Why do you guys buy Brand New Trucks?

[zz4guy]

You loose so much money driving off the lot. I can't figure it out. I've considered it myself. I could get the financing, but... why?? Doesn't make sense to me.

It would be nice to have the warranties, but I can pay for a lot of service after I save 50% of $35000.

Anybody want to explain the new truck reasoning to me?

[Bandit 1]

that new truck smell

[Raven386]

for me, i know no one else beat on the truck. dont have to worry if someone did the maintenance on it. apperance has a lot to do with it too. people see it everyday i wouldnt want a old beat up truck blowing smoke and backfiring in front my house. but most importantly, were in the truck 8 hours a day, i want to be comfortable.

[nobagger]

I looked high and low for a nice used truck a few years old, problem was they all wanted just about new truck prices. The one that stands out the most is, I went to look at a 2004 F250SD xlt 4x4 it was nice and clean,had around 70,000 for mileage....asking price was around 22-24000.00;) there were several more I looked at before I bought a new one. I paid 31k for a brand new F250SD xlt. Plus I plow for some very nice places and being the only one who plowed them I needed something dependable not some one's old headache.

[Raven386]

well, buying a new ford is just kinda pointless... its going to breakdown no matter if its new or old :laugh:

[haybaler]

for me, i know no one else beat on the truck. dont have to worry if someone did the maintenance on it. apperance has a lot to do with it too. people see it everyday i wouldnt want a old beat up truck blowing smoke and backfiring in front my house. but most importantly, were in the truck 8 hours a day, i want to be comfortable.

so, wait, when do you work??

[Petr51488]

for me, i know no one else beat on the truck. dont have to worry if someone did the maintenance on it. apperance has a lot to do with it too. people see it everyday i wouldnt want a old beat up truck blowing smoke and backfiring in front my house. but most importantly, were in the truck 8 hours a day, i want to be comfortable.

Exaccccctly what i was going to say. You don't know how the last person drove it before you. You know when you buy new (99.9%) you get a new truck with 0 problems to worry about for at least 3 years (warranty) You take care of your truck, and it will take care of you.

[zz4guy]

I was looking for a used early 90s 3/4 ton and most dealers wanted $4-6k with 100k+ miles. Why is it so bad to get something like that? You could buy two trucks for that price and have a back up.

Eventually I found a 92 K2500 4x4 w/a new paint job for $2200 from a private owner. The A/C doesn't work, but other than that I've had zero problems since I bought it.

[JB1]

because I want to and I can.

[TWUllc]

Peace of mind, & can afford to do so.

[Lawnworks]

To me buying used is best way to reaching my financial goals. I would rather build my wealth and buy used trucks then spend alot of money on a depreciating assets. I buy 10-15k used trucks that give my virtually no problems, and I always have a back-up on the yard. I also find great deals on my trucks, so when it is time to replace them every few years I don't lose but a few thousand dollars. It is less stressful going into winter w/ virtually no payments.

[GravelyGuy]

I looked high and low for a nice used truck a few years old, problem was they all wanted just about new truck prices. The one that stands out the most is, I went to look at a 2004 F250SD xlt 4x4 it was nice and clean,had around 70,000 for mileage....asking price was around 22-24000.00;) there were several more I looked at before I bought a new one. I paid 31k for a brand new F250SD xlt. Plus I plow for some very nice places and being the only one who plowed them I needed something dependable not some one's old headache.


31K:confused: For your Diesel?

[TXNSLighting]

his is a gasser

[PlatinumLandCon]

I'm all about used trucks. Until you get to a point where you've saved more than enough for retirement, paid off equipment and have cash on hand, I'd never buy a new truck. It sure is nice to have a new vehicle (my uncle just bought an '08 CTS... wow) but financial goals are more important to me than new car smell or other BS.

Also, you can get a '00-'02 truck with <100k for $12-15k. What's wrong with that for a work truck? Its different for you that use your truck as personal too though.

[Lawnworks]

My wife drives a 02 Tundra quad cab v8 4x4 w/ 65k miles that I paid 12.5k for. It is in pristine condition as well. I don't really see a need for new trucks even for personal use.

[TheYardBoys]

my dad gave me my firsrt truck its a 78 gmc and its coming apart only thing holding it together is the paint. but in my oppion it is better. Because some of the work that i do requires me to drive in some pretty wooded areas and there are always limbs scratching the pain. Well for me if i spend 20 or 30 k for a vehicle i dont want it to get scratched but for my old pick up i could run it into a tree and i wouldnt care. And for me that is why i would pick an old truck. And for the fellow that said he spends 8 hours a day in truck. Well then when do you mow. Because for me i spend maybe an hour a day in a truck but i mow big yard that takes a lot of time.

[mrusk]

The thing is, new trucks are less likely to break down then used. Lets say i send my 3 amigos out to a job site 50 miles away from the shop and they break down some where along the way. Chances are my day is going to be inconviences, and chances are my amigos will get no work done that day. So there is atleast 2k of lost revenue. Only takes a couple of those break downs to make a used vehicle cost more than new.

[task125]

I buy new because Its just me and my kid,I use it for work and play,I know no one beat on it ,warrenty for 100,000 and They had 0% financing

[DRM Ventures]

I bought a 1 yr old Dodge 2500, CTD, it had 21,000 miles on it when I got it.... It was in great shape, althought the bed had seen some use. I paid $29k for it, but I use as my personal vehicle also. The new 06's were $38K+ at the time.......I consider that a significant savings. I plow by myself also and wanted a reliable vehicle. It has 43,000 miles on it now......no problems......

