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View Full Version : Whats a better 21" Commercial Honda or Toro


greenscapes,inc.
12-11-2006, 11:30 PM
I have been using the honda hrc 216 walkbehind's and they have been pretty good mowers. I had some problems with the drive shafts but other than that they have been pretty good. Next year I need to buy a couple new ones and I have been debating on trying the toro's. What do you guys think that have used both?? Thanks

Picture Perfect Landscape
12-12-2006, 04:38 AM
Technically the toro with the honda motor is pretty much the same thing. Similar deck design and material and similar cost, with almost an identical motor.

That being said I have have 2 honda commericals and a snapper. I love the hondas. Even the one thats 10 years old.

J&R Landscaping
12-15-2006, 07:24 PM
I have a 21" snapper commercial and dont like it all that much. I will probably be getting a toro next season.

pclawncare
12-30-2006, 05:57 PM
Snappers new 21" commercials are no good. Not enough power or bagging ability. The side discarge tube for bagging alwase gets plugged id prefer my john deere jx 85 any day

BobcatBoy06
12-30-2006, 06:12 PM
We have toro, honda, and lawn boy all are commerical. We have toros that are both 2 cycle and 4 stroke. I'd have to say it depends on the application that you are using the mower for. I'd probally take the toro over the honda, I just like how it feels better. The honda does have the blade brake clutch which really isn't a big deal unless you are doing alot of bagging.If all you want to do it mulching with the mower, I think the honda may do alittle better, being that it has two blades its just a better set up for mulching. Sometimes it tends to bag better, being as it can chop the blades finer. Sometimes the motor on the honda feels like it is underpowered, and i'm not really a fan of the hande bar set up it pretty much requires that you use both hands. The toros have already proven themselves over the years, they will never let you down no matter what you are doing.

S man
12-30-2006, 06:39 PM
We have toro, honda, and lawn boy all are commerical. We have toros that are both 2 cycle and 4 stroke. I'd have to say it depends on the application that you are using the mower for. I'd probally take the toro over the honda, I just like how it feels better. The honda does have the blade brake clutch which really isn't a big deal unless you are doing alot of bagging.If all you want to do it mulching with the mower, I think the honda may do alittle better, being that it has two blades its just a better set up for mulching. Sometimes it tends to bag better, being as it can chop the blades finer. Sometimes the motor on the honda feels like it is underpowered, and i'm not really a fan of the hande bar set up it pretty much requires that you use both hands. The toros have already proven themselves over the years, they will never let you down no matter what you are doing.


This is interesting. I have a toro model 22176 with the kawasaki that I have had this year. At first I didn't like it. It cut bad and didn't have enough power. I switched to the gator blade and had the dealer up my rpms. Now this thing is awsome. The let downs are that the deck when cutting wet grass and or weeds will get very clogged up with grass that will have to be taken out by hand in order for it to cut. Also the wheels and the adjusters are quirky. The 2006 new adjuster tabs break VERY EASY. The drive rear wheels wobble just a little but seem really tight. All in all it is a nice mower and cuts nice. Although bagging with it is good as far as picking up the grass, it is a pain to take off and if clogged. But that's not a big deal.
With that said,
I would like to try a honda and see which is better. I think over all the toro will win because of it's lighter design and simple set up. Nothing complicated. But the honda has more goodies and will bag easier and better most likely.
The honda does have plenty of power, it just needs the rpms adjusted to 3600 like the manual says.

lawnpro724
01-04-2007, 02:19 PM
Toro and Honda are both good mower and I have used each one of them at different times in the last 17yrs. I would have to give the edge to toro, they will go on and on like the energizer bunny, the Honda has more perks like hydro 21" cut commercial model which I used to own years ago but Toro mowers just wont die. If you looking for a mower you can beat to death and will give you a good cut and dependable service for years to come then go with Toro Proline

