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View Full Version : Which 2 cycle oil do you use?


AAXteriors
04-05-2007, 02:48 PM
I was just wondering what everyone else likes/uses. Also I'm thinking synthetic but is it worth the extra $

Thanks,
Josh

Daner
04-05-2007, 03:44 PM
I use Sthil...If you stick to the brand that the machines recommends, your pretty well covered. I have tried synthetic...but then It complicates things.

AAXteriors
04-05-2007, 03:45 PM
Anybody???

AAXteriors
04-05-2007, 03:47 PM
I use Sthil...If you stick to the brand that the machines recommends, your pretty well covered. I have tried synthetic...but then It complicates things.

What complicates things? Different brands other than the original manufacturer?

Josh

Daner
04-05-2007, 04:03 PM
What complicates things? Different brands other than the original manufacturer?

Josh

If you run Synthetic In just some equipment and not the others...It can get mixed up...guys working with you or even yourself can put the wrong mix In.

I always try to keep things simple:)

Gruneich Lawn Care, Inc.
04-05-2007, 06:26 PM
I have used Opti-2 synthetic in everything for the last 5 years, no problems in anything. I buy a case of the pouches that mix 2.5 gallons at the start of the year, dont have to worry about mixing it...

ribbie78
04-05-2007, 07:01 PM
stihl hd ultra. I too get a bunch for the whole year.

Fantasy Lawns
04-05-2007, 07:17 PM
I get the Shin mix in the 5 gallon bucket .... last fall local dealer had buy 3 get 1 free @ $70 per bucket

Just transfer it into a 2 quart container n mix it at 13oz per 5 gallon of fuel ... no issues last 10 years

Watson's Landscaping
04-05-2007, 07:49 PM
I run amsoil 2 cycle mix in all my stuff and it runs great. Turns the gas blue so no way you could mix it up with any thing else. I'm also a dealer for amsoil so if you guys need any let me know I'll get you a price.

mrgreen3
04-05-2007, 07:54 PM
Like the old saying goes...2 cycle oil is 2 cycle oil..

mouse
04-05-2007, 08:07 PM
I use opti 2 in all my two strokes. This makes it simple one can for all. I have never had any oil related problems.

Rizzo
04-05-2007, 08:59 PM
A buddy of mine that has run a solo LCO for many years uses synthetic only and uses a 100:1 ratio for everything even snowblowers. He claims the lubricity is so much better he has never had any problems with his equipment. I might try it this season...

ProMo
04-05-2007, 09:21 PM
I have been using ace hardware oil for the last 14 years

Lynden-Jeff
04-05-2007, 09:43 PM
I use echo in all my echo stuff. Why fix what aint broke.

Cheers

ThirdDay
04-05-2007, 09:43 PM
We use Echo Power Blend in everything we have and it works great.

ed2hess
04-05-2007, 10:19 PM
We use Echo 2 cycle oil......can't image trying other things for cost or even if they SAY it is better. We have not had a engine seize in 25 years over many many units.

nmez21
04-05-2007, 10:38 PM
I've always used the Lawn-boy "ashless" oil cans for my 2 cylce stuff. I've had thoughts about chaging to something else, something more economical, but my ignorance has gotten the best of me thus far. So my question for you guys is: Can a Lawnboy 21" mower run on anything other than the Lawn-boy "ashless" oil without experiencing problems so long as the blend ratio is right? Stories/ myths around here say that it just wont work, but I'd like to hear what you guys have to say before I take the 'plunge'.

Rizzo
04-05-2007, 10:42 PM
I had a 1972 19" lawnboy that my grandpa used to mow cemetaries with and never used the lawnboy brand oil... I sold it with our last house about 5 years ago and it was still cutting well!

lawnboy dan
04-05-2007, 10:44 PM
i have 11 lawnboys and dont use lawnboy oil. cause its just too expencive and mostly i dont want to have a seperate gas can just for them. i use mercury quicksilver tcw3 and its worked fine.

JTF40
04-05-2007, 10:46 PM
Like the old saying goes...2 cycle oil is 2 cycle oil..

WRONG !!!!!!

Opti-2 only for me. :usflag:

1cooltreeguy
04-05-2007, 10:46 PM
Echo,Stihl - Bulk - Buy 5-6 cases per year.

nmez21
04-05-2007, 10:48 PM
I had a 1972 19" lawnboy that my grandpa used to mow cemetaries with and never used the lawnboy brand oil... I sold it with our last house about 5 years ago and it was still cutting well!

i have 11 lawnboys and dont use lawnboy oil. cause its just too expencive and mostly i dont want to have a seperate gas can just for them. i use mercury quicksilver tcw3 and its worked fine.

Thanks! Should save me a good chunk of change (and hassle) this year.:)

Roger
04-05-2007, 10:49 PM
nmez21, ... I have used Amsoil and Opti-2 in LawnBoy engines. When I switched from LB oil at 32:1, I went with Amsoil 100:1. I ran it that way for awhile, but changed to 80:1. I was also using the same 100:1 mix in my handheld equipment. To me, the engines sounded "loose," for the lack of a better term. I think they run better at 80:1, but I know others on LS that have done well with 100:1.

