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clcare2
11-06-2007, 12:33 AM
I am doing a large hardscape in a residential courtyard setting the customer detests regular paver block lights.

Are there any other options??

I was thinking that it would be cool to find a light that would sit in the block that I am already using. Something with a core drill maybe?

INTEGRA Bespoke Lighting
11-06-2007, 01:12 AM
There are a wide variety of inground (core drill) type of lights that might work for you from a wide variety of manufacturers. Look at Nightscaping, Vision3, Hunza, BK, and others. It is just a matter of looking through all the catalogs and picking the right fixture for your application.

Have a great day.

klkanders
11-06-2007, 06:33 AM
clcare2,
Are you talking about lights in your SRW block walls? If not...sorry go with James suggestions. If you are then check these out to see if any will work for you:
Vista - 4260 rail light
Integral hardscape lighting
Hadco - LLL 6,12,18,24"
Unique - Viking or Gemini

Good Luck!

Pro-Scapes
11-06-2007, 10:25 AM
if its going in the ground look up what James mentioned... If its going in the wall some suggestions are

Deck lights... dont discredit a hockey puck

Up and down scones... who says you need to install them in the walk way. Coppermoon makes a nice small one. I think its the CM400

Aurora Meridian would fit nice into a core drilled wall as well.

If they want something similar to a paver light but not rectangular evening stars are the only ones I know but good luck with your hardscape when you got 747's landing in the courtyard.

Hide the light source... see the light

Also dont forget about downlighting if there is an arbor... mature trees... eaves on the house ect to work with

Lawn Designers
11-06-2007, 09:10 PM
Integral lighting makes a nice piece for the walls. For the lights on the ground evening star if you want to use the same brick/block and have it drilled to fit.

clcare2
11-07-2007, 08:26 AM
I like the look of the evening star lights. Does anyone know the start up cost.

I don't have a 2 1/2" core bit and would have to get one.

Pro-Scapes
11-07-2007, 09:05 AM
CONTACT INFORMATION
anthony@eveningstarlighting.com

516-676-8003

Call and ask for anthony he is a regular poster on here but pls do not discuss contractor pricing in public its bad for business. Keep in mind the evening stars are 4w and do not really throw light but will serve to define the pathway. Some find them obnoxious some like em. Comes down to what you and your client want.

Anthony has all the tooling and such you will need I belive and can either sell to you or point you to a distributor who can

NightScenes
11-07-2007, 09:23 AM
I'm not big on paver lights but I had a client that insisted on them. I installed Evening star lights and they came out quite nice and glare is not an issue. I did buy the core bit and all of the accessories for the installation and the prices were not bad at all. I added all of the costs into the project though.

The client had a photographer shoot the project last week. When the photos come in I'll share them.

ChampionLS
11-07-2007, 01:50 PM
Hi Clcare2,

We can gladly help you with your inquiry. I will send you some information out ASAP.

Everyone else, thanks for your support. It really takes seeing them installed along with conventional lighting, and/or the completed landscaping. We'll probably sponsor a forum on here for 2008 as we add new fixtures to our product line.

pete scalia
11-07-2007, 10:17 PM
I think paver lights are like finger nails on a chalk board. IMHO they have no place in a landscape.

Lite4
11-07-2007, 11:03 PM
I used to think that until about 4 months ago. I was doing a house in a neighborhood that had very steep hillsides. A house that was 4 houses down the street from the house I was working on had a driveway that had a side entrance into the house. One side of the driveway had a dropoff that was about 150 feet down the other side of the hill. He had his paver driveway demarked with paver lights and it worked beautifully to outline the 'NO NO Zone'. It was actually pretty cool looking down at it from the road. With the city lights way down below it in the valley, it almost looked like the driveway was floating in space. There was no glare to speak of, just a soft glow. It was perfect for it's intended purpose in that installation. So, like I said; paver lights have their place.

clcare2
11-07-2007, 11:43 PM
The lights are not a problem,in and of themselves. The problem lies in the shape and form of most lights. The paver that I am using is a tumbled stone, so lights with a clean edge look bad in the day.

clcare2
11-07-2007, 11:53 PM
CONTACT INFORMATION
anthony@eveningstarlighting.com

516-676-8003

Call and ask for anthony he is a regular poster on here but pls do not discuss contractor pricing in public its bad for business.

