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newblade
04-04-2007, 10:18 PM
I am thinking about getting either the pup with the 30hp Kohler or the 26 kaw liquid cooled, both with the 60" deck. Any comments at all about which of these would be better and why. Also any pictures of yards that you have mowed with these would be great. One concern is the electric lift, I would like a way to be able to lock in the deck height, anyone have any problems with that. :weightlifter:

Thanks

newblade
04-04-2007, 10:23 PM
Does anyone like the liquid cooled engine? I just got an e-mail back from a dealer and he said that he didn't recommend the liquid cooled engine because of the chance of overheating.:confused: I always thought in my mind they would be better

dwost
04-04-2007, 10:27 PM
Just demo'd them both this past weekend and was very impressed with both. I will say my mistake was running the Lightning prior to the Pup. There is no comparison on ride comfort. The suspension works very well on smoothing out the ride. My plans are to go for the Lighting. Here is a link to my recent research including a write up on the test drive. http://www.lawnsite.com/showthread.php?t=177861&highlight=bad+boy

newblade
04-05-2007, 12:10 AM
bump..........

newblade
04-05-2007, 05:50 AM
bump......bump

dwost
04-05-2007, 08:20 AM
Does anyone like the liquid cooled engine? I just got an e-mail back from a dealer and he said that he didn't recommend the liquid cooled engine because of the chance of overheating.:confused: I always thought in my mind they would be better

Well, if you don't take care of your equipment and let the coolant get too low then yes........but in all reality, it will outlast an air cooled engine without a doubt. They also run MUCH cooler overall and are quieter. I think he's feeding you a line of BS.

newblade
04-05-2007, 03:08 PM
bump...bump

Rhinox29
04-05-2007, 05:00 PM
I have a 2005 Pup with a 27hp kohler. It all comes down to which you prefer. The only problem I have had to fix on my Kohler was a starter last year. As for the electric lift deck? I have had no problems. It stays where you put it.

JimQ
04-05-2007, 05:27 PM
The dealer is not feeding you a line. The reality of the situation is, in the right (or wrong, depending on how you look at it) conditions, Late summer/fall, dry grass, lots of chaff in the air, you can plug the sreen and radiator in just a few minutes use. The liquid cooled engine is much quieter though.

newblade
04-05-2007, 06:19 PM
So which one is better? I know liquid cooled gasses aren't that common so how many people do you know have overheated one? I know that all the diesels are liquid, right?

FATWEASEL
04-05-2007, 06:38 PM
I don't know about the whole plugging the screen idea. I guess it depends on the location of the radiator but I just don't see it happening.

If you have a fan drawing air through the screen and across the cooling fins, it might clog the screen but this isn't a closed box like an air filter. The screen is just there to block debris from getting in the cooling fins. The screen should be removable as well by simply lifting it out and tapping the grass off of it.

Go LIQUID! Btw, the dealer is a dope. My guess is he doesn't have a LC and doesn't want to lose the sell so he feeds you a line of bull.

dwost
04-05-2007, 06:46 PM
So which one is better? I know liquid cooled gasses aren't that common so how many people do you know have overheated one? I know that all the diesels are liquid, right?

You are splitting hairs, if you take care of your equipment either choice will be fine.

JimQ
04-05-2007, 06:48 PM
To say all Diesels are liquid cooled is not true. There are air cooled diesels. However, I don't know of any air cooled diesel Z's.

I work as a Test Engineer for manufacturer of commercial Z's. Our sales and marketing team requested the 26hp liquid cooled Kawi be offered on one of our current platforms. After extensive field testing throughout last summer and fall we made the decision not to offer the engine because we could not keep the radiator clear. Kawi has offered a couple of different screens and seals to improve the issue, but we continued to have problems. It's a nice engine. Runs quiet and smooth. If you can keep it clean, go for it. If not, stick with the less expensive air cooled engine. Watch the 30hp Kohler. They had major carb/intake issues last season. (Runs rough over bumps, rough terrain, sidehills). They've offered several fixes. Make sure it's not an old engine.

Good Luck
Q

JimQ
04-05-2007, 06:56 PM
77758

The screen completely blocks the radiator off. It is sealed with foam seals around the base.

1 of 2 things happens

1. large clippings/chaff covers the screen and blocks air flow through the rad.

2. small chaff passes through the screen and clogs the radiator.

The radiator and screen can be kept clean. It just requires more effort/attention than we thought our customers were willing to give it.

newblade
04-05-2007, 07:43 PM
Does anyone know if it has a temperature gauge or just an alarm when it gets to hot. I would think that I could keep it clean or at least monitor the temp gauge if it has one. Do you think that the liquid cooled is more fuel efficient and will last longer?

newblade
04-05-2007, 07:45 PM
Do you work for badboy jimq? I guess not because they are still offering the motor.

newblade
04-06-2007, 12:05 AM
I believe that I will make an offer to the dealer on the mower. Anyone think that they can be talked down a little bit, they are already $400 cheaper than the other closest dealer for Bad Boy's. I am going to try the 26 liquid Kaw. Enough power? Any reason not to go ahead and buy this mower? Thanks

ACEMowing
04-06-2007, 01:42 AM
I believe that I will make an offer to the dealer on the mower. Anyone think that they can be talked down a little bit, they are already $400 cheaper than the other closest dealer for Bad Boy's. I am going to try the 26 liquid Kaw. Enough power? Any reason not to go ahead and buy this mower? Thanks

Bad Boy's seem to be priced right to start with and you can't go wrong with the LC Kawi 26hp... that's a dream machine from mower to engine. I was quoted $7995 for the lightning with full suspension and the 26hp LC Kawi. Our local dealer just had the Pup in a 52" (with no suspension) with what I think was a 23hp Vanguard for around $6200. Either seemed real reasonable in price for what you get.

FATWEASEL
04-08-2007, 08:28 PM
I was quoted $7995 for the lightning with full suspension and the 26hp LC Kawi.

I believe that's typical asking price for that model and engine choice with no rebates or discounts. I would imagine someone could get a little off of that.

Andy:)

ed2hess
04-08-2007, 08:52 PM
To say all Diesels are liquid cooled is not true. There are air cooled diesels. However, I don't know of any air cooled diesel Z's.

I work as a Test Engineer for manufacturer of commercial Z's. Our sales and marketing team requested the 26hp liquid cooled Kawi be offered on one of our current platforms. After extensive field testing throughout last summer and fall we made the decision not to offer the engine because we could not keep the radiator clear. Kawi has offered a couple of different screens and seals to improve the issue, but we continued to have problems. It's a nice engine. Runs quiet and smooth. If you can keep it clean, go for it. If not, stick with the less expensive air cooled engine. Watch the 30hp Kohler. They had major carb/intake issues last season. (Runs rough over bumps, rough terrain, sidehills). They've offered several fixes. Make sure it's not an old engine.

Good Luck
Q

There was a guy from Australia last year that had some model of John Deere mowing machine that couldn't keep the radiator clean. I would wonder if there is likely a solution for units like these that are so low to the ground. On large equipment like farm implements they got some pretty elaborate mechanism to keep them clean. Can't see these mowers putting those kind of changes on. ....I envy you in your job I tried to get on as a test engineer with John Deere about 40 years ago but at the time the tractor industry was doing badly so I went to IBM.