I don't know that I will ever buy new again.......there are so many good 1-2 yr old vehicles out there........

[LB1234]

For us its really quite simple. First, we can't afford the downtime. Second, we don't have the knowledge nor time to fix things that are ineveitably going to break (sooner rather than later).

Every hour that I'm not running is an hour I'm not bringing in any money.

[greensway]

http://www.lawnsite.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=92391&stc=1&d=1193702600

All the deals and financing specials this year, could'nt pass up the chance - almost a two for one special!

All kidding aside, how much would you pay for any running truck at midnight when your old truck just died & 3 inches of snow on the ground with 4 or 5 more by morning?

Lose 1 account and it would have paid for the difference - plus sleep a lot better not worrying if that old tree in the backyard will be able to support another engine swap!

[PlatinumLandCon]

http://www.lawnsite.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=92391&stc=1&d=1193702600

All the deals and financing specials this year, could'nt pass up the chance - almost a two for one special!

All kidding aside, how much would you pay for any running truck at midnight when your old truck just died & 3 inches of snow on the ground with 4 or 5 more by morning?

Lose 1 account and it would have paid for the difference - plus sleep a lot better not worrying if that old tree in the backyard will be able to support another engine swap!

If you can snipe a good 2.9% or less financing deal and cash rebates etc, a new truck is a good deal. It all depends on your financial status and your business' status. Run the numbers and you'll get a no-nonsense decision.

BTW, those trucks are BEAUTIES!

[greensway]

Also helps out that I got my father-in-laws "D Plan" pricing for both plus incentives & rebates.

:usflag:

[Lawnworks]

The thing is, new trucks are less likely to break down then used. Lets say i send my 3 amigos out to a job site 50 miles away from the shop and they break down some where along the way. Chances are my day is going to be inconviences, and chances are my amigos will get no work done that day. So there is atleast 2k of lost revenue. Only takes a couple of those break downs to make a used vehicle cost more than new.

So a used truck w/ 50k miles is not reliable? And new trucks never have problems? What happens when the new truck breaks down and there isn't one sitting at the shop?

[Rons Rightway Lawncare]

well, buying a new ford is just kinda pointless... its going to breakdown no matter if its new or old :laugh:
ain't that the truth!

[Rons Rightway Lawncare]

I bought a 1 yr old Dodge 2500, CTD, it had 21,000 miles on it when I got it.... It was in great shape, althought the bed had seen some use. I paid $29k for it, but I use as my personal vehicle also. The new 06's were $38K+ at the time.......I consider that a significant savings. I plow by myself also and wanted a reliable vehicle. It has 43,000 miles on it now......no problems......

I don't know that I will ever buy new again.......there are so many good 1-2 yr old vehicles out there........

It comes down to the fact that many people who have the money coming in, and good credit needed to qualify for a new truck... Well many of these people would prefer to drive a new truck, over a used one, especially a used one that is obviously used - with scratches, dents, dings, and mechanical problems of some sort or another.

For some people, a $300 or even $900 a month payment is not a big deal.

as for me, I would love to buy used.... If I could walk onto a dealer lot, find a one year old truck that still have a years worth of warranty milage left on it, and could get it for 10 grand less than a new one then I would buy it in a heart beat.

According to this guy, he saved 9 grand by buying a used truck. But what he paid for his used truck and what a new truck would have cost after rebates and negotiations may have been much different.

What I have found is for a one or two year old used truck, compared to a discounted new truck, there is little price difference. Not enough difference to not be worth paying the little extra and getting the satisfaction of knowing you were the first and only owner of this vehicle and not to mention new vehicles always get a better interest rate over used ones....

If you can find a private owner that needs to sell badly, you can score a good deal on a used truck. And if you shop long and hard enough, you might find a good deal on a used truck that has under 100 thousand miles and is priced low. But here lately, these are rare finds.

[TXNSLighting]

http://www.lawnsite.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=92391&stc=1&d=1193702600

All the deals and financing specials this year, could'nt pass up the chance - almost a two for one special!

All kidding aside, how much would you pay for any running truck at midnight when your old truck just died & 3 inches of snow on the ground with 4 or 5 more by morning?

Lose 1 account and it would have paid for the difference - plus sleep a lot better not worrying if that old tree in the backyard will be able to support another engine swap!

wow...you got both them dam trucks!! hate to see your payments. but great lookin trucks!

I much prefer buying new but since i dont like the new emmisions crap on diesels, i cant buy a new one! danget! So im looking for a nice 07 with very very low miles. Also at certain times brand new ones can be as cheap as one year old ones. especially when they take their 10,000 bucks off! and 2.9% intrest. thats what i got with mine when it was new!

[LawnBoy89]

Nice...your going to regret having that V-10 when you have that 6.4L twin turbo diesel...

Theres a lot of different methods that people choose when buying vehicles. Either you can buy brand new and sell it a couple years later and get a good amount of your money back, or you can buy a used, I mean USED, truck and run it to the ground so what it cost you would be the same as the money you lost from buying the new truck and selling it.

