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View Full Version : recoil backlash on 13ph Honda


lakesregionscapes
02-07-2007, 02:02 PM
OWW!
Sounds like a stupid issue, but it's getting really old, really fast....
We have a Honda 13hp commercial walkbehind unit with the snowblower attachment: on it's second motor, around 2 years. Been running it as a mower and a snowblower: slick setup.
We usually do our own repairs - husband is no stranger to small engines, but this one has got us - and it HURTS. (When I say we - I hand him the wrenches and thread tiny carburator screws back in...:rolleyes: )

This machine is usually an easy start, 2 pulls and it's going no matter how cold it is (Love that synthetic oil). Recently it doesn't pull smoothly some of the time - catches randomly - feels like the engine is resisting, not the recoil assembly though. Once it's running it's fine. Even more recently, at random moments it will rip the recoil handle out of your hand: if you're holding loosely it feels like your fingers got ripped off, and if you hold tight it feels like your wrist just got broken... It will fire up for a few seconds sometimes, but it can't seem to stay running long enough to settle out; in my opinion because it is being pulled to many times and either the choke isn't where it wants/needs anymore, or it's half flooded at that point. Leaving it 'til the next day hasn't helped - it's been dead on the trailer for several days, resisting multiple attempts to fire it up. Problem being no one want to pull that damn rope anymore.

Wondering if the recoil isn't releasing correctly at these times or if there is another explanation. Recoil assembly was taken off, and lubricated with graphite - it seemed in fine working order either way.

Any ideas?

Thanks!

MowerMedic77
02-07-2007, 03:26 PM
Having never worked on this particular engine the only two things that come to mind are similar issues that Kawi had on their engine. Kawi has a compression relief built on to the backside of their cam what it does is bumps open the exhaust valve to release extra compression for easier starting. What tends to happen most common is the valve lash setting gets too far out of spec and the valve does not open, and you end up trying to pull thought the compression. If you adjust the valves back to spec and it still does the same thing then the compression relief is broken(in Kawi's case repl the cam) or you may also have a sheered flywheel key causing the timing to be off. Hope this helps :)

pugs
02-07-2007, 04:07 PM
Yah, I would try adjusting the valves first...could fix you right up...

Restrorob
02-07-2007, 06:51 PM
I agree with MM also, Check the valves with the piston at top dead center compression stroke. Intake should be .006 and exhaust .008

mojob
02-07-2007, 07:21 PM
I think mowermedic is on the right track. It sounds like the timing is too far advanced and is trying to fire before the piston is close to top dead center. This will cause the piston to reverse its direction and since the drive pawl of the pull start coil is still engaged, it causes the rope to retract.

khouse
02-07-2007, 08:14 PM
A bad flywheel key will do that also. It will alter the ignition timing.

lakesregionscapes
02-08-2007, 10:28 AM
Taking your recommendations home at lunch and we'll check it out...
Thanks guys; I'll keep you posted on the outcome.

lakesregionscapes
02-09-2007, 10:45 AM
Turns out the flywheel on this one appears to be bolted, not keyed.... So on to the valve adjustment - did it yesterday afternoon, and she fired right up-YEAH! And he got it fixed before the next storm, yesss! (I hate it when the "plan B" is dead, cause I'm "plan c" ;-) )

Thank to everyone for your help

khouse
02-09-2007, 03:33 PM
It's just nice to know things are running good. Glad you got it running!

MowerMedic77
02-09-2007, 03:54 PM
Congrats :drinkup:

pugs
02-09-2007, 04:27 PM
Turns out the flywheel on this one appears to be bolted, not keyed.... So on to the valve adjustment - did it yesterday afternoon, and she fired right up-YEAH! And he got it fixed before the next storm, yesss! (I hate it when the "plan B" is dead, cause I'm "plan c" ;-) )

Thank to everyone for your help

It is still keyed to the shaft...just a FYI

Restrorob
02-09-2007, 06:01 PM
she fired right up-YEAH!


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lakesregionscapes
02-19-2007, 03:07 PM
Life is an unrelenting comedy. Therein lies the tragedy of it.

What a horribly fitting quote! :cry:

Thursday, 2AM, 12 inches of snow and a bitter cold, driving wind.... First driveway and the rocker arm splits. Not sure if the adjusting pushed it over the edge - it looked fine on visual inspection last week, or if it was already failing then and was the underlying cause of the bad attitude.
Waiting for the new part; rod looks OK. (I seem to remember the same repair on another 13hp some 4-5 years ago, but in summer.)