i'm really angry.....am i wrong??

[imdawrlus]

so i brought my truck in for an allignment at a shop that has done 2 of my trucks before, and has always done an awsome job.

so after replacing all the front end components its time for an allignment....so i make an appointemt, and today i drop it off at the shop. i left a detailed note on the seat stating what i had done to the truck, and that the truck pulls to the right.

so i pick up the truck today, and pay (104 bucks) and i'm off on my merry way....well i'm going down the road and the steering wheel is off center and the truck is pulling to the right.....its like they did NOTHING...this is the reason i brought the truck in.....and someone DID test drive it, because they put 4 miles on the odometer.

so i go back and go straight to the owner, and he gets the allign guy that did the work to come up and talk to me....he tells me that the "machine is very accurate, and the problem is probably the tires"....

so for their benefit i go home and take a set of KNOWN GOOD TIRES and put them on the front of the truck...pulls to the right...i swap the known good tires, and it still pulls to the right.

so i put thoes tires back on my other truck, and park it....then i take the tires that were on the back of the subject truck, and put them on the front, and put the fronts on the back.....still pulls to the right, and the steering wheel is off center.

so now its deffinate that the problem is not in the tires...these tires arent even old!! their bridgstone blizzaks and there maby 2-3 years old....they still have most of their tread, and they were well taken care of....and the tires from the other truck that i swapped on, are only about a year old, were always taken care of.

so i drop it back off at the stop tonight, and i just came home and left a message for the owner, that pretty much says in a polite way, that i want him to make this right for me, and that i know he can do it.

what my question is, am i wrong for being kind of ticked off?? and should i be even more ticked off if he tries to charge me again???

[DFW Area Landscaper]

I have ben there and done that before. I bought a brand new set of tires from one of these local "tire only" places, where they have immigrant laborors raising the car with floor jacks. The tires were no name tires. I put them on my Xterra and I drove it straight to the alignment shop. They aligned it and as I was leaving, I noticed it was pulliing hard to the right. So I went back and complained. They fooled around and test drove it and re-did the entire procedure 4 or 5 times and finally got it drive straight.

The tires wore out within a year. Because I had been using these no name tires for a long time, and they never lasted very long. So this time, I decided to buy name brand tires from Costco. I got Michelins.

So I put the Michelin tires from Costco on there and the thing drove straight as an arrow without an alignment. The tie rods and ball joints were not replaced. Nothing was done outside of putting name brand tires on. It was like a brand new car. The suspension felt better. Everything was better. No more bumpiness. It was amazing.

I will never buy cheap tires again. I am a lifetime Costco tire customer from here on out.

I would guess your tires aren't as good as you think they are.

I always thought a tire is a tire is a tire. Wrong. Not so.

Later,
DFW Area Landscaper

[imdawrlus]

all the tires that were swapped on and off this front end are brand name tires in good shape.

[imdawrlus]

http://img217.imageshack.us/my.php?image=allign1ab6.jpg

he pointed to the top right and said "hmmm i dont know why that didnt change....i set it to blah blah blah"

do these sheets just "not update" themselves....or did he really do NOTHING, and does this sheet just confirm it??

[jc1]

Has that truck ever been aligned before? If not it still has the plugs in the alignment slots. With the plugs still in you can try to turn the adjustments for caster and camber all day and they wont change. For a vehicle to go straight on an average the caster needs to be less on the left by about 1/2 a degree then the right side. Also the camber should be set about the same about .75 degrees to 1 degree on your truck according to the specs on the chart. If you look at the sheet the before and after reading haven't changed. The final readings for caster and camber indicate that it probably will drift to the right. I spent 20 years as a chevrolet tech in a dealership and have done 100's of aligments on those trucks. Often we had them come from shops that didnt know about the plugs. Hope this helps.

[Randy J]

http://img217.imageshack.us/my.php?image=allign1ab6.jpg

he pointed to the top right and said "hmmm i dont know why that didnt change....i set it to blah blah blah"

do these sheets just "not update" themselves....or did he really do NOTHING, and does this sheet just confirm it??


Your problem is the camber - a little too positive on the right compared to the left. However, the caster should balance it out somewhat. (Vehicles pull towards the side with the most positive camber, and least positive caster.) Also, too much toe in on the right (probably in part a result of the camber) which will definately eat tires. They don't show SAI or Included Angle - which you should demand they always do on alignment printouts, but in the absence of those 2 readings I would guess if you knock out the plugs and put the adjustable kit in as jc1 has suggested, the camber can be adjusted down to a reasonable level. I would suggest a little more positive caster on both sides - to help it driver even straighter. Personally, I differ from jc1 on this just a little - unless you drive a lot of 2 lane "crowned" back highways, I'd try and keep the caster as close as possible from side to side, as well as the camber. No more than 1/2 degree difference from side to side anyway. Rear angles look good.

