Highest profit margin in this business

[dmk395]

Of all the types of landscaping work, which do you think has the highest profit margin and why? maintenance, pesticide, heavy equipment etc?

[lawnboy82]

As far as I know spraying and granular apps are gonna hold the best profits.

[dmk395]

Thats exactly what I was thinking, guess I shall go for my applicators license soon.

[lawnboy82]

Yes, it is probably the highest regulated part of this business, but it is also the most profitable.

[turfman99]

Applications do have very high margins and you can crank out a lot of work in a short period of time, keeping your costs down.

The following are services my business provides to commercial and residentail clients. You will note that we do no mowing, edging, and only specialty pruning. All these services yield me better than a 65% to 120% gross margin and all time is 100% billable. Some of these services require a little hiigher experience level than a beginning business, but it is agood way to start heading.

Commercial and Residentail Fertilizer Service. Push and ATV spreaders.

Commercial and Residential Spray Service - backpack, ATV and towbehind sprayers.

Sprinkler System Repair and Maintenance. Startup, shutdown, backflow testing. We make good money on this.

Organic Fertilizer Service and SoilBuilding Programs.

Water Feature and Pond Maintenance. Another good money maker.

Pasture Management Servcie. Spray, aeration and fertilizer. Aerations done with tow behind aerator and ATV.

Sports Field Fertilizer, Spray and Aerations. I did the local high school for free 4 times this summer and it looks great. 3000 people will see it every week for 12 weeks and my free bannner on the grandstand for donating the services.

Future Plans: Aeravator AE 40 and some type of large area overseeder and a Ryan or Claussen walkbehind overseeder for ov erseeding and lawn renovations.

My son has a seperate mowing business that he provides mowing services with and we work on the same properties. He makes good money with just mowing and edging services. None of his equipment is owned by me, though, he has all that.

[Mike Paulsen]

turfman, do you mean blowing out the sprinkler systems when you say shut down? I wouldn't have guess the need in the Portland area. I would have to say granular app. and sprinkler system services for us.

[MATTHEW]

Lawn apps-no doubt! I can do 3 times the production dollars
that maintenance brings.Just add it up for instance, let's say a solo guy can make 250.00 in 8 hrs of mowing. You can do $850.00
doing apps. But the problem with that is that you need to be able to inspect the lawn-fertilize-treat weeds/insects-fill out paperwork
required by law. A new guy to the business will take much longer than a guy that has made over 40,000 treatments, but even if he took twice as long to do that, $425.00 everyday is a nice prize!:blob1:

[1MajorTom]

425.00 everyday is a nice prize!

I'm almost afraid to say this in fear that I am going to come across snotty, high-n-mighty, and stuck-up.

But $425.00 a day is not good money. I at one time in the beginning thought I would be thrilled to be making $425.00 a day. Now I don't blink an eye at that. That just won't get us by. We work 8 months out of the year, and if that is all we brought home we would be in the shelter come winter time.

$425.00, that does not cover your expenses. And I'm assuming all money is turned in, taxes paid, etc.

Do the math, multiply that by 5 days, then by the number of weeks in a month, then by the number of months you are able to work according to the weather. That is your GROSS income.
Then what exactly is your NET?

I TOTALLY agree though. Fertilizing is where the money can be made. Now if you're talking about being in the ballpark of $850.00, as stated above, now that's better. At least for now for us it is.

Uh oh, I better re-clarify. $425.00 a day is not good money for us and for people that do this FULL TIME and have no other means of income and have a family to raise.

I guess it all depends upon your situation what is good and what isn't.

[cp]

My feelings are hurt.:( :mad:

[Allyn]

Well I was in the spray business. Well work for a friend. There is a lot of liability to it. I personally was around the chemical crap for 9 years. We use to call Pre M agent orange.
I make more money doing lawns cut, trim and edge than anything I have done. For the amount of hours it is hard to beat.

Plus some of those chemcial can stay in your system for awhile. If you need to put fert. use a pellet. But fert. is the least of the problem. It is the 2 4 D and insecticide.

What I was recommending to my customer in SL. Was have Chemlawn come and spray in the spring. That way you get all the product. Then cancel at the first of the summer. The summer mix is the big return for the money. Usually only Urea. But the spring mix has Urea, 2 4 D, pre m, iron, and other micor nutrents.

Allyn:blob2: :angel:

[Allyn]

More to this: You will not be able to work out of your home. You will need to fix a way not to get back flow of chemcial in the drinking water when you fill.
A big one is getting the accounts. Cutting is something that someone needs to do every week until snow. But fert. you go every 6 to 8 weeks.

Allyn

[Lawn-Scapes]

Jodi,

You are speaking for two of you... right?