Just wanted to know the price pf a drill bit. Idon't talk numbers. no ones business and most people lie anyways.

Frog Lights, LLC
11-08-2007, 04:05 PM
We checked the market and found it lacking for quality paver lights. We spend a great deal of time and money developing a great product. Our paver lights use LED technology. They are good for 100,000 hours. They are sealed so water and insects cannot enter. Use on the average 1.5 watts of power. Sizes equal to common paver sizes so it is not necessary to drill or cut the pavers. Not cheap plastic but stainless steel and glass. no hot spots or glaring light. This is the best product on the market.
We just came out with our new wall/step light. While some of these that are on the market are okay. I find the same problem with the bulbs and the risk of fire or burns if they are touched accidentally. Ours is made of one piece construction using a module of 5 super bright LED's. It is water resistant and cold to the touch. It uses .4 watts not 4-7 as with the others.
This is to be priced way below the others.
I have been having problems updating the web site but I do have our paver light posted there. I hope to have our new super web up in about another 5 days. The new web will have a portal for special access for Lawnsite members. We have many new items, that are great. I also have some closeouts that I want to liquidate. We are working on better distribution and representation. This has been a problem for us. If anyone is interested in trying these products they should contact me.
I will attempt to post pictures of both.

INTEGRA Bespoke Lighting
11-08-2007, 08:42 PM
We checked the market and found it lacking for quality paver lights. We spend a great deal of time and money developing a great product. Our paver lights use LED technology. They are good for 100,000 hours. They are sealed so water and insects cannot enter. Use on the average 1.5 watts of power. Sizes equal to common paver sizes so it is not necessary to drill or cut the pavers. Not cheap plastic but stainless steel and glass. no hot spots or glaring light. This is the best product on the market.
We just came out with our new wall/step light. While some of these that are on the market are okay. I find the same problem with the bulbs and the risk of fire or burns if they are touched accidentally. Ours is made of one piece construction using a module of 5 super bright LED's. It is water resistant and cold to the touch. It uses .4 watts not 4-7 as with the others.
This is to be priced way below the others.
I have been having problems updating the web site but I do have our paver light posted there. I hope to have our new super web up in about another 5 days. The new web will have a portal for special access for Lawnsite members. We have many new items, that are great. I also have some closeouts that I want to liquidate. We are working on better distribution and representation. This has been a problem for us. If anyone is interested in trying these products they should contact me.
I will attempt to post pictures of both.

Hi Noel.

Some questions on your LED product line....

1: what colour temperature are your LED emmitters?

2: whose LED technology are you installing into your fixtures?

3: what light output are you achieving in terms of L/m.

4 what efficacy are you achieving in terms of lumens per watt?

5 Are your LED fixtures sealed?

6 To what standard are you rating life expectancy? 70%, 50% or 30% decrease in output from new?

7 Are your LED products cluster LEDs or power Leds?

I look forward to finding out more. Thanks.

JoeyD
11-08-2007, 10:39 PM
Hi Noel.

Some questions on your LED product line....

1: what colour temperature are your LED emmitters?

2: whose LED technology are you installing into your fixtures?

3: what light output are you achieving in terms of L/m.

4 what efficacy are you achieving in terms of lumens per watt?

5 Are your LED fixtures sealed?

6 To what standard are you rating life expectancy? 70%, 50% or 30% decrease in output from new?

7 Are your LED products cluster LEDs or power Leds?

I look forward to finding out more. Thanks.


Where were you on the night of september 13th 1977????????


LOL!

just joking around James:drinkup:

Frog Lights, LLC
11-09-2007, 03:19 PM
Jim
Thank you for the great questions ! I am sure that most of the people on this site know exactly what you are asking. Forgive me if the response is not exact as I am not an engineer but only somewhat knowledgable.

Color Temp. …The structure of the LED emits a wavelength of 450-480 nm or about 4000 K. This light is ideal for hardscape, washing a wall or under a step.

LED technology:…… I use Lunar white that is a result of scintillator version of a single crystal (ZnSe) emitting a yellowish light that the human eye sees as pure white.
This was developed by a man named “Nichia”

Output:..I did not measure the output for this product. (the wall step light) but I estimate as follows. Somewhere between 20-35 lumens per watt.

Sealed:.. The LED module is sealed , and water resistant but not recommended for underwater use.

