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Ed G
12-18-2006, 08:47 AM
Yesterday, I opened the controller box (Rainbird ESP 4MI) to see what time it was and I found the alarm led on.

All zones work fine in manual mode and in test mode. Nothing on the display panel indicating a problem.

I'm suspecting a problem with the rain sensor - a Hunter Rain Click.

The alarm light went off when I flipped the sensor switch to "bypass". Alarm comes back on when I put the switch back on "active"

The Hunter sensor is wired to the two "sens" terminals in the rainbird.

Any ideas what would trip the alarm light?

It had rained earlier in the day and the sensor may have still been wet. The irrigation system was not scheduled to run until today.

Flow Control
12-18-2006, 10:11 AM
I think you may have answered your own question

Ed G
12-18-2006, 10:22 AM
normal function, eh?

This was the first time I had opened the controller door when it was wet outside (early rain with heavy morning fog and dew) since I installed the irrigation system.

Flow Control
12-18-2006, 10:53 AM
When the light is on and you have the sensor switch on active will the system still turn on manually?

Ed G
12-18-2006, 10:59 AM
no. I had to switch it to bypass to activate the valves.

Wet_Boots
12-18-2006, 11:23 AM
What does the controller manual have to say about rain detectors?

Flow Control
12-18-2006, 11:23 AM
It is just the rain sensor doing its job then.

koster_irrigation
12-19-2006, 08:12 AM
:dizzy: I thought the alarm light ment you had a 6" or larger mainline break!!:drinkup:

PurpHaze
12-19-2006, 09:01 AM
:dizzy: I thought the alarm light ment you had a 6" or larger mainline break!!:drinkup:

It must be acting up then and giving out a false reading. Ed's largest line in his system is 1-1/4". :drinkup:

Wet_Boots
12-19-2006, 10:15 AM
I thought the alarm light signalled the presense of stagnant pressure. :dizzy:

Ed G
12-19-2006, 11:09 AM
According to Rainbird, it is not unusual for the alarm light to be on for up to three days after sensing moisture.

The alarm LED is now off and controller is functioning normally.

Thank you all for the replies.

On a side note, my next door neighbor is a supervisor for a large national landscaping company and supposedly "trained" in Irrigation repair and maintenance. His yard has brown spots and green circles from low water pressure.

My DIY installed MP Rotator system has caused patches of dollar weed to be growing in my grass - from too much water :).

Flow Control
12-19-2006, 01:08 PM
On a side note, my next door neighbor is a supervisor for a large national landscaping company and supposedly "trained" in Irrigation repair and maintenance. His yard has brown spots and green circles from low water pressure.

My DIY installed MP Rotator system has caused patches of dollar weed to be growing in my grass - from too much water :).

Don't get too high on your horse.

I am assuming you are basically saying that he did it himself too. I am assuming that there are no in-line regulators. I am assuming that you understand there is a difference in irrigation repair and maintenance verse design. I am assuming you are not the first couple of builds in a new development. I am assuming you offered your glorious find of the MP rotors as a olive branch to your side note neighbor. I am assuming there is no turf disease at your neighbors house, adequate coverage and adequate run times. I am assuming your neighbor has the same amount of time to worry about his yard as you do. "On a side note" Green Industry workers can either get more then enough of trying to make all of their customers property's look nice that they are too burned out to put the same time and effort into their own property. Or they can be the opposite and do triple back flips to make sure their property is impeccable. Also Kudos for putting in the MP rotors but :hammerhead: for not knowing what the red light meant even though it rained and the bypass switch was the only way to turn the system on.

Ed G
12-19-2006, 01:49 PM
I don't know ICS, It sounds as if YOU are tetering a bit on your pony!

The last sentences of my last post was to give a compliment to those who helped me with my system and yes, doing a bit of a dig on those inept Florida Irrigators who claim to be pro's.

"I am assuming you are basically saying that he did it himself too."
Incorrect assumption. He paid a "professional" $2300 to install a six zone system. (Main line shut off valves are plastic)


"I am assuming that there are no in-line regulators."
correct assumption.

"I am assuming that you understand there is a difference in irrigation repair and maintenance verse design."
correct assumption


" I am assuming you are not the first couple of builds in a new development." correct

"I am assuming you offered your glorious find of the MP rotors as a olive branch to your side note neighbor."

He learned a lot watching me do the install.


