Looks like I will stick with the junk business

[Gravel Rat]

Finding a tandem axle dump for the amount of money I want to spend is becoming not a easy task its nothing but junk. If a person wants a decent truck looking at spending 40,000 dollars anything for 25,000 dollars is site trucks.

Also the prediction of the local economy doesn't look good I think the housing boom we have had fizzled out. This time last year contractors were busy and the same time last year were busy. Right now its like somebody pulled the plug on the work the contractors are laying employees off or they are down to couple days a week.

A little frustrated sitting at home no work going on I can't find a job with a excavation contractor because they have no work :rolleyes:

[ksss]

I would move. Granted easier said than done but a man has to do what a man has to do. Certianly other parts of CANADA must do better than where your at. If nothing else get a work visa and come south. Pick up some skills and go back up north. You would be much more marketable with a good resume.

[Gravel Rat]

I have to move to Alberta where is 40 below zero in the winter and in the summer the black flies are like birds and 40 celcius. One of my brother's friends works out in Alberta driving end dump makes 6 grand a month he is working 12 hours a day never sees days shorter than 12 hours and works 2 weeks on 10 days off. Lives in a camp and never see's his familly he is trying his hardest to find a job out here but there is nothing.

Most jobs in Alberta are working on the oil fields and most of it is in camp work. There are not many places to rent in Alberta if you do find a place its a 1 bedroom appartment for 1000 a month. People are renting out bedrooms in their houses for 200 a month. There is no real life most guys in Alberta spend allot of time in the bar and gambling.

I have looked in the Interior of B.C. where my uncle is he said there isn't much going on. He works for a company that tries to create work and enployment. The economy in the Interior isn't doing that good because it is mainly logging as the industry.

When the B.C. gov't keeps preaching B.C.s economy is doing good is limited to Vancouver and that little corner. It is all the hype about the winter olympics in 2010 that is driving the economy there. The 2010 olympics is going to drive B.C. so far into the hole the provincial debt will increase millions.

I don't want to really live in Vancouver its a horrible city with bad crime just living there will shorten you life by 10 years. Just visiting for a day drives me insane.

Driving truck in Vancouver is frustrating as h*ll because the roads are not designed for the amount of traffic on them because they were designed for a 1950s 1960s population. One accident grid locks the freeways for hours I talked with guys that drive in the city sometimes you can be sitting in traffic for 2 to 4 hours. One truck driver I talk to quite abit says even at 3am there is rush hour traffic.

The requirement to drive dump truck in Vancouver is you wear a turban and don't speak english. They under cut the rates so bad nobody else can work. They will work for the cost of fuel if it means they will get the job and then they end up crying they are not making any money. They operate their trucks in deplorable shape but they are certified because they take them to shops with their own race working there. They will pass a truck even thou its not really legal. The trucks I looked at in Vancouver would never pass inspection at our shops here but in Vancouver they have a current inspection.
The one truck I looked at had a new CVI done and it was passed but when I looked at the truck it had tires that were past the legal limit. Other parts of the truck were not legal and would have made the truck fail here.

I have helped with many truck inspections I know what needs to be done and what is legal. I asked on of my mechanic buddies he said they get away with that done there because soon as the gov't inspectors check on these shops they start pleading racism :angry:

If the gov't does close these shops down they pop up somewhere else and start the same BS all over again.

So I'am not sure what to do I thought I could make enough living with a dump truck here thats not the case. Then there are more people jumping on the excavation bandwagon I seen a few more ads in the local paper for new excavation companies offering services.

The people I talked to figure our local economy isn't going to pick up till March and who knows if its going to be good or bad.

I'am looking for other ways to get work so I can quit my part time gov't job that I dislike. Its a dead end job that will never go anywhere plus the fact you never know what they will do. With them your a number and thats it.

I could get a job with the highways maintenance contractor but they are worse than the company I work for now. They wonder why they can't get anybody to work for them. The starting wage they pay is :laugh: able I would make more money sitting at home.

There are so many companies with bad attitudes towards their employees and they wonder why B.C. has a labour shortage problem.

[Fieldman12]

I can tell you it's getting that way especially in the US no matter what field of work your in. Even excavating for example has been a big thing around here for the past few years. I have several friends that farm that bought some excavating equipment. I have one buddy for example that has bought the follwoing in the past three years. He has Cat 2002 D4 dozer,Deere CTL 322 with many attachements, Cat track hoe, Deere 35 mini track hoe, 2006 dodge ram 4x4 diesel,Cat crawler loader, just bought two old Terex pans,2000 4x4 extended cab dodge ram diesel, 20' corn pro gooseneck trailer, 2005 chevrolet one ton duramax service truck, 1999 day cab Peterbuilt with a drop deck detach trailer. He bought all of these and is now twenty five years old. He is very good at the books and hired workers that know there stuff. The main guy that he has is almost 70 years old and has done it all his life. He does mostly septic systems but recently got a job putting in a 1.5 mile road to the sound of $600,000. Im not sure on the debt he has but personally I think he got big way to quick and personally I would rather know how to do all the work as good as my employees. Anyway according to him and others the housing development has fallen off sharply. He told me he has put in about half the basements he put in the year before. Also if you work somewhere like I do the companies keep wanting more work for less money. I mean we will take where I work for example. They want to start a person out at $9.35 an hour. There is no way you can rent an apartment and pay a cheap car payment on that. I think the big picture is this. Allot of money in the last few years spent has been (old money) that has been made in the stock market and from people that sold there land for a bunch and had to reinvest that money in a given time to avoid the heavy taxes. Eventually and where seeing it around here all over in Ohio as soon as the average people are not spending any money no one will be spending any. I recently bought me a skid steer to make a little extra money. I sometimes fear though that in another five years they will be doing that work for nothing. Around here a skid steer is as common if not more than a tractor now.

[RockSet N' Grade]

We are beginning to see cracks in the proverbial dam here. I was working at a site the other day and overheard the contractor talking about filing bankrupcy because some of the homes he built and that were due to close, fell out of escrow the day before closing. When this thing breaks, and it will, I don't see a soft landing........there is too much debt floating out there. More important, once confidence is lost by the majority, homes from 200,000 to 2 million will see a drop. I've rode through this cycle two times before in my life and made it both times. It's most interesting though that the homes from 5 million and up seem to be a stable commodity even in bad times when bottoms are falling out all over. I personally, am reducing debt.

[Gravel Rat]

My situation is I don't want to take on debt I have a clean record now and if the housing boom we have had is going to take a dump there is going to be a few contractors going under. There are allot of home owners so deep in debt with house payments they can't see the light at the end of the tunnel.

For me to buy a tandem axle dump truck for 25,000 is 500 dollars a month plus another 200 a month in insurance. The truck will have to work atleast 10hours a month to make the truck payment.

I know contractors that have gone out and bought new equipment I think some of them might be selling that new equipment if next year turns bad.

The people that are trying to flip houses aka buy them cheap and try re-sell them are going to take a bath. Then there are people out there with 2000 dollar a month house payments.

Have to wait and see what happens I might be glad I have a part time job :p

Our economy in Canada partially relys on the US economy and if the California market is slowing down there goes millions of dollars in gravel sales and wood. There are millions of tons of gravel shipped to California from the West Coast of B.C. .