Life … While there are many factors that affect the length of life, under ideal conditions life is expected to be 100,000 to 1,000, 000 hours. We use 100,000 hours with decreases approaching 50 percent but not substantiated.

Cluster/Power…. The Wall/Step light is a module of 5 LEDs all the fixtures I sell are cluster LEDs.

That September I was playing with myself and picking my nose:canadaflag:

jhuanger629
11-17-2007, 01:33 PM
Noel, browsed through your site and you have some great products. Do you manufacture your entire line or are you open to distributing others as well?

and +1, Nichia is the way to go!

The Lighting Geek
11-17-2007, 02:05 PM
If you want to same a few bucks the first time you core a job, check with the local rental yards as well. They have most of the common core sizes as well as the drill motors. That is what we did before we bought all the equipment.

Frog Lights, LLC
11-17-2007, 02:33 PM
We produce everything that we sell. For the last three years we have been upgrading our product line. Now we are working on our web that has not been touched since we started. I am sorry but that got neglected and it should be corrected in a couple of weeks. Our aluminum will not rot . Our paver lights are the best on the market, real professional not cheap plastic junk. We have a new wall step light called the "Wall Eye" that will be the market leader. Coming soon are some novel high end underwater lights. Please look for our new website and we will try to keep you informed. Our goal is the quality at the right price so you can make money. I have distribution in Europe and other countries, and we are actively seeking distributors and manufacturer's representatives here. Please feel free to contact us if you have something interesting. We are always willing to evaluate the possibilities.

jhuanger629
11-17-2007, 02:35 PM
thanks Noel for the quick reply. I'll send you an email later in the day introducing our line.

Who knows, may have already crossed paths at the Lightfair lol

have a great weekend.

Chris J
11-17-2007, 08:20 PM
jhuanger, I respect your intentions. But from now on, could you please identify yourself as either contractor, manufacturer or supplier before you chime in on an open forum? I originally thought you were a contractor like me, but now I know different. I get a really sick feeling in my stomach when someone poses as a fellow contractor, only to learn that he has an agenda. It's much akin to being at the neighborhood bar after a long day sharing stories with your pals, when in walks a salesman trying to push his wares. There is a time and a place, but don't disguise yourself; it only makes you look shady (at best). Food for thought. :realmad:

Pro-Scapes
11-17-2007, 08:42 PM
Gotta ditto what Chris Stated. The boards are here to help pros learn and share ideas. Seems latley more than ever we got a ton of manufactures chiming in. If you produce or wish to otherwise bring attention to your product line up please follow Noel's and Joey/Nate's lead and sponsor this forum.

To me someone that comes on as a contractor then turns out to be a peddler gets a big RED strike in my book no matter what they are offering. Build like and trust and the rest will fall in line.

jhuanger629
11-17-2007, 10:29 PM
I completely agree, but I did try to chime in multiple times in terms of introducing myself, my profession, etc but all of my threads were deleted as violating forum policies.

I didn't mean to mislead anyone into thinking I was a contractor and certainly wasn't planning to pull a fast one by implying I was and then saying, oh buy these lights! lol

Chris, I appreciate your comment and agree for the most part. But you did use the words "open forum" and my intent has not been to push sales or you would have seen "buy these lights, order from me...etc." Who amongst the community would ever respond positively to a member with such a low post count? I guess the topic of manufacturer dominated forums is another thread topic in itself, but in all honesty, I was just hoping to gain insight from seasoned landscapers.

I came across the community by chance, (or google for lack of a better word) and found it to be a great forum to bounce ideas and ideally gain feedback on a new lighting technology.

pete scalia
11-17-2007, 10:54 PM
We produce everything that we sell. For the last three years we have been upgrading our product line. Now we are working on our web that has not been touched since we started. I am sorry but that got neglected and it should be corrected in a couple of weeks. Our aluminum will not rot . Our paver lights are the best on the market, real professional not cheap plastic junk. We have a new wall step light called the "Wall Eye" that will be the market leader. Coming soon are some novel high end underwater lights. Please look for our new website and we will try to keep you informed. Our goal is the quality at the right price so you can make money. I have distribution in Europe and other countries, and we are actively seeking distributors and manufacturer's representatives here. Please feel free to contact us if you have something interesting. We are always willing to evaluate the possibilities.

Since you produce everything you sell, I'd like to take a trip to southern NY (wherever that may be) and take a tour of your factory. I'm sure it can't be that far from Long Island. Coupla hour trip at most. I look forward to your invitation. Thanks. looking forward to seeing your raw materials and machinery at work.

Pro-Scapes
11-17-2007, 11:49 PM
I completely agree, but I did try to chime in multiple times in terms of introducing myself, my profession, etc but all of my threads were deleted as violating forum policies. .

Perhaps that should of been a signal to follow the rules and not try to catch a draft off others sponsorships??? just an idea there


I came across the community by chance, (or google for lack of a better word) and found it to be a great forum to bounce ideas and ideally gain feedback on a new lighting technology.

Then you should have stated this and we would of been more than happy to give you feedback and ideas!

ChampionLS
11-18-2007, 06:39 AM
Originally Posted by Frog Lights, LLC
We produce everything that we sell. For the last three years we have been upgrading our product line. Now we are working on our web that has not been touched since we started. I am sorry but that got neglected and it should be corrected in a couple of weeks. Our aluminum will not rot . Our paver lights are the best on the market, real professional not cheap plastic junk. We have a new wall step light called the "Wall Eye" that will be the market leader. Coming soon are some novel high end underwater lights. Please look for our new website and we will try to keep you informed. Our goal is the quality at the right price so you can make money. I have distribution in Europe and other countries, and we are actively seeking distributors and manufacturer's representatives here. Please feel free to contact us if you have something interesting. We are always willing to evaluate the possibilities.

Since you produce everything you sell, I'd like to take a trip to southern NY (wherever that may be) and take a tour of your factory. I'm sure it can't be that far from Long Island. Coupla hour trip at most. I look forward to your invitation. Thanks. looking forward to seeing your raw materials and machinery at work.

Peter,
You and others may just be very well disappointed. A certain person monitoring the threads under a different name is too busy installing irrigation systems and consulting to manufacture anything of quality. :laugh:

I run 3 businesses ! I manufacture landscape lighting, have a large irrigation business and I am an H2B recruiting company. Need to establish priorities for the particular stage of your life. What is most important to you at this time.
Noel

NightScenes
11-18-2007, 09:43 AM
John, the main thing is that you came clean right away (only made one post that is in question). I look forward to learning more about solar and LED technology. Once again, I think it's great that manufactures are getting involved in forums like this as well as associations like the AOLP, which continues to gain manufacture members. This shows that they are interested in the contractors thoughts and the progression of the industry.

Welcome aboard.

Chris J
11-18-2007, 11:15 AM
I completely agree, but I did try to chime in multiple times in terms of introducing myself, my profession, etc but all of my threads were deleted as violating forum policies.

I didn't mean to mislead anyone into thinking I was a contractor and certainly wasn't planning to pull a fast one by implying I was and then saying, oh buy these lights! lol

Chris, I appreciate your comment and agree for the most part. But you did use the words "open forum" and my intent has not been to push sales or you would have seen "buy these lights, order from me...etc." Who amongst the community would ever respond positively to a member with such a low post count? I guess the topic of manufacturer dominated forums is another thread topic in itself, but in all honesty, I was just hoping to gain insight from seasoned landscapers.

I came across the community by chance, (or google for lack of a better word) and found it to be a great forum to bounce ideas and ideally gain feedback on a new lighting technology.

No worries. I just felt obligated to bring it up in the hope that others will refrain from doing such a thing. I welcome any and all manufacturer input, but I just want to be certain who I'm dealing with right out of the gate. Welcome to the forum.

irrig8r
11-18-2007, 11:35 AM
05-08-2005, 07:06 PM
Georgia Bull Dog
LawnSite Member Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: NJ
Posts: 47

They are over priced ! I like frog lights stuff.


Interesting. Stealth promotion?

pete scalia
11-18-2007, 11:43 AM
Peter,
You and others may just be very well disappointed. A certain person monitoring the threads under a different name is too busy installing irrigation systems and consulting to manufacture anything of quality. :laugh:

I am really disappointed now. I was so looking forward to that tour too.

pete scalia
11-18-2007, 11:46 AM
John, the main thing is that you came clean right away (only made one post that is in question). I look forward to learning more about solar and LED technology. Once again, I think it's great that manufactures are getting involved in forums like this as well as associations like the AOLP, which continues to gain manufacture members. This shows that they are interested in the contractors thoughts and the progression of the industry.

Welcome aboard.

It shows they are interested in selling product.:laugh::laugh::laugh:

NightScenes
11-18-2007, 12:58 PM
05-08-2005, 07:06 PM
Georgia Bull Dog
LawnSite Member Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: NJ
Posts: 47

They are over priced ! I like frog lights stuff.


Interesting. Stealth promotion?

This, I have a problem with. You have a manufacturer who was promoting himself while pretending to be someone else. In a word, this is dishonest. This tells me what kind of person he is and therefore what could be expected in product and support.

Frog Lights, LLC
11-18-2007, 01:02 PM
Pete Scalia
It would be our pleasure if you could visit. Please give me a call to set an appointment.
I travel a great deal. The offices and warehouse is located in Chestnut Ridge, New York. That is not too far.

steveparrott
11-18-2007, 03:29 PM
With all due respect to the forum sponsors, I'd like to infuse some reality.

I know LED's will eventually rule the day, but how can anyone make a claim of 100,000 to 1,000,000 hrs. life of LED's that have only been on the market for a year?

Two or three major manufacturers recalled their LED fixtures a few months after release - they also made claims of 10 to 15 years life!

We should also question whether or not the continual condensation/evaporation cycle in a sealed fixture will result in accelerated internal corrosion. To expect any electrical/electronic component to survive 15 years of that is expecting a lot.

We all need to remember that LED's are still in the 'early adopter' stage of development. In all technology sectors, early adopters run into problems. Fine, if we want to experiment with this new technology, we can, but I think our customers might be pissed if their million-hour lights fail after one or two years. Manufacturers should be cautious - recalls cost a fortune!

In defense of fixture manufacturers, they make their claims based on the claims of LED manufacturers. Believe me, I've heard them all, it's such a competitve business and they are all rushing their products to market. Walking around light fair, I visited with all of them. The ink on their brochures was barely dry. I also had the sense that only the bigger LED manufacturers are doing true R & D. The copycats are probably basing their claims not on real testing, but rather on theoretical estimations under ideal laboratory conditions.

Even lamp life claims of our archaic incandescents fall far short in fixtures installed in the landscape. Why should we expect LED's to live up to their laboratory ideals under the same conditions?

Chris J
11-18-2007, 10:06 PM
I really don't get why people do this kind of thing. Do they really think that they are that much smarter than the rest of us to be able to pull this off indefinitely? I view this as a total and complete lack of respect for the entire community, which is why I will probably never purchase any product from someone who uses these methods. If they are willing to do this to get into your pockets, what will they do after they have got your money? It's just plain ol' bad business and it's very unprofessional.
Of course, this is just my opinion.

Chris J
11-18-2007, 10:24 PM
With all due respect to the forum sponsors, I'd like to infuse some reality.

I know LED's will eventually rule the day, but how can anyone make a claim of 100,000 to 1,000,000 hrs. life of LED's that have only been on the market for a year?

Two or three major manufacturers recalled their LED fixtures a few months after release - they also made claims of 10 to 15 years life!

We should also question whether or not the continual condensation/evaporation cycle in a sealed fixture will result in accelerated internal corrosion. To expect any electrical/electronic component to survive 15 years of that is expecting a lot.

We all need to remember that LED's are still in the 'early adopter' stage of development. In all technology sectors, early adopters run into problems. Fine, if we want to experiment with this new technology, we can, but I think our customers might be pissed if their million-hour lights fail after one or two years. Manufacturers should be cautious - recalls cost a fortune!

In defense of fixture manufacturers, they make their claims based on the claims of LED manufacturers. Believe me, I've heard them all, it's such a competitve business and they are all rushing their products to market. Walking around light fair, I visited with all of them. The ink on their brochures was barely dry. I also had the sense that only the bigger LED manufacturers are doing true R & D. The copycats are probably basing their claims not on real testing, but rather on theoretical estimations under ideal laboratory conditions.

Even lamp life claims of our archaic incandescents fall far short in fixtures installed in the landscape. Why should we expect LED's to live up to their laboratory ideals under the same conditions?

Preach it Steve! Now that's stuff that makes sense!

Mike M
11-18-2007, 10:53 PM
Really, don't let them spend too much R&D on it Steve, keep those bronze fixtures affordable.

Let the bulb manu's sweat it out.

jhuanger629
11-19-2007, 05:04 PM
John, the main thing is that you came clean right away (only made one post that is in question). I look forward to learning more about solar and LED technology. Once again, I think it's great that manufactures are getting involved in forums like this as well as associations like the AOLP, which continues to gain manufacture members. This shows that they are interested in the contractors thoughts and the progression of the industry.

Welcome aboard.

Thanks guys for understanding as I really did try to make my intro as detailed as possible without violating forum policy. Our product line is already carried by good reps across the US and available to customer, so my intent was not to push sales through to individuals on the forum.

I was solely hoping to use the forum as an opportunity to gain feedback on what positives and negatives our line entails and how we should progress in the future. Companies are doing great things with solar, and while many have understandable issues with current versions, I definitely see a strong future for it as a whole.

Thanks again for the warm welcome to the community.

john

JoeyD
11-19-2007, 05:53 PM
I'm still waiting to see a good solar light!?

jhuanger629
11-19-2007, 05:57 PM
haha, joey, if you're interested in taking a look, I'd be happy to send you some stuff. what's the best way to do so?

ChampionLS
11-19-2007, 09:17 PM
I'm still waiting to see a good solar light!?

Me too!...

It's been raining here for a few days! :rolleyes:

JoeyD
11-20-2007, 12:06 PM
haha, joey, if you're interested in taking a look, I'd be happy to send you some stuff. what's the best way to do so?


Thanks John

Please Ship to 1240 Simpson Way Escondido, CA 92029. Attn: Joey D.

I look forward to seeing what you have!

Joey D.

jhuanger629
11-20-2007, 12:10 PM
morning joey, would love to send a unit out there, but we have a strict sample order policy.

The next time I'm visiting our Rep agency in SD, i'll give you a holler and see if I can show you the units firsthand. I'd be happy to send some product images in the meantime.

Happy early Thanksgiving everyone!

JoeyD
11-20-2007, 12:15 PM
BTW guys I did get some samples of the Evening Star lights and they are really impressive. Thanks again Anthony.

Chris J
11-20-2007, 11:21 PM
haha, joey, if you're interested in taking a look, I'd be happy to send you some stuff. what's the best way to do so?

morning joey, would love to send a unit out there, but we have a strict sample order policy.

The next time I'm visiting our Rep agency in SD, i'll give you a holler and see if I can show you the units firsthand. I'd be happy to send some product images in the meantime.

Happy early Thanksgiving everyone!

What's this all about? "Let me send you stuff!" OK, send me stuff. "Sorry, can't send you stuff; we have a policy" Geez man! Do you work for Barnam & Bailey or what?

Edited: After further examination, I realize that "stuff" could be interpreted as brochures. My bad, your foul.

jhuanger629
11-21-2007, 12:41 AM
yup, i meant our website link or a pdf brochure....

NightScenes
11-21-2007, 12:51 AM
I have a policy to NEVER pay for SAMPLES.

Chris J
11-21-2007, 01:20 AM
When someone is as good as you Paul, the manufacturers just piss all over themselves to send free samples!...:laugh:

pete scalia
11-21-2007, 01:22 AM
I have a policy to NEVER pay for SAMPLES.

I can afford to pay for samples therefore have no such policy

INTEGRA Bespoke Lighting
11-21-2007, 01:27 AM
I have a policy to NEVER pay for SAMPLES.

Hey Paul... I like that policy of yours! I may just have to adopt that one. :)

I haven't had any problem with fixture manufactures suppling me with samples for a few years now. This is not the case however when dealing with lamp and LED manufacturers though. When trying to source new tech. LED lamps, I have had no end of troubles trying to obtain samples, especially from Asian manufacturers. They seem to insist on inital minimum order quantities in the hundreds of units.

Chris J
11-21-2007, 01:34 AM
I guess you guys will just have to keep trying out the free samples on your customer's homes while Pete and I pay the cabbage to buy the good stuff.

NightScenes
11-21-2007, 08:44 AM
I was trying to make a joke about the LED manufacturers' policy of not sending out free samples after offering to send out samples.

I still don't pay for samples though. A sample is just that, if they want me to SAMPLE their product, they can supply me with one to SAMPLE. If I bought every new product out there for lighting I would be broke, but I do have quite a great collection of SAMPLE fixtures in my yard that I am trying out.

pete scalia
11-21-2007, 09:20 AM
I guess you guys will just have to keep trying out the free samples on your customer's homes while Pete and I pay the cabbage to buy the good stuff.