Or you can go right in the middle and buy a pre-owned one with a good warranty. At the beginning of this year I bought a MINT 2002 F-350 Lariat with the V-10, which whoever is considering getting I would definetly recomend diesel just because of how much gas it burns. It only have 35K miles on it so instead of paying almost $40k for it brand new I got it for $22k OTD and to me it's just as good as a new truck. It's actually so nice that I'm going to stop working with it this week and put my F-250 back on the road so I don't have to get the new one dirty.

If I had a large enough company where I had people driving my trucks, I really don't know if I would get brand new, I guess it makes sense either way. You don't want to spend loads of money buying a brand new truck to have other people drive around in and beat on (let's face it no one is going to treat anything like its their own), but at the same time most of what they break will be covered under the warranty so it won't be coming out of your pocket when the tranny blows on it. It's probably alot easier for most to buy a cheap $10k work truck that will last you a couple years to have your workers use.

[LindblomRJ]

well, buying a new ford is just kinda pointless... its going to breakdown no matter if its new or old :laugh:

ain't that the truth!

So will your dodges and chevrolet's. So whats your point?

[Rons Rightway Lawncare]

Ryan, to each his own. I have seen sooooooooooooo many of my friends with Ford trucks have problem after problem with them. In my opinion, fords are good trucks, but have the most problems, especially as the miles add up. Dodge is almost as bad. Chevys have far less problems, especially the 2000 year model and newer Chevys.

[TXNSLighting]

Ryan, to each his own. I have seen sooooooooooooo many of my friends with Ford trucks have problem after problem with them. In my opinion, fords are good trucks, but have the most problems, especially as the miles add up. Dodge is almost as bad. Chevys have far less problems, especially the 2000 year model and newer Chevys.

now i have never heard that. the dodge has way more problems than any fords. thats a natural fact. theyve never built a decent truck. they got the cummins and thats all theyve got goin for them. Ford and gm are right about equal. Maybe its the different areas. but not to long ago, it was in stone for quality and power: Ford, GM, little red wagons, then dodge...ha! sorry had to do it. but dodge has been last for many a many years. The cummins has kept them in the running.

[zz4guy]

Saying Chevys last longer than fords because "I have a chevy and it hasn't broken" is pretty antedotal.

When I worked at Deere I saw an industry wide Quality study that said the best quality record belonged to Toyota with Chevy/GM next and then Ford, Dodge, Hundai, and all the other foreign jobs.

Deere fell somewhere behind Chevy actually :laugh:

[mrusk]

I always laugh when people base dodge. I am have 57k on my 05 dodge cummins. I have drove from nj to texas in it. I tow a trailer every other day. I use it as a truck. I am hard on it. I have not had 1 single proablem with it.

[Lawnworks]

Well I have one dodge w/ 315k and another w/ 255k, and I run them every single day. Great trucks that built to pull.

[Budget]

Hey Tex,
You mind digging up some natural facts about Dodge. 37000 superdutys 2008 models for fires, 3.6 million cars & trucks for faulty cruise switches.
How many different trucks have you owned to compare to. I have owned them all 2wd, 4 wd, except for a GMC. Do you listen to what your friends tell you about other trucks? Well talk is cheap. I can say that they are all close and all have their problems. Even the new Toyota Tundra, the truck that changes everything has it faults. My truck that cost me the most was 1993 Chevy that i plowed with, bought that with 13000 mile on it great shape, but every thing went wrong with it. Purchased another 1994 Chevy 2500 at a property sale and that truck was a great runner, we put another 90000 on it and sold it.:waving:

[mag360]

now i have never heard that. the dodge has way more problems than any fords. thats a natural fact. theyve never built a decent truck. they got the cummins and thats all theyve got goin for them. Ford and gm are right about equal. Maybe its the different areas. but not to long ago, it was in stone for quality and power: Ford, GM, little red wagons, then dodge...ha! sorry had to do it. but dodge has been last for many a many years. The cummins has kept them in the running.

Here are some trucks that went the distance for me.
1987 Dodge power ram 4x4---231,000 miles on the original 318 v8, original automatic trans, original transfer case and rears.
1990 Dodge power ram 4x4---165,000 miles or so on the original 318 v8, original automatic trans, original transfer case and rears and still going.
1992 Ford F250 4x4---272,000 miles on the original 7.3 diesel (non-powerstroke), rebuilt trans, original transfer case and rears and still going.
1997 Dodge ram 1500---233,000 miles on the original 360 v8---rebuilt trans (the first one lasted to 185,000 miles), original chrysler 9.25 rear and still going.
1999 Dodge ram 2500 4x4---140,000 miles on the cummins diesel, original 47re automatic trans, original transfer case and rears and still towing 7,000-14,000 lbs on a regular basis and plowing year after year.
2003 Dodge ram 3500 srw 4x4---just rolled over to 90,000 miles all original but still a baby. Working regularly.

Id buy another Ford or GM vehicle for the right price. You hear a lot of complaints about Ford heavy duty trucks but there are more out there than any other brand. They all have their issues but no-one thinks their own kid is ugly if you know what I mean.

[Fianolawn]

First of all the best time to buy a new truck is when the next model year comes out. We typically wait until then to make our move that way we get lots of rebates. On the second note it all depends on what type of clients you are dealing with. High end clients typically like to see high end service & professionalism. Our trucks are detailed weekly washed in and out, our employees wear cintas uniforms, all of our equipment is same brand. It all depends on what you want the image of your company to be.

