Billy Goat MV.....

[Poncho25]

Well I just purchased one of these because mainly of the hose system it offered. Well its a piece of garbage!! Most of the parts are plastic and can warp very easily I would see over time of closing and opening the main intake. Also the way the MV is built it has about a 1/2 inch opening when closed for the vacuum system and thats spread across a 33 wide machine, thats a big hole and alot of lost suction. On the one I got, it was almost an inch gap, and I brought it back to the dealer and we even took the bar off to try to close the gap and could not. I am waiting to hear back from the dealer who took pictures of this and waiting to see if Billy Goat stands behind their products to offer a full money back satisfaction. I will just get the older model that you have to put the plate on the bottom to get the hose to work. The MV would have been a great idea with the bagging system change and the ease of use, but honestly if they put a bit more thought and $$ into the design of it, I think it would have been much better. All in all, I was very disappointed in the product and I was very much looking forward to using this on quite a few big jobs I have for cleaning out flower bed areas that are full with leaves.

[Poncho25]

Gezz I was hoping for a response from one of the billy goat sponsers about this..

[Mr. Force]

Poncho, honestly try using honey instead of vinegar. Step back a read your post as if it was written by one of your customers. Kinda' rubs you the wrong way doesn't it?

I've seen the photos of the unit in question. We're already in the process of addressing the problem. It's currently in prototype, and we've even sent off drawings to get quotes on the part. We should be getting samples in a couple of weeks. I could send you one of these samples for your review and for installation on your unit. Would you be interested in this?

Let me know.

[justinL110]

I purchased a billy goat vac last year hoping to use it for leaves and other debris. The only place I have found that this machine works well is on a flat blacktop parking lot. There it does an excellent job sucking up all the leaves. Other than that I have many complaints about the design of the machine and the miss information you read when researching the product

[Mr. Force]

Justin, What vacuum do you own? What's your application? I might be able to give you some pointers.

[Truly Beautiful Lawn Care]

Wow! Now that is a true sponsor indeed. I only wish Little Wonder would give me the same treatment! I've posted my complaint about the 5631 I recently purchased. And to think, I actually ordered a Billy Goat MV. If the local dealer would have called me to come and pick it up... I could have Mr. Force in my corner!
Jay

[Mr. Force]

5631? That's an Little Wonder Self-Propelled HPV with a liner right? My wife used to work at a hospital where the term HPV has a completely different meaning. ...I'm now going to stick to the golden rule I learned from my mother. :rolleyes:

Seriously, when you re-enter the market for a self propelled vacuum don't forget about us but maybe try another dealer who'll call you when your order comes in.

[Truly Beautiful Lawn Care]

Will do Drew!

[Poncho25]

Poncho, honestly try using honey instead of vinegar. Step back a read your post as if it was written by one of your customers. Kinda' rubs you the wrong way doesn't it?

I've seen the photos of the unit in question. We're already in the process of addressing the problem. It's currently in prototype, and we've even sent off drawings to get quotes on the part. We should be getting samples in a couple of weeks. I could send you one of these samples for your review and for installation on your unit. Would you be interested in this?

Let me know.


Sorry you feel that I was being blunt and to the point about this! I dropped a pretty bill on this product and now its taken a full week before I even heard anything back, not just on here but after calling my dealer to find out they are going to send a retrofit something or another. I just wanted the company to stand behind its product. I have lost alot of work time because of this machine being down, I took quite a few cleanups (leaf) knowing I was going to have this machine in my corner, only to find out that it performs the way it did? A goat would have been cheaper and faster to use! I had to put in more time then I bid on a clean up job because I had to do it all manually (old fashioned way), so I lost money again. The older model of the billy goat vac seems to be designed alot more practical, with the metal guard that goes over the intake, why would you design a product that is required to have 1/4 of a hole across the 33 inch span? Thats alot of loss suction when using the hose? and the plastic parts, give it a full season of use in the heat, that plastic will warp over time with use. It just does not seem like a good product after all, and so far, I am completely, totally unsatisfied with this product and so far how long it has taken to get response with still no solution!