The reason I changed from 32:1 LawnBoy mix was exhaust port clogging. I continually had problems with my older "F" engine in that regard. It was with that engine that I went to 100:1 Amsoil, and the clogging problem disappeared.

Two years ago, I tried Opti-2 2 cycle oil, and have used it the past couple of seasons in my LawnBoy (DuraForce) and Stihl handhelds. I mix 80:1 with the Opti-2. I buy the gallon bottle, and mix as needed, using 2.5 and 5.0 gallon cans. It is so much less costly than the 1.0 or 2.5 gallon pouches. Yes, the pouches make for easy mixing, but the cost of the oil is much higher on a $/gallon of mixed fuel.

When I first bought my Stihl handhelds (trimmer, edger, hedge clipper, hand blower), I used Stihl oil, 50:1 mix. I was having some exhaust port clogging problems, but have no problems with the Opti-2 mix.

I have found only one supplier of gallon bottles of Opti-2, and that supplier is online order. Only one local dealer carries Opti-2, and they only stock 1 gallon (maybe 2.5 gallon too?) pouches.

I only switched from Amsoil to Opti-2 because I could buy 1 gallon Opti-2 bottles, but only quart sized bottles for Amsoil. I believe the product performance is comparable.

Rizzo
04-05-2007, 10:58 PM
Opti-2 site says it's not to be mixed but for an injector tank on a marine engine. I was told not to use marine 2 cycle oil in lawn equipment. Is there any difference? I have 2 gallons of full synthetic marine 2 cycle oil I could use up if it doesn't hurt (no longer have the boat)...

KS_Grasscutter
04-05-2007, 11:06 PM
I was using stihl and echo oil last season, finally ran out of that so this season I have been running Opti-2. Never had any trouble with any 2 cycle stuff due to oil, but of course I put no where near the hours on stuff that ya'll do.

razor1
04-05-2007, 11:11 PM
Walmart Super Tech 2 cycle oil. It's about $6. per gallon. Never failed me yet. :weightlifter:

bart may
04-05-2007, 11:20 PM
I run Amsoil 100:1. I used all the other brands and never had engine failure, but I have had serious carb problems. The other oils are too rich and I always begin to get oil coming out of the exhaust. Because of the better lubricity of synthetics you can run them leaner elimating much of this excess sludge and junk. Since I've switched I haven't had any black oil oosing out the exhaust. Maybe it's my elevation but the new carbs are basically non adjustable.

smcunningham
04-05-2007, 11:23 PM
shindy 2 cycle

mcwlandscaping
04-05-2007, 11:24 PM
Opti-2...............

Rizzo
04-05-2007, 11:43 PM
Ok, I found this article on why water cooled engines and air cooled engines require different 2 cycle oil. Maybe it doesn't apply to synthetics as much as traditional oils though. Very long but informative.

http://www.ultralightnews.com/features/oilworks.htm

ProStreetCamaro
04-06-2007, 12:05 AM
We use the cheapest $hit money can buy. Like that wal-mart crap etc etc. We have never had a 2 cycle engine fail in over 20 years. Everything else falls apart and it gets worn out but never an engine failure.

naturescape
04-06-2007, 12:14 AM
Don't use Shin One! I have and my Shin bp blower sounded like it was going to throw a rod after a couple months. Switched to Tanaka oil and everything was fine. Shin makes 2 types of 2 cycle oil. The Shin One is not as premium as their other oil.

Now I can't prove this, but my Shin blower just got stronger and stronger as soon as I switched from their S. One oil. I have heard Echo 2 cycle is fine.

Anyone else have a problem with Shin One?

By the way, all those guys that say they have used cheaper 2 cycle oil and not had a problem in 20 years or so -- you mean you have not replaced one piece of 2 cycle equipment in 20 years? Of course you have! How long did it last?

When I was running Shin trimmers on Shin One oil, that was years ago (like 6 - 9) I had to replace them every season. Now that I run Tanaka and Echo oil, my trimmers have about 3 years on em and are still running like new.

craglawnmanor
04-06-2007, 01:29 AM
Opti-2 for me also. :cool2:

AAXteriors
04-06-2007, 02:02 AM
Where do you guys buy the amisol and opti-2?

Richard Martin
04-06-2007, 05:50 AM
Before I switched to Amsoil many years ago I had been using Shindaiwa oil in everything mixed at 50:1. Like a lot of other people here I experienced muffler and port clogging all of the time. It was a real pain with having to do exhaust maintenace on a regular basis.

After I switched to Amsoil all of those types of problems went away and I haven't cleaned anything since then.

At the beginning of last year my local Shindy dealer made me a great deal on some Shindaiwa ONE oil so I said "what the hey, I'll save a few bucks". Big mistake. All of my old problems came racing right back.

This year I tried Stihl synthetic and I must say that I'm impressed. It is about the same as Amsoil but it has no smoke what-so-ever. I like it a lot and it even has fuel stabilizer in it. The Amsoil doesn't.

2 clowns mowing
04-06-2007, 07:04 AM
stihl ultra

lawnboy dan
04-06-2007, 09:25 AM
i too am impressed with the new sthil synth oil. all my machines seem to like it esp my br600. when i use up my stock of dino-i might go to the sthil full time. its nice not to have to breath smoke from the hedge trimmers. (i trim a lot of bushes-hedges)

wriken
04-06-2007, 10:06 AM
Walmart Super Tech 2 cycle oil. It's about $6. per gallon. Never failed me yet. :weightlifter:

Thats what I use also, but its 8.34 up here. Used it for probably 2-2.5 years. Thinking about running it in the new sleds I have also next year.

LawnGuy73
04-06-2007, 10:08 AM
Echo, because I run all Echo products.

desii
04-06-2007, 10:36 AM
Walmart Super Tech 2 cycle oil. It's about $6. per gallon. Never failed me yet. :weightlifter:

I read the first couple of pages and thought I was the only one! I've been using the Wal-Mart 2 Cycle oil for at least three years and have NEVER had any problems. Weed eaters, blowers and snow blowers....Never any issues and it's about $.75 for 8 oz. (plastic) can. JMO, but I have yet to have any engine problems from using it.

JKOOPERS
04-06-2007, 12:31 PM
opti-2 here also i have been using it for 2 years now and couldnt be happier. boy do i remember those days of cleaning the exhaust ports and mufflers not anymore. we buy it in the gallon jug with the pump on it. 2 pumps per gallon who the hell can mess that up?

suzuki4life
04-06-2007, 01:06 PM
i used to run the $6/gallon marine oil from walmart in my older crappy trimmers. Then i moved up to shindi and i started using the opti-2. It was recomended to me but also i LOVE the thing that you can just squeeze oil to the top of the can, and you just keep squuezing till you hit your 1 or 2 gallon mark, dump it in and throw the oil can in the tool box. no more spilling oil everywhere from those 1gal cans. Also since its 100/1 mixing ratio you use about half as much oil per gallon of gas.



-zach

Metro Lawn
04-06-2007, 01:33 PM
Amsoil 100:1 unless I get in a pinch I will use Opti as a 2nd choice

Duncan90si
04-06-2007, 06:07 PM
I use whatever brand I can get my hands on when I run out. I don't like to pay the higher prices of the "better" oils. For me, two stroke oil is like getting fuel: I get it from where ever is closest to me when I am ready to run out.

Splicer
04-06-2007, 08:16 PM
Opti-2 site says it's not to be mixed but for an injector tank on a marine engine. I was told not to use marine 2 cycle oil in lawn equipment. Is there any difference? I have 2 gallons of full synthetic marine 2 cycle oil I could use up if it doesn't hurt (no longer have the boat)...

Don't know about the synthetic stuff but marine 2 cycle WILL destroy a Lawn Boy 2 cycle motor...I used that stuff by mistake :hammerhead: for a couple of tankfuls:nono: ...Destroyed my 'F' engine:cry:

Rizzo
04-06-2007, 08:37 PM
Splicer- Thanks for the lesson learned.. I bought some amsoil synthetic today that says it works for aircooled engines.

4curbappeal
04-06-2007, 10:03 PM
I agree 100% I just bought a case of Lesco 2 cycle (48 bottles of 2 1/2 gal mix) for $38. I have used Stihl, JD and Echo and honestly can't tell the difference.

Metro Lawn
04-06-2007, 10:09 PM
I use whatever brand I can get my hands on when I run out. I don't like to pay the higher prices of the "better" oils. For me, two stroke oil is like getting fuel: I get it from where ever is closest to me when I am ready to run out.

Hmmmm

1 quart "el cheapo" 2 cycle oil $2.99 at 32:1 makes 8 gallons of mix
cost is about 38 cents per gallon

1 quart Amsoil 100:1 premix $6.99 makes 32 gallons
cost about 22 cents per gallon

Better oil is cheaper, not to mention the no smoke, no carbon build up, and plugs will last up to 3 years


Saberô Professional Synthetic 100:1 Pre-Mix 2-Cycle Oil (ATP)
AMSOIL Saberô Professional (ATP) is formulated with exclusive AMSOIL synthetic base oils and premium additives. Designed for lean mix ratios in two-cycle motors, Saber 2-Cycle Oil has excellent lubricity and cleanliness properties to control friction and prevent wear, plug fouling, ring sticking and exhaust port blocking. AMSOIL Synthetic 100:1 2-Cycle Oils have been protecting and providing improved performance in two-cycle motors since 1973.

