women workin in this industry

[LAWNGODFATHER]

mrs. lawngodfather wants to know how many are for women being hired onto your crews, and why...or why not...and don't worry your replies cannot offend me in any way. I work with the guys so I hear it all day, every day. Just curiosity...i have my own comments and opinions to add later, but I wanted to hear some of yours first...

Mrs. LGF:blob3:

[rider1000]

My wife and I work together. We average 8-10 residential lawns per day. We have 42 residential accounts we cut M-F, cut 1 Comm. account on Sat. Then myself and three others cut a large comm. account on Saturday afternoon. She can work just as hard as I until the temp. reaches over 90 and high humidity, then she has a rough way to go, but she hangs in there. Depends on the person and what they're used to. I know women who can work circles around some men I've worked with. I wouldn't hesitate to hire a woman if she can prove herself.

[MOW ED]

My wife will just be starting with me in September when our youngest starts school. I have been working on lawns for 6 years and she has done all the billing and accounting work.
I wonder if I have to increase her pay now. ;)

[awm]

im solo now but plan on crewing in a couple yrs.
i have a lady in mind that i want to train to take charge as i get older. after she has run a crew a few yrs ,i intend to turn it over to her and just take care of the handyman duties.
lot ifs there but we ll see.

[jeffex]

My wife also works with me at times. When we first started we both were slow on our toro wb but it wasn't long before 5th gear
was the only one we used. She works with me in our pressure
washing business and fills in mowing from time to time. I think a
great market for help in this business is the "stay at home" mother that needs extra money. This business can be somewhat flexible to thier schedule and much better pay than MIckey D's
My wife refused to weed eat though she uses my beat up legs as
an example!!

[HOMER]

Homette spends every day with me. She loves it (not)!
She has hung in there like a hair in a biscuit. The heat does get to her some days so I try to take it easy on her. We did 11 properties yesterday and came home at dark thirty. One day soon I hope she can stay home more......................I miss them home cooked meals......................Homette sure can cook when she has the time!:D

She has been told she can stop any time she wants......................I ain't forcing her to endure these harsh conditions.

[geogunn]

mrs. lgf--if I ran a large operation I would not have a problem hiring a woman. she would be asked to work as a crew member and not as an individual, as would the men on the crew. and I would expect that all would work well together.

HOWEVER, there are nagging thoughts of how to protect myself from the possibility of problems related to "sexual harassment in the workplace" allegations. the courts and the lawyers have gone crazy over this subject.

as a result of my former employ, I personally am well trained in how to avoid the pitfalls on the issue, however, the male crew members likely would not be and would create a dangerous situation if they did not take "how to avoid" training seriously.

and the way things are now...if an employee commits sexual harassment, the employer is responsible.

oh, and BTW, in case people don't know, sexual harassment doesn't usually have anything to do with SEX.

good luck and give us your thoughts.

GEO

[TJLC]

My wife has helped me a couple of times and that was enough for her. She works full time at her present job which keeps her very busy. She is also alergic to fire ants so that makes it hard for her to help me. Thank god for benadryl. She helps me in other valuable ways. She's ok, I guess I'll hang onto her. LOL

[Chuck Sinclair]

Best crew leader i ever had was a women, They may be a little slower but the make up for it in detail.
My sister works for me now and i know if i send her to do a job it will be do the right way.

[mdb landscaping]

i use to work on a crew before i went solo for myself that was mostly women. one time we had four women working. the guy that owned the business said he had better luck with women than men. since then, he decided to sell the business and the woman bought it and now runs a nice business and most of the crew is women.

[Mike (MLC)]

My wife has helped me out several times when I needed an extra hand. We worked great together. She got along with the clients really well. She knows just what to say to them. I haven't had to use her in quite a while, because I have plenty of help. But, I know if I needed her she would do it. She is now in charge of the financial part of the business and answering the phones. She seems to like doing that the best. :D

[LAWNGODFATHER]

I'm glad to hear most of you have wives/girlfriends/friends that are willing to help out...I've been working with Mr. LGF for over 5 years now. I do everything the guys can do, but I need help with the gates(I'm only 5'1", 105 lbs) so if I lift the gate by myself, the chiropractor gets the money earned. But someone hit on the more important subject I was looking for, sexual harassment. Every year when we place an ad for employment, a few females inquire. I try my best to talk them out of wanting the job(i.e.can you lift 50 to 100 lbs on a regular basis, does working 12 to 15 hours a day in a 100 degrees sound unpleasant, etc..)just to avoid this subject. I have a hard enough time trying to explain to the guys why they can't yell out of the windows of a truck, I'm not sure if I want to put a female in between them in a truck. Plus, even though they may not personally say anything to her, if they make a comment about a girl driving by, she can press sexual harassment charges for that. Every one is different, I personally get along with the guys and blow everything off or laugh with them, but all females are not like that...Any suggestions or comments? I just feel it's different taking your significant other with you, or her going out with the guys she already knows; and hiring someone you've never met, and hoping everything will turn out alright...

Mrs. LGF:blob3:

[jnjnlc]

Mrs. Jeff here- OK, for what it is worth my grandmother put my first lawnmower in my hands at the age of 8. By the time I was 11, there wasn't a boy in the neighborhood with the clients I had. I had the whole neighborhood! However, heat & humidity does get to some women quicker. Women have an eye for detail, color coordination and are pretty great sales people. I take care of Jeff's accounting, deposits, and run errrands for him. I talk with clients and go with him to give quotes. If I had my way, I would be right beside him. He thinks I am his best crew. I also have a BS in Business. We make decisions together. I also pick out great equipment (growing up surrounded by guys helped). Safety is important no matter what the job. Think.

Mr Jeff here. Well I was going to add something to this but all I got to say is "what she said." Seriously, she is the best help I have ever had. And yes if I were to hire someone a woman would get the same consideration as a man.

[Groundlevel]

Mrs. Groundlevel's: I feel that this type of work is hard to a degree, temperature wise dragging around a trimmer, but is no harder than some jobs. My husband has been in this line of work for 8 yrs. I joined him 3 yrs ago. I'm a partner, a co-worker and the Accountant (this word I stress). It's not easy running a business, looking after the household and kids but if I had a choice between working in a factory or sitting behind a desk all day, I'd pick the great outdoors. Some people prefer the indoors. I am a hard worker and work as fast and as hard as any man. There are some women that could handle this type of work and some that can't. Same for men. It depends on the person. I don't feel that it is male or female issue. Just because your a female doesn't mean that you are going to be slower or tire more easily. We all slow down on the job at times ( Don't we guys!). If you hire a women and she can't cut it so to speak, do the same as you would a man, let them go and find someone who can. I get different looks from people. Sometimes men will pass by and and flirtatiously say hi. There are other times when I get strange looks. Could be that the old timers think I should be at home or people find it strange to see a women on a chopper or trimming, don't know. I've kidded my husband about painting the chopper pink and hiring a crew called the Dixie Chicks!! That would really grab some attention! As far as sexual harassment, can you file charges against your husband? lol!

[Turf Cutters]

My wife has been working with me since 1994. She runs the crew while I am on duty. She runs all the equipment except the walk behinds. She does all the books and customer relations. She won't do maintenance on the equipment, thats my job beside the mowing on my off days. It has given us time together to talk over problems or just to bs and I get to take her out to lunch all the time. This arangment has worked out great.

[kris]

We now have a female running a maintenance crew...she is a excellent worker...trims , mows( walkbehind with velky), does great paperwork and the customers love her.. I have let two females go(fired) this year , fired one man and another quit ...she was a stranger off the street... the guys are warned ahead of time about sexual harassment although this gal can give it as well as take it... In general I tend to believe that females are more dependable. I have to be honest and tell you that I was very leary before last year when we hired our first female but was very pleasantly surprised... BTW... work with my girlfriend?? NOT A CHANCE!! LOL ... I tend to order her around when we are in the yard at home and she doesn't care for it at all.

[kutnkru]

Negatively:
There are a pair of gals up yander here who are the loudest, lewdest(sp), most vulgar set of broads to walk the face of the Green Industry. If they could kick the livin snot out of their male employees - THEY WOULD.

Positively:
I think that if they are of the mindset and have something to offer, I would welcome them to our organization.

Kris

[Dink38]

I have owned my own business since 1996. My husband and I do most all the work. I hate the heat but deal with it. I do the paper work along with mowing with out surfers or dixie chopper. I weedeat, pressure wash, seal driveways. My husband and I work great together. One thing I don't do is the pruning.
I like what I do and hope I never have to give it up.

[1MajorTom]

As a woman in this business, I feel I am fairly qualified to answer this question. :)

I personally would not feel comfortable working for a crew of men. The honest truth is I just am not as physically capable as a man.
But since I work with my husband, he does at times cut me some slack ;)
Such as, he loads and unloads all of the equipment. He also starts up my walkbehind for me.
He does the harder areas of mowing and trimming. I handle the flat areas and blowing off the driveways and walks. I also handle all of the accounting work.

