me to search for the gov. arm etc etc..) it should at least be cautioned against in the manual. And it should have cautioned against removing the plate if it is this difficult to get back together for anyone but someone that works on these for a living.
07-21-2006, 12:19 AM
We have been adjusting RPM'S on kawi V-TWIN'S, since there have been Kawi V-Twins. Never any problems, never have had to take the plate off.
07-21-2006, 07:24 PM
I just wish i knew what exactly i did to begin with that made me lose the throttle control and have the rpm's skyrocket like they did. I can see that this shouldh't have been so complicated and i think its something important to know how to do so you know you are geting the right amount of power out of your equipment. Guess i'm learning the hard way.
NORMALLY... you would just ease the plat up A LITTLE after loosening the mounting bolts and this should do it.. .. So i will try again later, and just remember that no matter what DONT take off the PLATE!! :hammerhead:
07-21-2006, 08:56 PM
no matter what DONT take off the PLATE!! :hammerhead:
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