S man
01-09-2007, 07:27 PM
Toro and Honda are both good mower and I have used each one of them at different times in the last 17yrs. I would have to give the edge to toro, they will go on and on like the energizer bunny, the Honda has more perks like hydro 21" cut commercial model which I used to own years ago but Toro mowers just wont die. If you looking for a mower you can beat to death and will give you a good cut and dependable service for years to come then go with Toro Proline

Mainly because they are simple. No bbc and no drive shaft. Even though there is a belt, it lasts and doesn't need to be replaced as much as cheaper s/p units. Also much easier than a drive shaft for repair. I love my toro. I'm just trying to tweak some issues with mulching right now.

lawnpro724
01-09-2007, 08:09 PM
Mainly because they are simple. No bbc and no drive shaft. Even though there is a belt, it lasts and doesn't need to be replaced as much as cheaper s/p units. Also much easier than a drive shaft for repair. I love my toro. I'm just trying to tweak some issues with mulching right now.

You use Toro Proline 21"? Get your facts straight Toro proline mowers come with BBC. Certain models in the commercial line don't have it but those are the entry level commercial models. All of mine do.

SOUTHERNGREENSCAPES
01-18-2007, 10:42 PM
Actually, if you look at the toro website, you will find that each model comes both ways. With or without bbc.

S man
01-19-2007, 11:25 PM
You use Toro Proline 21"? Get your facts straight Toro proline mowers come with BBC. Certain models in the commercial line don't have it but those are the entry level commercial models. All of mine do.

Yes some have it and some don't. But personally, for mulching I like not having it. Also did you know the bbc models don't have the crankshaft protector that the non bbc ones have?

joed
02-03-2007, 07:24 PM
I own both the Toro proline and honda commercial models. The toro is an 06 model, non BBC, with the kawasaki. The honda is an 06 model with the new design. Both are very good mowers but each one has its strength and weaknesses. Here's what I've found:
1. Engine
The kawasaki is a stronger engine than the honda. This is especially evident when mulching but the honda consumes less fuel, is quieter and has a bit less maintenance as it has no oil filter.

2. Speed
With both engines at 3600, the toro moves more quickly than the honda but not by much.

3. Cut quality
Bagging: the honda
Mulching: The toro

4. Bagging
Honda. The twin blades allows the bag to be really packed. The toro's bag is awkward to empty due to the big flap on the front.

5. Mulching
Toro. It mulches better than the honda though I've not done enough mulching with the honda to say by how much.

6. Ergnomics
Toro. It's a much simpler and easy to use design. The hydro tranny on the honda is sweet but having to hold the bar that has the bbc button on it up against a bar when moving is a huge pain. I worked around this by putting a bungee cord to hold the bbc bar in place, leaving both my hands free to work the transmission bar.

As mentionned, both are excellent machines. In an ideal world, I'd say buy one of each. Use the honda to bag in the spring and for clean ups and use the toro for the rest of the year, especially during mulching. If you can only get one, I say go with the toro.

lawnbutch
02-16-2007, 12:18 AM
But Toro has a new model this year the 22189 is a Hi Vac Bagger. SO now we have to start all over for 2007, that is they have to be compared all over again! Wow it never ends does it?

S man
02-16-2007, 01:06 AM
But Toro has a new model this year the 22189 is a Hi Vac Bagger. SO now we have to start all over for 2007, that is they have to be compared all over again! Wow it never ends does it?

That thing looks too complicated.

APV's Mowing
06-20-2007, 01:18 AM
i would say toro, first year and i have a toro super recylcer residential with 10 years on it, still cuts great and putting about 20 hrs a week on it. prob. gunna be replaced late summer or next year by a new 21" toro commercial

Exact Rototilling
06-20-2007, 12:28 PM
i would say toro, first year and i have a toro super recylcer residential with 10 years on it, still cuts great and putting about 20 hrs a week on it. prob. gunna be replaced late summer or next year by a new 21" toro commercial
I also have a 10 year old Toro Super recycler. I just looked at the Proline Toro yesterday. Kawasaki engine, handy grab bar on the front of the mower & huge gas tank. Old style bag release like the higher end residential mower Toro had 10 year ago. What I don't like is the drive speed selector is actuated by your left foot ( N - 1 - 2 - 3) Sure there is now fewer cables etc. however I really prefer using my left hand instead of my left foot. IMHO this is the only glaring flaw with the Proline mower. Would not of been vary hard to mount it where it should be. Retail on these mower is over $1100