"I am assuming there is no turf disease at your neighbors house, adequate coverage and adequate run times."

wrong. he has the worst looking grass in the neighborhood due to incorrect watering (every day for 10 minutes per zone) and cutting grass entirely too short.


"I am assuming your neighbor has the same amount of time to worry about his yard as you do."

He and his wife spend many hours worrying about their yard. I don't have to worry.


" "On a side note" Green Industry workers can either get more then enough of trying to make all of their customers property's look nice that they are too burned out to put the same time and effort into their own property. Or they can be the opposite and do triple back flips to make sure their property is impeccable."

Neighbors spend all weekend on their own yard. I waterski


"Kudos for putting in the MP rotors"
Thanks. It's actually MP ROTATORS

"but for not knowing what the red light meant even though it rained and the bypass switch was the only way to turn the system on."

1. It's the first controller I have owned that had the alarm light.
2. I did turn the system on with the bypass switch
3. Rainbird troubleshooting tips aren't that clear.

Flow Control
12-19-2006, 06:07 PM
"I don't know ICS, It sounds as if YOU are tetering a bit on your pony!"
Fair enough, but I was not throwing rocks. You don't see me on a concrete forum explaining how I am better then my next door pro at doing a stamped concrete patio.

"doing a bit of a dig on those inept Florida Irrigators who claim to be pro's"
Don't make such an ignorant statement. Those "inept Florida Irrigators who claim to be pro's" are just all trying to make it in this ULTRA competitive industry and put food on the tables while paying bills.

"I am assuming you are basically saying that he did it himself too."
Incorrect assumption. He paid a "professional" $2300 to install a six zone system."
Then WHY the dumb arse comment in the first place?? What do you do for a living besides jumping on your soapbox?

"I am assuming that you understand there is a difference in irrigation repair and maintenance verse design."
No it is very clear you do not understand, there is a huge difference between repair and design.

" I am assuming you are not the first couple of builds in a new development." correct
Well since you know everything, what happens frequently when the are just the first couple of houses up in a new development pertaining to low water pressure???????

"I am assuming you offered your glorious find of the MP rotors as a olive branch to your side note neighbor."
He learned a lot watching me do the install.
Man you are something else!!

"I am assuming there is no turf disease at your neighbors house, adequate coverage and adequate run times."
wrong. he has the worst looking grass in the neighborhood due to incorrect watering (every day for 10 minutes per zone) and cutting grass entirely too short.
Under watering or over watering, either one does not matter if you cut the grass too short

"On a side note" Green Industry workers can either get more then enough of trying to make all of their customers property's look nice that they are too burned out to put the same time and effort into their own property. Or they can be the opposite and do triple back flips to make sure their property is impeccable."

Neighbors spend all weekend on their own yard. I waterski


"Kudos for putting in the MP rotors"
Thanks. It's actually MP ROTATORS
Got me there


"but for not knowing what the red light meant even though it rained and the bypass switch was the only way to turn the system on."

1. It's the first controller I have owned that had the alarm light.
2. I did turn the system on with the bypass switch
3. Rainbird troubleshooting tips aren't that clear.

Come on you could have thought of more excuses then that.

You know what you win, I deal enough with your type of mentality during the season. I give up you are the superior human to all of us we should just bow down to our master. *trucewhiteflag*

Ed G
12-19-2006, 06:43 PM
LOL!

Thanks.

Happy Holidays to you and family.

e

Wet_Boots
12-19-2006, 07:48 PM
Do not forget, oh Grasshopper, that this thread was begun by someone who might not have RTFM

"We may have taught you everything you know about lawn sprinklers, but that doesn't even begin to mean that you know everything that we know." :nono:

Ed G
12-19-2006, 08:04 PM
Oh contraire, Boots. The FM was absorbed weeks before installation began.

It truly is not that clear, nor offers the appropriate fix.

e

Dirty Water
12-19-2006, 08:29 PM
I'll I'm going to say in this thread, is that in my experience, Florida Irrigation installation techniques seem to be sub par compared to other area's.

Not talking about you Ed.

Wet_Boots
12-19-2006, 09:13 PM
Oh contraire, Boots. The FM was absorbed weeks before installation began.