[imdawrlus]

update

so i go into the shop around 1:30 today and talk to one of the customer care guys....he says the owners not around, and that they didnt get a chance to look at my truck today....

so i asked when the owner was comin back, and he said he would be back in a few mins.....so i sit and wait, in the meantime, the guy goes out back and talks to the allign guy...he says the truck is "within spec." and that in order to adjust it more, the control arm has to come off, and they would have to charge me 2 more hours.....so i politely get pretty mad at the guy and explain to him that nobody told me any of this when i picked up the truck, and the bill of sale i got said it was A*OK.

so the guy says if it was up to me i would give you your money back, the owner should be back shortly.

so the owner shows up and i explain myself and my situation to him, and he says: "that machine is very acurate, your truck is all within spec." i said "well a machine is just a maching, and my truck still has the same problem i brought it in here with, for you to fix" he says "i'll see if i can have the allign guy take a look at it, if not come back at 5 and i'll give you your money back"

are they full of crap???? does these control arms have to be taken out to adjust????

its almost 4 and i just want my money back...i hope they dont butcher it anymore.

[Randy J]

update

so i go into the shop around 1:30 today and talk to one of the customer care guys....he says the owners not around, and that they didnt get a chance to look at my truck today....

so i asked when the owner was comin back, and he said he would be back in a few mins.....so i sit and wait, in the meantime, the guy goes out back and talks to the allign guy...he says the truck is "within spec." and that in order to adjust it more, the control arm has to come off, and they would have to charge me 2 more hours.....so i politely get pretty mad at the guy and explain to him that nobody told me any of this when i picked up the truck, and the bill of sale i got said it was A*OK.

so the guy says if it was up to me i would give you your money back, the owner should be back shortly.

so the owner shows up and i explain myself and my situation to him, and he says: "that machine is very acurate, your truck is all within spec." i said "well a machine is just a maching, and my truck still has the same problem i brought it in here with, for you to fix" he says "i'll see if i can have the allign guy take a look at it, if not come back at 5 and i'll give you your money back"

are they full of crap???? does these control arms have to be taken out to adjust????

its almost 4 and i just want my money back...i hope they dont butcher it anymore.

The "knockouts" need to be taken out, and adjusting shims installed instead. It is more labor intensive. It may be within specs on the paper, but the angles from side to side should still be within 1/2 degree from each other and camber is not. Besides, it still pulls and you aren't happy! I'd look at getting your money back and taking it to an alignment shop that is a little more familiar with truck alignments.

[imdawrlus]

i got my money back...all of it.

when i got home i took a closer look at the upper control arm bolts....they looked EXACTLY the same way as they did before i brought it in...no petetrating oil or anything.

but the thing that really gives it away.........



theres sand on the bolt heads....you do the math.

[Tim Wright]

I think I would take it back to the owner and show him the "Work" and the OLD PARTS.

Either he has a smuck working for him or he is a good guy turned bad.

Either way, I am tired of running into junk like this myself.

I refuse to give my money away to businesses like this.

Tim

[FearThisDeere]

so i politely get pretty mad at the guy
Haha... that's funny! I think you are right in line gettin POed at the guy. He was ripping you off this time, that is for sure. Glad to hear that you got all your money back. I'd make sure that you or anybody that you know never go there. I'd even talk to you local attorney general as well. They usually have acomplaint department for places that "work" on vehicles and still find a way to charge you. You might be able to complain and get someone to listen if you really think it is worth it. My old shop that I would take all my stuff to was great until one day they did not replace a seal like I had asked. The thing still leaked when I got home. Brought the track back and the same thing happened. They hadn't touched a thing. The tranny fluid that was leaking was just the same as when I hat brought it in. I made a mark on the driveshaft with a little bit of white chalk and it was still there. It would have worn off for sure if they worked on it. I was pretty angry. Never got my money back, but they'll never see me again.

[imdawrlus]

it actually kind of sucks for me to have to be pushy with the owner...when i made the appointment me and the owner were shootin the breeze about how him and my grandfather grew up together....and now i had to be a jerk and ask for my money back....i dont think i can ever go there again.

they guy that did allignment told me that hes done, according to him in his own words "probably a thousand of these" and he knows what hes doing.

so why couldent he do this one without screwing it all up?? if the punchouts need to come out to allign it right...DO IT....dont say its AOK on the bill and shuffle it out the door unchanged....i dont think i could ever trust him again, although i know someone who knows him very well, and says hes a good mechanic.

but anyways when i had the tire argument with them, after i came back the first time.....the allign guy said to me, "if your still not happy bring it back and i'll put a little more angle on it, even tho i dont think its a good idea"....so what happens when i bring it back?? they tell me the control arms need to come out...to me this seems like a dead giveaway that they didnt do a thing to it.

i've spent hours sitting on the ground this summer hammering out these ball joint rivots, and i've spend a lot of time looking at these upper control arm adjusters.....and to me, they looked untouched....maby i'm wrong, but i dont think he touched them at all.

[FearThisDeere]

If he had done the work and done it right I don't think he would have given you your money back so easily.

[imdawrlus]

thats what i thought too.

it ended up they wanted to charge me to take off my control arms to punch out the adjusters....

so today i took the bolts off and they are allready fully adjustable...so they wanted to bill me for work that they wouldent have had to do....

i feel bad for soccer moms who have no idea.....and dont know enough to have an argument with the mechanic doing the shady work.

[mojob]

The thing I don't get is the fact they "test drove" it for four miles with the wheel off center and pulling to one side and they thought that was ok. I wouldn't want to go back there if I were you. I wouldn't give a crap who he grew up with.

[FearThisDeere]

They probably just drove it around to make it look like they did something to it. I know when I get my truck back from service, the first thing I look at is the odometer. They probably went for a spin to Dunkin Donuts.