We most of the time work great together. It is just the two of us. We are able to bring in some decent money which is nice.

My biggest adjustment was getting used to not wearing make-up and curling my hair. I never liked to get dirty. Now I just deal with it, but when I get home, I can't wait to get clean and fixed up.

My husband and I both the like the freedom and opportunities this business gives us. Plus, we are able to support ourselves decently working 8 months out of the year. Pretty nice for us.

[bobbygedd]

as much as i would love to get my wife involved in our business, its never gonna happen. she helped one time, ran the same piece of lawn over about 10 times with a 21 in. mower, broke a sweat, then a fingernail, and that was that. although id love to have her, it will never work, i do see alot of ladies here though cutting, and they do a great job. as far as hiring a female, well, someone mentioned the sex harrasment thing. u know its rough enough with a heavy workload, extreme heat, etc, and on top of it i would have to watch every word i say as not to "offend" her.

[lawnboy82]

i have had one woman working for me now for the past couple of months. she may not work the fastest. but she can dig holes just like the guys. and is again, the most detail oriented person. she is kind, and only wants to work. several customers of mine request her especially. only problem is that her husband works for me too, and there may be problems there soon. so we gotta see how long this lasts for now. :(

[kris]

[QUOTE]Originally posted by 1MajorTom
[B]The honest truth is I just am not as physically capable as a man.
But since I work with my husband, he does at times cut me some slack ;)
Such as, he loads and unloads all of the equipment. He also starts up my walkbehind for me.
He does the harder areas of mowing and trimming. I handle the flat areas and blowing off the driveways and walks. I also handle all of the accounting work.


Jodi

Thanks for your honesty... I believe because you are a husband and wife "team" that is is ok. For me...this would not cut it.. I could not expect the rest of a crew to do the majority of the "hard " physical work. Guy or Gal...they would be looking elsewhere for work. Please don't take this as a personal attack as I know there are alot of both men and woman that can't handle this type of work. Just wondering if your hubby would be alot better off (easier on him) if you were able to pick up some more work, hire someone else and have you strictly in the office?

[1MajorTom]

No I'm not offended at all. I know my limitations, but that's ok.

The way we see it, hiring a helper would be a pain in the butt.

In the business, you either stay small, or get real big. And when I say big I mean run five or more crews at least. To hire a few workers in our opinion is just lame. Then we would have to deal with paying them, paying into workmans comp, the whole nine yards. Then there would be the problem of finding one or two good helpers. And all of this for what? How much more productive would this make us after we would have to pay out the added expenses. And that's not even mentioning finding a good employee that wouldn't beat up our equipment.
(Sure, some might pay under the table, but that's not how we would want it to be.)

No, we are doing fine as we are. But I can see how some women wouldn't be able to handle the workload working with a crew of men. She more than likely would have to be a brute of woman to keep up day after day with a man.

[bubble boy]

i don't know that hiring one or two people is lame. if you have one productive employee, or 5 productive employees, you pay them each the same amount, say $12/hr. its not as if the fifth costs you less in salary.

and, at least canada, workers comp is based on payroill, whether your payroll is $20000 or $100 000. so each worker, regardless of your total workforce, costs you the same.

The decision to hire, whether it be a man or a woman, should be based on whether you are better off with or without the help. this is a financial AND practical issue. Each employee should be making you money, or making your life easier, or both:D

as for man or woman, i know a few women who can get thru a lawn as fast as me, with as good a job, and they don't complain as much as me. but i tend to complain a lot, or so says my business partner
:rolleyes:

[Jason Pallas]

Actually I'm pretty qualified to answer this question - been in the business for 20+ years and currently have a company that handles 500+ weekly accounts - and have hired more than my fair share of women. Most are better workers than the men - on time, curtious, polite, conscienscious. and hard workers. Every once in a while, we'll get one that's a little slow or just doesn't take to the labor intensive side of the biz - but, we get more than a few men that are the same or worse. Right now I've got a woman that has worked for me for 3 years on one of the crews. The customers love her, she holds her own with the co-workers and she's one of the best workers I've ever had. In addition, she's a very attractive woman, respected by her co-workers and ready to work all the time. The sexual harassment thing is a very big issue and the others workers need to be warned if it becomes an issue - however, here we've had enough women work that it's a given that that kind of stuff doesn't happen. This woman would probably knock the snot out of them if it happened. She definitely holds her own.

[Charles]

A new study just came out saying the women have more indurance than men. Anyone have access to the article?
I see alot of women out doing lawncare these days. The other day I saw 3 working for 1 crew. Weedeating and riding

[Charles]

Just found this:
> > > The following is an excerpt from the July 1943 issue of
> > > Transportation Magazine. It was a guide for hiring women. This was
> > > serious and written for male supervisors of women in the workforce
> > > during World War II - a mere 56 years ago! Obviously, the intent was
> > > not to be "funny" but, by today's standards, this is hilarious! For
>*> > those of you with efficiency issues, pay attention to #8.
> > >
> > > Eleven Tips on Getting More Efficiency Out of Women Employees:
>
> > > There's no longer any question whether transit companies should hire
> > > women for jobs formerly held by men. The draft and manpower
>*> > shortage has settled that point. The important things now are to
> > > select the most efficient women available and how to use them to the best
>*> > advantage.
>
> > > Here are eleven helpful tips on the subject from Western Properties:
> > >
> > > 1. Pick young married women. They usually have more of a sense of
> > > responsibility than their unmarried sisters, they're less likely to be
> > > flirtatious, they need the work or they wouldn't be doing it, they still
> > > have the pep and interest to work hard and to deal with the public
> > > efficiently.
> > >
> > > 2. When you have to use older women, try to get ones who have worked
> > > outside the home at some time in their lives. Older women who have
>* * ** never contacted the public have a hard time adapting themselves and are
> > > inclined to be cantankerous and fussy. It's always well to impress upon
> > > older women the importance of friendliness and courtesy.
> > >
> > > 3. General experience indicates that "husky" girls - those who are just
> * * * a little on the heavy side - are more even-tempered and efficient than
> > > their underweight sisters.
> > >
> > > 4. Retain a physician to give each woman you hire a special physical
> > > examination - one covering female conditions. This step not only
> > > protects the property against the possibilities of lawsuit, but also
> > > reveals whether the employee-to-be has any female weaknesses
> > > which would make her mentally or physically unfit for the job.
> > >
> > > 5. Stress at the outset the importance of time, the fact that a minute
> > > or two lost here and there makes serious inroads on schedules. Until
> > > this point is gotten across, service is likely to be slowed up.
> > >
> > > 6. Give the female employee a definite day-long schedule of duties so
> > > that they'll keep busy without bothering the management for
> > > instructions every few minutes. Numerous properties say that women
> > > make excellent workers when they have their jobs cut out for them, but
> > > that they lack initiative in finding work themselves.
> > >
> > > 7. Whenever possible, let the inside employee change from one job to
> > > another at some time during the day. Women are inclined to be less
> > > nervous and happier with change.
> > >
> > > 8. Give every girl an adequate number of rest periods during the day.
> > > You have to make some allowances for feminine psychology. A girl has
> > > more confidence and is more efficient if she can keep her hair tidied,
> > > apply fresh lipstick and wash her hands several times a day.
> > >
> > > 9. Be tactful when issuing instructions or in making criticisms. Women
> > > are often sensitive; they can't shrug off harsh words the way men do.
> > > Never ridicule a woman - it breaks her spirit and cuts off her
>* * * *efficiency.
> > >
> > > 10. Be reasonably considerate about using strong language around
>* * * **women. Even though a girl's husband or father may swear
> > > vociferously, she'll grow to dislike a place of business where she hears > > > too much of this.
> > >
> > > 11. Get enough size variety in operator's uniforms so that each girl can
> > > have a proper fit. This point can't be stressed too much in keeping
> > > women happy.

[bobbygedd]

women have more endurance than men? i dont know about that. are we talking about a male speciman in good physical condition, compared to a female in the same good physical condition? or a female althlete compared to a male out of shape beer drinking, ciggarette smoking slob?first contest should be shoveling and wheelbarrowing stone.

[geogunn]

Originally posted by Charles
Just found this:
> > > The following is an excerpt from the July 1943 issue of
> > > Transportation Magazine. It was a guide for hiring women. This was
> > > serious and written for male supervisors of women in the workforce
> > > during World War II - a mere 56 years ago! Obviously, the intent was
> > > not to be "funny" but, by today's standards, this is hilarious!

CHARLES...WHAT'S SO HILLARIOUS ABOUT THIS? I USE THE SAME MANUAL!!!:D

GEO

[jwalker]

My husband and I own our business. He started doing residential yards about 6 years ago and then I came along and married into the business.

First of all let me say if someone had told me years ago I would be doing this for a living now, I would have had a really good belly laugh. I always hated mowing when I was a kid and hadn't mowed anything at all in about 25 years until I met my husband. Heck, I never even picked up a Weedeater until I was 35!!