You get what you pay for. Most times.

jhuanger629
11-21-2007, 04:03 PM
Yup, I normally don't like paying for samples either and if each unit cost a dollar to make, I'd probably be more likely to send freebies out there.

We've sent some out in the past without ever hearing from the person again. Thus, a simple memo bill usually solves the problem. If you like what you see, keep it and pay for it, if not, simply return and no harm done.

Have a safe turkey day fellas.

Pro-Scapes
11-21-2007, 05:00 PM
I dont pay for samples either. If your a manufacture and want potential clients to use/see it you need to make it avalible for them to preview. Minimum orders then if you dont like it send it back is a pain in the rump.

Manufactures come off like they got the greatest thing of all time and it will change the way we do things or claim they got the best and i will like it so much I will only use thiers then it shouldnt be much of a big deal. You should verify it is indeed a legitimate company you are sending them to.

If I got a bill with a sample I wouldnt even look at the samples. They would be promptly returned.

ChampionLS
11-22-2007, 12:50 AM
SaviLED sent us some free samples. They (and others) may treat contractors different than suppliers.

clevliteguy
01-29-2008, 11:17 AM
We brought the Integral line in for the spring of 07'. Unsure of reaction we started out small looking for some guinea pigs and found a few. By the end of 07' guys were absolutley thrilled with the appearance and ease of installation. Pricing was not an issue due to the amount of time saved in labor. Oh yeah, they looked great as well. I am interested to get some of the 18' units installed in the spring.

INTEGRA Bespoke Lighting
01-29-2008, 11:30 AM
Am I missing something here or is this a lighting "manufacturer" that only carries one item in their line up?

Does that not make you ask some questions?

JoeyD
01-29-2008, 11:34 AM
Yes they only have that under rail light.....that Vista now has. Hadco has made one for some time now that I have used.

clevliteguy
01-29-2008, 11:36 AM
Of course there was concern in regards to Integral only carrying one item. It became a niche item that had been requested by many contractors in previous seasons. I can say that after having this item for a full season, I am completely satisfied with the results.

INTEGRA Bespoke Lighting
01-29-2008, 11:40 AM
If you are happy with their support and service then continue to patronize them. Personally I would be looking to shorten the supply chain and find the manufacturer of the item, but that is just me, and I have some Scottish in my blood.

clevliteguy
01-29-2008, 11:43 AM
From my understanding the Vista line is in the process of being removed. The industry has turned into a copycat industry and everyone must have saw the impact and decided to jump on board.

JoeyD
01-29-2008, 11:43 AM
They are when they are, and they are pretty cool. I hear of lots of people form the mid west using the intergal light. We have a version coming out hopefully this year based on the same concept. Ours however will use a better lamp be constructed of brass and have a covered opaque lens to protect the wiring, socket, and lamp.

clevliteguy
01-29-2008, 12:02 PM
That is the one concern I have about them, the uncovered lamp. If any moisture hits the lamp (since it is so exposed), I am scared of the kickback from that.

JoeyD
01-29-2008, 12:03 PM
its going to have probems, you dont want to have to replace that light.....Make sure you grease the crap out of those sockets with a good di electric.

INTEGRA Bespoke Lighting
01-29-2008, 12:49 PM
From my understanding the Vista line is in the process of being removed. The industry has turned into a copycat industry and everyone must have saw the impact and decided to jump on board.

Hadco has the same thing available too.. various lengths, different materials including copper and SS I think. Still an open fixture which is not great.

Go get them Joey... make it right.

Lite4
01-29-2008, 03:21 PM
I believe Vistas is a closed light. I have been looking forward to trying some of these on some block wall installs. I hate cutting blocks and I really don't like the way most brick lights look on walls. The slim design of the undercap light looks much cleaner and being at the top of the wall gives a better spread on the ground in front.

clevliteguy
01-29-2008, 03:27 PM
The one thing I can tell you from experience is not to space them out to far. They looked decent when installed 5-6' apart but look much better in the 3-4' range.

ChampionLS
01-29-2008, 09:10 PM
Lalalalalalalalalalalala.............

Stay VERY tuned to this thread. It's going to get very interesting in the next few weeks. :weightlifter: