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View Full Version : You think this is to code?


Dirty Water
11-22-2006, 08:16 PM
Ran into this yesterday. AVB where a PVB should be on a 4 zone system, tied directly into the house water with no shutoff valve.

This neighborhood has NO backflow requirements on their water, which is crazy.

I installed a shutoff and a drain below grade. Would have liked to ditch the AVB as its doing nothing, but the guy didn't go for it.

PurpHaze
11-22-2006, 08:24 PM
This neighborhood has NO backflow requirements on their water, which is crazy.

Is the a case of the inmates running the asylum???:)

KCLandscape
11-22-2006, 08:41 PM
yes, but let them pay or move on if they dont like the advice......

sildoc
11-22-2006, 08:49 PM
See that a lot on homeowner installs. That and coroded asv's lower than the highest point.

PurpHaze
11-22-2006, 09:12 PM
On a recent repair job at our main stadium I actually replaced a brass ASV that is down in a box. However, the box is located almost to the top of a slope on a main line spur and the only sprinklers (Toro 300 Stream Rotors) are back down the slope at the bottom where the main line is located near a sidewalk.

There used to be another ASV in the box for a drip system that did plants above slope from the valve and down slope near the sidewalk but I removed it. All the drip has been abandoned for years and the plants are established and don't lack water.

This backside area is really in need of being totally renovated/automated and I'm supposed to draw up a design and cost estimate sometime this winter. We'll see what happens.

jerryrwm
11-23-2006, 12:11 AM
Ran into this yesterday. AVB where a PVB should be on a 4 zone system, tied directly into the house water with no shutoff valve.

This neighborhood has NO backflow requirements on their water, which is crazy.

I installed a shutoff and a drain below grade. Would have liked to ditch the AVB as its doing nothing, but the guy didn't go for it.
If it has a 'wild head' and a master valve then it is to code in Wisconsin. I'm not too impressed with the piping however. It's all copper to the BFD and usually down into the ground.

Dirty Water
11-23-2006, 12:14 AM
Yeah, everything for us is brass to the BFD (though we do doublechecks), I'm not a fan of PVC before backflows, or PVC in the sunlight.

I chopped out the male adapter/coupler elbow crap that someone else did and put in a new male adapter and a 90 as my last glue point after installing the drain, the exposed PVC was very very brittle.

Hank Reardon
11-23-2006, 12:19 AM
If it has a 'wild head' and a master valve then it is to code in Wisconsin. I'm not too impressed with the piping however. It's all copper to the BFD and usually down into the ground.

The Washington DOH does not allow AVB's as an approved BPA. I can't believe that guy wouldn't install a PVB in it's place. Our local code doesn't even allow PVB's and requires DCVA's.

What is a "Wild Head"?

Dirty Water
11-23-2006, 12:24 AM
What Jerry is referring to is something along the lines of this:

Master Valve --> AVB --> Wild Head -- > Mainline.

The wildhead keeps constant pressure off the AVB, allowing it to function as a BF, however I'd imagine you'd get a swampy spot :D

Hank Reardon
11-23-2006, 12:29 AM
With no mechanical loading on the poppet, they fail. Definately a green patch of lawn around it though.

jerryrwm
11-23-2006, 12:41 AM
What Jerry is referring to is something along the lines of this:

Master Valve --> AVB --> Wild Head -- > Mainline.

The wildhead keeps constant pressure off the AVB, allowing it to function as a BF, however I'd imagine you'd get a swampy spot :D

Use the smallest nozzle you can, throttle it back and hope like hell it doesn't leak into the basement. I've even seen then run a line to the nearest drain tile. It's crazy but that's what the plumbing codes call for.

Wet_Boots
11-23-2006, 04:11 PM
Ran into this yesterday. AVB where a PVB should be on a 4 zone system, tied directly into the house water with no shutoff valve.

This neighborhood has NO backflow requirements on their water, which is crazy.

I installed a shutoff and a drain below grade. Would have liked to ditch the AVB as its doing nothing, but the guy didn't go for it.So, does the state of Washington have no plumbing code, or building code that refers to a regional code? Somehow, I am never reassured by local municipal pinheads who don't care about backflow preventers.

I only have about a fifty percent success rate at getting these AVB's upgraded to PVB's - I'm more than willing to walk away from an instance where the owner doesn't want to bring a system up to actual code specifications.

Hank Reardon
11-23-2006, 05:17 PM
In the state of Washington, everyone must meet the DOH (Department of Health) minimal requirements (determined by the degree of hazzard). Local municipalities or private water purveyors can have more strict laws (I.e. my city does not permit PVA's on irrigation, only DCVA's).

The problem is enforcement.

Here's a thought...what obligation would a service technician have if he were BAT cerified and came onto a property where a clear safety violation existed? Is he/she bound to report it to the water purveyor?

:confused:

Mad Estonian
11-23-2006, 05:53 PM
Here's a thought...what obligation would a service technician have if he were BAT cerified and came onto a property where a clear safety violation existed? Is he/she bound to report it to the water purveyor?

I take it you're in Washington State, I'm just over on Vancouver Island, and I think the rules are similar for both of us (obviously depending on the purveyor, but it's all Pacific NW AWWA). I know they told us that if we see something illegal, you tell the owner it needs to be fixed, and if they're not willing to do that, you're supposed to notify the purveyor. Haven't had to do that, wouldn't particularly want to, but if I saw a hose end sitting in a pool of nuclear waste or something...