Duncan90si
04-07-2007, 12:24 AM
I wasn't specifically talking about 100:1 Amsoil mix. I like their products and have used them before. I was meaning the oils such as Stihl, Echo etc. where I'm not always willing to make a special trip to the dealer to pick up 2 stroke oil that cost more than Walmart brand or "el cheapo". The closest dealer to me is 15 miles away. Its just more convenient for me just to grab whatever is close. I haven't had any major problems due to the quality (or lack thereof) of 2 cycle oil. If I knew of a place local that carried Amsoil 100:1 mix I might consider using that.

dfischer
04-07-2007, 03:56 AM
Been a few comments about 2 stroke oil is 2 stroke oil, and another about worrying about mixing synthetic w/std dino mixed:

There is no problem mixing synthetic w/semi-synthetic or straight dino mix.
the only no-no out there is mixing Bean oil (caster bean oil), w/dino oil, and it strikes me as rather unlikely anybody in lawn care is using bean oil in there leaf blowers...

amsoil running @ 100:1 ain't the oil many think it is. It's base stock viscosity is higher the most oils, so it's not that it's better, it's that its real real thick right out of the can.

For lawn machines I run any reasonable oil @ 32:1. If I care a bit more about it my prefered oils are:

Motul 800 2T
Yamalube 2-r
Redline

I run 37:1 w/those...

Sammy
04-07-2007, 04:07 AM
Stihl ....... the One !

Richard Martin
04-07-2007, 07:02 AM
amsoil running @ 100:1 ain't the oil many think it is. It's base stock viscosity is higher the most oils, so it's not that it's better, it's that its real real thick right out of the can.

For lawn machines I run any reasonable oil @ 32:1.

Well, this much I can tell you. It's a rare day when someone complains about Amsoil, Opti-2, Stihl HP Ultra or any of the synthetics at higher mix ratios.

The only advantage I can imagine to using a 32:1 ratio in all 2 stroke equipment is if you like seeing oil come out of the muffler, enjoy tearing motors apart to clean carbon buildups out and enjoy replacing spark plugs.

hughmcjr
04-07-2007, 07:44 AM
I use Opti-2 also. 100:1. Never had an engine go because of it. Use it at that ratio for all equipment, mowers, trimmers, weedeaters and chainsaws. Never smokes and no carbon build up. It can even be used in your truck if you get low on gas, won't smoke either and valves get a bit of lube. :) At 40.00 a gal for Opti-2 it costs me about 1.90 per five gallons mixed, if I calculated correctly.

Beau Rivage
04-07-2007, 08:39 AM
Still running Husqvarna 50:1 since I started 2 years ago...so far, so good. But I'm still new at this. I've had no problems with smoking or clogging etc.

wriken
04-07-2007, 09:23 AM
I read the first couple of pages and thought I was the only one! I've been using the Wal-Mart 2 Cycle oil for at least three years and have NEVER had any problems. Weed eaters, blowers and snow blowers....Never any issues and it's about $.75 for 8 oz. (plastic) can. JMO, but I have yet to have any engine problems from using it.

I think it Pennsoil 2-stroke. I'm not a big fan of Pennsoil, but after all its a brand name.

lawnboy dan
04-07-2007, 09:57 AM
marine oil will NOT destroy a lawnboy! who do you think made lawnboys in the first place . omc= outboard marine corp. the correct oil for a lawnboy is twc3

jrc lawncare
04-07-2007, 10:04 AM
Still running Husqvarna 50:1 since I started 2 years ago...so far, so good. But I'm still new at this. I've had no problems with smoking or clogging etc.Been using it as well for five years +. Zero issues as well.:waving:

Metro Lawn
04-07-2007, 11:33 AM
I wasn't specifically talking about 100:1 Amsoil mix. I like their products and have used them before. I was meaning the oils such as Stihl, Echo etc. where I'm not always willing to make a special trip to the dealer to pick up 2 stroke oil that cost more than Walmart brand or "el cheapo". The closest dealer to me is 15 miles away. Its just more convenient for me just to grab whatever is close. I haven't had any major problems due to the quality (or lack thereof) of 2 cycle oil. If I knew of a place local that carried Amsoil 100:1 mix I might consider using that.


You can order Amsoil right from their website. amsoil.com

lawnpro724
04-07-2007, 02:56 PM
I use Echo 50:1 2gl mix

Andyshine77
05-07-2007, 04:59 AM
Mobil-1 Racing 2T is about the best 2 cycle oil on the market today. It can be found at most auto parts store. http://www.lawnsite.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=80138&stc=1&d=1178520916

Opti-2 and Amsoil = Snake oil. Running Amsoil at 100:1 is a joke, if you use this mix, your engine is now toast.

Most synthetic oils are really a GPIII base oil, which is severely hydro-cracked petro oil, this is normally done using the iso-dewaxing process that Chevron developed, although there are other methods. The difference between dino GPII/II+ oils and (what is sold as synthetic) GPIII base oil is the time and temperature the oil spends in the reactor. Some oils, like Redline Racing which is a GPV baseoil (ester) is formed from reacting certain alcohols, etc. This is really the only “synthetic” oil other than the GTL oils. GTL are gas-to-liquid products, most using the Fisher Trophes (not sure on the spelling) method (there are other methods however).