As a solo operator $425 per day would be decent money to me... because I'm not quite there..... yet :)

[David Gretzmier]

lessee- 425 /day. * 5 days= 2125 per wek. 4.3 weeks per month, * 8= 34 weeks. 34 * 2125 approx. 72,000. cost of equipment- spray rig 2500, comm push spreader, 350, used pickup. 10000, My cost of goods ratio average on my apps, 18%- so 12,500 or so, insurance, 1000. 1st year 72000-2500-350-10000-12500=bout 43000, for 8 months work? 2nd year 50000+ ? even figuring uniforms and gas and taxes that aint bad money. I can do about 850-1000 per day in apps, but not enough clients to go full time from round to round yet. also Route density is KING. if you can do two or more in one nieghborhood like the big folks you could do 1500 per day with motorized spreader. I know a guy near here does close to 300 g's by himself a year in apps. he look pretty tired though. and kinda wrinkly. and coughs funny. and talk funny too. Dave g

[lbmd1]

I am basically the only one doing organic apps in my area and charge an average of $65-70 app for 5-7500 sq ft lawns. I do about 15 in a 1/2 day, grossing about $1000 by myself. I've got about 45 accounts so far, but like someone stated, it's only done 5 times a year. Secondly, my most profitable and most hated is snowplowing. I gross about $1500 in about 7 hours on my route, roughly $200 hr with no labor but myself. Every year I swear I'm going to get out of plowing, but it's a necessary evil up north here.

Mike

[dmk395]

Seems like the net profit is quite high for fert apps. Anyone have luck with bobcat work?

[Eric ELM]

Aerating has a nice profit margin also. I've heard other members say the same thing.

[AltaLawnCare]

I don't know, but I'll bet te most least profitable is mowing.

I gotta agree with TSG, if my math is right, thats almost 70,000 gross per year. If the business is realtively new, then that 's not bad.

I would think the most profit is in what ever is in the most demand and fewer people can provide.

[TGCummings]

$425/day cutting lawns solo isn't a bad take, but Jodi's right in that it depends on your situation and where you live. Around here, we cut 12 months out of the year, so that can be good money. However, if I met that goal this year then next year I'd want more. ;)

-TGC

[HBFOXJr]

On an annual basis, my material costs for my program of 6 apps (non-organic) runs from 20% on small jobs to 53% on large jobs. I hit materials equal to 50% of sales around 35K in size. My jobs run from 2K to 25 acres, but average is 11.5K for residential. That average size will average annual material costs of 31.6%. Also included in the material cost is 10% for material overage and/or price changes.

I hear and read industry numbers of 20% and less. I can't believe large jobs are being done or application businesses or divisions could run on those low numbers.

Maybe those percentages are of company sales including non material things like aeration or specialty apps like fungicide, etc. where margins are higher. Maybe mowing and other things are included if job costing is not used.

What's real?

[1MajorTom]

TGCummings,

I couldn't agree with you more. $425.00 a day is good money working 12 months out of the year.

$425.00 a day is damn good money if you are have a full time job or even a part time job for that matter to fall back on.

And $425.00 a day is good money if you have a wife that works and carries the families benefits.

But I am realistic here. Matt here is working his butt off, and he can make $425.00 a day easily working 7 hours a day by himself if need be. BUT add me to the equation, and I can bring up the gross, and then add in that he will drop me off at 4:00/5:00 and go back out to work in the evening sometimes. That is how we make more along with a really condensed route. BUT, how long can this go on? Eventually Matt will burn out. SO, that is why we know that this pace can not continue forever. We have to make changes.

That's why this is a good thread. It gives people a general idea of where the high profit is. And mowing in my opinion is not the highest, unless you constantly want to work your butt off.

[cleancutdude]

Hight profit margin is up to your self .
I can easy make £40 UK a hour with an 18" push mower

[1MajorTom]

£40 UK a hour

How much is that U.S. dollars?

[David Gretzmier]

last I checked the pound was about 1.65 dollars. 65 bucks an hour w/ 18" push? sign me up! of course, over there, milk is 4 bucks a liter and gas( petro ) runs 4-5 bucks per gallon. or is it liter? Dave g

[cleancutdude]

A high profit margin is up to you
I can easy make £40 U.K. with my 18" etasia pse push mower
It's simple charge more for less grass

[cleancutdude]

sorry about the double posting
The going rate for a ride on mower is also £40
Can't see the point in buying one

[MATTHEW]

I am not even close to burnt out! BUT, I must admit that I do not have enough treatment accounts right now to do $425 every day of the month. And in actuality, when doing my treatments, I usually put in 3 days and my gross is $3300. That is $1100 per day subtract chem. costs= $3000.00. But I work like a machine. I have made over 40,000 applications since 1989. Now, if I can do these numbers 5 days a week, the gross should be around $200,000. Which is about the $$$ I produced every year for.......
Well, OK I will admit it. I worked for Chemlawn. Please don't hate me. I learned my lesson. I learned how to run a business and how NOT to! :blush:

[hustlers]

matt
how big are your average yards and how many can you
do in a day.
Im only 20 but just got my pesticide licsences for lawns
trees, and shubs and for fertilizing
What spreader do you use and what do you use
for spraying and how much was the unit.
I looking to go mostly organic but I could use any help
you have cause the only reason im doing this is
im sick of chemlawn messing up my yards.
thanks

[Nathan]

There are definitely some very highly profitable tasks out there in our feild. The only thing that most don't think about is that none offer consistent income, unless you have a huge customer base. Let's say you do 20 fert apps. per day 5 days per week, usually on a 10 week rotation. You would need 1000 accounts to work full time! I know there are some of you out there saying why work full time if you can make reasonable money at part time, but I don't think a true entrepreneur can accept sitting on their butt.

As far as profitability, I think that aeration would have to be king in my sales area. Average $/hour is about 150. The only problem is that so many joes have seen that they can go out and rent a machine, throw some flyers and make quick cash with almost no expense, so we only market the service to our current customers.

[Mowingman]

dmk395,
I was going to get a bobcat and get into that type of work along with my mowing business. However, around here, everyone and their brother has got one now and hourly rates being qouted are less than I get for mowing. I am sure glad I didn't invest in one. Rental rates are pretty cheap on bobcats here. I line up 2 or 3 jobs and then rent one for a day or two. I still make better money on mowing.:(

[HOMER]

425.00 a day would be great here in south alabama.

I work hard enough now, don't want to die too young trying to keep up with the Jones's.

There ain't but one of me, wish I could dabble in everything out there but I take one day at a time, right now I'm mowing, next year we'll see.

I used to make a little over $100.00 a day at the factory and got by with that, I think I'll make it on my new and improved salary.

[TJLC]

Homer took the words right out of my mouth! I don't make ANYWHERE NEAR what guys up north are making, but we are doing fine. My wife works and carries the benifits, which is a big deal. We have just about everything we want and need.I think it's not how much you make, but what you do with what you make. Hats off to you guys up north for being able to make that kind of money.

[MATTHEW]

Hustlers: If I do 35 $30.00 apps a day the numbers add up. But, that is one long, hard day. Right now I use a Lesco spreader ($350.00) And a trailer-mounted spray unit from C&S in N. Canton ($3,000) It is a slower way to do it-that is double walking the lawns, but that is what I will use until I get over 300 accounts, then I will probably add a Permagreen ($4,000)
In our area, most every LCO goes on a 6-8 week interval. And then there's grub controls and aerations,limes,ect. Plenty to keep us busy.

[Stonewall]

This is a great thread and very enlightening. I had begun to suspect that spraying and fertilizing was more profitable than mowing, which is mostly what I do. I hope to study up on this over the winter. Do any of you use soil samples with your spraying programs?

I noticed that most of the folks that do spraying/granular apps on a 6-8 week schedule live up north. Do any of you southern guys do this? I don't know anybody in my area that does this. Does it have to do with the type of turf you're working with?

[dmk395]

Just curious if anyone has any names of books on what type of chemicals to put down when, or if certain types of weeds pop up?

[Guido]

off anything but apps, there's something wrong. Small equipment work has its share of gold to be gotten. So does specialized work like Eric said, i.e. Aerating, De-Thatching, hydroseeding, etc.

Look into some different avenues and play with the numbers a bit.

Don't get me wrong, there is great money in apps and I understand that, but it shouldn't be that far out front that its the only thing thats been spoken of in two pages of this thread.

[paul]

I think Guido is right you are all looking at it from a solo operating standpoint, a crew of three men installing hardscapes should do $3000 per day, using others formulas thats $516,000 a year after payroll and material you should be taking home $150K of that! equipment expenses are higher but it will last a lot longer than any mower or other equipment you can buy. Expand your horizons!

[MATTHEW]

$150,000 is OK but you said the equipment expenses are higher. I used to produce $250,000 per year, by myself with a Lawncare Co. that I was employed with. The Chem costs were 10%. They are a bit higher for us unless we can buy 50 tons and keep it in stock. But If a solo guy can produce $1000.00 per day, every day (5 days a week) that is $5,000 a week. $20,000 a month. X 10 months = $200,000
$1,000 a day is 33 lawns a day at $33.00 a piece.
The thing about lawncare apps is that they are scheduled and basically guaranteed (x5) with every sale. With hardscaping, there is the need to sell a lot of jobs as most customers get one job and that's it. You need to advertise and sell to new customers. Lawncare customers tend to stay on the service for MANY years. No more sales time/ money needed.

[paul]

So you need 1525 customers to make $250K in gross sales were as I need 51 customers to do my $510K in sales (limiting) me to a 10K sales for each one. That $10K is a 650 sq ft patio and walk way or a 285 face ft wall or combo of both. I need to find only 51 customers Vs your 1525 ! Y,es yours are a longer lasting customer but the amount of calls you need to generate that is much larger than I need. And as with any service business you will lose customers, where as I need to satisfy mine one time, you need to do this 5 times. I don't need to have special wash stations for my chemicals or heavy reporting of chems. plus posting and notification.

As with all businesses there are trade offs, I'm just saying there are other avenues that have a better return than mowing!

[curlawngreen]

Matthew can you tell us your total schedule from start time to stop time. pickup material, load truck, reload truck, reload water, do paper work , record wind, humidoty, etc.
Thanks Tim.

[SprinklerGuy]

Sorry so late...was doing a search and found this thread...that search thing is very informative......

Sprinkler Repair and Installation is very profitable here in the desert. One repairman does about 400-450 per day, that is labor fees plus the profit on parts. obviously all of our companies will "net out differently" but, 2 repairman,,,,,900 and so on and so on. ]

I am looking into apps as well only differently. I only want to fertilize shrubs and trees. This way I will not get into the LCO's pockets. Don't bite the hand that feeds you!!!

See my other post........plant fertilization

[scagman]

Im 18 been a lawn service for one year not into big landscape yet just flowerbeds and whatnot I always find myself talking to family and friends about my new buisness and just about every time they say " what you need to do is get into landscaping theres more money in that then cutting grass" yes that may be true but cutting grass is steady

[Runner]

You have to understand, thst Mathew is basing his $1000 days with that many customers on $33. an application. Here, we don't even have $33. applications, so it takes much lessstops. Our average, for a standard subdivision lot, is between 50 and 70 bucks. I can pull all my equipment over to a job, drop my $10,000 mower, mow it, trim it, and blow it all off, taking me about 30 to 40 minutes (to do it right) and I have made my 35-40 bucks, minus fuel I ran through the machine. THEN, I can unload my $350 spreader, put in a bag and a half (12 bucks worth) of material, (and that's heavy, I apply at 20 instead of the recommended 15 on the setting) and put this fert down. NOW, I have just done a $60 dollar application. Let's do the math. $60 in, $12 out. That leaves me $48. I just made this in about 10 minutes. (just over) And I didn't even burn any gas doing it! (except a little to blow off the driveway) No $10,000 mower, no fuel burnt, no trimming, and the customers are happy, because they are getting so much more of a better program than they could get anywhere else! And I'M off to the next job! Sure, it takes a bit more of a client base, but for 32 to 36 cuts a year, to 6 apps. a year, you only need 6 times the amount of customers as mowing customers and you're going to make aLOT more money! (Less customers to make the same) And this is, of course NOT including your insecticides, and/or any other specialties that may be needed. And yes, you are in a GREAT position to sell aerations, seedings and such. No equipment breakdowns, no parts, etc. What can go wrong with a spreader!? As I said before in another thread; CLTG made 12.5 million in my county last year. I want a slice of that pie! It's a regular thing, it's established, and all spelled out for you in black & white. All I know, is this thing is REALLY taking off for me! And Matthew, I'll be dog-goned if I'm gonna wait until I have 300 accounts before I get a Perma-green!lol! I can't afford to lose that much weight!:blob4:

[strickdad]

we only have about 15 or 20 regular fert apps a year and the rates run anywhere from 45 to 120.00 dollars per app. now this is not bad money to time spent. but the post was about the highest profit margins, and our highest profit comes from cleaning gutters. now we dont do a whole lot of them (60 per yr.aprox.) but we have a 50.00 dollar min. and rates run from 1 to 4 dollars a foot depending on complexity. in all cases we are in the 100.00 dollar per man hour range or more. we use a 350.00 dollar backpack blower and a 250.00 ladder and a 15.00 dollar wallmart garden hose.( to flush downspouts... customer supplied water) next most profitable for us would be tree work. the moral to this is the profits get high when our feet leave the ground......

[Mowin4cash]

This $450.00 seems to have ruffled a few feathers. I am a solo operator who does pay all taxes, ins, and certified for chem. My wife is a stay at home mom. If I could make $450.00 a day, 5 days a week, no one would be happier. I just don't need to make payments on a $45,000.00 truck, or have to have a $200,000.00 house. Learn to live on less, and you'll end up working less, and enjoying your family more.

[Albemarle Lawn]

Its not what you make but what you keep. This must be a lawnsite secret...what one keeps.

[Ric]

Landscape Installation