[carcrz]

Less headaches. Warranty covers the initial problems. I know exactly how the truck has been treated. If I didn't plan on keeping it forever, I wouldn't have financed a new truck. It'll be payed off this next year after only 3 years anyways.

[TXNSLighting]

Hey Tex,
You mind digging up some natural facts about Dodge. 37000 superdutys 2008 models for fires, 3.6 million cars & trucks for faulty cruise switches.
How many different trucks have you owned to compare to. I have owned them all 2wd, 4 wd, except for a GMC. Do you listen to what your friends tell you about other trucks? Well talk is cheap. I can say that they are all close and all have their problems. Even the new Toyota Tundra, the truck that changes everything has it faults. My truck that cost me the most was 1993 Chevy that i plowed with, bought that with 13000 mile on it great shape, but every thing went wrong with it. Purchased another 1994 Chevy 2500 at a property sale and that truck was a great runner, we put another 90000 on it and sold it.:waving:

its all from personal experiences, and close friends that i have actually witnessed. and im not saying ford is perfect or gmc. but im in a smaller town and i know many of people in every dealership around here. man when the 6.0's came out you couldnt find any open room in the parking lot for service area...But ive had two dodges, and both have just started falling apart way to early! both of them, both different issues. alota my friends have dodges and the only thing keepin them in em is the cummins. they always say "man if this thing didnt have the cummins it would be so easy to get rid of it." Its all personal experience. i like to see things before i talk bad. and ive seen it all. ive had mostly fords and the biggest problem ive ever had with one was an oil leak. the trucks themselves were beasts. i did a transmission on my 99 super duty because of my lovely 120 hp chip. I was very hard and that truck and it just kept goin. ive also seen many of quality reports online that seem to always put dodge last. All personal experiences and personal opinion.

[TXNSLighting]

o and i love how most dodges look. i think they really build a great looking truck. i just want them to use better parts.

[meets1]

warrenty, new I know what I have. Just a bought a new GMC HD Reg cab with Boss V plow all under 30K - it is an 07.

Looked all over for a good used one but nothing with snow prep, nothing with a reg cab - all being 4 door or ext.

As far as the big three go. i am sticking with chevy for a while. Had all the trucks and the one that failed us badly was dogde-gas engines. Ford was ok but tranny/turbo/injector problems. Currently all Chevy - from an 2003, 2004, 2005, 2006, 2007, 2008 models.

Quality - personal I guess - over all though - I would either being looking at GM product or Ford. My neighbor is a 5 star dodge/chy. dealer and he even says a few "things" about the dodge truck that needs work.

[BrandonV]

i'm trying leasing right now. leasing a f750 right now for 4 years, and by the time I'm done with it I probably will want to get rid of it. if you think about it if you have a payment/lease w. warranty you have a SET expense every month you can expect. with used trucks (which I have several) you get unexpected HUGE cost. tranny this month, brakes next. gets real expensive and it'll kill your cash flow. also I think you owe your employees a safe ride, not comfortable but safe easiest way to ensure safety is keep a modern fleet of vehicles and machines.

[muddstopper]

I base my buying decision on present value/future value. I have bought new and used vehicles for years. I always try to by newer than the vehicle I am replaceing. I usually search the internet to get a good ideal of what used trucks are bringing. I then figure into the price the cost of financeing. That way when I go to the dealer, I can take their price and add financeing, substract any rebates, etc and then compare the difference in actual purchase cost of the vehicles. Then I factor in the depreciation to see which is the better bargain. What I have found is that if I am looking at a vehicle that is only one or two years old, its usually better to just buy a new one. With several years difference in models, it takes careful searching to not exceed the actual cost of the new vehicle 3 or 4 years down the road. I can buy a 5 year old truck from a individual with low miles at a better price than I could purchase that same truck from a dealer. On used trucks, dealers usually have easier financeing, longer terms, but my bank usually has a better percentage rate. I have found that a 5 yearold truck with low miles is usually a better buy than a brandnew truck. That doesnt mean every 5yearold truck is better than a new one, you still need to check it out for hidden abuse. It might look shiny and clean, but never had its oil changed.

[topsites]

My thing is I have enough problems getting all dirty then taking a seat in my older truck, I dang near cringe thinking of what that does to the cloth bucket seats (even with seat covers). Equipment in and out, jack knife turns, driving around brush areas and what have you, there's no way it's going to stay pristine looking much longer than a lawn mower would :laugh:

The other problem is insurance, I would have to carry full coverage with a loan...
So not only might it cost more with interest, tack on the extra insurance and it does cost more.

I was looking for a used early 90s 3/4 ton and most dealers wanted $4-6k with 100k+ miles. Why is it so bad to get something like that? You could buy two trucks for that price and have a back up.

Eventually I found a 92 K2500 4x4 w/a new paint job for $2200 from a private owner. The A/C doesn't work, but other than that I've had zero problems since I bought it.


Nobody is talking about no 1978 400+k miles beater that makes you wonder how it gets down the road while getting 6 mpg...

I bought my '95 D-2500 slt laramie for 2500, spent another 1500 between flying to Boston / driving it back / doing all SORTS of repairs to it, must've spent two weeks working on fixing it all up right... But blue book for the truck is right at 4g, everything works except the Check engine light is on and the a/c is rigged (but works) and the gas gauge acts stupid, but it's loaded.