Many 2-stroke oils that are labeled synthetic are primarily castor based. Castor oil comes from the castor bean, so it is synthetic in the fact that it does not come from crude oil. However castor oil has long since been abandoned as a sole solution, and it is commonly mixed with other oils and additives to create a much better product.

This is a list of the best synthetic 2 cycle oils on the market.

Mobil 1 Racing 2T.
Maxim K2.
Motul 8002T.
Stihl HP Ultra.
Yamaha 2r

Richard Martin
05-07-2007, 05:49 AM
Opti-2 and Amsoil = Snake oil. Running Amsoil at 100:1 is a joke, if you use this mix, your engine is now toast.

I've been using Amsoil at 80:1 for many years now. My oldest piece of 2 stroke equipment is a 2000 model year Stihl edger. Care to explain why it's still running after using Snake oil for all of these years?

causalitist
05-07-2007, 06:18 AM
Amsoil saber professional 100:1 full synthetic.

andyshine77 ... i dont buy it.

causalitist
05-07-2007, 06:53 AM
Andyshine77:

so your saying amsoil makes the best oil filters, but makes complete crap gimmick 2 stoke oil? and no one can argue the fact that they make the best oil filters. they are absolutely efficient at the smallest micron level, other filters dont even use absolute efficiency, they dont even say the % removed, and they use multipass tests, and the micron size is STILL bigger.

i doubt it. its obvious if you look at their motor oil its as good by every measure as mobil1 synth but has a higher base number and wayyy more zinc.
all this and your saying they just decide to make complete crap 2 stroke oil? doubt it.
im only phrasing it like this because i havent read up as much on their 2 stroke oils as i have oil and oil filters in general.

Andyshine77
05-07-2007, 07:06 AM
Check the compression, if it's under 125-130 you have a problem. Do you sell Amsoil? Did you know that Amsoil buys it's base oils from Mobil.

The thing is all GPIII base oil is the same, it just depends on the ability of a manufacture to create the proper and often complex additives for the oil. Amsoil does in fact use GPIII base oils, however there additive package is sub par. Amsoil 2 cycle oil is not the worst in the world, however there are far better options. I don't know of any 2cycle oil good enough to run leaner than 50:1.

Opti-2 uses dino GPII oils, it's not a synthetic in any way.

I'm not trying to start a war, I'm just trying to give the cold hard facts.:)

Thank Andy.

Andyshine77
05-07-2007, 07:11 AM
Amsoil saber professional 100:1 full synthetic.

andyshine77 ... i dont buy it.

Did you read my first post, there is not such thing as Synthetic oil, just highly modified oil they call synthetic.

Andyshine77
05-07-2007, 07:30 AM
Zinc Is good for anti wear but so is phosphorous. It's not the amount of any one additive it's the proper combination. What about acid neutralizers like Boron and Magnesium do they play a role?

lawnboy dan
05-07-2007, 08:26 AM
mobil could sell more 2t if they marketed it right.impossiable to find!

LawnBrother
05-07-2007, 10:36 AM
Envirologic Biodegradable soy based 2 cycle oil from Terresolve. I use it just because it's better for the environment, although it's a little more expensive.

Richard Martin
05-07-2007, 11:09 AM
Check the compression, if it's under 125-130 you have a problem. Do you sell Amsoil? Did you know that Amsoil buys it's base oils from Mobil.

I don't know of any 2cycle oil good enough to run leaner than 50:1.

I'm not trying to start a war, I'm just trying to give the cold hard facts.:)

Thank Andy.

1: I don't need to check the compression. The edger starts on the first or second pull everytime. Engines with poor compression tend to be hard to start.

2: No.

3: I don't care where it comes from.

4: Amsoil has been doing it for me for many years now at 80:1.

5: If you're not trying to start a war then don't start spewing data from a chalkboard somewhere. We deal in real life here and regardless of what some engineer says Amsoil works and there are a whole lot of people here at Lawnsite that will testify to that.

If you want to see what an engineer can do just look at Exmark's new deck or that 26" mower they released. What a joke.

Brett's Cutting Edge
05-07-2007, 12:46 PM
I go my local auto parts store and buy it by the gallon for 10.00. Use it in everthing and have for 10 yrs. that equipment still runs fine.

Andyshine77
05-07-2007, 05:46 PM
Wow.

If you're not trying to start a war then don't start spewing data from a chalkboard somewhere. We deal in real life here and regardless of what some engineer says Amsoil works and there are a whole lot of people here at Lawnsite that will testify to that.