[Scag48]

I think there's money to be made with smaller equipment doing compact work. Buy a mini for $15K, a truck for $10K, and a trailer. Same investment, and at the end of the day, you can clear way more than a dump truck, plus it's less stressful and the insurance is a hell of a lot less. We were doing well with our excavation endeavour, us getting out had nothing to do with business dropping off, we were quite busy until the day I left for college. It was strictly a logistics issue my dad overlooked when purchasing the machine. With that said, if you came about 200 miles south, you'd find work in the Seattle area. There's always something going on over here. The housing develpment scene seems to still be going on, although in a lesser force, but nonetheless it's very, very consistent, there's tons of really loaded people looking to build and developers are breaking ground wherever they can. I don't know everything, but as far as I can tell, the middle man doesn't make it. Either you're small and have small overhead, or you're huge and taking on as much work as possible. There are too many guys in the 10-20 employee range that can't streamline to compete with the smaller guys and are losing bids to the big boys. My strategy when I get done with school is to start out with a small mini ex, a cheap truck, and just go for it. I might get on a with a big firm for a year or two and do some more hard knocks learning on someone else's dime, but we'll see where things take me. I still haven't learned large pipe work so that's on my list of things to learn, I want to run scraper for a while and understand what it takes to bid those types of jobs, I'd like to get on a grader as well, polish my dozer skills, and if I could do some demo work along the way I think I'd be pretty well rounded.

[Gravel Rat]

The guys jumping into the excavation business are guys with mini excavators. The mini market is getting just as flooded as the excavation contractors with fullsize machines.

It looks like if I want to stick around here I'am going have to do 20 different jobs not just one. It looks like I may have to go back to mowing lawns :nono:

I don't think I can do bullwork anymore doing landscaping by hand and digging with a shovel. I'am so out of shape I get tired running my 046 Stihl bucking firewood for 5 minutes. There will always be landscape maintenance work the one landscaper I work with was so busy this summer it was non-stop.

There has been too much speculation that this housing boom was going to continue. As I mentioned some contractors have gone out and bought newer equipment and I know those machine payments are pretty high. Some of the people I have talked to that have been through these housing spurts says this one has been the strongest boom yet. It might be fooling people to beleive its going to continue. I do think some of the developers have stuck their neck out pretty far spending big chunks of money clearing land on speculation.

The one subdivison I was hoping that would go isn't selling that quick. If it was selling lots then I could see lots of dirt hauling. It seems like the interest from buyers has turned into tire kickers want to look but no big sales.

It may turn into like it was 3-4 years ago there was people renovating houses but new construction and landclearing was pretty slow.

[mrusk]

Don't you guys save money? I do. If the market bottoms out and there is no work at all i will be fine. And i a truck loan and a skid steer loan. You got to save your money and budget so then your not afraid to take a little risk and spend money expanding in a new field.

BTW i doubt housing will fall drasticly nation wide. Interest rates are falling. I basically think housing will just even out for awhile.

Matt

[Fieldman12]

There is tons of mini-excavators and skids around here. Yes there is work for them around here but eventually they will be more people doing the work than there is a demand for the work. This will drive what you run the machine for way down. Dont forget all the rental stores that have both the machins you can rent for a decent price. I bought a skid steer to use on our three farms and Im looking at buying another farm. If it never leaves the farm it has more than paid for itself. I did buy a three year old machine that is good enough to take out and do some jobs. Im just not betting on getting rich or quitting my day job anytime soon. Allot of people that bought skids had to buy the truck, trailer, tools, fuel tank, and the machine. I had everything but the machine. Yes I could use a better trailer but that is no biggie. Farm ground has more than doubled in value the past few years. What we see here is extremely high prices for farm land and no one is buying. The funny thing is thought for some reason when they put it up for auction someone will go there and pay the outrageous price. Also in Ohio as of next year they are passing a new septic law that will add another $7,000 to $10,000 to put in a septic. Dont think that will have no effect. The person wanting to build will either have to build a smaller house, buy less land, or buy an existing house. Something else that will drive the land prices up around here is all the talk about ethanol and using soybeans for fuel. It's going to be an interesting next few years.

[murray83]

I'm laid off rite now...well....I quit but thats a whole other thread :rolleyes: but we have a new refinery in the works (Canada's biggest) and work continues on the new LNG terminal,housing here is in full swing,new appartment buildings,a new justice building,cruise ship terminal the list goes on.........its not all excavation but its still work.

Your best bet is to get out of BC and Alberta and move to a larger city heck even Ontario.......the housing prices in the west are a joke....I can buy a nice new bungaloo here for under 150 grand out west? half a mill,thats simply a joke.

You ever look at prices for equipment here? you'd probably buy the nice set up you want for the money you have to spend and still save some,out west equipment is so overpriced I really don't know how you guys do it :confused:

[Gravel Rat]

It is expensive here on the West Coast but I think it is the same all the way down the coast right to the Mexican boarder.

We will have to see what happens there are allot of people out there with credit cards maxed out they spend 80% of their monthly income for car payments and house payment.

[janb]

I...
I'am looking for other ways to get work so I can quit my part time gov't job that I dislike. Its a dead end job that will never go anywhere plus the fact you never know what they will do. With them your a number and thats it.

Keep the PT job, don't let them wear you down, maybe you could locate a FT gov't job that is 'off-shift' and not a bozo for a boss (if so, just 'humor them)- make them feel real good, and hopefully they'll leave you alone and let you work

in the meantime, pursue your passion, on-the-cheap, putting plans into place to 'jettison' when the right time comes

like... fixing an older F-450 with dump / hoist ... and a killer-good drivetrain / hitch, for when the economy improves.

remember,
low debt, keep PT job for benefits / income / food / rent
but, in the meantime go have some fun :waving:

[Gravel Rat]

The job I have is going to be full time some time in Aug 2007 if I want it but management is picking on all employees. We don't have one boss we have managers they pretty well look over 300 employees in the division I work in.

Our managers are no different than the other division managers they keep pushing the employees. Alot of us put up with the BS I'am part time so I only have to deal a little bit with the BS but the full time guys get most of it.

Its kind of like a nagging woman you can only take so much. Its one of the reasons why I'am trying to find ways of getting another job or more work.

I would like to get back to excavating but I don't know what our local economy is going to do.

[Qualey]

"I would like to get back to excavating but I don't know what our local economy is going to do."

Who does? Jesus, if you wasted half as much time doing business as you do thinking about doing business you'd be a millionaire by now.

[AL Inc]

^About time someone said it^ Life's too short Gravel, you have to take chances, if you fail, get back up and try again.

[hosejockey2002]

If you are willing to take a risk and come south of the border there is plenty of work. Lots of companies are seeking experienced dump and pup drivers as well as equipment drivers. Just the other day I saw a news story about the Washington State DOT having a hard time recruiting and retaining plow and dump truck drivers. Base pay is around $35,000 US a year and they probably get lots of overtime in the winter, and I imagine they have decent benefits. Getting a CDL is really not that big of a deal. I don't know what legal stuff you would have to do to make yourself legal to work in the US, but lots of folks do it.

[Dirty Water]

Apparently there is a good shortage of skilled HDPE pipe fusers as well.

Consider a career change?

[Gravel Rat]

There is a shortage of carpenters here but I never was a good carpenter I try hard but it takes me forever to do anything when it comes to building things out of wood. To tell you the truth I'am scared of circular saws I will use a chainsaw with a 48" bar but a 7 1/4 skill saw I'am worried about cutting myself.

