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kptexan
04-28-2007, 09:35 PM
This afternoon, I made one of the most foolish mistakes ever. I bought some Scotts Turf Builder with Plus 2 Weed control and applied it to my lawn as instructed. After I doing this, I realized the bag said not to use this product on St. Augustine grass. The problem is that my entire lawn is St. Augustine! What can I do to keep it from killing my lawn? I've already throughly sprayed every square inch of my lawn with a high pressure water hose nozzle to knock the granules off the grass blades and I've been constantly watering my lawn with the sprinkler. What's the chance my lawn is going to die on me? How long will it take for me to know? I'm so upset at myself for doing this and wish it never happened.

Thanks,

Wes

ed2hess
04-28-2007, 09:51 PM
Calll Scotts hot line and hope you can get someone before the sun comes up. I think you are on the correct track in trying to get it washed off and down into the ground....about the only thing you can do.

kptexan
04-28-2007, 10:05 PM
Yeah, I spoke with them earlier and that's pretty much what they told me to do. They kind of scared me but I think they have to tell the worst case scenario for liability reasons. I just pray that this isnt the end of my lawn. This is truly one of the dumbest mistkakes I've ever made. Anyone have firsthand experience with this exact mistake?

Thanks,

Wes

Nathan Robinson
04-28-2007, 10:26 PM
your grass is going to be fine. just wait and see.

kptexan
04-28-2007, 10:32 PM
Thanks for the positive reply. I sure hope you're right. I live on a street where all the houses have nice green, well cared for lawns and I keep having this horrible daydream that my lawn will be the only one that's brown and ugly! That would be pretty embarrasing so I'm gonna pray it doesn't happen.

Thanks,

Wes

Nathan Robinson
04-28-2007, 10:38 PM
If it where to die just rent a sod cutter and steal your next door neighbors lawn when he is at work Monday. He will never notice! But 4real, your lawn will be fine. Use a organic fertikizer next time and stay away from as many chemicals as possible. Use chemicals and synthetic fertilizers on a as needed basis. Organics are environmentally safe and better effective.

mwaller98
04-29-2007, 12:23 AM
if you are really worried about it, you can apply an activated charcoal (either granular or powder) to the entire lawn to absorb the weed control. The fert won't harm the lawn but the weed control may.

check out this link for app rates etc.

http://www.dupont.com/ag/vm/literature/K-14320.pdf

Lesco sells 2.5 gallon jugs (23 lbs) for about 70-80 bucks which will treat approx 4-10 thousand sq ft

hope this helps

sheshovel
04-29-2007, 01:31 AM
Probably did more damage with that high pressure nozzle than the herbicide did. I would have sucked up the stuff with a shop-vac then flooded the lawn to leach it out.

vegomatic40
04-29-2007, 04:17 AM
St. Augustine is pretty sensitive to phenoxy herbicides especially when it is fully out of dormancy and growing rapidly. Maybe Ric or other members in the deep south can chime in with some advice but at this point copius amounts of water and A. Charcoal maybe your best bet. I'd be very surprised if you didn't see at least some damage to the lawn. The fert. should help it recover but watch for yellowing, deformation of leaves, twisting, curling etc. I would also be curious why Scott's thought it would be ok to sell that product in your market since that turf-type is so common.

RAlmaroad
04-29-2007, 06:36 AM
Kptexan: I did a check for the composition on Scotts and Southern Speedzone. Southern Speedzone is "labeled" as being safe for common St. Augustine. The comparision of the two shows that the 2,4-D is much much lower in the Scotts Product. I don't have a label on the Scotts products to see what else is in it but as Nathan pointed out in above post--Your grass will be fine. You "may" get a little yellowing but it should recover.
It's a good thing that you watered it into the ground, I'd water it again today especially if it is going to be warm.

Do you have a sprinkler system? If, so turn them on during the heat of the day.

I have St. Augustine on the SC property as well as centipede. In the future there is a Scotts products for St. Augustine that is Weed and Feed. Never seen it but it's available maybe at Lowe's or Home Depot.

For your summer weeds, check out the "Image for St. Augustine and Centipede" It is a hose end application that covers 8K. and available at Lowe's. St. Augustine and Centipede are picky grasses. Outside of Atrazine, and 0-0-7 Dimension and other Pre-em, there are few Herbicides that the grass will tolerate, especially the Three-Ways as in the Southern Speedzone.