As for this prototype that your talking about..not 100% sure I follow you on what part its replacing? The entire door that should close, or what? And can you explain to me why this model (unlike the ones in the past) require that gap in the intake when using the hose? *the main reason i bought this was not because of the vacuum itself, but was because of the hose. Maybe there's another product that I don't know about that will better suit my needs..?

[Turf Dancer]

Sorry you feel that I was being blunt and to the point about this! I dropped a pretty bill on this product and now its taken a full week before I even heard anything back, not just on here but after calling my dealer to find out they are going to send a retrofit something or another. I just wanted the company to stand behind its product. I have lost alot of work time because of this machine being down, I took quite a few cleanups (leaf) knowing I was going to have this machine in my corner, only to find out that it performs the way it did? A goat would have been cheaper and faster to use! I had to put in more time then I bid on a clean up job because I had to do it all manually (old fashioned way), so I lost money again. The older model of the billy goat vac seems to be designed alot more practical, with the metal guard that goes over the intake, why would you design a product that is required to have 1/4 of a hole across the 33 inch span? Thats alot of loss suction when using the hose? and the plastic parts, give it a full season of use in the heat, that plastic will warp over time with use. It just does not seem like a good product after all, and so far, I am completely, totally unsatisfied with this product and so far how long it has taken to get response with still no solution!

As for this prototype that your talking about..not 100% sure I follow you on what part its replacing? The entire door that should close, or what? And can you explain to me why this model (unlike the ones in the past) require that gap in the intake when using the hose? *the main reason i bought this was not because of the vacuum itself, but was because of the hose. Maybe there's another product that I don't know about that will better suit my needs..?

What did this vac cost? I have an older model that I purchased several years ago at the recomendation of a dealer and while it does a good job it is pita to dump and the zipper has been a problem from day one. The hose also constantly clogged which didn't make me real happy. I am trying to sell it as we speak. I only used it a few times. I wish the hose kit was a 5" instead of a 4" and I wish it were clear hose instead of the black and green. I also wished the hose were about a foot longer.

[Mr. Force]

Poncho, I'll do my best to answer the questions you have here. It took four days for me to respond with Spring Break starting and Easter weekend in the middle of those 4 days. We didn't go with the KD series style of hose kit because of requests to make it more user friendly and easier activate. Will the plastic warp enough over time to effect performance? In short, no, "plastic" (this is actually HDPE) also allows the unit to stay flexible, lightweight, rustproof, not needing to be painted, and substantially lower in cost than steel. These are many of the reasons why you see so many auto manufacturers using plastic.

How often have you been offered a prototype part from a manufacturer 4 days after you voiced a concern? The prototype part allows the nozzle to more completely shut off the intake airflow, forcing more air through the hose. It retrofits to all MV's as well. If you're mostly interested in the hose kit have you looked into a truckloader?

Let me know if you want to try this prototype part, we are scheduled to get the samples in this week.

[nobagger]

Poncho, honestly try using honey instead of vinegar. Step back a read your post as if it was written by one of your customers. Kinda' rubs you the wrong way doesn't it?

I've seen the photos of the unit in question. We're already in the process of addressing the problem. It's currently in prototype, and we've even sent off drawings to get quotes on the part. We should be getting samples in a couple of weeks. I could send you one of these samples for your review and for installation on your unit. Would you be interested in this?

Let me know.

I would be pissed too if I spent a ton of money on something that doesnt do what the manufacture said it would do! I think there is something called "field testing" some manufacture's might want to try this concept out before releasing JUNK! for a premium price...just some helpful hints!:clapping:

[Mr. Force]

I would be pissed too if I spent a ton of money on something that doesnt do what the manufacture said it would do! I think there is something called "field testing" some manufacture's might want to try this concept out before releasing JUNK! for a premium price...just some helpful hints!:clapping:

Nobagger, when you mention "JUNK" are you referring to your post "Little Wonder HPV a real piece of....."? I trust there's no insinuation that field testing is not important to us. There could be nothing further from the truth. When we are made aware of concerns we try to address them as quickly as possible.

If we didn't care what our customers thought we wouldn't be a sponsor and I wouldn't be here directly addressing feedback.

[Poncho25]

Poncho, I'll do my best to answer the questions you have here. It took four days for me to respond with Spring Break starting and Easter weekend in the middle of those 4 days. We didn't go with the KD series style of hose kit because of requests to make it more user friendly and easier activate. Will the plastic warp enough over time to effect performance? In short, no, "plastic" (this is actually HDPE) also allows the unit to stay flexible, lightweight, rustproof, not needing to be painted, and substantially lower in cost than steel. These are many of the reasons why you see so many auto manufacturers using plastic.

How often have you been offered a prototype part from a manufacturer 4 days after you voiced a concern? The prototype part allows the nozzle to more completely shut off the intake airflow, forcing more air through the hose. It retrofits to all MV's as well. If you're mostly interested in the hose kit have you looked into a truckloader?

Let me know if you want to try this prototype part, we are scheduled to get the samples in this week.


Thanks for responding Mr. Force I do appreciate it. the main reason I see this plastic over a short time bending and warping is how the bar that you use opens and closes the closure part sits almost on the lip of the upper part, so when you push it close and if you have to push further to get it closed it will bend and in time will take that shape. Just a thought. As far as the prototype is concerned, I honestly would like billy goat to stand behind its product and offer me a full money back satisfaction response as its just not something that has left a good taste in my mouth with these results. I understand that you guys get busy, but in all honesty. That doesn't mean diddly to me! this has cost me more money then just the unit, this has cost me down time, lost time and overtime on jobs that i took when I purchased this, and bid it on the time it would take me...then having to do it all manually which is not the clients fault so I could not change my bid and mark it up for a product that was defected. I would probably purchase the older model of the vac for the hose. And i have thought about a truck-loader, its just not a practical idea for me. As stated before, the main reason that I wanted this, was because of the hose. I am sorry but this whole exp has left a bad impression for me on the billy goat product as this was my 1st piece I have ever purchased from this company....and might be the last, depending on how the end result of this headache turns out.

[nobagger]

Nobagger, when you mention "JUNK" are you referring to your post "Little Wonder HPV a real piece of....."? I trust there's no insinuation that field testing is not important to us. There could be nothing further from the truth. When we are made aware of concerns we try to address them as quickly as possible.

If we didn't care what our customers thought we wouldn't be a sponsor and I wouldn't be here directly addressing feedback.

Oh I agree 1000000% My Little Wonder HPV is one of the worst things I have ever bought, hands down. Put yourselves in our shoes for a change...We work our butts off to make ends meet, buy what we think is going to be a great investment, then crap! I just wasted a ton of money on this piece of sh!t. I as well as many other's obviously become more frustrated every day with things like this. And IMO, if you really "field tested" it in the real world you might have found this problem before you wasted someones valuable time. And its not just Billygoat I'm talking about, many other manufacture's. I personally dont own one of these things but I share this guy's pain, I spent 5k on a new snow plow and in 6hrs the cutting edge was wore down almost an inch...to me thats not acceptable! Again IMO if manufacture's would go that little extra mile and make something that will last for years w/o problems we would be willing to pay a little more then everyone would be happy. And its great you address concerns quickly but if it were made right the first time there would be no concerns to address.

[Mr. Force]

As far as the prototype is concerned, I honestly would like billy goat to stand behind its product and offer me a full money back satisfaction response as its just not something that has left a good taste in my mouth with these results.

There's the problem... If you've got a bad taste in your mouth you're probably running the machine incorrectly.:laugh:

Seriously, did you get a demonstration before you bought the unit? If not why? You demonstrated your ZTR, walk-behind, sting trimmer, backpack, before you bought it didn't you?

If you did, the product obviously performed well enough for you to buy it. Have you asked your dealer for your money back? If not why? If you have and they won't give it to you why?

We shipped your dealer the part last week. Have you tried the part that was designed to address your complaint?

[Mr. Force]

Oh I agree 1000000% My Little Wonder HPV is one of the worst things I have ever bought, hands down. Put yourselves in our shoes for a change...We work our butts off to make ends meet, buy what we think is going to be a great investment, then crap! I just wasted a ton of money on this piece of sh!t. I as well as many other's obviously become more frustrated every day with things like this. And IMO, if you really "field tested" it in the real world you might have found this problem before you wasted someones valuable time. And its not just Billygoat I'm talking about, many other manufacture's. I personally dont own one of these things but I share this guy's pain, I spent 5k on a new snow plow and in 6hrs the cutting edge was wore down almost an inch...to me thats not acceptable! Again IMO if manufacture's would go that little extra mile and make something that will last for years w/o problems we would be willing to pay a little more then everyone would be happy. And its great you address concerns quickly but if it were made right the first time there would be no concerns to address.

Nobagger, no amount of field testing will find everything. We spent over 2000 hours in commercial and residential test time with completely different users. Our own grounds here at Billy Goat were spotless as well. Many of the internal hours put on by myself. Try to name one product that didn't have updates. You can't, how people use them and in what applications is so varied that by the time you field tested something to oblivion you would have spent so much money and time the product couldn't be profitable. You also have people with expectations that are unattainable.

As a manufacturer, you do have to draw the line as well as how much you build into a product. You could make it bulletproof but then it would be too heavy, complex, loud, fuel inefficient, large, expensive than no one would buy it. "Yea it works great but I can't afford it"

I truely feel the frustration of a customer who's needs are not being met through no fault of his own. I truely understand how you make your money and I understand that if you don't make money you don't buy new equipment. However it's frustrating for us as a manufacturer to have people blame problems on us that they bear some responsiblity for and making demands that are not reasonable.

[Turf Dancer]

Could someone please tell me what the average cost of this machine is? What is the hose kit cost? It this better then the old style vacs? Is the suction much better then the KD511H that I have?

[Poncho25]

There's the problem... If you've got a bad taste in your mouth you're probably running the machine incorrectly.:laugh:

Seriously, did you get a demonstration before you bought the unit? If not why? You demonstrated your ZTR, walk-behind, sting trimmer, backpack, before you bought it didn't you?

If you did, the product obviously performed well enough for you to buy it. Have you asked your dealer for your money back? If not why? If you have and they won't give it to you why?

We shipped your dealer the part last week. Have you tried the part that was designed to address your complaint?


To answer some of these questions is that from my knowledge, billy goat does not offer dealers a demo so no, I could not demo it as you don't offer that. I made the purchase based on others thoughts on the older models, and from what my dealer told me about the older models. I went with the new model as it seemed to fit in the area of what i needed. I went and saw your "prototype fix" for my unit. Whats the fix? the fact that its a different color? I mean, there is still a 1/2 inch gap when closing it for the hose unit to work, a 1/2 inch gap across a 33 inch span.....thats a LARGE hole with lost suction! The fact of the matter is, how many times you want to try to put the blame in my hands, this is your companys fault, this product that I received was defected. Not only that, but it is my opinion that its faulty design for use of the hose kit in particular! I said this earlier on in my posts, that this was the 1st billy goat product that I purchased, and I hate to say it, it will probably be my last. And I would highly recommend anyone in my field of work, to use this as an example of how your treated when you have a faulty product that you purchase from a company. Its clear that you are not from the customer relations dept of your company as your lack of tactfulness is all over the place here. Either way. This was a nightmare to have to deal with at the start of the season and I sure hope no one else has to run into this situation to often.:nono:

[Mr. Force]

To answer some of these questions is that from my knowledge, billy goat does not offer dealers a demo so no, I could not demo it as you don't offer that.[QUOTE]

Our distributors ALL have demonstration units, and some dealers use their units to demo as well. You never asked for a demo did you? Had you, one could have easily been arranged.

[QUOTE]I went and saw your "prototype fix" for my unit. Whats the fix? the fact that its a different color? I mean, there is still a 1/2 inch gap when closing it for the hose unit to work, a 1/2 inch gap across a 33 inch span.....thats a LARGE hole with lost suction! The fact of the matter is, how many times you want to try to put the blame in my hands, this is your companys fault, this product that I received was defected. Not only that, but it is my opinion that its faulty design for use of the hose kit in particular![QUOTE]

It is my opinion that although we went above and beyond to keep you happy nothing was going to make you happy. You were looking for a way to return the unit, get your money back, and save face for making a purchase that did not fit your needs. The intake is 28 inches not 33, that gap was 1/2 inch and now it's no more. You didn't even really look at it did you? With that being said, by no stretch of the imagination is the product defective. We've got MANY happy MV customers.


[QUOTE]I said this earlier on in my posts, that this was the 1st billy goat product that I purchased, and I hate to say it, it will probably be my last. And I would highly recommend anyone in my field of work, to use this as an example of how your treated when you have a faulty product that you purchase from a company. Its clear that you are not from the customer relations dept of your company as your lack of tactfulness is all over the place here. Either way. This was a nightmare to have to deal with at the start of the season and I sure hope no one else has to run into this situation to often.:nono:

Are you seriously complaining about a lack of tactfulness? I don't mean to be rude but you weren't going to buy any of my product again anyway. That was a hollow threat you were trying to hold over my head. In the future please buy a competitive product. Unlike Billy Goat, they will be happy to ignore you, and your requests for assistance.

[Mr. Force]

Could someone please tell me what the average cost of this machine is? What is the hose kit cost? It this better then the old style vacs? Is the suction much better then the KD511H that I have?

The list is from $1499 for a Honda powered push to $1799 for a Honda powered Self propelled unit. The hose kit has a list price of $149. The suction is over 1000 CFM more than the KD series. I'm not certain of your application so I would recommend asking for a demonstration from your dealer. If he doesn't have a demo unit his distributor does. Let the product speak for itself to see if it meets your needs.

Let me know if you have any other questions.

[Poncho25]

[QUOTE]

Our distributors ALL have demonstration units, and some dealers use their units to demo as well. You never asked for a demo did you? Had you, one could have easily been arranged.

No not ALL your distributors have demo units, as if they did, yes I would have demo'd it!!


It is my opinion that although we went above and beyond to keep you happy nothing was going to make you happy. You were looking for a way to return the unit, get your money back, and save face for making a purchase that did not fit your needs. The intake is 28 inches not 33, that gap was 1/2 inch and now it's no more. You didn't even really look at it did you? With that being said, by no stretch of the imagination is the product defective. We've got MANY happy MV customers.

I am glad this is just your opinion here!! Yes I agree you attempted to make the mistake be corrected but you failed! This unit would have fit my needs to the exact, the fact that you even want to state that, justifies my comment about your lack of tactfulness!! And yes, I looked at it, and when its closed I could run my finger up to the end of my nail all the way across! was the suction improved, yes it was, but still a gap non the less! So yes, this product or at least the one I purchased is defective and faulty design! And if you want pictures AGAIN i am sure we can provide them, in fact we can compare the to the floor unit they have in the shop, as the floor unit has a complete seal when its closed, but on mine, there is still a gap!!



Are you seriously complaining about a lack of tactfulness? I don't mean to be rude but you weren't going to buy any of my product again anyway. That was a hollow threat you were trying to hold over my head. In the future please buy a competitive product. Unlike Billy Goat, they will be happy to ignore you, and your requests for assistance.

It was far from a hollow threat, it was my 1st time ever getting a billy goat product and it was an extremely costly, headache of a purchase. The fact that I never buy a billy goat product again is based on this piece of trash that I purchased. I am sorry, but until this post and the last one, I have attempted to be extremely nice and professional about this matter, but the fact that you insist on trying to deal with me at the back of your hand soto say, is something to say about your responses. I mean, they should at least preview what you write as you are representing your company in my eyes extremely poorly. Yes you attempted to fix the issue, i will give you that much.

[Mr. Force]

Poncho,

I don't think you understand. I was in sales for Billy Goat for over 13 years until 2 1/2 years ago when I was asked to come be the Billy Goat Product Manager. I've dealt with all types of people in this industry in all types of applications in many territories, including yours.

No not ALL your distributors have demo units, as if they did, yes I would have demo'd it!!

You simply don't know what you are talking about. ALL of our Distributors do have demo units. Not all of our Dealers do so they ask Distributors to borrow theirs. You never asked for a demo. This whole thing could have been avoided had the product been demonstrated.

I'm not even going to discuss the product any further. Nothing I say and or do will make you happy. We simply disagree. It's like potty training a cat. It's not going to work and you just end up tired and frustrated with an annoyed cat.;)

I am sorry, but until this post and the last one, I have attempted to be extremely nice and professional about this matter, but the fact that you insist on trying to deal with me at the back of your hand soto say, is something to say about your responses. I mean, they should at least preview what you write as you are representing your company in my eyes extremely poorly.

Honey versus Vinegar, from the very beginning you've had a chip on your shoulder. You've tried to bully and embarrass me into getting attention. I've done my best to try to satisfy you but it was not meant to be.

Who is the "they who should at least preview what you write"? Again, I don't think you understand. I am one of the owners of this company.

[Turf Dancer]

So can someone tell me what these machines cost? I am interested assuming that the machine in question is just a fluke lemon and the rest of them are good machines!

So here is my question about this whole mess! So Poncho buys a machine and the thing as I am understanding is not as it should be regarding the gap problem. Why doesn't the dealer or distributor just replace the faulty part and if that is not possible then replace the machine. I mean come on that is what the dealer is for in the first place is to service what they sell and make sure a machine is working as it should be when they deliver it. If it is not then the distributor should have to make it right and then the manufacturer should take it on themselves to make good with the distributor. It should never have to come to this mess that has been created in this forum. The dealer should have made sure things were right to begin with! If the dealer was any kind of dealer at all then it would have been taken care of at that level and never made it here assuming that the dealer had been made aware of the issue.

[Poncho25]

So can someone tell me what these machines cost? I am interested assuming that the machine in question is just a fluke lemon and the rest of them are good machines!

So here is my question about this whole mess! So Poncho buys a machine and the thing as I am understanding is not as it should be regarding the gap problem. Why doesn't the dealer or distributor just replace the faulty part and if that is not possible then replace the machine. I mean come on that is what the dealer is for in the first place is to service what they sell and make sure a machine is working as it should be when they deliver it. If it is not then the distributor should have to make it right and then the manufacturer should take it on themselves to make good with the distributor. It should never have to come to this mess that has been created in this forum. The dealer should have made sure things were right to begin with! If the dealer was any kind of dealer at all then it would have been taken care of at that level and never made it here assuming that the dealer had been made aware of the issue.

The problem is that the dealer and myself found a defect in the product and needed it to be addressed to the manufacturer, so we contacted all parties about the issue, they wanted pictures, so we took them, and then this thread was started. And hence a wonderful POC prototype was given to attempt to fix the issue. Which it did not, the main problem with this unit is that when the hose kit is attached the door that closes does not make a complete seal, it leaves a gap that I can run my finger through the entire width, where as the floor unit which does not have the hose kit attached, when closed creates a complete seal. So, my guess is that its one of two things, either its a complete faulty design when the hose kit is attached or the unit i have is just a defect. Either way it seems billy goat doesn't want to take either of those as an option and wants to just blame me :) GL with what ever you do decide to go with, but be forewarned about this issue here!! As I would hate to see another post with someone that this happened to!!

[Turf Dancer]

The problem is that the dealer and myself found a defect in the product and needed it to be addressed to the manufacturer, so we contacted all parties about the issue, they wanted pictures, so we took them, and then this thread was started. And hence a wonderful POC prototype was given to attempt to fix the issue. Which it did not, the main problem with this unit is that when the hose kit is attached the door that closes does not make a complete seal, it leaves a gap that I can run my finger through the entire width, where as the floor unit which does not have the hose kit attached, when closed creates a complete seal. So, my guess is that its one of two things, either its a complete faulty design when the hose kit is attached or the unit i have is just a defect. Either way it seems billy goat doesn't want to take either of those as an option and wants to just blame me :) GL with what ever you do decide to go with, but be forewarned about this issue here!! As I would hate to see another post with someone that this happened to!!


So what is the deal with this machine not closing all they way with the hose attached? According to the pictures on Billy Goats Website the port is already there does the hose not just fit in the port some way? Could I see the pics of the unit with the problem?

[Poncho25]

So what is the deal with this machine not closing all they way with the hose attached? According to the pictures on Billy Goats Website the port is already there does the hose not just fit in the port some way? Could I see the pics of the unit with the problem?

The issue is not where the hose is attached, but when the intake door is closed, which should put all the vacuume to the hose unit instead of the main intake, having a 1/2 inch gap across the main intake is a huge hole and loss of alot of suction. I don't have the photos on hand, my dealer does and so does Billy Goat as it was sent to them. But as I stated, without the hose kit attached and when closing the main intake it creates a complete seal, but it seems at least on the unit I got, this is not the case.

[DuraCutter]

I've read all the posts here in this thread and it's clear that this issue would be best resolved with pms.

Billy Goat is a good manufacturer and I own a few vacuums, the old style and a new VQ, the widea area unit. They are intended for specific uses and may sometimes come with certain small defects. I see this with all the equipment I use everyday, and that includes John Deere, Bobcat, Ford tractors, ariens, bluebird etc... I've had to do some mods to most of these brands and more. I have a full time mechanic and myself work on all our machinery and it's a fact of life.

Poncho is a well meaning lco and has become a part of lawnsite. His beef is probably legitimate as most machines have some issues the owner needs to contend with. I can relate to that.

I love coming here to Lawnsite to read all types of posts and get great ideas for business. Lawnsite is also a business that needs to have sponsors like Billy Goat and members like Poncho. Poncho, maybe it's best if you go behind the scenes to resolve this issue, and don't forget, it's because of sponsors that we have the opportunity to come on Lawnsite and discuss many things...
Let's not kill the goose that layed the golden egg...please!!!

Peace...

:)

[Mr. Force]

Just like Landscapers have customers who, no matter what you do, will not be satisfied. We manufacturers have the same things happen as well. This is one of those times. Part ways the best you can and let your competitor deal with them. The unit in question was taken back to the dealer and the money has been returned. This has been a money loosing headache for all involved.

Always ask for a demo of a product you haven't tried before. If the Dealer says "no" be leery, and make sure the dealer explains their return policy at the least so you know what you are getting into. Remember, ALL Billy Goat Dealers have access to their Distributors demonstration units. One of the reasons we have Distributors and Dealers is to perform demonstrations.

The intake door cover has been changed to deal with some of the issues voiced here. The improved intake door bracket increases the hose kit performance nicely and easily retrofits to all units ever made. The mechanic at the Dealer in question felt the update effectively addressed the issue. However, I believe even with a complete seal on the hose kit this customer may not be satisfied. I doubt there is a walk behind vacuum that will meet this customers needs.

With this improved bracket we loose over 10% of our airflow. This is a minimal loss considering the actual airflow. It was tested versus an intake that had been duct taped shut to ensure a complete seal. The costs involved in trying to capturing the remaining lost airflow would make the unit simply too expensive for the bulk of our customers. This doesn't even take into account making sure a complete seal can durable enough to handle the rigors of a commercial landscaper.

[DuraCutter]

Nobagger, when you mention "JUNK" are you referring to your post "Little Wonder HPV a real piece of....."? I trust there's no insinuation that field testing is not important to us. There could be nothing further from the truth. When we are made aware of concerns we try to address them as quickly as possible.

If we didn't care what our customers thought we wouldn't be a sponsor and I wouldn't be here directly addressing feedback.

I have one for you. We bought the VQ wide area vacuum about 3 months ago. It's seen little use because of the bag and the zipper. As soon as the bag gets dirty from a few minutes working it loses suction because the bag acts as the filter. Even with the little zippered area open, it doesn't work well. We paid $4,500 for the unit with the velkie and have used it all of 1 hour. It just made us into non believers in the vacuums. Then we bought the little wonder non propelled. It sucks like crazy and the liner directs the dust to the bottom.

Is there an attachment that can be fitted to the VQ that would have that kind of bag with the outer cover to redirect to the ground? The way the VQ bag works, it gets clogged way way way too fast. It doesn't work!!

How could that be missed in field testing? I rode the unit and in the first 5 minutes I was eating dust and the bag had most pores shut tight.

Let me know if you guys are working on a converter. I usually don't complain, but the money was high and the usage remains very low.

Thanks

Dan :)

[ProMo]

I have a kd and it is a major pita do dump the bag and I now have a large hole in the bag and not sure if it is worth replacing. Any way you could come up with something a little easier. I tried to empty a bag into a garbage can and ended up shoveling the stuff. Also when emtying the bag in a dumpster I end up eating about half of it.

[Mr. Force]

Promow,

We've got some new prototype KD bags coming in that we've been working on. The current bag design works but it can definately be improved. The prototype bag should fit on your unit and they don't have zippers. What KD model number do you have?

I'll send you one at no charge when they come in if you'll give me feedback (con as well as pro). Let me know when you can. If it's a yes PM me your address and I'll get the ball rolling.

[Mr. Force]

Duracutter,

That machine was designed in 1992 and the bag has not really changed since then. We are working on some bag changes but there's nothing in prototype form for the VQ yet.

In some applications the dust is much tougher to deal with. First of all I'd take the bag to a car wash and power wash it. You can actually wash it in your washing machine. However speaking from experience, only do this if you want to get the washing machine REALLY dirty. Once the bag has been used and cleaned a few times it's less prone to clogging and has better airflow. It has something to do with the air pores becoming established and broken in. As for the dust there's a dust cover option for the VQ that directs the airflow down away from the end user. It goes over the bag. It's part number is 830284.

Please let me know if you have any other questions or problems I can help you with

[ProMo]

Promow,

We've got some new prototype KD bags coming in that we've been working on. The current bag design works but it can definately be improved. The prototype bag should fit on your unit and they don't have zippers. What KD model number do you have?

I'll send you one at no charge when they come in if you'll give me feedback (con as well as pro). Let me know when you can. If it's a yes PM me your address and I'll get the ball rolling.
That would be great I will pm you.

[DuraCutter]

Duracutter,

That machine was designed in 1992 and the bag has not really changed since then. We are working on some bag changes but there's nothing in prototype form for the VQ yet.

In some applications the dust is much tougher to deal with. First of all I'd take the bag to a car wash and power wash it. You can actually wash it in your washing machine. However speaking from experience, only do this if you want to get the washing machine REALLY dirty. Once the bag has been used and cleaned a few times it's less prone to clogging and has better airflow. It has something to do with the air pores becoming established and broken in. As for the dust there's a dust cover option for the VQ that directs the airflow down away from the end user. It goes over the bag. It's part number is 830284.

Please let me know if you have any other questions or problems I can help you with

Yes, I do have a problem. A cover over the bag will help with dust, but it would be faster to use a broom...lol Since it's a design from 1992, do you think it might be time to remove the wording on the internet to sell the VQ. It says it's the "heavyweight of vacuums"... Really, I don't think so. Why do I feel like I'm brushed aside. It's over 4 grand of hard earned money that is "completely" useless. Maybe it's time to redesign this machine with a proper bag system like the MV. It's a heavyweight allright. It's extremely heavy to move around and does less vacuuming than a hoover.

Please prototype a bag like the little wonder or the MV or get the damn thing off the website... I don't appreciate being brushed aside like some nuisance.

Please?

:nono: :)

[Mr. Force]

Duracutter,

I am sincerely sorry if you feel brushed aside. That's not at all my intention. We have many customers that purchase and enjoy that the VQ Series for its performance, durability, intake size, hose kit, and self-propelled system. It's still the best large area vacuum in the industry. Does it have the latest and greatest bag design? No. Are we aware of this? Yes. Are we doing anything about this? Yes.

Unfortunately, I don't have anything I can send you that meets the exact desires you have at this time to test. I can direct you to how we currently address the concerns you've voiced as well as some tips on how to get the most out of the VQ Series.

Please let me know if you have any other questions or problems