All you can do is attack and resist knowledge. I live in the real world as well, but I don't think your open enough to take anyones advice. It's a free world and you are free to use what you like, but you could not pay me to use Amsoil, don't attack me there is no reason for that, just say you disagree and move on I am.:usflag:

Richard Martin
05-07-2007, 08:11 PM
All you can do is attack and resist knowledge. I live in the real world as well, but I don't think your open enough to take anyones advice. It's a free world and you are free to use what you like, but you could not pay me to use Amsoil, don't attack me there is no reason for that, just say you disagree and move on I am.:usflag:

I attacked no one. I politely answered your questions and told you what I know to be fact. You, on the other hand, come onto this board and attack Amsoil as being garbage when the reality is that it works for plenty of people.

Mark in MD
05-07-2007, 09:23 PM
I use echo in all my echo stuff. Why fix what aint broke.

CheersMe too. I could probably save a few bucks if I bought something else, but I just stick with Echo.

They've changed it once or twice over the years. The 2 gal mix bottle have gotten smaller.

mouse
05-07-2007, 11:29 PM
I've used opti-2 for many years and have NEVER had an oil related engine problem. This speaks at least as loud as the methods used for producing these oils.

Andyshine77
05-08-2007, 01:30 AM
You can't go wrong with Echo power blend, it's a very good product.

causalitist
05-08-2007, 02:52 AM
What about acid neutralizers like Boron and Magnesium do they play a role?

yes. amsoil has a higher base number. ie buffering capability (KH) .. so they use more of those as well. zinc was reduced in almost all motor oils because it was found to be harmful to catalytic converters. they reduced the amount from what was initially calculated as the optimum amount because of this. everyone did this except amsoil.

na, facts are good. im very capable of exchanging information with you without becoming angry like a child lol

no, i dont sell amsoil.
ya, amsoil is a comparitively small company, i would expect a larger company like mobil to be their source. to me it seems their whole gig is to use the same good base "synthetic" oil as mobil but with more additives.
you saying that explains why the oil that is most comparable to amsoil in all the scientific tests i have read is mobil synth.

if you can get data on the base number, Noack Volatility, volitility , and flash point for mobil 1 synth, and they exceed amsoil 0w-30, i will switch.

Andyshine77
05-08-2007, 06:59 PM
Racing 2T

http://www.mobil.com/USA-English/Lubes/PDS/nausenpvlmomobil1_motorcycle_oils.pdf

Andyshine77
05-08-2007, 07:19 PM
Maxima K2 http://www.maximausa.com/products/2stroke/formulak2.asp

Andyshine77
05-09-2007, 03:30 AM
BTW causalitist I'm glad you got back with me, you seem very reasonable.:)

The thing I personally dislike about Amsoil is there pushy marketing and outlandish claims. There is no way I would run any oil at 100:1 in an air-cooled engine, that would be like running one quart of oil in your car or truck.

lawnboy dan
05-09-2007, 09:25 AM
mobil racing 2t is the best i have ever tried. the problem is mobil has done a poor job of marketing this oil and its impossiable to find in ANY store shelves. frankly i am tired of jumping tru hoops to try to find it! sthil ultra hp is execellent and best yet -i can buy it at my local dealer. once my stock of dino is gone -its synth for me from now on. when i do use amzoil -i use it at 80/1 -just to be cautious. i prefer not to give my $ to a pryimid scheeme driven company

Rizzo
05-09-2007, 09:57 AM
-its synth for me from now on. when i do use amzoil -i use it at 80/1 -just to be cautious. i prefer not to give my $ to a pryimid scheeme driven company

What is pyramid about amsoil? I found it at the local hardware/discount store and have seen no advertising except a sign here or there where it is sold. I too use it 80:1.

Paradise Yard Service
05-09-2007, 01:44 PM
Love that Amsoil 100:1. Used it in Puch moped in 1980 in Hawaii. Tried the other brands and the moped would hesitate going up the Pali (mountain). Changed to Amsoil and problem solved....plus less smoke.

I don't have a problem with Amsoil sellers making a commission. When I bought my Toyota Tacoma I was under the impression that the sales staff would make a commission....a multi level commission. But yes, I have had my fill of MLMs.

LandscaperPro
05-09-2007, 01:56 PM
WRONG !!!!!!

Opti-2 only for me. :usflag:


LandscaperPro (http://landscaperpro.com)


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OPTI 2 (http://www.landscaperpro.com/index.asp?PageAction=VIEWCATS&Category=27) is rated ISO-EG-D+, the highest rating available in the stringent International Standards Organization global performance ratings system. Opti-2 meets and exceeds all equipment manufacturers rating requirements.

OPTI 2 (http://www.landscaperpro.com/index.asp?PageAction=VIEWCATS&Category=27) is formulated utilizing patented Eutectic additive technology that provides exclusive performance results:


One gas can covers all two-cycle engines.


Highest rated 2-cycle oil in industry


A single mix for all two-cycle engines.


Increased performance and longer engine life.


Smoke-free operation.

Gasohol compatible.