My vote is to possibly go with the high end residential Toro with the personal pace drive system. I've been using this mower for a few years on my dad's lawn. Not sure how durable the drive systems is however your productivity $$$ payup will go up since you will not be fumbling with the drive speed especially with you left foot. Just grab and go. :walking: The more I mow with this systems the more I like it. This mower is well made and around $650 or less depending on your local prices. My only gripe with this series is that for whatever reason Toro decided to put a longer handle on the mower so you have more leverage? Not sure why?

The only real negative on Toros is they are not high vacuum baggers.

I just mowed a clients smaller over grown yard with a 11 year old Areins Hi Vac bagger. They are horrible mulchers unless the grass is brown and dead. These are fast bagging mowers so your productivity will go up especially cutting an overgrown lawn for the first time.

However my vote is the Higher end consumer grade personal pace Toro overall. The only wild card is how long the drive systems will hold up. Yet it's priced at half of the Toro Proline series.

I'd like to hear some input on the durability of the Toro Personal Pace system.

APV's Mowing
06-22-2007, 11:34 PM
im also very tempted to get the residential toro instead of the commercial, i guess it matters how much i make on side jobs, im putting all of that money towards new equip.

Howard Roark
06-23-2007, 10:07 PM
im also very tempted to get the residential toro instead of the commercial, i guess it matters how much i make on side jobs, im putting all of that money towards new equip.


I think it matters more how much you'll be using the 21. The resi Toro is awesome...cuts fantastic and last well under light commercial use. If you plan on pounding the 21 go commercial. Also consider loading/unloading, and inexperienced users will kill any mower regardless.

APV's Mowing
06-23-2007, 10:40 PM
i have 15 lawns this year and i would be using that as my main mower for the rest of the season, then next year im going to get a 36" Scag and only use it as a trim mower, and i also would transport it in the bed of my pickup always straped down, and use ramps to unload it

DillonsLawnCare
07-13-2007, 02:53 AM
either one would be great

S man
07-13-2007, 10:26 PM
The snapper hivac is also a good 21". I have the commercial one w/ the kawasaki. It has great lift and the bag ain't to bad to empty. It mulches pretty good and has no bulid up under the deck. Much easier on the hands also compared to the toro commercial.

Pro-Scapes
07-14-2007, 07:46 AM
last year our 21 died... we looked at deere.... toro... snapper and I think cub

I settled on the snapper. dealer support is awsome.. I got the briggs powered one. I think it was around 500 bucks. So far its been awsome. Effortless to switch between bagging and mulching. The variable drivespeed goes from te perfect pace to a jogging pace. Bags well and mulches fine for us.

Keep in mind we only use it on about 3 accts we cant get the Z on. Only drawback I see is the briggs airfilter is mounted in a bad spot and needs attention often.

S man
07-21-2007, 11:29 PM
last year our 21 died... we looked at deere.... toro... snapper and I think cub

I settled on the snapper. dealer support is awsome.. I got the briggs powered one. I think it was around 500 bucks. So far its been awsome. Effortless to switch between bagging and mulching. The variable drivespeed goes from te perfect pace to a jogging pace. Bags well and mulches fine for us.

Keep in mind we only use it on about 3 accts we cant get the Z on. Only drawback I see is the briggs airfilter is mounted in a bad spot and needs attention often.

I went with the commercial one because I use my 21"s alot. My phazer should fix that though.:weightlifter:

TSG
07-22-2007, 10:58 AM
Honda
Is no longer making their traditional commercial mower.
They are trying to move everyone to the high end home owners
edition.
The college down the road just bought 12 of them and they are very happy with them
Just .02

ps. I also have a tough time spending 1200.00 on a mower that is mostly used for trimming. I can't see how an LCO can be using them as their main mowers