We will see I may still end up buying a tandem axle dump but if we are into the normal pace that we have seen here for the last 20 years I will end up going back to landscaping and light trucking. I stopped doing it for most of this year becuase I got allot of work from the gov't.

I don't want to take a risk I have a clean record with my local bank once you get a bad record like going bankrupt it takes years to regain your credit.

You bounce one check around here every business knows it. I never bounced a check yet.

If I stick with the gov't job and go full time with them I will make 30,000 a year roughly. That isn't enough money per year to live comfortably and own a house a person needs to make atleast 40,000 a year.

[murray83]

Ha! wanna come east?

I was offered a nice chunk of land today,250 acres plus a 5 bedroom farm house.The land has plenty of hardwood on it plus the fact it has a large deposit of gravel on it,the old lady offered me $65,000 ;) Ugh if only my credit was better I'd run out and buy it :cry:

I feel so sorry for you guys out west paying out your behind to just buy a home,I relly hope that never happens here.

[Gravel Rat]

To buy a cheap house the payment is 1500 a month and a cheap house is 200,000.

I can't afford 1500 a month even with my gov't job wage I only make 2000 a month. Some months I only make 500 a month.

[RockSet N' Grade]

Ok Gravel Rat.....enough! If you aren't willing to take a risk, quit whining and complaining. Life is about risk, from birth to death. There are no sure fixes. There are no pat answers. There is no fu***ing holy grail that anyone of us has that you don't have! I get up every morning and sweat bullets about my next payroll, payments, where's my next job coming from, and yada yada yada....that Amigo, is LIFE. Get a grip....do something other than nothing (although that is something, but not very productive). Get motivated to get out of that chair......you make $500 a month sometimes and don't want to ruin your bank credit? Jump into it man, go for it, do something.....just stop whining and finding excuses to stay stuck! I write this to you not as a put down, far from it, I write this to you to kick your ass in a positive way to get moving.........

[Gravel Rat]

I'am willing to take a risk but if it doesn't work out and I get a bad credit rating it can take up to 5-10 years before the bank will even look at you.

I do want to eventually buy a house or some land I'am looking at 230,000 dollars I would have to put 12,000 dollars down and have a annual income of 80,000 a year.

The way I'am at now I need to make another 50 grand a year I have a choice try go to excavation or start growing herbs its good till you get caught but its easy way to make a extra money :laugh:

At 20 dollars per hour job like I have now isn't enough money for a person to even dream of buying a house. The sad part of it is if I go back to work for a excavation contractor I will only make 17 per hour. If I go back to driving truck for the building supply it would be 16 per hour.

A person moves east of Alberta can buy 100 acres of land for 100,000 dollars but there is no work. If I move all the way East where Murray is the economy isn't that great.

With my current financial status I can only get a 25,000 dollar loan so that limits on what truck I can buy or what I can get into.

[dozerman21]

Gravel Rat- If the economy and cost of living is as bad as you say it is, why are you still there? Most anyplace you go either has a high cost of living, a highly competitive market (my area), or a slow construction rate. However, most places don't have all three! If you go back and read all the posts that you've made about your living and working situation, I don't see why you would possibly want to hang around? Unless you have a family situation, or someone you are looking after, take a hard look in the mirror and ask yourself why you're still there. Then get the f**k out of dodge! You'll find a better situation probably anywhere you go, by the you talk about you current situation. Like everyone else has said, sometimes you just have to dive in head first, otherwise you won't even get your feet wet. Nothing is guarenteed in life. Being self-employed is no different. Find a better location, choose a trade that there is a demand for, and go for it. Give it all you've got and let the chips fall where they may.:usflag:

[Scag48]

Dude you're killin me, you know enough to get into the business just in the way of saving money by working on your own trucks. Take a risk man, get outta BC and start somewhere else. Get on with a big firm in Alberta and buy a house there. There HAS to be work somewhere with decent housing. I guarantee that Seattle area real estate is as high if not higher than you're paying, I pay my bills and I work in a restaurant for God's sake while going to college full time. I know you can find an operation job somewhere, establish yourself and get the living arrangements down, then go after your own work. If BC is as bad as you make it out to be, I would have left years ago, don't know what you're hanging on to. You might not like going to Alberta because of the cold, blah blah, but that's where the work is and that's what it takes sometimes. Stick it out dude, make a run for it.

My old man and I took a monster plunge buying $200K worth of new equipment this year. Had my dad planned a little better for who was going to keep that equipment running once I headed back to college, we'd still be in that business. Point is, sometimes it doeson't work out, whether it be economy drops off, or in our case, a logistical issue. At this point, you have nothing to lose and everything to gain. Success isn't going to happen on it's own, you have to put some effort into it.

[mrusk]

Gravel Rat- You just have to take a risk. You might as well just sneek over the US boarder at night. It looks like all illegal immgrants are going to get amnesty. You could become a american overnight! There is pleanty of work here.

Yea if your business fails you could ruin your credit. Or if your business does well you could be a millionaire!!!! You got to give it a shot. Just do something. Doning nothing is not good enough. I sware to god we have all been over this topic with you for the past couple years.

I know it is scary starting your own business but it is worth it. If you have to travel somewhere else to find enough work, do it. You said it yourself, that if you stay where your at, doing what your doing, you will never be able to afford a house. Is that what you want?

Move to NJ and i'll put you to work at 25 a hour.

Matt

[Gravel Rat]

All of B.C. isn't as bad its just the little southern corner and the Okanagan where the Albertans are buying recreational property like its going out of style they have money to burn so 800,000 to million isn't a problem for them.

As for Alberta there are still places way out in the boondocks that is cheaper I know one of the regular truck drivers is from there. He says there is no work in those areas but you would have to drive 2 hours to get to Calgary or Edmonton to go to work. I have been searching for info on the oil field work but I have been told becarefull with those companies they promise you the world but you end up getting screwed around.

Where the big money is in Fort Mc Murray Alberta that used to be a little hick town till the oil business moved into town and things went nuts. Housing prices went up 200% when peoples wages per month used to be 2000 are pushing 18,000. Used P/U trucks are non exisitant there everybody drives a new P/U truck. People in Mc Donalds make 16 dollars per hour flipping hamburgers compare to here 8.50 per hour. Restaurants can't find cooks because they get jobs at oilfield camps and make close to 25 dollars per hour.

I have a friend in Fort Mc he started there before the boom he is still there makes good money but when he moved there you could buy a mobile on a chunk of land for 50,000 now he is buying a house for 600,000. I can't remember what he sold his trailer for but it was somewhere around 100,000 dollars. People are living in tents or cardboard boxes untill they find a bedroom to rent at 300-400 a month. Every camp ground is full with people living in tents,campers,RVs. A RV parking spot is 1000 dollars a month in a camp ground a tent spot is 300 a month. Winter is brutal up there I can't see living in a tent very good :eek:

Nothing to do in Fort Mc besides work and go to the bar to drink and gamble guys go into the bar and spend a grand a night on booze and gambling. Most people that go to Fort Mc end up more broke than they were before :laugh:

I think I will get through winter and start looking at moving to Williams Lake area (Interior of B.C.). Places are a little cheaper I will miss the coast and being near the water but atleast a person can afford to buy something. The winters are a little rougher got to get used to the -30 celcius you go outside you put on enough winter clothes to keep from getting frostbite. Williams Lake is a cowboy town its a nice place I haven't been there in 15 years but it has grown.

