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View Full Version : Ever have another LCO remove your mailbox lawn flyers?


Ramairfreak98ss
06-08-2007, 12:38 AM
While your passing them out or still at your lawn site?

Today, my employee on the mower was about 10-15 minutes from completion in a more upscale NJ development. So i throw on my roller blades (how i usually pass out my fancy color mailbox flyers) and off i go. I go basically in a big look real quick taking about ~10 minutes. I pass out 35 flyers and on my way back to the lawn i just cut, about 4 houses down is a guy with a backpack blower in someones back yard.

His old beatup rack/box body gmc truck and shabby open trailer is sitting in the wide road and which looks like hes getting done cutting a lawn. I figure its just some other company "landscape etc" or whatever the name was, so i dont put a flyer in that mailbox and continue on my way with another ~5 flyers till i get back to the house im cutting.

5 minutes later, the guy is walking down the road with the backpack blower pulling all my flyers out, he gets now right Across the street from the lawn im doing and i start to walk over to him, so he says, "here you want these back?, Theyre already taken care of".

What stumped me is that i know for a fact that another large company 3 weeks ago was cutting the one across the street and did last year too.. and where did this little single crew company/guy come from having "5" 1.5 acre properties damn near in a row? He also cuts the one right next door to the one i was doing and i KNOW all of last year they had some other guy come out with a toro ZTR, younger white guy doing that lawn.. Im thinking maybe the large company across the street from my lawn is selling off lawn accounts to little guys or something. The guy must have been there for hours working on these lawns because when i pulled up to do my clients lawn, the grass in the road next door looked almost like it was cut yesterday so it was sitting there for hours before he blew off the streets and driveways.

It wasnt so much the fact he took off the flyers from the lawns he was cutting, as much as to do it after he saw me go by and that i was still there. I myself would probably take them off one of my clients mail box, but then i thought about it, it probably wouldnt bother me because most flyers i see are pretty "shiatty" to say the least and im not worried about my clients seeing that and dropping my services because of it.

My flyer is a full color double sided sheet and is pretty intimidating to other LCOs, especially little guys i guess. Now if he went down the entire street pulling off my flyers i would have just called the cops.

I think over the weekend ill go around to all them and put flyers in their front door :dancing: Seems the guy thinks hes got something to loose i guess.

gavin478
06-08-2007, 01:17 AM
Personally, If I'm dropping off flyers, and see another company's I pull it off. However, it is rediculous for the other guy to go out of his way to do that. Go back in 2 days and hit them all again!

KTO Enterprises
06-08-2007, 01:19 AM
Go get em! I was cuttin a yard one day and a fly by nighter left a crappy lookin flyer on the mailbox. It fell off so i took it to my customer and said someone left this on their mailbox. She looked at it, laughed and threw it in the trash, then proceded to make me a sandwich and pour me a glass of sweet tea. Thats my nicest customer. Everytime I get done with her yard she has lunch ready for me. Just the gesture alone makes it worth the fact that I probably shorted myself $15 per month on this account.

The Captain
06-08-2007, 01:20 AM
I'd be a little P.O.'d with him too. But anyone with only a few accounts is likely to be paranoid about anything threatening. Just remember the rules about USPS mailboxes. If you had them in the mailbox and he took them out, that's a big no no also.

Be safe, use the front door if you can.

KTO Enterprises
06-08-2007, 01:21 AM
Do you guys put the flyers in the mail box or on the flag. Im scared to open someones mailbox, so I put it on the flag or in the paperbox.

topsites
06-08-2007, 01:21 AM
No, so long you are respectful enough not to put one in the mailbox of the yard I am working on, I have no issues with you doing your business. Matter of fact, this might be one time I just might wave at another Lco.

I will take a slew of them out, but only if someone has the gaul to put one in the mailbox of the yard I am working on, only then do I get upset. Then again, that guy might've had more than the one account, not sure what to think or say, but even if I pulled the 3-4 in adjacent boxes because they're my customers, I could also see you could not have known that... Either way, I sure as heck would never walk up to the Lco who just put them there LOL.

Respect my yard, I respect you, and yours.
Peace

/////////
Other notes: Technically, you're not supposed to put them on any part of the mail box itself, the paper box is fine, you might try their front door knob (or wedged in the screen door), say if they have a paved driveway.

Trimmer Man007
06-08-2007, 01:39 AM
Isn't it illegal to pull anything out of someone else's mailbox? Like a federal crime?

fiveoboy01
06-08-2007, 03:00 AM
So, I'm curious what you told the guy when he went to hand you your flyers back.

I'd be pretty pissed, and maybe inform him that I will consider calling the police on him because he is stealing out of people's newspaper boxes.

What a f'in hack.

Richard Martin
06-08-2007, 05:04 AM
Do you guys put the flyers in the mail box or on the flag. Im scared to open someones mailbox, so I put it on the flag or in the paperbox.