It's niiice, don't look like a million bucks but it already has 3-4 dings more than before and you can't tell, little rust from being up north but mostly intact paint, just don't look new. I like to be comfy too, but my 95 slt has all that, 4 thousand paid cash, 120k miles, minimum liability insurance.

I don't get that 30+ thousand for a new vehicle either.
New truck smell was the best answer thou.

[TJLANDS]

I have bought nothing but brand new trucks and mowers for the last 15 years. In the beginning I suffered through some used trucks and equipment,
many, many many issues. Big money issues and some, not many, lost accounts.
After one winter plowing, I don't want to remember the year, I decided to never buy used again and I haven't. That was probably 15 trucks ago, and 30 mowers. For me it was the best decision. Tax wise there are just as many pros and cons for buying new or used. That depends on your business. Buying used gives you(at least it did for me) more repair issues and more down time. Sure you could get lucky and get a fantastic deal on a used truck,one that would last you 10 years, if I had maybe my outlook would be different. I know for a fact that one of my biggest accounts went with me 12 years ago because when they came to visit my shop, they saw my guys working on 2 brand new trucks, with new plows and salters. Just last week
I had a potential snow customer come and inspect my equipment. I just don't know what would happen if i had old beat up trucks, you never know what people think.
Someone mentioned insurance, OK, my 94 GMC 3500 dump costs me more than my 2005 F350. Liability alone for the GMC and full coverage for the Ford.
So that kind of messes up that theory. I bought the F350 brand new at the end of 2005 for 27000. Sticker was 41000. No money down 0 % for 60.
For the length of the warranty I know that truck will not cost me an extra dime and that is easy to figure into my business costs.

And yes I too like the new truck smell!

[JB1]

then again you could always buy some of this. :waving:

[LindblomRJ]

TJ makes some excellent points. Tax deductions and repair cost and warranty being chief advantages.

[YardPro]

there are many reasons that you buy new....
when you guys buying used grow your business and start getting good financial advise, then you will see why larger companies buy new.
first is the tax reason. Corporate taxes are near 50%. I would rather spend it than give it to uncle same to hand out to all the lazy a$$es that can work but prefer a handout.

next is the warranty. something breaks, i get a loaner and it is fixed.

we bill nearly $100K/month...with 7 trucks. That means that for every day we have a truck down we loose $6K worth of revenue.
not all of our trucks are new. But all of our main ones are.

[Lawnworks]

I will always buy used. I have a good accountant, and would rather put money in the bank, land, or investments than invest heavily in a depreciating asset. I have a truck that sits at the yard, so if one ever goes down time is not lost. You can find an extremely reliable work truck for 15k-20k.

As far as tax purposes go, sometimes I could see it making sense if you need to get in a different tax bracket, but I think most of the time it is just an excuse to get a new toy. I would rather pay 20-30% taxes, and put the rest in the bank for peace of mind and futher business ventures.

[PlatinumLandCon]

I will always buy used. I have a good accountant, and would rather put money in the bank, land, or investments than invest heavily in a depreciating asset. I have a truck that sits at the yard, so if one ever goes down time is not lost. You can find an extremely reliable work truck for 15k-20k.

As far as tax purposes go, sometimes I could see it making sense if you need to get in a different tax bracket, but I think most of the time it is just an excuse to get a new toy. I would rather pay 20-30% taxes, and put the rest in the bank for peace of mind and futher business ventures.

Everyone has opinions both ways. Everything about buying new from YardPro makes PERFECT SENSE. Personally, I agree with the above statement.

To each his own.

[meets1]

The problem I have had in my area is that trucks hold value pretty good. I have looked at a good used truck - 2 -3 yrs old with 20-30K 3/4 ton. Still in that high teens to mid twenties. Then I looked at new. Bought a new 2007 GMC Reg Cab HD with Boss V plow all for around 27K Truck month with GM, it is an 07 with 52 miles and been sitting all summer and now they installed a new plow and I am set. $$ decision or not to go new - to me I had no choice.

[rockytop00]

LOL, that new truck smell... so true. Peace of mind as well...

[YardPro]

whatever works for you is the best choice.

we are in a position that we buy new trucks but only buy basic work truck packages, so we still only pay $20-$22K for a 3/4 ton truck.

our corperate tax rate is well into the 40% range. so if we had not spent that $20K on a truck then we would have had to pay $9K in taxes... that means that the truck only cost us $11K.... not bad for a brand new truck.

as for spending money on other things instead of trucks, I agree that for younger businesses used is a better choice, but be careful what you spend on, uncle sam is strict on what assets are deductible. For property to be deductible it has to be 100% used for business. Any other usage limits your deductible amount.
Also i am not saying that we buy every truck brand new. Our PRIMARY trucks are new... all other trucks are used.

[meets1]

I agree with yardpro as well. I have purchased a few used 03 & 04 trucks. Now the last three have all been new and I am negioating for a new 4 door HD for myself. Pay the gov't or spend of money for yourself which eqates to your biz. Obviously though if your new, a few years into the market - I think your better off investing in new equipment such as a 10K mower or a 30K skid instead of the new truck but that new truck will come with time and hard work.

[EagleLandscape]

Simple,

Depreciation And Tax Benefits.

[zz4guy]

whatever works for you is the best choice.

we are in a position that we buy new trucks but only buy basic work truck packages, so we still only pay $20-$22K for a 3/4 ton truck.

our corperate tax rate is well into the 40% range. so if we had not spent that $20K on a truck then we would have had to pay $9K in taxes... that means that the truck only cost us $11K.... not bad for a brand new truck.

as for spending money on other things instead of trucks, I agree that for younger businesses used is a better choice, but be careful what you spend on, uncle sam is strict on what assets are deductible. For property to be deductible it has to be 100% used for business. Any other usage limits your deductible amount.
Also i am not saying that we buy every truck brand new. Our PRIMARY trucks are new... all other trucks are used.
Let's say you pay $11k more for that new truck versus one a few years old. $11k * 40% is about $5k. That means you keep $6k and the gobernment gets $5k. I guess what you're saying is it is worth paying only $6k more for a new truck. I also hear that there is a DO178 rule or something that lets you depreciate the ENTIRE truck cost that year if the truck is new. Is that true?

In anycase I would rather give my extra $5k to GM/Ford/Dodge who employs people and makes something versus the gobernment which squanders it on lazy welfare moms and old peoples' medicine

[DUSTYCEDAR]

that new truck smell

so true:) ..................

[YardPro]

Let's say you pay $11k more for that new truck versus one a few years old. $11k * 40% is about $5k. That means you keep $6k and the gobernment gets $5k. I guess what you're saying is it is worth paying only $6k more for a new truck. I also hear that there is a DO178 rule or something that lets you depreciate the ENTIRE truck cost that year if the truck is new. Is that true?

In anycase I would rather give my extra $5k to GM/Ford/Dodge who employs people and makes something versus the gobernment which squanders it on lazy welfare moms and old peoples' medicine

that is exactly the way i feel about it.

uncle sam creates tax incentives to get companies to recirculate the money.

[stroker51]

To each his own, I'd love to own a new truck, but all I will ever run from now on is diesel's, and i'm going to stay away from the 08 emissions trucks as long as possible. I've been in business five years, and will be turning 20 next spring. I would rather have 20k sitting in the bank to buy a house, shop or other property than have a 50K truck in my driveway. I have a $15K 99 F350 that looks brand new for my pickup, the main mowing truck is a 96 F250 that i gave $10k for in 05, now has 200K but has given me zero problems in 60K miles since i bought it other than a clutch at 198K, mostly due to my 80 horse programmer. If it goes down i can hook up my Super duty or my 84 F250 plow truck, that i have gone completely through and only have about 4 grand in it. Gave $4K for my 89 F450 dump, and it's made me lots of money since then. A company i used to work for ran only 80's chevy trucks, and one would get pulled into the shop every winter to get a complete overhaul, engine rebuilt, tranny if needed, body, paint, they were old but he would only have 8 grand in a basically new truck. My boss was a really good mechanic though too so that helped. I think for the small guys used makes more sense, especially if you have a little bit of mechanical ability or have a good mechanic to work on your stuff and wont gouge you on the bill. I would rather have my money tied up in an asset that will appreciate over time rather than a guaranteed depreciation.

[POPO4995]

Im thinking about a new Dodge 6.7 Cummins in the spring. My Ford is nothing but nickel and dimed me to death! My Dodge 1500 held up way better than this piece. But then again, my buddy has a '97 F-250 Powerstroke with 305,000 miles and still going strong. Original motor and new tranny at 260K....:rolleyes:

[YardPro]

To each his own, I'd love to own a new truck, but all I will ever run from now on is diesel's, and i'm going to stay away from the 08 emissions trucks as long as possible. I've been in business five years, and will be turning 20 next spring. I would rather have 20k sitting in the bank to buy a house, shop or other property than have a 50K truck in my driveway. I have a $15K 99 F350 that looks brand new for my pickup, the main mowing truck is a 96 F250 that i gave $10k for in 05, now has 200K but has given me zero problems in 60K miles since i bought it other than a clutch at 198K, mostly due to my 80 horse programmer. If it goes down i can hook up my Super duty or my 84 F250 plow truck, that i have gone completely through and only have about 4 grand in it. Gave $4K for my 89 F450 dump, and it's made me lots of money since then. A company i used to work for ran only 80's chevy trucks, and one would get pulled into the shop every winter to get a complete overhaul, engine rebuilt, tranny if needed, body, paint, they were old but he would only have 8 grand in a basically new truck. My boss was a really good mechanic though too so that helped. I think for the small guys used makes more sense, especially if you have a little bit of mechanical ability or have a good mechanic to work on your stuff and wont gouge you on the bill. I would rather have my money tied up in an asset that will appreciate over time rather than a guaranteed depreciation.


don't take this the wrong way, BUT if you can not justify a new truck, then your business is not making money. You have never been given the option of giving uncle sam $40K or buying two trucks and other equipment for $100K and not having to give uncle sam a dime. This means you just bought $100K worth of stuff and only paid $60K for it......

pretty good savings.

once you start getting into larger numbers and your tax liability increases you will start hearing your accountant tell you that you need to spend X dollars on something for your business.

[tthomass]

don't take this the wrong way, BUT if you can not justify a new truck, then your business is not making money. You have never been given the option of giving uncle sam $40K or buying two trucks and other equipment for $100K and not having to give uncle sam a dime. This means you just bought $100K worth of stuff and only paid $60K for it......

pretty good savings.

once you start getting into larger numbers and your tax liability increases you will start hearing your accountant tell you that you need to spend X dollars on something for your business.

ding ding ding!