The area I live in now has over priced the younger generation out if a person in my age group wants a house they will have to inherit (sp) it from their parents. Its only going to get worse as the baby boomers retire sell their house in Vancouver for 700,000 buy one here for 500,000 and stick the rest into the bank. Vancouver island is seeing the same problem.

The real sad part of it is the younger guys that are in construction building these houses don't make enough money to buy a house :confused:

A framer or any trades person besides a plumber or electrician only makes 20-22 per hour not enough to buy a house. A person makes enough to pay rent and live okay no new vehicals no holidays etc.

The only way you can buy a house here or any where in Vancouver is if your married (which I'am not) and your spouse's wages goes to the mortage payment on a house. Here annual salary pretty well goes to pay for the house the guys salary is what a person lives on. You need to have a wife that makes 40 grand a year and you have to make 40 grand a year. In Vancouver you need to make alteast 100 grand a year to buy a house and live.

There is lots of money floating around B.C. I don't have it but there are people that are buying chunks of property in my area for 2 million dollars no house on the property just a 4 acre waterfront lot you can't even get near the water :laugh:

I don't know what will happen here next year maybe the market will take a dump and become poverty again :rolleyes:

Anyhow enough rambling :)

[crab]

it can be done,work more spend less.good luck!

[treadlite]

Gravel Rat..... sorry to say this but you've got the same disease that most people from B.C. have, in that you wait for the world to come to you, and untill is does, you live off the government (a complaint common to the maritimers as well). Spend 10k on a nice used travel trailer, head for alberta and get a job. there's tons of companies looking for operators and they're paying $25/hr+..... Living near the coast is fantastic, gorgeous scenery, weather etc.... but at the end of the day, if you don't get off your ass and make your way, no one will do it for you!!! A year or two in the oil patch, saving your money and you'll easily have enough to go back to the coast, pay cash for some decent used equipment and never look back!!! I know.... I've done it!! Sometimes you've got to do what you don't want to to get ahead.....

[Gravel Rat]

I work for the gov't so I guess I do live off of them I never collected unemployment or welfare in my life. The problem is I don't make enough money at the gov't job even if I go full time which a full time employee makes less money than a part time guy like me.

My wage of 20 dollars per hour is classed as good I guess it is if the cost of living wasn't so high. The one problem is I don't get any overtime the gov't company I work for tries every which way to avoid over time. Also in B.C. our income tax is higher. I calculated my take home pay to be about 16 dollars per hour.

If I go to self-employeed back doing what was doing previous years I could charge 20-30 dollars for labour per hour and my 1.5 ton truck at 45 per hour. One of my landscaper friends is easily charging 40 dollars per hour for mowing lawns now and he is so d*mn busy he can't keep up. I keep sending him new customers because I don't do lawn work anymore.

If the construction stays the same and there is lots of gravel hauling and I have a decent dump truck I could easily gross 80,000 in the one season. One of the pavement haulers I know who has been doing it for years he makes a estimated 120,000-140,000 a year.

[ksss]

OK GR, I find myself reading your posts only when there is nothing else left to read. Why is that? Same sh!t, different post perhaps? Worse than that, it is very frustrating (why I care enough to be frustrated, I don't know). After some contimplation however, I think I have a theory (put your Big Girl panties on, this might hurt). Most everyone who frequents this board owns their own company. I would imagine most started with nothing or next to it and built themselves to whatever size or income level they maybe at. So when someone like you asks for advice and then whines about how tough you have it, your not going to get a lot of sympathy. Everyone here has had their own dragons to slay. Guys offer advice and you give back excuses. Your response is to go off on a tangent that is not revelent (probably a psycological response you have developed which acts as some sort of defense mechanism to allow you to rationalize your own self defeatist attitude, but I am only speculating). These tangents can at times be mildly entertaining perhaps, but in the end never really had anything to do with the topic at hand.

OK here is where the "rubber meets the road". Here is my final piece of advice. Don't do a dam# thing. There are doers and there are followers. NEWS FLASH your the latter. Chances are your right, you will most likely fail on your own in some type of business venture. Why? you've beaten yourself before you even start. Starting your own business is very tough; most don't make it. You will certainly give up the moment the road gets rocky. You need to work for someone else and pull a steady, if smaller, paycheck. Leave the risk taking to others, you belong with "those cold and timid souls who know neither victory or defeat".

Nothing I have said is meant in a mean spirit, I just think it is time to call it as it is and move on. :usflag:

[Gravel Rat]

I was reading in the paper today that financial analists figure 2007 isn't going to slow down the housing prices will rise 10% so that pretty well puts houses into only the rich class.

Personally I would rather stay on the coast and suffer being broke moving to Alberta no thanks why do you think Albertans are buying up property in B.C. like its going out of style. I would rather live in a place I enjoy living in than somewhere I hate. There is more to life than work. I don't like cold weather and I don't like hot weather the Pacific Northwest area has neither of those. I would rather work in rain than snow and would rather work in mild temperatures and not in temperatures where you could cook a egg in the shade on the pavement.

I'am pretty well better off than most people as I do work for the gov't it will be a gauranteed job. The Forest industry in B.C. is disapearing and its putting 1000 or so people out of work. If the housing market does take a dump and people get unemployeed I will still be working.

I will wait and see what spring time brings I may have to get some lessons in hydroponics and grow lights so a guy can make some good money :laugh:

[RockSet N' Grade]

Well, that pretty much says it all....you seem to know it all and have a better handle on world affairs than Henry Kissinger could possibly have. Your thinking and response about hydroponics is certainly a mature, positive and progressive way to be a productive part of society and move yourself forward. Your thinking and digesting of all the heart felt thoughts of all the folks that have posted here, I'm sure, is deeply appreciated by everyone. It's nice to see someone who wants to better themselves by stepping out of their comfort zone and create something new. YEA RIGHT, NOT!

[TAF]

Enough of your thoughts GR, I am with RS&G end this thread

[Gravel Rat]

I was talking with one of my mom's friends husband the other day we were talking about work and wages. He says you will never buy a house on a 20 dollar per hour job he says even at 30 dollars per hour you won't have enough annual income to afford a house.

I have to face the fact I live in a area that has work but can't afford to buy a house to call my own. Or I move to a place with cheaper house prices but there is no work there so you don't make any money to buy a house :cry:

The banks say for to buy a house in BC you need to make 100 grand a year either way what I do go into business for myself or stick with working for the gov't its going to be pretty hard to make 100 grand a year.

Most people I talked to say stick with the gov't job even thou you don't like it the job is gauranteed. Also if I want to borrow some money I can get a loan. By the time I pay rent I have 1500 dollars left for groceries and fuel currently I'am house sitting its the only way I can survive now. House rent around here is 650-700 a month.

So while I can house sit I'am saving the 700 a month in rent I have that extra money I can put towards a small business venture. My most feasable option is stick with small scale I trade my current F-450 in for a 2000 or newer F-450. I figure I could get 12,000 for the truck I have access to 25,000 that would give me 37,000 to get me a better truck to haul topsoil and stick with the landscaping.

If I need a mini excavator or skid I can rent, I may beable to buy a 10,000lb mitsubushi excavator I haven't looked into it yet its going to be going through estate sale. I know the people they have parted ways and things are going to be sold but its not up forsale yet.

