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View Full Version : Dump bed/truck question


nobagger
03-11-2007, 08:46 PM
We are puting in a Downeaster dump bed insert in our 06 F250 Super Duty. It has a heavy suspension package on it (5 leafs and 1 helper per side). The payload says 2900lbs but the bed alone is 850ish pounds. My question is, you guys who have them, did you beef up the rear suspension any and how much if you did.

SpruceLandscape
03-11-2007, 10:58 PM
instead of beefing up the rear suspension anymore, just get a set of timbrens for the rear.

hosejockey2002
03-12-2007, 12:16 AM
I second the Timbrens, that's what I did with mine.

tthomass
03-12-2007, 12:24 AM
So with Timbrens and related products..........all we're really doing is saying "hey, I'm not as loaded as I look" to the police as we drive by? Your GVW doesn't change. May prevent sagging etc but the vehicle is still being over loaded.......am I missing it?

nobagger
03-12-2007, 06:23 AM
So with Timbrens and related products..........all we're really doing is saying "hey, I'm not as loaded as I look" to the police as we drive by? Your GVW doesn't change. May prevent sagging etc but the vehicle is still being over loaded.......am I missing it?

Not in all cases, I see what your saying though. In my case I will not be overloaded with a payload of 2900lbs. The suspension (differential,axles ect.) are a 1 ton any way the only difference is the 250's are 1 spring short of being a 1 ton truck. Even if I just leave it alone I will be at or just under the payload rating...2900lbs-850(dump bed)=2050lbs then minus the load. Our typical load will be grass clippings and stuff like that every day and the occasional 2-5 yards of much. I just hate it when a truck saggs,even a little.

SpruceLandscape
03-12-2007, 07:41 AM
first of all, I'm not the kind of guy who believes in buying a cheaper piece of equipment and then trying to just barely make it work... So lets not try to go in that direction. For what he wants to do, a set of timbrens is the obvious choice without getting into reworking the springs and rear suspension. They will take some of the load off of the springs and hopefully save some money in the long run by way of not compressing the crap out of the rear shocks and near bottoming out the truck! It has nothing to do with how much weight it makes the truck look like its carrying to the cops! I've got timbrens on the front off all my trucks with plows and a set in my truck that has a dump insert for this exact same reason... that is to save the equipment.

nobagger
03-12-2007, 08:44 AM
first of all, I'm not the kind of guy who believes in buying a cheaper piece of equipment and then trying to just barely make it work... So lets not try to go in that direction. For what he wants to do, a set of timbrens is the obvious choice without getting into reworking the springs and rear suspension. They will take some of the load off of the springs and hopefully save some money in the long run by way of not compressing the crap out of the rear shocks and near bottoming out the truck! It has nothing to do with how much weight it makes the truck look like its carrying to the cops! I've got timbrens on the front off all my trucks with plows and a set in my truck that has a dump insert for this exact same reason... that is to save the equipment.

Exactly, I just want to help out the rear springs when loaded. When its not loaded the insert wont be a problem at all. I'm going to start with Timbren's then if it squats too much (remember I hate it when a truck squats down) I'll go with just 1 extra leaf in each rear spring.

Tim Wright
03-12-2007, 09:58 AM
OK, here is a dumb question.

I hear all of this timbren talk but have no clue as to what one is or what it looks like.

Can you all enlighten me please?!!

Thank you,

Tim

nobagger
03-12-2007, 10:03 AM
OK, here is a dumb question.

I hear all of this timbren talk but have no clue as to what one is or what it looks like.

Can you all enlighten me please?!!

Thank you,

Tim

Tim, these are very thick rubber "bumper stops" that go either on the front of a truck (for plowing) or the rear for heavy loads. They are about 4-5" long and about 3-4" round. They bolt right onto the frame of your truck. In a nut shell, they prevent any heavy load from brinning down the truck too far (sagging). Hope that helped.

patpls
03-12-2007, 10:48 AM
Hey Guys, got to agree with getting some timbrens. Other than saving your springs has helped with evening the ride when towing my 10,000lbs dump trailer. Will be getting timbrens for all trucks from now on!

Drew Gemma
03-12-2007, 01:38 PM
what do timberend cost usually

nobagger
03-12-2007, 03:05 PM
what do timberend cost usually

The ones I need are around 166.00, thats a typical price.

MysticLandscape
03-12-2007, 06:50 PM
Does the suspension of the truck have to come down so you can fit them in? Like putting the truck on a life to get under it and such or can I just do it in my driveway?

GreenN'Clean
03-12-2007, 07:55 PM
I have air bags on the rear suspension and its worked good. Hauled alot of dirt,stone,mulch etc and springs haven't ever sagged

Shady Brook
03-12-2007, 08:56 PM
I realize you are not talking about legalities, however you might want to get the truck weighed if you have not already. They are usually over generous with payloads if you are going by what Ford says. Weigh the truck with bed and any tools, plus any guys you usually have to be sure what you can legally carry. If I put an insert in my 95 ford diesel with two guys, I would be able to legally carry a case of pop. It ain't much! Also know that if you have a load in the truck and also have a trailer, you will put more weight on that rear axle causing you to be over weight on that axle even if the truck by itself is legal.

Ok, I know our trucks will haul more weight then they are rated for, but if we are overloaded and get stopped by the Dot....big fines. If we are in an accident and we are over weight....it could be worse.

Just thoughts.

hosejockey2002
03-13-2007, 11:56 AM
Ok, I know our trucks will haul more weight then they are rated for, but if we are overloaded and get stopped by the Dot....big fines. If we are in an accident and we are over weight....it could be worse.

The DOT doesn't really care what your truck is rated at by the factory. There are thousands of trucks on the road every day operating legally above their factory GVWR. The DOT is concerned with:
1) Not operating above your LICENSED Gross Vehicle Weight. My truck is licensed for 12,000, so I'm legal below that weight even if I may be over my factory GVWR.
2) Not violating federal bridge (axle load) laws. Those are 20,000 for each single axle and 34,000 for a set of tandems. Not an issue for the little trucks we drive.
3) Not violating tire loads per inch of width. IIRC those are 600 lbs./inch for rear axles and 500 lbs./inch for steer axles. Again, not likely to be an issue for small trucks.

If you are in an accident, you can be cited or charged if you are at fault, regardless of whether you are overloaded or not. If you are overloaded and rear end someone because you can't stop, you can be cited, charged and/or sued. The same thing can happen if you are not overloaded.

Unless your insurance specifically excludes overloading (I doubt it does), it will still cover you if you get in a wreck. If you are cited for negligent driving, they may cancel you or raise your rates, but they will do this whether you are overloaded or not. Heck, your insurance will cover you if you get hammered and drive your truck through the front wall of the liquor store.:drinkup:

My point to all this is for the most part, at least in my experience, is that the police really don't care if you are overloaded as long as you are licensed for the load and are in control of your vehicle.

SimonCX
03-13-2007, 12:20 PM
Why did you not go with a 350 if you knew you where going to put a dump insert in? When I bought mine 2 years ago the price was the same but 1500lbs more payload. Timbrens will help but if you get stopped by dot your still over.

Shady Brook
03-13-2007, 12:30 PM
People can do what they want, and they will. But...

Your telling me that my worker in his ranger can get an 11,000lb plate to avoid emission testing and load it to 11k and the Dot officer will not care a lick? From my experience they don't want you over your rated plate, but they don't want you over you GVW.

The idea of the DOT other then to take more money from me is to keep safe vehicles on the road. We have axle ratings, spring ratings, tire ratings, brake ratings, and frame thickness to match not to mention other parts. If I could rate my one ton to a GVW of 26k would it be safe, and would the Dot cop care?

If you are going to be sued because of an accident would you rather go into the court room having a lawyer plead the case of a responsible business owner with properly inspected vehicles operating within the manufacturers specs, or overloaded? Leaves the imrpession to most that you were not operating responsibly, that you were not thinking safety first if you are over weight. Hey if your going to be sued so what's the difference?

I think there is a misconception about plateing trucks above their legal limits. If someone would like to give me proof this is true I would love to see it. I just know that the license branch, and the state cops I have spoken to have said otherwise.

hosejockey2002
03-13-2007, 04:24 PM
Your mileage may vary, of course, but in this state the DOT is focused on commercial trucks over 26,000 GVWR. A Ranger is not required to cross a scale. Of course, if you loaded a Ranger to 11,000 gross the tires would be flat and the bumper dragging on the ground. Obviously this will get you negative attention from the local police. But, if you install overload springs on a Ranger and load it over it's GVWR by 1,000 pounds the DOT won't give a rip and they won't know. You can license a truck in this state for over the factory GVWR. I heard from a guy on another forum that his International had a factory GVWR of 19,000 but he licensed it for 26,000. Since his truck is over 16,000 in this state he has to cross the scales. The only time he has been ticketed was for exceeding 600 lbs./inch in his tires.

On the court issue, if you injure someone by your negligence, you can be held liable. Exceeding your truck's GVWR makes you more likely to get in an at-fault accident, so I guess you could say that overloading your truck can be considered negligent if it causes an accident. I never said exceeding factory GVWR was smart, only that in my experience it is not illegal.

Tim Wright
03-13-2007, 06:12 PM
Is this what you are talking about when speaking of Timbrens?

Tim

nobagger
03-13-2007, 06:42 PM
Why did you not go with a 350 if you knew you where going to put a dump insert in? When I bought mine 2 years ago the price was the same but 1500lbs more payload. Timbrens will help but if you get stopped by dot your still over.

Well, we needed a new truck and this was one of the last remaining ones for 06 with everything we wanted and in white. The dealer told me we would have to wait about 6mos. for the 07's to come.

SimonCX
03-13-2007, 10:57 PM
Well, we needed a new truck and this was one of the last remaining ones for 06 with everything we wanted and in white. The dealer told me we would have to wait about 6mos. for the 07's to come.


Wow, I didn't think it was that long of a wait. I guess I bought mine at a good time because there was a 250 and a 350 with the options that I wanted at the time. I got the 350 because of the increased payload, the only down side is reg. is more because of the higher gvw. I think the major difference in the 2 is the rear has an extra leaf and bigger wheels and tires. Which tires did yours come with because I can't stand the conti's on mine.

nobagger
03-14-2007, 06:51 AM
Wow, I didn't think it was that long of a wait. I guess I bought mine at a good time because there was a 250 and a 350 with the options that I wanted at the time. I got the 350 because of the increased payload, the only down side is reg. is more because of the higher gvw. I think the major difference in the 2 is the rear has an extra leaf and bigger wheels and tires. Which tires did yours come with because I can't stand the conti's on mine.

Ours came with 17" aluminum wheel and Perelli scoprions , I thought these perelli's would be terrible in the snow and ice but surprisingly they hooked up with no problem. I often plowed in 2wd, it has 410 posi traction so I'm sure the posi helped.

HydroCutter
03-14-2007, 08:13 AM
Downeaster makes a stainless insert. That may be lighter, and it costs about 900 more.

How much does soil weigh per yard? how much does a bed full of clippings weigh?

SpruceLandscape
03-14-2007, 11:23 AM
Tim, usually the timbrens will go in place of the bumpstop. on most newer trucks they end up contacting either on the axle itself, or on top of the leaf pack between the u-bolts. I'm not sure what year or make of truck was in your picture, but thats probably about where it would end up being installed at. hope that helps. If you have any other questions, you can always go to their website, locate the make and model of your truck and then see an image of how they install.