Although my husband started this business, he was never one to push himself more than he saw fit. He is just happy rideing around all day mowing and trimming. One of his favorite things to do is an all day brush cutting job. He doesn't like the businees or selling side at all. However he is good with the customers and before he met me he was getting new business by referals, which I think says alot.

We have grown alot since we got married. Mostly because I have taken over the main parts of running the business. He lets things get to him too much and so I have tried to take some of the strain off. He is not fond of being rushed (time is money).

We both like outdoor work and although we no longer work together much, we did do very well when we did. We both enjoyed working with each other and the fact that we were together 24 hrs a day did not bother us in the least.

I tent to be more detail oriented (can you say "ANAL") while he looks at things and if it's passable in his eyes it's OK.

We have tried to hire females but none have worked out. That's not to say we won't contiue trying but we have gone to hireing Hispanics now and they are working out well. We talked to some other lwan care people who have Hispanics because we wre worried they wouldn't take direction from a female boss. The people we talked to hadn't had that problem and we haven't either. I let them know who is BOSS when they start working here. They get the picture.

Of the two of us, I am more mechanicaly inclined than my husband. He can do mechanical stuff if he really has to, but I am the one who does the bulk of any mechanical work or training that needs to be done. I have always been pretty mechanical and have been able to make and fabricate most anything, especially anything having to do with metal.

Unlike most females, I hate to shop, but heaven help me if I go into Home Depot or Northern Tools :o)

Just my 2 1/2 cents

[crazygator]

OK my 2 cents. If the person (male or female) can do the work, is willing to accept everything you explain about the type of work they will be doing, then no problem. I know my wife will not do it full time with me. Although she would help me anytime I needed an extra hand. But as far as sexual harassment, I have seen too many companies here (all types) go out due to law suits, so you have to be careful. But then what does "be careful" mean? Tip toe around things us guys are known to talk, joke or jest about? Maybe "we" need to grow up and just be mature more often. As a owner of several other past companies, I have worked with all types. But the ones that would fit into the profile as a sexual harassment liability are never worth keeping anyway. They are all the same, more mouth than work, all the time. So yes, I would hire a woman to work with us, and probably have less problems than with a man. Good luck to all the women out there. And good luck to all the women trying to keep us men in line....hehehe LOL!

[jwalker]

I did want to add one other thing or two...

I have worked in non-traditional (male dominated) jobs all my adult life. I guess I'm just not your typical female. I have alway like working outside or working in a job that had a lot of variety and the jobs that have these traits seem to be more male oriented than female.

It has been my experience that women who work in these types of professions, and are successfull, tend to know how to get along with the men they have to work with. I can only speak for myself but I would have never been able to stay in this work had I taken everything that is said on a jobsite seriously. It really doesn't matter where you work, you're always going to have some jerks, male and female. I my case I just ignore the idiots that feel like they have to say certain things in order to justify themselves.

I can not say I have ever been "sexually harrassed" on the job. I can say, however, that I have had to put up with ignorant imbisles (sic) that seem to get their kicks by putting others down or saying things that would otherwise be unacceptable. But they have tended to do it to men and women alike. The men just don't realise it or think "thats just what men do".

This is just my opinion, but it has been my experience that the women who are in non- traditional jobs, and are successful, have a tough skin. They have to. Do they need to put up with the jerks? Yes and no. Most women I have worked with in these jobs have been well more than able to hold their own. I know I have. Any woman knows if she is going to last in a non-traditional job, she is going to have to be tough. The work requires it, physicaly, and mentally. Overall, we are not as strong physically, but I know I can always find a way to get a job done, even if it would seem I am not physically able to do it. I just have to be a bit more creative than my male counterparts.

It irks me when these whiny women come along and say they are being harrassed, when most of the time they could have put a stop to it themselves. Yes there may be times when they will not be able to get the offender to shut up, but those are few. And in such cases, if they won't quite, then they should be reported. The lawsuits come into play when the offender is reported and management doesn't do anything about it.

If you have it stated in your Employee manual (you do have one don't you?) that you will not tolerate harrassment of any kind toward any of your employees, then you must stick by that and if someone reports harrassment to you , you must investigate and take care of the problem. It's not pleasant but running a business ain't all sweet smellin' roses.

The bottom line when it cames to sexual harrassment or any other kind of harrassment, is that you have to have a written policy and you have to stick to it. And you must document, document, document. Anything that happens, you must keep meticulous paperwork so if you do get dragged into a lawsuit you can prove you did all that was required of you.

Basicaly, all we women want is to be treated fairly and be left alone to do our work.

Is that not what men should want in there jobs too?