[Scag48]

Let's face it, BC sucks. $100K a year to buy a house? That's just BC man, get out of there. I'm 20 and have almost bought a $300K house, it's not that difficult....

You really should be investing in real estate, that's where it's at. Get a loan for a good house and rent a room. Cover half your monthly mortgage just by having a room mate. There's equity in the house, real estate is where REAL money is made. I know a handfull of people worth over 20 million just by playing the real estate game.

[AL Inc]

I was thinking the same as Scag, buy a house with an apartment in it, or rent out a room. If the housing market is as bad as you make it sound, there should be lots of people looking to rent. I did the same thing when I bought my first house, it had an apartment in the basement and I got $850 a month for it. I could never had been able to afford the mortgage on my own (I was 26)

[Gravel Rat]

The problem I have is I can't save enough for a down payment on a 200,000 dollar house which is really hard to find you need a 10% down payment so 20 grand. House payments for the next 25 years are 1600 dollars a month that takes a good chunk of my monthly income I only have 600 dollars left for food and spending money. With my current annual salary it will take me two years to save up enough down payment. Oh ya by the way a 200,000 dollar house is a 1000 square foot cabin on a 1/2 acre. Condo units are selling for 250,000-300,000.

The cheapest house on the market is about 220,000 more its closer to 240,000 but most places in my area is 300,000. The cheapest option for me would be buy a brandnew mobile for 50,000 and try find a trailer park the pad rental is around 500 a month and the nearest one to where I live now is 40 mins away Its still going to cost me atleast 1000 dollars a month with my montly take home pay being 2000.

I would have to move to Saskatchewan which is the Prarrie country of Canada not much work besides farming. A person could buy a house in Prince Albert Sask for 84,000 the house built in 1959 on a 50x130 lot.

Looked up some jobs in Saskatchewan I can work in a gravel pit for 12 dollars per hour or drive dump truck for 17 per hour. I could go to work in the forestry industry in Saskatchewan annual salary there is 25,000 a year.

Move to the next province over Manitoba a dump truck driver equipment operator gets 16 dollars per hour which is pretty much the same on the East Coast with top wage being 24 per hour.

Moving out of B.C. doesn't really gain me anything the only benefit is the cost of living is cheaper.

I'am not the only person that has the problem there are tons of people in the same boat I'am in that the 20-35 age group will never beable to afford a house in B.C. . The cost of living is so high and the wages are not high enough.

[treadlite]

Or you could just sit on your butt and ***** about how the world is passing you by because it's big and mean and unfair..... you ***** about all the people from alberta coming to BC and drivig up the prices.... I'm one of them and it's because I've got the money to invest and the market in BC is full of people that just want to sit and do nothing, take the alberta money for the property and then complain about it. The world WILL pass you buy if you let it.... get off your ass and do something about it!!!!

[tnmtn]

learn how to tend bar. keep your gov't job and p/u a couple shifts tending bar. tips should be good with all the rich tourons that are in your area. it would be some extra money to save toward starting off small when the economy kicks back in. i believe it will and those that are ready will make a killing as before. those that don't catch the next wave will be left behind. i think you are on the right track with the f-450 and starting to assemble a bussiness. there are a number of people on this board that are working 2 jobs to get a new bussiness going. it would be hard for them to feel any pity. i myself am spending christmas on a boat in louisiana for a some quick money during the slower winter. i will be here for 6 weeks this trip then one for for 4 weeks after 2 weeks off. you do what you have to. not looking for anyone to feel sorry for me. i am proud to get out and do what it takes, whether it is conveniant or not. when i am able to go full time i feel any contractors will recognize this drive and things will eventually break loose. i have been around this board for over a year and have read some great very authoritative advice from you on what others should do for their bussiness. maybe it is time to read what some of the others are doing and copy. i have been doing my best to emulate some of the others and so far it seems to be working.
wish you the best and good luck,

[RockSet N' Grade]

Here's the start of GR next response: "I can't" "It doesn't really" "It's going to" "the market is going to" " I don't". GR, wake up Amigo! Reprogram your negative self. Read the books that were reccommended to you way back when. Do something different to get out of this rut, or on the otherhand, I am beginning to believe that you really enjoy blaming the world on your inability to do something different and that you like to mentally masturbate over the same thing day in and day out. Go back and read all your posts and see how negative and defeatist you are.......and the real test, what steps have you taken since then to change your course? And as for me? Well, when someone says a book has made a difference to them......I go and buy it and read it and if I can get just one thing.....just one idea.....to help me move forward, it was well worth it! I have read the book that was posted earlier and it is a must read.....not gonna give ya the name, you go back and find it. I work every day from before daylight late into the night 6 sometimes 7 days a week promoting my business, working on equipment, researching, picking successful peoples brains for ideas and help! I am successful and deserve every bit of it...I work my guts out in the field every opportunity I get and come home bone tired. I run an excavating company, I started a computor based business recently, I am involved in training horses and directed and produced a video on horsemanship, I own a small ranch, I own rentals........and I started with just desire and want to! If I can do it you can too! S**t or get off the pot! This is my last post to you....period.

[Lazer_Z]

Rockset, Great post and I'll agree with the SH*T or get off the pot remark as well.

Rob

[Gravel Rat]

The reason why I'am so undecided is if I quit my gov't job I will have a tough time getting employeed with them again. It takes a long time to get a full time position some people they have been part time for 12 years. Once you get on steady though you can work there for 30 years like most of the employees. I have 7 months to go and I will be a full time employee. I will make 30 grand a year for the next 30 years. I'am one of the lucky ones I have only been part time for 5 years and will get a full time position.

The excavation industry is tough competition in my area with a population of 3000 you have 7 excavation contractors all fighting for the same work. Currently there are 12 dump trucks that serving the area I bought one it would make it 13 trucks.

All the contractors know each other nobody really fights with each other. The community is small enough your neighbour down the road knows if you farted. I like living here because people know me and I know most of the residents ie the people that have been here for 30 years like my familly. You can leave the keys in your vehical you can leave doors unlocked you walk down the street people say hello you actually want to know your neighbours.

As for advertising a business in the area doesn't require much because if your a long time resident your already well known the advertising is for the newcomers to the area. I have been trucking in the area for 15 years so people know what I do. Also if you get a bad name for doing shoddy work or charge out rageous prices that spreads around like a bad rash and you sure loose allot of jobs. I don't have a bad name I have worked for allot of the little old ladies in the neighbourhood I never pizzed any of them off.

The comunities further down the little stretch of West Coast is where I don't know many of the contractors or the people that live there. The work potential is a little greater but you also have the local contractors in that area looking for work. There is about 20 excavation contractors that serivice that area.

I was hoping the work would continue all through winter but it never did this year so it looks like our local economy has peaked out. It is getting pretty costly to build a house your looking at 200-300 dollars a square foot so a average 2000 square house is going to cost 600,000 dollars plus the price of the property 250,000. A house and property costs 850,000 then add the landscaping and finishes to the yard your looking at another 20,000-40,000.

We have seen our american buyers drop right off the prices have gotten way too much for them. The richer people are not blinking at spending 1 to 4 million for a summer house. The trend that is happening here is its becoming a retirement village. The resource industries that used to support the famillies are disapearing and the younger generation moved away because its too expensive here and no employement. Already 40% of the population is retired and over 65 which we call nearly deads :laugh:

We figure 5 years from now the over 65 population in the area will be 60% and ten years from now the schools will probably close there will be very little students enrolled. Its a shame but that the way it goes when people with money push the people without out of a community where they have lived for generations.

So any service I will provide will have to cater to the retired I don't know maybe I should open a store that sells adult diapers (depends). Landscape maintenance and garbage removal will be two services will be required.

Right now there is only 2 landscapers that service the area there are people that do light garden maintenance but don't do the hardscaping. There is only one contractor with a skid steer service. Nobody does a 2 ton dump truck service.

[Mjh Excavating]

Sounds like the town I grew up in, if you didn't work for the state, county, or town you didn't work. Nice town to visit. The best thing i ever did was move out of there. Just no possible way to be successful there. GR, go for it or stay with your comfortable government job but please don't cry to us how tough you have it or would have it starting a business. Good luck either way.

[Scag48]

Don't quit the govt. job, work weekends and part time to start out with. You can't just jump in an be at 40-50 hours a week, you'd go broke fast. Start landscaping on weekends, suck it up, and go for it. Minimal investment and if you can get the word out, you've got it made. Nobody said it will be easy, you will have to work weekends untill you can safely jump off the govt. boat (which sounds like it sucks at $30K Canadian per year).

[Gravel Rat]

I was looking up some stats for my area and for males workers I make higher annual income over the average so like I said lots of people in the same boat I'am in.

The tandem axle dump is on the back burner I have to make a 40,000 dollar investement on a limited work truck. I was frustrated what people are trying to sell for 20-25 grand nothing but total crap they were beyond the fix the little problems. There is work for a tandem but not enough to spend 40 grand and especially when the truck has one purpose. If the one subdivison does start selling the place is going to need millions of tons of material hauled in.

If the subdivison sells slowly then it make take 10 years before all 40 lots are developed. We were hoping it would sell quick and all of us would have work building the 800,000 to 2 million dollar houses but it isn't happening.

As for my gov't job I'am on call so I never know when I go to work and when I do know it could be for a day or 20 days straight. I hate the 20 days straight its mind and body burn out I'am tired. When I go on a regular schedule as in full time employment you work 8 days on and 4 off.

I have been self employeed for years but pretty well 90% of my self employeed work is cash money. I pay the income tax for a annual income of 20,000 which is minimum you have to pay. I never really kept track of what I made per year being self-employeed as I did work for other companies and was on their pay roll so thats what the gov't knew what I made.

When I graduated HS in 1995 the area was in a slow economic period so it was tough to make a good wage getting a full-time job with somebody was non existant. So I did everything from lawn mowing to falling trees etc and I was mainly in junk removal. Worked long hours and in those days 10 dollars per hour was top wage a person had a tough time making 100 dollars a day.
I was visiting the chiropractor almost once a week thou lifting things that were too heavy or doing stuff over straining my back.

I'am not scared of hard labour but I don't know if my body can do it anymore being 30 and having to be carefull on what I do. No more digging crawl spaces into partial basements or mixing 3 yards of concrete by hand.

Upgrading my junk removal business has always been on the back of my mind because garbage is going to be always produced. I don't want to do residential waste I want to stay with removing old scrap metal or 30 years work of junk out of basements. Now that I can get about 25 grand out of the local bank's fingers I can do something. Also there is some money to be made in landscaping there never was before people used to biatch that I was charging too much I don't think 15 dollars per hour was too much when I was using my tools. Tough luck the labour rate now is 20 dollars per hour and 25-30 if your using tools like chainsaws etc. If you have 3/4s to million dollars to buy a house you have the money to have work done to it.

[turfquip]

analysis paralysis?

[Pelican]

Who am I?? Why am I here???

[Rickco]

I have never heard such a cry baby! If you put half the effort into some work as you do whining about how you Can't do this and can't do that You would be doing pretty well. You're 30 not 80,get off your lazy a$$ and do something constructive. 5 pages of this is sick!

[freddyc]

Hey Gravelrat....


You gotta consider one thing strongly I think.. you said you keep giving your buddy landscaping/mowing work because you dont want to do it.

Seems to me you're in a better position than most in that you have a potenial source of income that you know how to do but you just dont want to do it.

Might not be a bad idea to do a search and see how many people kill themselves trying to find more work (mowing...) but can't.

Just seems like the golden egg is at your fingertips and you dont want to take advantage of it.


If thats the case, start with an inventory of what you can do---whats your skill set. Then match that up and keep your eyes open for opportunity.

The people on this board are about the most resourceful people I have ever encountered...

1/ Christmas lighting
2/ trash hauling
3/ all kinds of handyman stuff
4/ power washing
5/ car detailing
6/utility trenching

and a million other suggestions.

You got a truck?? Contact your local city haul and ask them about cleaning up abandoned or vacant lots. Pick up some trash, make some cash. Move some furniture for somebody. Go to your local heating service company and ask if they need a helper.

Nobody is gonna offer you $100G's a year unless you have a specialized skill. You want a house, either get into a high tech azz kissing job or work out a diversity plan on what you already can do.

If it were me, I'd be taking advantage of the mowing thing first.

Good luck whatever you do.

[murray83]

British Columbia is probably by far the worst area to set yourself up at in Canada,so for those that wish to post constructive comments do so but if your going to start name calling and not add any positive purpose to this thread please do not post.

Makes me laugh heaing folks like Rickco post useless crap in threads that they have no idea what it is about or have any related experience.

I guess every 12 year old now is a landscaping contractor and anyone can be an excavation contractor :rolleyes:

[ksss]

FreddyC makes some good points. The Christmas lighting has turned into a big business here. Nothing I want to do but it is amazing what people will pay for a cool looking lighting job.

[Gravel Rat]

Thanks murray83

Most of the excavation contractors in the area started in the 70s and 80s when things were far cheaper. Now things cost so much its hard to start a business.

Its tough for the younger generation to get a start when things cost so much and the jobs out there are low paying. It is getting to the point now that people my age have to inherit a house when your parents pass away.

Currently with my gov't job I will be only able to afford 100,000 dollar house on my income. You can't buy anything for 100,000 unless you buy a 1/8 of a acre chunk of land and live in a tent on it.

I'am trying to find ways of increasing my gross monthly income of 3200 a month to atleast 5000 to give me a 60,000 dollar gross income. Then I can afford the 2000 a month house payment.

Oh ya I hate putting up X-mas lights I dread putting them up every year at my parents house. As for putting them up for somebody else you would be lucky they would give you 10 dollars per hour.

Homeowners haven't grasped the fact that its going to cost them 40 to 50 dollars per hour to mow their lawn. The cost of living in the area has gone up so much a person pays almost 1000 dollars a month for rent. Local landscapers can't find employees because people can't afford to live off of 12 to 15 dollars per hour. A 15 dollar per hour job is borderline survival I make 20 and I'am lucky I have a house sitting job or I would be paying the 700 a month for a basement suite. If you make less money say 10 dollars per hour you have to live with a group of people to afford the rent.

[Gravel Rat]

The people with money are pushing the people without out and its happening all over B.C. I guess when there is nobody to work in the grocery stores and restaurants something might be done. I feel sorry for anybody that makes 10 to 12 dollars per hour I have been there its depressing you can't afford nothing.

The job I have now working for the gov't used to be top of the line in wages and annual salary its not the case anymore.

I'am looking at a service that will be needed here and garbage removal is one of them. Landscaping is another one but it will be tough to do part time.

The excavation market is flooded I think there are more excavation contractors for the amount of work. Now that everybody thinks we are in for a good boom they are jumping into the excavating biz.

[murray83]

The lower mainland has basicly become a gated community,anything along the pacific coast of BC has been swallowed up by the upper class plus the forest products industry has died off because of the tree huggers that have infested BC.

I pray to god housing prices won't skyrocket much more across Canada or BC is going to get into a major rut.

[Gravel Rat]

I think its already happening people moving east bound ie past Alberta into Saskatchewan Manitoba then Ontario and Quebec are left out then moves to the Maritimes. The rest of my relatives live in Vancouver and have lived there all their lives. One of my cousins she and her husband both raised here moved to Vancouver for work. Both make good money both make more than 20 dollars per hour are trying every which way to buy a house in Vancouver but its nearly impossible.

Vancouver is going to be a big big problem in couple years something is going to let go. The poverty population is getting so bad there may end up being a war between the haves and have nots. And the people that think they can afford it will end up loosing what they have.

I was going to quit my gov't job but after seeing what is happening maybe not.

[murray83]

And your going to have the olympics soon :rolleyes:

I'm glad homes here are still decently priced but if the second oil refinery here starts up the prices will skyrocket so I'm looking for a nice lot here within the next couple years before it turns into little Alberta/BC

[Gravel Rat]

The rotten Olympics is fueling Vancouvers economy which I feel is going to be a another nail in B.C s coffin. Only the rich will beable to afford to go to the Olympics the gov't is spending billions of dollars on it.

Alberta is riding on the oil industry the rest of the province has nothing to show for itself.

Allot of people in B.C. are saying should have could have. Now there is a housing boom on the belief that the Olympics is going to bring big money to B.C. . Then Albertans have money to burn and they want a vacation home so if it cost couple million what the h*ll it is pocket change.

[Scag48]

Alberta is riding on the oil industry the rest of the province has nothing to show for itself.



Alberta is good for two things: Oil and awesome skiing. :drinkup:

[Gravel Rat]

I don't know how well skiing is this year in Alberta I don't think they are getting the really cold winter like they usually get. The oil business is big business in Alberta there is insane amount of money being made there.

[Shadetree Ltd]

Really nothing constructive to add that will actually be heard but... BC is a great place to live and work. You just have to want to work. In the four years GR has been talking himself out of taking responsibility for something I have done OK. I am a year older, have more than 50% equity in a $500 K house, with another $ 110 K in paid for equipment. Buy a cheap apartment that can be rented out for close to your monthly expenses and let someone else build equity in it while you sit around trying to decide what to do next. The numbers you quote about labour, cost of building, wages and most everything else are inaccurate. With a government job with super annuation (retirement supplement) accruing you have a huge oppurtunity to make a great supplemental income business with very little risk. If you spent less time posting "I am still undecided" you could be out hustling work and increasing your income probably by 20%, socializing and meeting a better half that could eventually lead to doubling your available income for a mortage and the current economy/housing market wouldn't pass you any further than it already has.

[Gravel Rat]

When I go full time I can apply for a different area I probably look at Vancouver Island or maybe Prince Rupert or somewhere cheaper to live.

We have no appartment blocks or anything on the coast and a cheap piece of property with a house on it is well over 200,000 dollars. My mom is a realtor and she is keeping a eye out on something cheap but there is very very little cheap property. My brother wants to buy a house aswell and he makes more per year than I do. My aunt is a loans officer we have talked about what I can afford and the max loan I can get for any equipment is 25 grand.

To let you know I work for the company that the ship sunk. The position I'am in we only make roughly 37,000 dollars a year gross. Our contract with the gov't sucks we pay into a retirement but its not much. Our next raise is about 6 years from now. The management is on your back all the time worse than a nagging wife but you just deal with it.

What I said about wages is what is paid here you are god damn lucky to make 20 dollars per hour. The only guys that make good wages are the loggers they are 28-30 dollars per hour.

Our rent costs are higher than Vancouver things cost more. If I bought a house to rent it out its pretty hard to find a person that will pay 1000 dollars a month. Some of my brothers rent a dumpy house for 900 a month. Like I said before people are renting out travel trailers because there is no places to rent.

There are very little places for tourists to stay now any of the resort places have been knocked down and 300,000 dollar condos went up. The coast has gotten so expensive that American buyers have dropped back allot. Some of them said its getting like California.

This area now has a over 55 age group at 50% if things continue this year that will be up to 70%. More people that retire and move out of ****hole Vancouver they buy a place here for 500,000 and put 200,000 in the bank for retirement.

We figure couple years from now enrollment in the elementry and highschool will drop off considerably. If the current trend continues 10 years from now the schools will close because the younger generation can't afford to live here. There are no jobs and when the house building ends the construction jobs will dwindle off. The service jobs will be still here but it will be retired people working in the stores because they are the only ones that can afford to live here.

Like I said once I go full time with the company I have the option to go somewhere else I have talked with people from Vancouver Island while at work and they said places are cheaper.

I know allot of contractors so finding extra work wouldn't be the problem if there was extra work. The excavation contractors I know have slowed down considerably same with the nail pounders. I contractor I worked for laid some of his guys off and the equipment is sitting. I have been around the excavation industry since I was able to walk.

I was all ready to go to buy a tandem axle dump truck then I started to ask around what happened to the work it dissapeared. I was told wait till march or april things might pick up again. The realtors are a little worried that things fell off so quick. I guess its from house prices that doubled and trippled in 2 years.

[Scag48]

Some of your posts don't make sense, first you say real estate prices are crazy, then you say realtors are worried because sales have dropped? If sales have dropped, meaning so has demand, prices would drop as well? Not following some of the stuff you're saying dude. If you say the work is dropping off then the real estate market is as well. Stick there and buy something this winter cheap.

[mrusk]

GR you say rent it outrages in one post. Then you say its hard to find people to pay a 1000 a month to rent a house.

Man you just have to do something. Find a new loan broker if they only want to give you 25k. Caterpillar gave me 38k when i was only 19.

Matt

[Gravel Rat]

Scag the house prices will not drop the days are gone when house prices were cheap. This area is a popular area for retirement which any place on the West Coast is. The developers have a price set on any of the lots being developed. Now that the property assessments have gone up on property taxes that keeps the prices higher. Its been about 2 years of pretty brisk house sales people trying to out bid each other. Places have sold for 50,000 to 100,000 more than they are worth.

My neighbours property tax went from 600,000 to 1.2 million he has lived there 50 years. We have no street lights no sewers no bus service but we pay very high property tax.

Even bare lots that are horrible chunks of land to try do anything with sold. When they do finally build on the property the septic system is going to cost them 40 grand. The reason why they never sold was the septic system costs allot because there is no perkable ground.

I doubt a person will beable to buy a house for under 200,000 now the average house price will be 300,000. That is cheap compared to Vancouver where your paying 500-700,000 dollars for a average house. One of my aunts has lived in one of the richer areas in Vancouver for 25 years back then the house was 100,000 its probably close to 1 mill maybe more. Its the way it is for most of the retirees they sell their house in Vancouver for big dollars come here spend 300-400,000 and put 200,000 in the bank for retirement.

Rent is high around here because it is hard to find a place to rent if you see a place in the newspaper usually its rented if its not the place is a dump. For a person to afford 1000 dollars a month you either have to be a familly or have a good paying job. I couldn't afford 1000 dollar a month rent being a bachelor. If I can't afford 1000 a month I can't afford a house payment which is 1500-1700 a month for a 200,000 dollar house. I would have to try save 2-3 years for the down payment for a house which is 20-25 grand.

Trying to get money out of the local banks is pretty tough its why I have been struggling for years trying to get my business going. Finally now that the bank finally acknologes that I'am a person they said upto 25,000 thats for 5 years. The only reason why they are willing to deal is I work for the gov't otherwise when I was self employeed it was go away. You have to own a house for collateral before they will loan you any larger amounts of money. To buy a house you need money so its not easy.

Its pretty tough for what I want to do with the amount of money I can get and my familly doesn't have extra money to help me so I'am on my own. I was in the landscaping business I struggled along for 8 years any of the tools I bought with a credit card paid off one tool at a time. I started with a Stihl FS85 which I still have and borrowed a lawn mower. I had dads chainsaw which I wore out so when I finally got my credit car paid off bought a new 046Magnum Stihl so I could go cut firewood and do tree clearing.

In the 8 years I worked at landscaping it was all low money work because there wasn't much money floating around the economy was dead. Nodody wanted to pay more than 15 dollars per hour for you and your tools. Mowing lawns was a loosing proposition I tried raising my rates but customers complained. Cutting firewood was allot of work for 100 dollars a cord but I did it anyways. I also did allot of odd jobs I have skills in a little bit of everything so I did allot of construction work not big money making it took a long time for me to get my labour rate at 15 dollars per hour.

I always was in trucking with a 1 ton the rate back then was 25 dollars per hour now its doubled I make 50. I had to get out of the lawn mowing the people complaining was getting to me. I had people timing me with their clocks because they thought I was adding time to my bills. I'am fairly fussy and do a good job but the people complained it wasn't good enough.

I started with the gov't 4 years ago and have been on call with them for 4 years your pretty much tied to your phone 24 hours a day 7 days a week and your a part time employee. When they call your expected to drop everything and go to work. I'am one of the lucky ones I have a opertunity to go full time in less than 5 years most guys have been part time 12 to 16 years before they get on fulltime. Its been tough sticking with the gov't but everybody said stick with it so I did. Lots of times I wanted to quit but never did.

I definatly haven't had things handed to me any of the trucks I bought I had to scrape every penny together to buy them. My current 95 is the most expensive truck I ever bought for 15 grand. I do all my own repairs to save money. I never was able to get a bank loan to buy a truck so its all been cash sales and credit cards.

I want to see if I can make the garbage business go but if you keep getting kicked to the curb by the banks its tough. If I want to make the garbage business go I need to make a container truck so I can do more than one job a day. The way I haul garbage now I can pretty well only do 1-2 jobs a day plus the fact I don't have a dumping flatdeck loading and unloading by hand takes allot out of you.

I would be still working for the contractor I worked for last year if I wasn't being pushed so hard. Just because I'am mechanically inclined doesn't mean I will be a heavy duty mechanic for 15 dollars per hour I wasn't hired as a mechanic/welder. I liked the job but the stress trying to keep all the old iron going was getting old. I would get something fixed then one of the other guys broke something else. The last straw was when the boss broke the Cat that I spent hours repairing.

[mrusk]

In all your post you say people will only pay xx a hour. Stop letting people tell you what you will charge hourly and you might be able to make some money. Price jobs out by the job not the hour.

If you make 37k a year, how come you can't afford 1000 a month rent? Why not get a room mate and make it 500 a month?

I jsut can't belive that BC is any different then any other place in the US.

Matt

[AintNoFun]

can be no worse than jersey.. we did a job in brooklyn last week. over $100 in tolls between a few trucks...




I jsut can't belive that BC is any different then any other place in the US.

Matt

[Gravel Rat]

My take home pay each month is roughly 2200 dollars a month that leaves me 1100 dollars to live off of. I'am not worried about rent I'am house sitting so its why I want to do something now plus the bank will talk with me. If I'am paying rent they will give me less money because my expenses are higher.

The job rates have gone up here now but when I was self-employeed nobody wanted to pay you what your figure is fair. The labour rate has gone up to 20 per hour even house cleaners are charging that to come clean your house.

The trucking rates have gone up allot because the cost of fuel we pay 4.22 a gallon for diesel fuel. A tandem axle dump truck went from 65 dollars per hour to 80 dollars per hour. My rate for my 1.5 ton truck was 30 dollars to 45 to 50 depending on what I'am doing.

One of the landscapers I work with charges 45 dollars per hour its more when he has extra help man people are squeeling like pigs. I have heard lots of complaints about the cost. I don't think people realized we have to charge that to make a living.

I always give the customer a ballpark idea because they grill you like a chunk of meat worried on what its going to cost. I always tack on time if it took 3 hours I will say 4 or 4.5 . There only has been a couple jobs I have worked on where the customer has said I don't care what it costs just do the job.

After the job is done I demand a check on the spot or cash I never give anybody credit unless it is a regular customer or I'am working for the general contractor on the job. The new people that move to the area think oh this is a rural area they can screw around about not paying bills quickly. That spreads around through the contractors like a bad rash and the home owner ends up having a tough time finding anybody to work for them.

They are rich for a reason most of them are so do darn cheap they want you to work every second in the hour your working. I know the excavation contractors have a tough time getting paid its pretty stressfull for them. Especially when you have to go knock on the customers door demanding a payment. The contractor I worked for was always chasing down customers for money.

Some of the customers ask can I get a break I usually say no or if they ask can I share a load with somebody else while the homeowner has a 60,000 dollar car in the garage and a whole pile of toys. Usually once the customer has pizzed me off I charge them for anything I can you want to play that game I can too. My famillies business is always fighting to get paid from new homebuilders mom is constantly phoning the dead beats that don't pay they always say oh we didn't get the bill B.S. .

I have to be carefull on what I charge because I work for senior citizens on fixed incomes. Most of these old timers that have lived here for 50 plus years are property rich but they live off of their meager pension check. Their famillies been here for generations some of them founded the community.

In this area the old timers class you as a resident if your familly has lived here for 30 years otherwise your a newcomer to the area. My familly has been here for 29 years now.

[murray83]

BC ferries from what I've herd out east is one of the worst government agencys to hire on with so after you let that slip what gov' place your at I see finally why your in a jam.

I'm told it was worse than Marine Atlantic was and thats just plain sad.

[Gravel Rat]

Geez BCFs reputation is all the way to the East Coast :laugh:

They were good when I started 4 years ago but now its not that good I go do my job and go home. Employee moral isn't like it used to be anybody that is ready to retire is counting the days.

I really can't quit now untill I get something else started one of the reasons why I'am trying to get selfemployeed again. I don't know if I can be with the company 30 years like some of the employees.

[murray83]

I was part time with Marine Atlantic between here and Digby NS loading tractor trailers onto the ferry with my shunt truck but we were through the longshoreman's union untill recently when they went C.A.W when they went private,it was a nice little gig and I wish they could have kept it going.The port here is slowly dieing and union membership is slowly declining but like you love the money for a part time job.