Contains

"Opti-Mizer" (http://www.landscaperpro.com/index.asp?PageAction=VIEWPROD&ProdID=4403) fuel stabilizer.


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Andyshine77
05-09-2007, 02:30 PM
You sell the stuff.

Contrary to what Ansmsoil and opti say its the engine design and load the dictates mix ratio, not the oil. These 100:1 oils are nothing new. They basically use alot of metallic antiwear additives to prevent seizure in lew of the decreased oil inside the motor. The problem with doing this is that it leads to increased deposits(which causes wear), higher operating temps and less compression from lack of ring seal.

lawnboy dan
05-09-2007, 02:57 PM
more oil does = more power. i have a sthill backpac thats at least 12 yrs old (was used when i bought it) i used opti 2 in it for 10 of those yrs . i notoiced it was losing power and thought it was just age catching up w it so i decided to save some $ by not using the expexcive opt 2 in it since it was my biggest fuel user (2 cycle that is) and started using my lawnboy 32/1 mix of twc3 oil in it and it started running better and stronger . (smoked a lot more-but i can live with this) yes i know you arnt supposed to use tw3 in a sthil but i figured it was on its last legs so ...wtf .

MTR999
05-09-2007, 05:52 PM
Hmmmm

1 quart "el cheapo" 2 cycle oil $2.99 at 32:1 makes 8 gallons of mix
cost is about 38 cents per gallon

1 quart Amsoil 100:1 premix $6.99 makes 32 gallons
cost about 22 cents per gallon

Better oil is cheaper, not to mention the no smoke, no carbon build up, and plugs will last up to 3 years


Saberô Professional Synthetic 100:1 Pre-Mix 2-Cycle Oil (ATP)
AMSOIL Saberô Professional (ATP) is formulated with exclusive AMSOIL synthetic base oils and premium additives. Designed for lean mix ratios in two-cycle motors, Saber 2-Cycle Oil has excellent lubricity and cleanliness properties to control friction and prevent wear, plug fouling, ring sticking and exhaust port blocking. AMSOIL Synthetic 100:1 2-Cycle Oils have been protecting and providing improved performance in two-cycle motors since 1973.

That Saber is what we have been using, excellent oil, my stihl stuff running on its 5th year of service scream like mad machines...:laugh:

qualitylawnlc
05-09-2007, 06:48 PM
My local dealer carries ProBlend 2 cycle oil. I tried it once and as long as I can get it, I will never switch. No carbon build up, synthetic, better lubrication, less smoke and only 99 cents a packet. IT'S THE BEST!!!

Andyshine77
05-10-2007, 01:57 AM
more oil does = more power. i have a sthill backpac thats at least 12 yrs old (was used when i bought it) i used opti 2 in it for 10 of those yrs . i notoiced it was losing power and thought it was just age catching up w it so i decided to save some $ by not using the expexcive opt 2 in it since it was my biggest fuel user (2 cycle that is) and started using my lawnboy 32/1 mix of twc3 oil in it and it started running better and stronger . (smoked a lot more-but i can live with this) yes i know you arnt supposed to use tw3 in a sthil but i figured it was on its last legs so ...wtf .

You were starting to lose compression, the richer mix resealed the rings temporarily.

When it comes to oil don't go cheap, new power equipment costs more than oil.

lawnboy dan
05-10-2007, 09:52 AM
i have no doubt its starting to loose compression after all the years of comm use. there is nothing cheap about mercury quicksilver oil. ask any marine mechanic and they will tell you its the best dino twc3 there is.

MANOFSTIHL
05-10-2007, 11:26 PM
Oil formulated for water cooled two strokes (marine) are not suitable for our air cooled two stroke engines. Like the other guy said the rich oil you ran just helped you boost compression b/c of ring wear. Listen to the engineer who DESIGNED the engine, not what's on the back of a bottle... At the factory (in ideal conditions) Stihl runs a lot of their mixes 80:1 but in the real world with varying temps, elevations, air quality, etc... we are better running a 50:1 ratio. Anything richer is causing excess carbon, increased heat, LOSS of power...

Andyshine77
05-11-2007, 12:38 AM
Oil formulated for water cooled two strokes (marine) are not suitable for our air cooled two stroke engines. Like the other guy said the rich oil you ran just helped you boost compression b/c of ring wear. Listen to the engineer who DESIGNED the engine, not what's on the back of a bottle... At the factory (in ideal conditions) Stihl runs a lot of their mixes 80:1 but in the real world with varying temps, elevations, air quality, etc... we are better running a 50:1 ratio. Anything richer is causing excess carbon, increased heat, LOSS of power...

The first part of your post is 100% correct, you should not use twc3 oil in an air cooled engine.

Running more oil does in fact give you more power. Running as rich 32:1 with a synthetic oil will give you no more carbon buildup than leaner mixes, in fact running a richer mix can leave the cylinder with a light coating of oil, witch prevents carbon from sticking to internal parts.

Have a good one Andy.:drinkup:

SoloSulkySurfer
05-11-2007, 02:23 AM
I use Stihl 2 cycle oil.

causalitist
05-11-2007, 02:24 AM
in those links i was looking at their 4 stroke oils because there is more data and they are a good indicator of the quality of all the products. the place that sold 0w-30 had similar specs to amsoil ow-30 .. but the only info was on viscosity ect.. and im betting the base oil is pretty similar if no the same. what i do want to know is the additive levels. mainly the base number (kh) .. since thats the main thing that gets used up in oil.

for the two strokes,,, there isnt really much hard data to know either way, besides you just saying 100:1 seems like quite a stretch, which it may very well be. i think im going to go down to 75:1 ... i only have a 2 gallon gas can anyway, when its supposed to be mixed with 2 gallons.

for the 2 strokes, i think we would really need a totally unbiased test of different oils over a few thousand hours.

amsoil 0w-30 has a base number of 12. which is very high. i really am doubting another brand has more. thing is, i need numbers .. to all those other companies "if you dont give me hard data to prove your better, im not buying the advertising hype"

You sell the stuff.

Contrary to what Ansmsoil and opti say its the engine design and load the dictates mix ratio, not the oil. These 100:1 oils are nothing new. They basically use alot of metallic antiwear additives to prevent seizure in lew of the decreased oil inside the motor. The problem with doing this is that it leads to increased deposits(which causes wear), higher operating temps and less compression from lack of ring seal.

Andyshine77
05-11-2007, 03:53 AM
I agree with you for the most part.:drinkup:

75:1 to me is still much to lean, I run all my 2cycle equipment at 32:1, with no more carbon buildup than when I was running 50:1. See I have spoken to many 2cycle engine builders, they all recommend an oil mix of 32:1, not only for the rings but also for the crank seals.

Here is a link to a test stihl did with there new ultra oil mixed at 50:1 oil.http://www.floridalawnandgarden.com/Attachments/258/WhyBuyOilScreen.pdf

lawnboy dan
05-11-2007, 09:00 AM
ok oil know it alls-i have the original owners manual for a john deere 2 cycl briggs engine 21 .it states to use a good quality BIA twc 2 cycle oil. guess what BIA stands for ...... boating industry association . also on older lawnboy oil cans its states rated twc3 . yes by now there is better technology for 2 cyc oil but twc3 oil can safely be used at least on older equiptment. with the leaner running epa compliant equiptment ... i would run the newer jasco rated oils.

128Steve
05-11-2007, 12:44 PM
Envirologic Biodegradable soy based 2 cycle oil from Terresolve. I use it just because it's better for the environment, although it's a little more expensive.


Why do you find it? It is supposed to be a high quality oil. They also blend Tanaka's two cycle oil!

J and D Lawn Care
05-24-2007, 11:50 AM
The Envirologic Biodegradable soy based 2 cycle oil from Terresolve is not the same stuff they make for Tanaka. I talked with Terresolve and they told me Tanaka has not decided to go that route at this time. Tanaka oil is a regular oil based 2 cycle oil made for them by Terresolve. I'm not that crazy about Tanaka's oil, but I love those 16 oz mix bottles. I have six of them full of Mobil 1 Racing 2T.

128Steve
05-30-2007, 04:10 PM
The Envirologic Biodegradable soy based 2 cycle oil from Terresolve is not the same stuff they make for Tanaka. I talked with Terresolve and they told me Tanaka has not decided to go that route at this time. Tanaka oil is a regular oil based 2 cycle oil made for them by Terresolve. I'm not that crazy about Tanaka's oil, but I love those 16 oz mix bottles. I have six of them full of Mobil 1 Racing 2T.


Thank you for the update on Tanaka oil.:) I too have Racing 2T in their bottles. Mobil is outstanding two cycle oil.

Is there a reason you do not care for the Tanaka oil? Before I used the bottle for 2T storage, I though the oil worked fine in my trimmers. I may be mistaken!

And have you tried the biodegradable oil, I couldn't find it? Is is for air cooled engines?

I know lots of questions, but you do seem to have "insider" information.

Thanks again,

Steve

LawnBrother
05-30-2007, 06:01 PM
Why do you find it? It is supposed to be a high quality oil. They also blend Tanaka's two cycle oil!

I bought it from their website. http://www.terresolve.com/

I did a lot of research first and discovered that soy based lubricants perform better than petrol based ones. I like it a lot. :usflag:

65hoss
05-31-2007, 12:13 AM
Opti-2 for 6 years without one single motor failure. That is with over 25 pieces of 2 cycle equipment.

02DURAMAX
05-31-2007, 01:15 AM
I use Echo 50:1 2gl mix.....since i have all echo equipment..

Andyshine77
05-31-2007, 02:28 AM
Like I've said before Echo power blend is good oil, it's a bit dirty compared to fully synthetic oils, but it lubricates beautifully.

RICHIE K
05-31-2007, 06:58 AM
we use super tech from walmart never any problems