[Lawnworks]

It seems to me if you set your company up a certain way you can avoid alot of taxes. S-corp... pay yourself a low salary then the taxes on the corporation avoids the ss and medicare that is what like 18%? I could easily afford a new truck, but I would rather pay my 20% in taxes and save save save. Maybe my accountant is just creative... I don't know. Either way I am not spending 1k a month on a payment, or spending 40k out of the bank on a pickup truck that will depreciate like a rock in a pond.

[greensway]

I believe someone has a lot of pride in their 10 -20 year old trucks!
There is nothing wrong with that - whatever works for each individual in their business.

That being said, the difference between each man's goals vary greatly and there is no standard that has been set on what equipment you must have in your arsenal.

There are two main sets of operators out there that I see,,,,

1. Companies wanting to set themselves apart from the dreaded " Lowballers"
by purchasing and maintaining newer vehicles and equipment & washing regular to keep an image that is going to attract more attention ( meaning more work) from larger business's that are wanting a little more attention paid to their property & willing to pay for it. ( Quality customer )

This in turn generates more income to continually turn over the equipment long before it gasps its final breath and is declared " A backup unit "

These individuals WILL enjoy the benefits of less breakdowns & headaches and bottom line a more stable enviorment. ( More profit )

2. Company or individual that is satisfied to get the job done & fast to get to the next job because the urgency to get back to the shop or garage to fix the aging truck or equipment is a higher priority than satisfying the customer's needs & double checking before leaving the property to make sure everything done there is completed.

With this breakneck speed comes " LEAVING MONEY ON THE TABLE"
Everyone has the opportunity to see what else needs done at each property and if in too big a hurry, leaves without securing this extra work and a lot of times putting it off until next week.

Basically it is a viscious circle of chasing your tail in all aspects of your business, not enough money to justify new stuff, too much time fixing old, not getting premium clients, taking any work that comes along to pay the bills
Not pre-screening new customers & doing work that you you have trouble collecting,,,,,,,,,,,on & on.

My take on this whole Lawn care "Problem" that many posters of this site have is that there was never a business model thought out in detail in advance of "getting in business".
Many decided that it would be the easiest to get into with little initial investment - that was the business model.

That is fine, but if that is the route you take - take it serious & put back into it the effort required (And money), if not you will be continually be chasing your tail & showing contempt for the man that has worked hard for what he has accomplished.

Are some people really serious here that they can bash a fellow for having new trucks & equipment? I Give *trucewhiteflag*

Tag, I'm it?

[Az Gardener]

Here is a simple mathematical way to take the emotion out of the equation.

Assume you are buying a diesel and expect a 200-K life out of the vehicle. Divide that by the cost say 40-k and you get a price of .05 per mile for the life of the vehicle less repairs maint etc. Thats new

Now lets say you can buy a used diesel with 40-k miles for 28-K sounds like a great deal right. Do the math and you will find it costs you 5.7 per mile for the remaining 160-K miles left on the truck.

The numbers are worse for gassers with a shorter mileage life.

This is without the consideration of better financing with new, better warranty, peace of mind knowing no one abused the vehicle before you and lastly the value of your time shopping for used vehicles.

[supercuts]

buying an 08 this week. nothing wrong with buying new but when im looking at 2 yr old trucks with 50K for $30K, im spendign the extra 8K for new. why let someone else have the best 1/3rd of the trucks life. also, the depreiation on new diesels is so low, you really can say your losing 50% driving off the lot. i bought my 00 in dec 02 for $20K. its still worth at least 12K 5 years later. its also a reliabilty thing too. not to say a 50k truck with break down more, but sooner if your keeping it long term.

when i bought my 00 it was 20k. a new one was 36K sticker, probably 31k out the door, 0%finacning at the time. by the time i paid interest, $4.5K, and repairs over the 4 yrs of the loan, i was up to 30K+. so, i could have had a new 03, with 64K miles less for the same price by the time it was paid off. the $10K plus in savings looked great at the time, price looked sweet, but i made a mistake buying it.

[Lawnworks]

I believe someone has a lot of pride in their 10 -20 year old trucks!
There is nothing wrong with that - whatever works for each individual in their business.

That being said, the difference between each man's goals vary greatly and there is no standard that has been set on what equipment you must have in your arsenal.

There are two main sets of operators out there that I see,,,,

1. Companies wanting to set themselves apart from the dreaded " Lowballers"
by purchasing and maintaining newer vehicles and equipment & washing regular to keep an image that is going to attract more attention ( meaning more work) from larger business's that are wanting a little more attention paid to their property & willing to pay for it. ( Quality customer )

This in turn generates more income to continually turn over the equipment long before it gasps its final breath and is declared " A backup unit "

These individuals WILL enjoy the benefits of less breakdowns & headaches and bottom line a more stable enviorment. ( More profit )

2. Company or individual that is satisfied to get the job done & fast to get to the next job because the urgency to get back to the shop or garage to fix the aging truck or equipment is a higher priority than satisfying the customer's needs & double checking before leaving the property to make sure everything done there is completed.

With this breakneck speed comes " LEAVING MONEY ON THE TABLE"
Everyone has the opportunity to see what else needs done at each property and if in too big a hurry, leaves without securing this extra work and a lot of times putting it off until next week.

