Help!!! I need some advice on $ collection

[alot2lurn]

This is my first year in the lawn and landscape business,and I do it part time.I don't usually deal with contracts unless requested by a customer.I'm not naive,but maybe a little to trusting,and so far with the exception of one customer I have'nt had any problems.A little background I mow this customers yard for the price of $135.00 first mow was $180.00 he paid me $200.00.Property is expensive here in Northern VA and he owns 20 acres with a 3500 sf house pool ,play ground ,basketball court probably worth $1.5 mil. or so.Other than mowing he requested mulching ,leaf removal,gutter cleaning,pruning etc.So I thought cool 5 min. from the house well off easy going customer with a ton of work at our agreed upon price of $45.00 per man hour.Well- I have'nt been able to get in touch with him for over 2 months after he accumulated a bill of over $600.00 with the exception of when I handed him the first bill ( he asked at that time if he could mail me the payment because he had his business check book at his office ) I called the #'s he gave me prob. 50 times literally (no response) he told me early on he gets about 300 voice mails a day in his line of work and cant possibly check them all. For his second notice I handed it to his wife 1 month ago ( no response).I'm going to drop off one more notice advising him he has 1 week to pay his debt or else There will be legal action taken.My question is and especially for you LCO's in VA but open to all- what are my options ? small claims court?With the info. I've given what are my chances of collecting ? What's it cost to do that in VA? How well does a verbal contract hold up in court? I have'nt done any work there for almost two months and informed his wife that was due to lack of payment and my unsuccessful attempts to contact him.Sorry for the length of this post there's a lot to explain here.Any help or advice would be appreciated , with the exception of busting my 00 about the lack of a contract.The bills I gave him were itemized bills the second stating it was his second notice.

[QualityLawnCare4u]

I just went threw this same crap. I dont know about VA but in Georgia a verbal agreement is binding. However, proving it is another thing! Get a signed contract/workorder to cover your arse from now on. Usually when you threaten with legal action or my favorite is to let them know you are going to put a lien on their house this usually gets their attention. Good luck and hope you get it! I have made this mistake several times and learned well from it. Also is a good idea to get half up front when there is material involved. Easier to eat labor than materials!

[dbc45420]

In Ohio you can do a mechanics lien on there property for $20 dollars, in Dayton anyhow. Forms are available at office supply stores and just fill it out, notarised, and take to county building. Its actually pretty easy. I think they get notified by certified mail.

[olderthandirt]

In Ohio you can do a mechanics lien on there property for $20 dollars, in Dayton anyhow. Forms are available at office supply stores and just fill it out, notarised, and take to county building. Its actually pretty easy. I think they get notified by certified mail.

And if you don't have proof that you did the work and tried to collect the other party can sue the he!l out of you and will win.

This same subject was brought up word for word in another thread and heres my reply. Try it and you then have the option of a lien

http://www.legaldocs.com/index.htm

find a demand for payment letter and send it registered mail with a return reciept. Then you have proof you at least tried to collect

[Rons Rightway Lawncare]

Go at night and knock on the door when the husband is home. Find out where he works and go visit him at work if you have to. Go to the house and if wife is home tell her to get check book and write you a check period...

[HOOLIE]

Filing in small claims in VA is around $30-$35, and you tack that onto the total they owe you. But first I would stay aggressive with this guy...sounds like a face-to-face collection might get the job done.

If you do small claims just call the courthouse in the county his property is in and they can instruct you on the procedure.

[alot2lurn]

Thanks for the replies,I have been by this guys house 4 or 5 times since his last notice.Caught his wife home once.I would love a face to face with him but he and his wife said he often does'nt get home til after midnight.He's a publisher,head hunter,consultant and motivational speaker so he's pretty busy.They have 4 kids and I can't see dropping by that late.You cant see his house from the road either .He lives on a long private drive through a woods.I thought about showing up at his work but if he's really trying to avoid me something tells me I'd get to know the lobby pretty well.And as for his wife ,and this to me is kinda wierd she did'nt even know I was'nt being paid ,what my $ rate was for my services the extent of work that was requested nothing.Just that I'd stopped showing up to mow.When I informed her showed her a copy of the itemized bill and said it had been a month and a half since I'd gotten paid she was shocked and informed me that she would pay it if she had it but she does'nt control the money and ask me to not say we had spoken . She also agreed that he is really hard to get in touch with and seemed truly embaressed by it all.With that I sealed the bill in an envelope as if to say she'd never seen it being sure to include an extra envelope with my return adress .This is really a strange situation I dont know what he's got goin on and dont care at this point I just want to get paid and let some other sucker deal with him.By the way olderthandirt the previous posting was me someone informed me I posted in the wrong forum for this question.I'm going to try the registered letter thing if that does'nt work I'll haul his a$$ to court.Man this sucks, on the surface this job/property had a lot of potential.

[Rons Rightway Lawncare]

Bullcrap! The wife has money... I would go back and tell her let's go to the ATM, or to whip out her checkbook. She doesn't handle the money.... How in the hell is she supposed to buy groceries?

I would go to this guys work too. 600$ is alot of money to not do what you can to collect.

Does he has some nice patio furniture? a nice BBQ grill? Go by and take that stuff, better than nothing right? :)

People like this make me want to take spray paint and paint a message in the road in front of the house to warn other lawn services, and to maybe fill a super squirter gun with round up and write the guy a reminder he owes money in his front lawn.....

Since you stopped cutting, has the lawn been cut????????????

[olderthandirt]

Bullcrap! The wife has money... I would go back and tell her let's go to the ATM, or to whip out her checkbook. She doesn't handle the money.... How in the hell is she supposed to buy groceries?

I would go to this guys work too. 600$ is alot of money to not do what you can to collect.

Does he has some nice patio furniture? a nice BBQ grill? Go by and take that stuff, better than nothing right? :)

People like this make me want to take spray paint and paint a message in the road in front of the house to warn other lawn services, and to maybe fill a super squirter gun with round up and write the guy a reminder he owes money in his front lawn.....

Since you stopped cutting, has the lawn been cut????????????


The mods ought to delete this stupid post!
You know for a fact the wife has money? and you would tell her I would go back and tell her let's go to the ATM, or to whip out her checkbook
your real close to extortion
But if that fails your advise is to
Does he has some nice patio furniture? a nice BBQ grill? Go by and take that stuff, better than nothing right?
Now your telling him to steal.

Its jerk bags like you that make it more difficult for legitamate businesses to collect whats owed to them. :dizzy: :dizzy: :dizzy:

[PMLAWN]

Bummer for you, Hard to deal with it sometimes, You have to make it important for him to take action.
$600.00 is a lot to you but may be nothing to him. He also may not even realize that it has been so long. I know it may be hard to think about but for very busy people weeks can disappear like minutes, ( not that that makes it right) So yes, use the mail with signed recite, tell about your need to receive payment on time to insure "your" business success and than explain that your next step will have to be legal action. This may be enough to kick him in the butt and pay up.
Always stay professional, Never berate, and keep a paper trail.
Rule of Law--"He with the most notes wins"
Good luck with it.

Or just call for BG and his shovel:laugh:

[PMLAWN]

Bullcrap!
I would go to this guys work too. 600$ is alot of money to not do what you can to collect.

???

Can you say defamation of character

[mojob]

I'd be tempted to camp out at the entrance of his driveway at night waiting for him to come home at midnight. At least you'd get your face to face with him. If he didn't pay you on the spot you could tell him that you'd be starting legal action against him. If we didn't pay our bills we might be able to afford a 1.5 mil house too! I'm sure you're not the only one this guy's stiffed. Go get em.

[alot2lurn]

I've been stopping by there a couple times a week (will start making notes of that too)I did notice someone I assume a family member tried to mow just around the house they did'nt get to far.I'm going to do this as legit as possible no stealing or vandalizing.If we do go to court over this I want to look credible and professional.Thanks for the replies ,this site is great being able to draw on everyones experience here is is invaluable.

[alot2lurn]

I talked to his wife again tonight.She confided in me that they are strapped financially,she apoligized emphatically and asked me "please don't take him to court" and that he had some recent business ventures fail.Seems between being a homemaker and homeschooling her 4 children she also has some source of income,and she has been paying all their bills.She said she gave him the bill and suspected his pride would prevent him from calling me and explaining their situation.She's supposed to call me on Wed. after going over their budget to set up a 6 or 12 week payment plan.I'm satisfied she understands that I'm not going to let this go and will take legal action if needed.But hopefully she'll be more reliable than he is.Hopefully I'm not being a sucker here but there was atime in my life where I had overextended myself financially I know how stressful that can be ,Thank GOD I got back on track.I'll give her a chance.

[topsites]

I talked to his wife again tonight.She confided in me that they are strapped financially,she apoligized emphatically and asked me "please don't take him to court" and that he had some recent business ventures fail.Seems between being a homemaker and homeschooling her 4 children she also has some source of income,and she has been paying all their bills.She said she gave him the bill and suspected his pride would prevent him from calling me and explaining their situation.She's supposed to call me on Wed. after going over their budget to set up a 6 or 12 week payment plan.I'm satisfied she understands that I'm not going to let this go and will take legal action if needed.But hopefully she'll be more reliable than he is.Hopefully I'm not being a sucker here but there was atime in my life where I had overextended myself financially I know how stressful that can be ,Thank GOD I got back on track.I'll give her a chance.

Yo I don't want to hear these dang money problem excuses... I done heard every one of these lame and sob stories and if you start to believe one, next thing you know others will try and pull this crap on you.

Way I see things, if the lady in the trailer park can pay me $20 to do her silly small lot (and likely she's on a lower type of income), then afaic they can ALL pay whatever it costs. If the poor are proud enough to pay, then what is the rich folks'es problem?

No way, I don't put up with this explanation stuff, I'm not here to play the fiddlefart whirlygig, I want my money and now.
Their stories bore me to tears.

[PMLAWN]

Yo I don't want to hear these dang money problem excuses... I done heard every one of these lame and sob stories and if you start to believe one, next thing you know others will try and pull this crap on you.

No way, I don't put up with this explanation stuff, I'm not here to play the fiddlefart whirlygig, I want my money and now.
Their stories bore me to tears.
But-But-But-- Think of it as a snowball, The man could really have problems in his business and has not paid his bills, so now alot2lurn has been put in the same boat and may have to tell the same story to someone else- and than would you still say the same statement about alot2lurn's story being bull, You will more than likely move over to the other side and help explain alot2lurn's story because now it is easy to understand. And yet it is all the same thing, NO????
It appears that there is some progress so let him keep working on it for a while longer, If there is to be a plan, put it in writing and put deadlines on it and the steps that will be taken if deadlines pass. (liens)
A person with a home like that will look to it for quick solution to money problems (2nd) but would not be able to if there is your lien, So keep moving and move fast. Good luck with it.

Play "fiddlefart whirlygig" ???:laugh: :laugh:

[alot2lurn]

Update...I picked up her first $100.00 installment on Saturday.I hope the trend continues.

[sheshovel]

See everything will be ok, I do hope you have learned to get your service agreements on paper and signed. Best lesson here is you can trust others..just don't.

[topsites]

But-But-But-- Think of it as a snowball, The man could really have problems in his business and has not paid his bills, so now alot2lurn has been put in the same boat and may have to tell the same story to someone else

I know, but I always say don't make your money problem into my money problem.

My issue with this was that if I start accepting excuses, then it never ends: ohhhh the transmission on my car, ohhhh the hospital bill, ohhhh this and that and the other... Far as I'm concerned, life or limb brother, those are the only excuses I deem acceptable.

Because my big problem is, I can let food, clothes, electric, water, phone, a basic car and to some extent rent slip past before I get paid - These are necessities and lawn care is a luxury, so be it... I'll even let dog food get paid first but when they're driving some niiiice late model vehicle, live in a 1/2 million dollar house and have a satelite dish in the yard and a broadband Internet connection, yo, I get paid right now!

By the way, there are articles concerning large scale jobs and how to handle getting paid. I think folks get excited about this lawn care thing and next thing you know, they agreed to get all this stuff done and now they can't pay:
You can pick whatever method works best for you, but the way I started doing it, I do $100 / week worth of work, bill it and wait for payment. Once I get the first check, I do another $100 and so long they pay right away, we can do $100 / week worth of work indefinitely. Now to some folks that isn't fast enough at first (yes I know they get all insistent and keep bugging you) but just put that on ignore and do $100 / week because I can assure you that 3-4 months into it, and one year later, $100 / week is more than enough for almost every type of income.

The only time it doesn't work is for certain jobs where I can't split it up like that, in that case I prefer to establish the relationship first or get some type of payment in advance.

I do know this: I doubt seriously I would've worked for the folks in this thread in the first place, due to pre-screening methods which I might recommend developing over time... That's not to say I always see it coming, I have my non-payment issues, too, so best of luck getting paid.

[Rons Rightway Lawncare]

You can go to Court, you may not win.... If you do it is not like you get your money right then and there, you may still have to wait for a long time to be finally paid.

Plus how much is YOUR TIME worth? Is it worth your time to try up a day or two in getting the court date set, then showing up for court - which around here may take several " appearances " to finally get in front of the judge....


You bet your butt these people are paying their power bill, their phone bill, their cable internet bill..... Why is your bill any different?

Look I can not stand a person who just ignores my bill, or calls and does not give me even a call to explain that they simple can not or do not want to pay the bill right now. I got plenty of money in the bank and plenty of fast paying customers that I can easily wait for one or two slow paying customers to get their bill caught up on.... But if they can't take the time to call me then that burns me up!

I was not serious about stealing their lawn chairs or grill, but in essence they by not paying you, they are stealing from you! No matter how professional or not this may be.....

And yes, who knows anyone whose wife does not have a checkbook? Give me a break!!!! Most women not only have the checkbook, but THEY dictate what is paid and how the money is spent. To have her tell you HE has the checkbook... That is just a way of passing the blame to someone who isn't there, Bet if the husband had been there and the wife gone, he would have said SHE has the checkbook....

If these people are so " rich" why not ask them if they have something to barter with? How about a nice TV, or surround sound system as payment? Or maybe some of the husbands tools? I know that sounds crazy, but who knows, maybe you could come out really good that way... And they come out good cause they got a debt taken care of and when they finally do have the money they can just go get a new TV or whatever...

All I am saying is no way is some customer of mine going to get away with not paying a bill that large. Under 100$ I will just write it off, but no way would I write off 600$.

[PMLAWN]

You can pick whatever method works best for you, but the way I started doing it, I do $100 / week worth of work, bill it and wait for payment. Once I get the first check, I do another $100 and so long they pay right away, we can do $100 / week worth of work indefinitely. Now to some folks that isn't fast enough at first (yes I know they get all insistent and keep bugging you) but just put that on ignore and do $100 / week because I can assure you that 3-4 months into it, and one year later, $100 / week is more than enough for almost every type of income.

.Good idea, I will work 45 min. on a job and spend another hour moving to the next. And I am sure that any client will understand why it will take 5 years to do the wall project


ALOT2LURN--- good job, send a thankyou note with a SASE for the next payment

[Down2EarthLawns]

Glad to see everything has started up alright with the "payment plan". Hope you added interest and collection to the bill.

[alot2lurn]

Glad to see everything has started up alright with the "payment plan". Hope you added interest and collection to the bill.
Nah,I did'nt tack on interest,if she just remains consistent with payments I'll be happy.Like I said before due to some poor decisions and budgeting and some unforseen personal matters I've been there before ( it sucks ! ) . I don't doubt they were giving me the run around at times but I don't think they hired me with intentions of not paying me . I don't want to run my business like a charity but I'll try to work with my customers from time to time . I might try to hit them up for some hunting permission after their paid up . Again , I want to thank everyone for their comments and suggestions . I guess I learned the hard way , as ussual ( lol ) . I'll keep ya'll posted .

[alot2lurn]

Well , she gave me another $100.00 check this evening .

[apowell18]

It's actually nice to read how this story has unfolded thus far...I think you have handled it well and very professional under the circumstances.

It sounds as if this property is one worth keeping, though. Have you thought of having them sign a contract to continue service? There are a few templates on this site that would work.

Just my opinion, but I don't think I will ever sue a customer over any amount of money. My time is too precious to waste on them in court and the effort. Simply send it to collections and cut the loss. At least this way they will remember you when they wonder why their credit score slid 50 points and now can't get that new car or house for what they can afford. In the end you get the last laugh.

well done alot2lrn

[PMLAWN]

Well , she gave me another $100.00 check this evening .:clapping: :clapping: :clapping:
Keep up the good work.

[alot2lurn]

It's actually nice to read how this story has unfolded thus far...I think you have handled it well and very professional under the circumstances.

It sounds as if this property is one worth keeping, though. Have you thought of having them sign a contract to continue service? There are a few templates on this site that would work.

Just my opinion, but I don't think I will ever sue a customer over any amount of money. My time is too precious to waste on them in court and the effort. Simply send it to collections and cut the loss. At least this way they will remember you when they wonder why their credit score slid 50 points and now can't get that new car or house for what they can afford. In the end you get the last laugh.

well done alot2lrn
I'll probably send all my customers including them a Christmas card this year , in each of those cards I'll thank all of my customers for their business and invite and encourage them to remain customers . I will require a contractual agreement with everyone .

[executive property maintenance]

you should take his daughter out have a couple drinks snap a couple pics of you taking body shots of her mail him the pics payment enough for me

[jcb287]

Make sure that next year you have some kind of agreement or contract made up stating what services will be performed billing periods,when payment is due......blah,blah,blah.You get the idea.Its much easier to cover yourself with some type of agreement that both contractor and client sign.I made mine up my first year on Microsoft Wordpad, dropped it of at the local printer and had them set it up as carbon-less document.I get the top copy and the client gets the bottom copy.I think $85.00 got me 250 copies. Hope it all works out for you.......:)

[Big Bad Bob]

This is my first year in the lawn and landscape business,and I do it part time.I don't usually deal with contracts unless requested by a customer.I'm not naive,but maybe a little to trusting,and so far with the exception of one customer I have'nt had any problems.A little background I mow this customers yard for the price of $135.00 first mow was $180.00 he paid me $200.00.Property is expensive here in Northern VA and he owns 20 acres with a 3500 sf house pool ,play ground ,basketball court probably worth $1.5 mil. or so.Other than mowing he requested mulching ,leaf removal,gutter cleaning,pruning etc.So I thought cool 5 min. from the house well off easy going customer with a ton of work at our agreed upon price of $45.00 per man hour.Well- I have'nt been able to get in touch with him for over 2 months after he accumulated a bill of over $600.00 with the exception of when I handed him the first bill ( he asked at that time if he could mail me the payment because he had his business check book at his office ) I called the #'s he gave me prob. 50 times literally (no response) he told me early on he gets about 300 voice mails a day in his line of work and cant possibly check them all. For his second notice I handed it to his wife 1 month ago ( no response).I'm going to drop off one more notice advising him he has 1 week to pay his debt or else There will be legal action taken.My question is and especially for you LCO's in VA but open to all- what are my options ? small claims court?With the info. I've given what are my chances of collecting ? What's it cost to do that in VA? How well does a verbal contract hold up in court? I have'nt done any work there for almost two months and informed his wife that was due to lack of payment and my unsuccessful attempts to contact him.Sorry for the length of this post there's a lot to explain here.Any help or advice would be appreciated , with the exception of busting my 00 about the lack of a contract.The bills I gave him were itemized bills the second stating it was his second notice.



I've got a mob connection if you like. :weightlifter:

[alot2lurn]

Make sure that next year you have some kind of agreement or contract made up stating what services will be performed billing periods,when payment is due......blah,blah,blah.You get the idea.Its much easier to cover yourself with some type of agreement that both contractor and client sign.I made mine up my first year on Microsoft Wordpad, dropped it of at the local printer and had them set it up as carbon-less document.I get the top copy and the client gets the bottom copy.I think $85.00 got me 250 copies. Hope it all works out for you.......:)
I'll check into someone making me carbon copies of a contract ,that's a good idea man.

[alot2lurn]

For those of you who were keeping up with this post and may come back across it , I stopped by their house last week and caught the husband home , he wrote me a check for the remaining balance . It would have been nice to have it before Christmas but my wife and daughters birthdays are coming up . Incidentally I went straight to his bank and cashed the check . Good luck to everyone on the approaching season .