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View Full Version : We don't need no stinkin' base.


TURFLORD
10-29-2006, 06:25 AM
Last year a customer of mine was having pavers done when I showed up to cut the lawn. I told him I was able to do that size job and was working it into the conversation as to why he didn't ask me for a quote. Anyway, we got to talking about price. Flat and square patio in back, approx. 16x25 and walkway around side to drive picking up side door along the way. Remove old slab 4". My price, off the top of my head and done on the spot... $13,000-$15,000. He got someone for $8500. I saw the job getting done.;) ;) ;) They ripped up the 4" slab, threw down about 1" of dust on top of the sub soil, and started laying bricks. Everything was dry cut. A nice cancer cloud hung in the air the whole time. And a note on professional courtesy, they didn't move a single tool out of my way.

Randy Scott
10-29-2006, 08:36 AM
Well, I know it's all regional, but here in the mid-west, you would be way out of line with your price. 400 sq. ft. patio (16x25), a walkway from the back to the drive, approximately 35 x 5 feet (max), another 175 sq.ft. plus removal of old patio. High end bid here would be 10K.

tthomass
10-29-2006, 10:01 AM
point out to the customer the installation is not being done correctly??

paponte
10-29-2006, 10:39 AM
I thought ICPI was a proud sponsor of stone dust? Some guy at a quarry came up with the idea of a "base" to move his product... no? :rolleyes:

I would agree that your price would be on the high end, of course site unseen.

PerfiCut L&L
10-29-2006, 11:21 AM
Without actually seeing the job site, $8500 seems about the going price for a similar job in this area.

All you can do is inform the customer of what they can expect from a quality job like that.

We send out small brochures with our invoices promoting services like stoneworks, and water features... things that a customer might not think a lawn company does. Works good for us.

TURFLORD
10-30-2006, 06:01 AM
The price wasn't the point I was making, but while we're at it, my price did include the cost of pavers which were an interlocking octagonal type, not the cheapest thing in the catalog. I know I'm not providing exact job specs but I know I'm pretty close for quoting from the hip. The main crux of this post is that there was absolutely no base used at all, just an inch of dust on grade. Some could argue crushed concrete/road stone, new/reuse base, how much base, etc. None was used.:confused:

tthomass
10-30-2006, 07:40 PM
it will fail, then you can fix it

stone dust shows they do NOT know what they are doing, big no no......aside from no base

ACutAbovesiny
11-03-2006, 10:41 PM
I thought ICPI was a proud sponsor of stone dust? Some guy at a quarry came up with the idea of a "base" to move his product... no? :rolleyes:

I would agree that your price would be on the high end, of course site unseen.


ICPI is strictly against using stone dust. It retains moisture and is just not as good as sand.

ACutAbovesiny
11-03-2006, 10:42 PM
Forgot about the no base part. Are they professional or just some guy that said "I could do that job cheaper than anyone else can."

paponte
11-04-2006, 09:41 AM
ICPI is strictly against using stone dust. It retains moisture and is just not as good as sand.

Thanks! Glad I'm certified or else I wouldnt have known that. I've been installing pavers for a couple of hours now, think I got the jist of it. I was being sarcastic, how you couldn't tell I don't know. :hammerhead:

SimonCX
11-07-2006, 05:09 PM
Last year a customer of mine was having pavers done when I showed up to cut the lawn. I told him I was able to do that size job and was working it into the conversation as to why he didn't ask me for a quote. Anyway, we got to talking about price. Flat and square patio in back, approx. 16x25 and walkway around side to drive picking up side door along the way. Remove old slab 4". My price, off the top of my head and done on the spot... $13,000-$15,000. He got someone for $8500. I saw the job getting done.;) ;) ;) They ripped up the 4" slab, threw down about 1" of dust on top of the sub soil, and started laying bricks. Everything was dry cut. A nice cancer cloud hung in the air the whole time. And a note on professional courtesy, they didn't move a single tool out of my way.

Where in nj are you because I had the same thing. A customer I mow had a patio and wall done by some guy that showed up in a old station wagon. This was even better, they didn't even put down any base and this is new construction. They put the pavers on the ground on top of the grass, the wall has colums which are not even connected to the wall. You can push over the colums by hand. The corners of the wall do not have corner stones, they are just reguler blocks that end and then turn 90 degree's so you can see in from the side. There are so many things wrong that I couldn't even name all of them. When I meet the customer I told her that the patio and wall wouldn't last the winter the way it was built, and should be ripped down. She said she was having problems because there was no permit to do it and now the township has called here in and wants plans and who built it. The thing that pissed me off is this guy isn't a legal business and this guy is doing is kind of BS all over, 3 houses that you can see from my customer's house and all are done like this. I have seen bad built wall's, but this one tops all of them never have I seen anything this bad.

Team-Green L&L
11-16-2006, 11:35 PM
Guys like that are the entire reason for ICPI. It's a shame that the paver industry took a great paving product (concrete) and provided us with a perfect and constant material with it, then Joe Blow ruins the product with improper installation?

We just finished the ICPI course today in Cincinnati and would recommend it to everyone that is considering laying pavers. We haven't been laying to specifications and never knew it. I'm sure we're not alone. Fortunately, we're a little smarter that the idget your talking about.