Basically it is a viscious circle of chasing your tail in all aspects of your business, not enough money to justify new stuff, too much time fixing old, not getting premium clients, taking any work that comes along to pay the bills
Not pre-screening new customers & doing work that you you have trouble collecting,,,,,,,,,,,on & on.

My take on this whole Lawn care "Problem" that many posters of this site have is that there was never a business model thought out in detail in advance of "getting in business".
Many decided that it would be the easiest to get into with little initial investment - that was the business model.

That is fine, but if that is the route you take - take it serious & put back into it the effort required (And money), if not you will be continually be chasing your tail & showing contempt for the man that has worked hard for what he has accomplished.

Are some people really serious here that they can bash a fellow for having new trucks & equipment? I Give *trucewhiteflag*

Tag, I'm it?


Using new trucks and used trucks doesn't have any correlation to what type of clients you have. I use '99-02 Nprs and you really cannot tell a different b/t an '99 and an '05. What kind of clients you have has absolutely nothing to do w/ what you drive. I am not saying buying new isn't right for you... we don't do any plowing in GA and trucks probably last a little longer down here.

My business model is make as much profit as possible w/ the lowest overhead as possible. Is that really that stupid? I find smokin deals on work trucks then flip them in a few years and get most of my investment out of them... so I really don't lose much of anything.

What looks more professional... your f350 or this purpose built landscaping truck that carries my cat, dingo, 3000 ft of pipe, and 7 employees to the job site?

http://www.lawnsite.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=83055&d=1182204344

I paid 16k for this truck... '02 w/ 60k miles.

[greensway]

Lawnworks;

You are missing the point, any BRAND NEW truck will be older after a few years - why pick up a used 5-10 year old truck with the financial problems mounting steadily, then come out about the same in monies spent as if you bought new?

Avoid the headaches and having it look good in the meantime.

The post was not just trucks, you have a nice looking vehicle there, and I'm sure it works for your needs well - it might not work for me in snow too well though.

The correlation can be summed up by saying if you do not have "good" customers that pay well & on time - you will be chasing your tail all the time and never have a STEADY income to pay for trucks & EQUIPMENT.

Obviously you have found what works for you, congrats!
Is it possible that some of these hater posters could mistake yours for new?
It is way too clean and professional looking!

[B Stove]

Dependable (Gets you where you need to be When you need to be there)

[meets1]

New vs used - do you guys share the same idea in renting vs owning a shop for all equipment etc?

Mytakeon this after looking at the threads and re-reading a few - it seems to me that those with new trucks would naturally own there shop vs those that buy used I get the idea that those would most likely rent??

Kinda hijacking the thread a bit but it would be interestiing to see some results.

[TXNSLighting]

Im thinking about a new Dodge 6.7 Cummins in the spring. My Ford is nothing but nickel and dimed me to death! My Dodge 1500 held up way better than this piece. But then again, my buddy has a '97 F-250 Powerstroke with 305,000 miles and still going strong. Original motor and new tranny at 260K....:rolleyes:

your problem is you bought an 04...dont ever buy a first year engine!

[TXNSLighting]

image is alot when it comes to business, The reason i got several jobs was because i have newer equipment and a nice truck. it gives people more faith in you that you will be there, and not calling cuz equipment broke and youll be late...It makes sense for companies that make money. it doesnt for companies just gettin by...

[nobagger]

well, buying a new ford is just kinda pointless... its going to breakdown no matter if its new or old :laugh:

LOL, well I can sleep at night knowing my frame wont crack in half when plowing like MANY of the GM's do! And I know it will pull a house unlike our shop truck which is a 02 Chevy 3/4HD that blows exhaust gaskets after pulling a 7x14ft trailer with 1 or 2 motorcycles on it. Since 02 this will be the 3rd set of gaskets,lol

[nobagger]

image is alot when it comes to business, The reason i got several jobs was because i have newer equipment and a nice truck. it gives people more faith in you that you will be there, and not calling cuz equipment broke and youll be late...It makes sense for companies that make money. it doesnt for companies just gettin by...

Very good point, even if its an older truck just keeping it clean sets a lot of companies apart. I have picked up a few jobs just by people seeing my truck and trailer and have said "you look like a reputable company can you stop by and give me an estimate".

[JayD]

: that new truck smell

:laugh: :laugh: :laugh:

[JayD]

well, buying a new ford is just kinda pointless... its going to breakdown no matter if its new or old :laugh:

:nono: :nono: :nono:

[YardPro]

lawnworks....

what is up with you and all these good deals????

next time you find something that is one of your killer deals give me a call....

$16K for that truck is an awesome deal..... I am SOOOOOO envious.


but as for the S corp,
it allows you to build capitol, and roll over losses to your personal income. If you do not spend money on something deductible, you will eventually have to pay taxes on it. We are also an S corp.

[Lawnworks]

lawnworks....

what is up with you and all these good deals????

next time you find something that is one of your killer deals give me a call....

$16K for that truck is an awesome deal..... I am SOOOOOO envious.


but as for the S corp,
it allows you to build capitol, and roll over losses to your personal income. If you do not spend money on something deductible, you will eventually have to pay taxes on it. We are also an S corp.


Lets just say, 95% of the time I get cussed out when I make my offer! The other 5% work pretty good for me.