It truly is not that clear, nor offers the appropriate fix.Pages five and six of the FM cover it quite clearly, and there is no 'fix' required.
http://www.rainbird.com/pdf/turf/man_ESPModular.pdf
Good installers can usually anticipate where customers might become confused or worried when working with a controller, and try to educate them, and eliminate callbacks over nothing.

jerryrwm
12-19-2006, 11:40 PM
I'll I'm going to say in this thread, is that in my experience, Florida Irrigation installation techniques seem to be sub par compared to other area's.

Not talking about you Ed.
And that vast storehouse of knowledge and experience is based on actual inspection of the Florida irrigation systems or just what you have heard and read?
There are clowns installing in every area of this country. Yes even in Washington State. It is not demographic in nature. There are excellent installers also in every area of this country.

Because someone uses poly and pulls it in, uses pvc and trenches it in, or a combination of the two it shows the different techniques and practises. You may pull sch 40 in up there in WA and think that is the only right way to do irrigation. There are others that think pulling poly is the best way. And there is nothing wrong with trenching in the system and using SDR-21 or SDR-26. I have systems that were put in in 1982 using 1-1/4" SDR-26 and those things are still humming along. Is that the wrong way to do it? Nope. It might not work for the company that you work for, but it's not wrong.

A blanket statement like that is a little arrogant and presumptious especially from someone with all of three yrs or so installing irrigation systems.

jerryrwm
12-19-2006, 11:42 PM
Do not forget, oh Grasshopper, that this thread was begun by someone who might not have RTFM

"We may have taught you everything you know about lawn sprinklers, but that doesn't even begin to mean that you know everything that we know." :nono:

An old timer once told me, "Boy, I can explain it to you time and again, but I damn sure can't understand it for you."

Dirty Water
12-20-2006, 12:40 AM
And that vast storehouse of knowledge and experience is based on actual inspection of the Florida irrigation systems or just what you have heard and read?
There are clowns installing in every area of this country. Yes even in Washington State. It is not demographic in nature. There are excellent installers also in every area of this country.

I agree, I probably should have said "In my limited experience" in the original post.

That said, from what I've read and heard (Poly mainlines, manifolds assembled from poly insert fittings and little pieces of poly..shorty valve boxes...etc) it seems like a real hodgepodge of stuff down there.

Or maybe I'm just jealous because they have sand, and I have rocks.

jerryrwm
12-20-2006, 01:13 AM
....

Or maybe I'm just jealous because they have sand, and I have rocks.
Amen to that. Had rocks in Central Texas, got rocks in SE Wisconsin.

Ed G
12-20-2006, 06:12 AM
Re-read pages 5 and 6.

Sure, now that I was given help from some of you guys (and especially the patient Techs at Rainbird), it makes a little more sense. Manual certainly never hints at how long it takes for alarm to clear.

I became a wee bit concerned when the LED was on after 7 hours.

It IS a real hodgepodge of stuff here in Florida. 1/3 of Florida installers live in HomeDepot and Lowes getting their irrigation education from the high school kid with the red vest.

How do you tell a successfull Florida Irrigator?

He has the most trailers up on blocks in his front yard

SprinklerGuy
12-20-2006, 09:01 AM
Ahhhh....finally, the winter infighting begins.....I have been eagerly awaiting this day as I have a sh*tload of pain and suffering that needs to be healed by arguing with my "buddies" on the message board about mindless sh*t that really doesn't matter. Nowhere else in the WORLD but an internet message board can everybody be right, everybody be perfect, and everybody drive a vintage Porsche(sha)......I love the internet.....carry on.

Wet_Boots
12-20-2006, 09:15 AM
Re-read pages 5 and 6.

Sure, now that I was given help from some of you guys (and especially the patient Techs at Rainbird), it makes a little more sense. Manual certainly never hints at how long it takes for alarm to clear.

I became a wee bit concerned when the LED was on after 7 hours.Some reading of the FM that comes with the rain detector would have helped to clear things up. The controller manual is long enough already, without getting into peripheral devices.

Please, SG, get it right - of course, I'm perfect, but my other car is a Lamborghini
http://img336.imageshack.us/img336/9895/campercabinonwheels17fd.jpg

Ed G
12-20-2006, 09:35 AM
Boots, are there any other manuals left unmentioned that you are going to imply I didn't read to help solve my alarm question? :)

Hunter Rain-clik instruction sheet states that the sensor will shut the controller down for 30 minutes to four hours if exposed to a light rain.

My sensor was exposed to light moisture and the controller's alarm led was on for more than 7 hours. ( I quit checking on it after 7 hours).

The FM didn't help clear it up. If it had, I would have not made the initial post.

I enjoy that photo everytime you post it.

e

Wet_Boots
12-20-2006, 10:03 AM
No amount of reading will give someone the knowledge that years of working with the tools and material will. One can simply determine what a Hunter Mini-Clik or Rain-Clik is up to by looking (and feeling) to see if the microswitches are still tripped or not. That, and pages 5 and 6 of the controller manual, were all that was needed to figure things out. No phone call necessary. In fact, common sense might have been more useful than a manual, which might have been written by someone with a differing opinion of what a 'light rain' is.

Some manufacturers will not say one word when a phone call comes in with a question. You have to talk with whoever sold you the item. Doesn't bother me a bit, and I imagine a good amount of money is saved by the policy.

Ed G
12-20-2006, 10:19 AM
Rainbird was very helpfull on the phone.

Fellow I talked to gave me a lot of info I would have never found in any printed material.

Who would have thought that is was "normal" to have the alarm LED on for up to three days.

Wet_Boots
12-20-2006, 10:27 AM
The rain sensor might be slightly out of whack - I've had a few Hunters that I would not trust to reset themselves, if I left them on their most sensitive setting. The mechanism does have some moisture sensitivity beyond rain, so far as the fiber discs drying out go, so performance in Florida humidity will differ than that in the dry western states.

Ed G
12-20-2006, 10:42 AM
My concern was WHY the alarm light was coming on and hoping that I did not have a controller problem.

I can live with an out of whack sensor. It doesn't rain that often this time of year and because of relatively new sod, the system runs three days a week rain or shine

Heck, it won't be too long until I turn the irrigation system off until late October.

e

Wet_Boots
12-20-2006, 11:05 AM
The why was already covered in the manual, and was confirmable without phone calls or internet searching - my posting on this thread is to reinforce the cautions about getting on one's high horse. As laudable as your efforts on performing a DIY project might be, you don't want to throw your shoulder out patting yourself on the back.

Every time I stray from my own field of expertise on a DIY project, I have the utmost sympathy for the counter guys who patiently cope with my lack of proper terminology. (you'd think those guys would know the difference between a doohickey and a gizmo :p)

Ed G
12-20-2006, 11:21 AM
customer service depts and internet bulletin boards are created for the purpose of receiving phone calls and internet searching. Haven't you read the manual?

Have we reached the point where we go back and forth until you get the last word in?

That's fine with me. I love verbal sparring.

The point of this string was moot long ago, but it is great entertainment.

Wet_Boots
12-20-2006, 01:23 PM
"I sense a great buildup
of Stagnant Pressure."
http://img144.imageshack.us/img144/2783/epviyg1.jpg

Ed G
12-20-2006, 01:29 PM
LOL!

How in the world can I possibly compete with that.:clapping:

I'm sure you do realize that their really is "stagnation" pressure.

Without A Drought
12-20-2006, 04:13 PM
i thought it was static pressure

jerryrwm
12-20-2006, 05:22 PM
i thought it was static pressureAhhh...ya had to be here on the 'stagnant pressure thread'

Dirty Water
12-20-2006, 09:26 PM
Don't even get me started on Georgia irrigators :)

jerryrwm
12-20-2006, 11:22 PM
Don't even get me started on Georgia irrigators :)
It was an interesting discussion with a solid knothead for sure. He was about as hard-headed and dense as some clown named mburnikas or something like that over on another site that I had some interesting discussions with concerning profitability.

Dirty Water
12-21-2006, 12:05 AM
It was an interesting discussion with a solid knothead for sure. He was about as hard-headed and dense as some clown named mburnikas or something like that over on another site that I had some interesting discussions with concerning profitability.

Are you active on Sprinkertalk?

Ed G
12-21-2006, 09:18 AM
Boots,

Do you recall writing this (march 2005)?

"Someday, someone is going to google "stagnant pressure" and get this thread, and boy, will they be sorry."

Your absolutely correct. I did and I am.

Peace brother.

Happy holidays to all of you with experience in the trench. You deserve every dime you earn.

PurpHaze
12-22-2006, 04:01 AM
I thought the alarm light signalled the presense of stagnant pressure. :dizzy:

You know Boots that this option is only available in the Georgia area. :laugh: