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LandscapeMember
08-08-2007, 10:34 AM
I am not a big fan of placing pavers on top of concrete... I normally place one inch of concrete sand, then proceed as normal when dealing with existing concrete.

I have a customer who wants their concrete patio which is only a year old (25 x 30 = 750 square feet) topped with pavers... his concrete guy said it would be cheaper to get the concrete pad and in the future get pavers on top. Interesting line of thinking. His concrete steps are another problem... I have to deal with them too.

I want to price this accordingly... Do you have any thoughts of a good price. My paver pricing depends on the job, I do not square foot price, but was thinking for this job, $8.50 - $9.00 a square foot would be fair. (this includes all materials and labor). They are requesting EP Henry Brickstone... The concrete is in great shape.

Do you see any problems this customer will have in the future? With concrete moving/cracking?. The house is less then 2 years old and the ground still may be settling. I have only done a couple jobs with pavers over concrete and this will be the biggest one yet.

MILSINC
08-08-2007, 11:47 AM
just don't guarantee it. tell them why. do the job, get paid when it needs to be repaired (and it will).

zedosix
08-08-2007, 01:13 PM
I would just bond the pavers to the border of the patio and install the rest as normal. Place my sand and away you go. Even if the patio cracks I think it would be an easy fix. Another way would be to bond a thicker stone to the outside edge and place a small amount of sand then pavers. This way there is some room for adjustment in the future if required.

neversatisfiedj
08-08-2007, 01:17 PM
Just screed 3'4 inch sand in the field. Install and glue 3" PAVERS FOR BORDER. hAVE FUN ;)

senatorcongressman
08-08-2007, 03:59 PM
Zedo6, NSJosh and all... If you bond the border course and dry-lay the field do you need to provide weep holes in the border course or some other way for rain water to escape? Or do you rely on the poly sand in the joints to direct head flow off the patio?

neversatisfiedj
08-08-2007, 04:38 PM
take a 12 inch wide piece of soil seperation matting (marafi) and put between the pavers and concrete before you screed sand. Ohh and yeah run your PL glue for the border course parallel to your soldier brick for drainage.

Drew Gemma
08-08-2007, 06:14 PM
glue them all then poly sand I just looked at a job where they glued border then laid the rest on sand bed it all washed out over time less than one year

neversatisfiedj
08-08-2007, 06:22 PM
It won't wash out if you use fabric as I suggested. Say pricipal applies to a pavement butting to a seating wall. If you don't contain the sand with fabric, it WILL wash out. You could certainly use poly as well .

zedosix
08-08-2007, 06:28 PM
glue them all then poly sand I just looked at a job where they glued border then laid the rest on sand bed it all washed out over time less than one year

What washed out? The sand?

Use a good read (expensive) polymeric xp sand and like neversatisfied says run the glue parallel with the brick to let the water seep out. There should not be any problems with that method. When I first started bonding to concrete back in the days of "stonebond" we used to bond every brick to the porch, what a job that was. Now we bond just the border and there really are no problems.

senatorcongressman
08-09-2007, 12:31 PM
take a 12 inch wide piece of soil seperation matting (marafi) and put between the pavers and concrete before you screed sand. Ohh and yeah run your PL glue for the border course parallel to your soldier brick for drainage.

Does this sketch roughly represent what you describe?

(Notes: Green=soldier pavers, blue-gray=field pavers, blue=glue, black=fabric, brown=existing grade and joint sand is not shown)

I recently replaced a concrete patio with a larger clay paver one, but the walk to the front of the house is in decent shape, so I was planning to lay right over it (once the weather cools off a bit :dizzy: )

neversatisfiedj
08-09-2007, 12:34 PM
You got it. You put that filter fabric there and you will lose NO sand. Remember your border"soldier" bricks will be thicker to make up the difference between you field 2 3/8" brick and 3/4" sand.

senatorcongressman
08-10-2007, 11:42 AM
The sketch I drew didn't show it, but I am using 4x8 clay pavers (2 1/4 thick, no lugs, Glen-Gery 26-HB). My plan previously was to bed the border course (soldier) in mortar which would elevate it enough to allow for a 1/2 - 3/4" sand bed in the field. Weep holes in the mortar bed every 4 bricks. Using "glue" I suppose I could lay the border course on edge (soldier or double sailor) but that means a 1 3/4" sand bed. On the other hand, this path slopes quite a bit, with steps on either end, and I still worry about sand washout along the run. The joint sand in the sloping path I did in the backyard has mostly washed out to the face of the pavers on the downhill side. Granted the joints are a little on the big side and filled with concrete sand, (this is before I leared about poly-sand from folks @this site). I'll be re-laying this in the fall or spring with tighter joints and poly-sand.

Then again I may just wet-lay the whole thing. Thanks for all your hints.

mrusk
08-10-2007, 04:54 PM
I do not know why you guys are worried about sand wash out? If you are so worried, glue the boarder on then put some concrete on the outside of it.

LandscapeMember
08-11-2007, 12:26 PM
Thank you for the replies and ideas. SenatorCongessman made a great sketch. I actually have to extend one area about 10 more feet and make a small wall. I will use the glue method as detailed in the sketch.

Do you think my quote of $8.50-$9.00 is fair? This will be a great job for October.