Scotts Plus 2 composition is 1.21% 2,4-D and 0.605% Mecoprop-PCarfentrazone-ethyl 0.54%

Southern Speedzone which used in the lower application/K is safe for common St. Augustine (see below)
2,4-D, 2-ethylhexyl ester . . . . . . . 10.49%
Mecoprop-p acid . . . . . . . . . . . . 2.66%
Dicamba acid . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 0.67

Sure hope this will help and remember to water again.

Ric
04-29-2007, 10:18 AM
RAlmaroad

You have the correct answer and the only reason I am replying to this post is because vegomatic called my name. I have seen the same mistake many times with Weed & feeds on different kinds of turf with no ill effects or slight stress that bounds back.

You took the time to read the Scotts Label as to what chemicals were used. As I read down this post, that was my first question. I wouldn't of taken the time to look it up.

Other manufacturer's Three way that are labelled for St Augustine are stronger than Speed Zone. However they are also an amine and not an ester based Product.

I will blame Scotts aggressive marketing for many mistakes by homeowner and lawn boys when using their products. When I see or hear their commercials it blows my mind. I wonder about other products advertised that I don't have the real knowledge of.

RAlmaroad
04-29-2007, 10:35 AM
Glad to see your post Ric--Your insite and knowledge is valuable to everyone.
I used a Scott's products about 35 years ago. I didn't trust or like it then and haven't changed attitudes. Their marketing to homeowners has brainwashed so many. There is a better products for St. Augustine grass and in my opinion far better and safer--It's Pennington St. Augustine fertilize 18-0-18 with weed control. Weed control is Atrazine. The only thing is that homeowners should wait about 2 weeks after greenup before applying.
Thanks Ric for chiming in as your experience with the stepchildren is worthy and appreciated--Roy

kptexan
04-29-2007, 11:55 AM
Probably did more damage with that high pressure nozzle than the herbicide did. I would have sucked up the stuff with a shop-vac then flooded the lawn to leach it out.

Well, since I made sure to wet the grass before applying the fertilizer (how did I see that detail in the instructions and not the real important one?), I figured it would be difficult to vacuum off. The nozzle I used was probably actually more volume than pressure but definitely had more pressure than just an open water hose.

Also the I made a mistake and the actual product I used is here:
http://www.scotts.com/index.cfm/event/ProductGuide.product/documentId/bd4d0e3ca2b37ce0f290e7015ef64f12

The good news is that the stuff I used has less 2,4-D and MCPP than the product I originally said I used. (Regular turf builder has 1.21% 2,4-D and .6%MCPP and the product I used has 1% 2,4-D and .5% MCPP). 2,4-D is the bad chemical for St. Augustine correct?

Yeah it made me angry but I know it's ultimately my fault. It's just that almost every yard in my town has St. Augustine grass (with the exception of some bermuda) and it was just laying on the shelf in my Ace hardware with every other fertilizer. Also, the warning is in sort of bold letters mixed in with a bunch of other writing on the back of the bag but they need to put it in red writing on the front of the bag or something. Maybe they figure it would scare away other users? Although it's my fault, Scotts apologized and told me if it does kill my lawn they will give me a refund.

If it does do damage, how soon should I look for this damage and how soon should the damage peak? Thanks so much for your help.

-Wes

Ric
04-29-2007, 12:40 PM
Well, since I made sure to wet the grass before applying the fertilizer (how did I see that detail in the instructions and not the real important one?), I figured it would be difficult to vacuum off. The nozzle I used was probably actually more volume than pressure but definitely had more pressure than just an open water hose.

Also the I made a mistake and the actual product I used is here:
http://www.scotts.com/index.cfm/event/ProductGuide.product/documentId/bd4d0e3ca2b37ce0f290e7015ef64f12

The good news is that the stuff I used has less 2,4-D and MCPP than the product I originally said I used. (Regular turf builder has 1.21% 2,4-D and .6%MCPP and the product I used has 1% 2,4-D and .5% MCPP). 2,4-D is the bad chemical for St. Augustine correct?

Yeah it made me angry but I know it's ultimately my fault. It's just that almost every yard in my town has St. Augustine grass (with the exception of some bermuda) and it was just laying on the shelf in my Ace hardware with every other fertilizer. Also, the warning is in sort of bold letters mixed in with a bunch of other writing on the back of the bag but they need to put it in red writing on the front of the bag or something. Maybe they figure it would scare away other users? Although it's my fault, Scotts apologized and told me if it does kill my lawn they will give me a refund.

If it does do damage, how soon should I look for this damage and how soon should the damage peak? Thanks so much for your help.

-Wes


Wes

2,4-D is the bad chemical for St. Augustine correct?

Sorry but you are incorrect. 2,4-D has gotten a bad rap for years. Recently it was proven not to cause cancer. 2,4-D is also an Aquatic Herbicide in proper formulation. There are people on this site from Texas who actually use 2,4-D for broad leaf control on St Augustine.

Mecoprop-p and Dicamba are the bad boys on St Augustine if over applied. Southern Speed Zone had to be taken off the market and re-Formulated a few years ago because of Mecoprop-p being too high a ratio in the mix. Atrazine 4 L is now a RUP (Restricted Use Products) because surface and ground water contamination. However watered down versions of Atrazine and Atrazine weed and Feeds are still GUP products.


Broad leaf weed control in St Augustine is still not an issue. However Grassy Weed control has been a real issue for many years. One of the things I keep proprietary is my Grassy Weed control methods because none of my competitor are doing Grassy Weed Control.

Ric
04-29-2007, 12:54 PM
Yo

I posted the above and then read the link to the Scotts Fertilizer. 29-3-3 plus Herbicide, ROFLMAO when I realized the ink on the bag cost more than the product in it. There is a local restaurant chain here that advertises very heavy on Radio. I finally went there one time and found the place very empty of customers, I couldn't eat the food it was so bad. This should be a lesson to all of us all, that products and services that advertise so heavy, do so because they have an inferior or over priced Products or Services.

RAlmaroad
04-29-2007, 01:09 PM
Ric:
Ditto, ditto, ditto truer word were never spoken...

kptexan
04-29-2007, 01:24 PM
Yo

I posted the above and then read the link to the Scotts Fertilizer. 29-3-3 plus Herbicide, ROFLMAO when I realized the ink on the bag cost more than the product in it. There is a local restaurant chain here that advertises very heavy on Radio. I finally went there one time and found the place very empty of customers, I couldn't eat the food it was so bad. This should be a lesson to all of us all, that products and services that advertise so heavy, do so because they have an inferior or over priced Products or Services.

Well, in this case, lets just hope that Scotts weed killer is inferior and will not do terrible irreversible damage to my lawn. I'm watering as I'm typing this! Thanks tremendously for all of you guys' input!

-Wes

RAlmaroad
04-29-2007, 02:08 PM
Tex: Please post us on how your yard look--let's say on Thursday/Friday. I would like to enter this in my log book. Yea, I keep situations that are unusual as a sorta reference. I'm betting that it will be greener because of the N. and water-- Thanks

Neal Wolbert
04-29-2007, 09:24 PM
[QUOTE=Nathan Robinson...Organics are environmentally safe and better effective.[/QUOTE]


Who says??? Pretty broad statement without any reference to what the organic source is. Are you of the mindset that all "organics" are safe and better?

Neal

kptexan
04-30-2007, 10:59 PM
I was visiting with my next door neighbor today and I told him about my fiasco with the wrong fertilizer/weed killer. I knew he mentioned using a Scotts fertilizer/weed killer and I was thinking he must have been using Bonus S Southern Weed & Feed. When I asked him if he still had the original bag, he said yes and we went to his garage to take a look. Guess what? Yep, thats right, he was using the exact same fertilizer/weed killer that I used on my lawn!! The only thing is that he applied it twice within the past few months and he actually waters his lawn less than I normally do! I was shocked and then I proceeded to show him the warning about St. Augustine on the back of the bag. The good thing for me is that his lawn really doesn't look bad at all, so I'm sure that means I'm in the clear. I'll post back in a few days and let you guys know how my lawn looks.

-Wes

kptexan
05-20-2008, 11:19 AM
I know it's been over a year since this has happened but I just wanted to give you guys an update. My lawn actually looks better than ever and that Scotts fertilizer made no noticeable change to my lawn! Actually immediately following the incident, I watered the lawn so much that it looked better than before.

Thanks,

Wes