It's just as illeagal to put them on the outside as the inside.

dgfitz
06-08-2007, 06:19 AM
Isn't it illegal to pull anything out of someone else's mailbox? Like a federal crime?

Yes, and yes. Also it is illegal to attach anything to the mailbox, or use
the mail box for any other reason except to forward or recieve mail. The
actual wording of the law is more precise and detailed, but the clear reasonable
meaning is that mailboxes belong to the Federal government. If you have
doubts, check with your Licensed Attorney At Law for advise.

Bagit
06-08-2007, 07:30 AM
Nobody should be removing anything from the paper boxes. Once it is there it is the homeowners property. I would go off if i saw another lco remove my flyer.

MOW ED
06-08-2007, 08:03 AM
The paperbox is fair game for delivery of your stuff. Stay away from all parts of the MAILBOX. You can actually put something in the mailbox if you put a stamp on it. It does not have to go thru a cancellation machine but it HAS to have a stamp.

A paperbox is a popular way to advertise and it is rotten for some mope to remove your advertisment. I personally wouldn't pull anyones flyer. Its a percentage game with flyers anyway so the ones he pulled may not have been closers but if you are really interested in the property then directly target them with mail and if you have the nads, go up and ring the bell. No one can stop you from that except for the homeowner. Good Luck.

DAV Mowers
06-08-2007, 09:03 AM
It's federal law that says we cannot put anything in or on a mail box, the law says the same in all 50 states. You put a flyer with your company name, phone or/and address and they've got you dead to rights.

KTO Enterprises
06-08-2007, 09:55 AM
Im just wondering. If my mailbox belongs to the federal government, why did I have to purchase it myself?

carcrz
06-08-2007, 09:57 AM
I don't mind people passing out their fliers as long as they skip the lawns I'm working on. You better believe that I'd pull one off the door if I saw it there though.

Mike Fronczak
06-08-2007, 10:25 AM
I don't pull them off custmers doors or mailboxes. If there in the lawn or beds they get picked up like any other piece of garbage, I will however look at them before I toss them. If this had happened to me, I would put all the house on the street (35) in my maillist & plaster them with post card once a week, for quite a while or when you think they will be looking for services. Post cards are dirt cheap way to target advertise, look at Vistaprint.com.

fiveoboy01
06-08-2007, 11:09 AM
Im just wondering. If my mailbox belongs to the federal government, why did I have to purchase it myself?

I was going to ask the same thing....

Kinda like your house, you don't own it, the guvment does. Oh sure the title is in your name, but try NOT paying property taxes and see how long you get to keep it. '

Emminent domain anyone?

KTO Enterprises
06-08-2007, 11:12 AM
I was going to ask the same thing....

Kinda like your house, you don't own it, the guvment does. Oh sure the title is in your name, but try NOT paying property taxes and see how long you get to keep it. '

Emminent domain anyone?

Lol Ive said for a while that you dont own a thing in this country. Once you pay it off you have to rent it from the government. I think If they could get inside your house, they would tax you on every spoon, plate, cup, tv, bed, and x rated dvd you own.

MarcSmith
06-08-2007, 11:21 AM
they would tax you on every spoon, plate, cup, tv, bed, and x rated dvd you own.

They already do. Its called sales tax.....and when you cook your you food you use electric and they usualy have some taxes or regulatory fees on you electric bills....

KTO Enterprises
06-08-2007, 11:24 AM
They already do. Its called sales tax.....and when you cook your you food you use electric and they usualy have some taxes or regulatory fees on you electric bills....

Im talking personal property tax. I dont knwo how many of you in your states have personal property tax, but here anything titled gets taxed every year.

Any business property that you write off, the depreciated value gets taxed. every year. This includes but not limited to. My mowers, trimmers, blowers, rakes, shovels, wheelbarrows, Office furniture, computer, Tools i use to repair my equipment.

dgfitz
06-08-2007, 09:10 PM
Im just wondering. If my mailbox belongs to the federal government, why did I have to purchase it myself?

History, the Post office was initially set up as a one stop building where you
and I went to collect our mail. People wanted a Delivery service, so Congress
authorised funds for that purpose, but you and I would provide the recepticle
or mail box. The provision where the mail box You just paid for became the property of the Federal government was included to provide the Federal government the power of protection to You and I so local Yoyo's would not use
the mail box for political and or business uses, and to provide the Postal Service with a police power to insure Your Mail was resonably protected. In
other words, You and I remand the mail box over to the Post Office after we
purchase it as a fee, in perpetuity, that is, non revocable. The system was invented by Benjamin Franklin, and adopted by the Federal government, and
has been extreemly succcessful.

brucec32
06-08-2007, 09:24 PM
"Section 1725 of Title 18 of the United States Code states that Whoever knowingly and willfully deposits any mailable matter such as statements of accounts, circulars, sale bills, or other like matter, on which no postage has been paid, in any letter box established, approved, or accepted by the Postal Service for the receipt or delivery of mail matter on any mail route with intent to avoid payment of lawful postage thereon, shall for each such offense be fined under this title.

The Domestic Mail Manual (which you can find on the Internet at www.usps.com) goes into more specifics. It states that no part of a mail receptacle may be used to deliver any matter not bearing postage, including items or matter placed upon, supported by, attached to, hung from, or inserted into a mail receptacle"

I guess it would depend, as so many things in the law, on the "interpretation" of the language in the law. The first part above relates to "letter box". So that might be interpreted to mean that attaching something to the post would be ok. The second part refers to a "mail receptacle". Again, does this mean the box or the post or both?

In reality, I'm sure it applies to what your carrier things of it. If he doesn't care, nothing happens I'd assume. I've never used them, but if I needed the work I would just take the time to hang them on doors near my existing accounts.

The reason the law is such is that the USPS wants to retain its monopoly on first class mail. If you could find someone to deliver stuff for less than $.41/house then they'd be losing revenue.

DiyDave
06-08-2007, 09:38 PM
I would take the competition's fliers and stick them in the mailbox, but he would have had to do something mighty mean to me first. I used to take just one of each of the competition's fliers, to keep a file of the competition, Problem is that if you call any of the numbers on a 2 or 3 year old flier, 90 % of 'em ain't in business anymore, so why bother!:laugh: :laugh:

SEALAWNMANAGEMENT
06-08-2007, 11:56 PM
The only problems I have ever heard someone having is if they put them in the mailbox or put them where it got in the mailmans way. I got a call from the paper delivery man because I put flyers in the paper box this spring.
I think he was just trying to get me to pay him to stick it in the paper because he called back a few minutes later and offered to do so.

Ramairfreak98ss
06-09-2007, 12:41 AM
Do you guys put the flyers in the mail box or on the flag. Im scared to open someones mailbox, so I put it on the flag or in the paperbox.

i put them all on the flag, a few i "get away with" sticking them in the mailboxes because the high end houses dont use flags or real boxes. They have built in boxes into brick/stone work in pillars and such at the end of their driveways. Sometimes i pinch it between the front door of the box but not IN the box.. I figure if 5 out of 100 i have to put in the box ive never been bothered locally for that. But mainly its after the mailman has already gone around i toss it in with their other mail.

Ramairfreak98ss
06-09-2007, 12:45 AM
So, I'm curious what you told the guy when he went to hand you your flyers back.

I'd be pretty pissed, and maybe inform him that I will consider calling the police on him because he is stealing out of people's newspaper boxes.

What a f'in hack.

lol, well at first i didnt realize he took them out until he was walking up to me... He didnt seem too much like he was all bent out of shape but he had some kind of attitude about it to say the least. he said "here you can have these back if you want"... i took them and said, "oh thanks" confused for a second and then he said "these are already taken care of" lol so he was cutting probably 5 of them but still, im sure he knew how was i supposed to know he was doing all 5 and not just the one i saw him on? Next time i should ring the bell lol.

I too wouldnt go and take them out of peoples mailboxes even if i saw someone put them there.. I usually pick one up to look it over to see which company it is or whatever just out of curiosity but its just weird that its more worth his time to take them out than to just pass out his own flyers or whatever.

Ramairfreak98ss
06-09-2007, 12:47 AM
Yes, and yes. Also it is illegal to attach anything to the mailbox, or use
the mail box for any other reason except to forward or recieve mail. The
actual wording of the law is more precise and detailed, but the clear reasonable
meaning is that mailboxes belong to the Federal government. If you have
doubts, check with your Licensed Attorney At Law for advise.


Ive heard this before too, im sure its true. Locally many companies stick cards or something inmailbox flags... no one gets hassled so thats good i guess.

If the mailbox belongs to the federal gobernments... can i get a reimbursement check this year for my $29.99 lowes mailbox i had to PAY for?:clapping:

justanotherlawnguy
06-11-2007, 01:39 AM
I pull other LCO fliers off my customers doors whenever I see them. Luckily I work in areas that are "no soliciting" so Its not usually a problem. Sometimes homeowners show them to me.

The other day a customer walks out to show me a flier he got offering him $50/month for service when I charge $100/month.

Customers know that its a B.S. flier from a B.S. company when those guys come through and try to undercut everybody...

Stillwater
06-11-2007, 03:03 AM
putting flyers in a USPS mail box is a federal offence

KTO Enterprises
06-11-2007, 09:15 AM
putting flyers in a USPS mail box is a federal offence

Thanks for pointing that out. If you have read half the posts you would have seen that that has already been discussed.

HFS
06-11-2007, 11:10 PM
It could be worse. I was mowing a lawn a few weeks back for a homeowner when he's out of town for work. (About twice a month.) I look up and see another LOC truck pull up and a guy gets out and takes a digital picture and writes down the street number. He was back in the truck before I could even lower the rpm's. That would'nt of been such a big deal but the guy does the same thing less than an hour later at another site I'm working. That time I tried to get the name of the company, but what a surprize to see no labeling on the truck and/or trailer. What a joke. LATER...