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bmwsmity
11-16-2007, 10:02 AM
I've read that many of you do live demos regularly. I currently do not do demos, and have never really had a problem because of this. However, it may be something I would do in the future.

My question is, if you are looking at say a 60-fixture job, do you set up all of those fixtures for the demo?

If not, how many DO you set up, and where? Just the house, the landscaping, or both?

Currently I utilize a very professional website with some decent pictures to show prospects what kind of work I do, and so far, this has not failed me.

I'm just wondering if demos are all that effective or better than what I'm currently doing?

I've also heard the argument that some people who do demos simply get their design ideas ripped off by the customer and the customer goes and gets some junk at the big-box store and does it themselves.

Those of you who are experienced, please enlighten me to your viewpoints! :drinkup:

JoeyD
11-16-2007, 11:56 AM
I've read that many of you do live demos regularly. I currently do not do demos, and have never really had a problem because of this. However, it may be something I would do in the future.

My question is, if you are looking at say a 60-fixture job, do you set up all of those fixtures for the demo?

If not, how many DO you set up, and where? Just the house, the landscaping, or both?

Currently I utilize a very professional website with some decent pictures to show prospects what kind of work I do, and so far, this has not failed me.

I'm just wondering if demos are all that effective or better than what I'm currently doing?

I've also heard the argument that some people who do demos simply get their design ideas ripped off by the customer and the customer goes and gets some junk at the big-box store and does it themselves.

Those of you who are experienced, please enlighten me to your viewpoints! :drinkup:


Demo's without a doubt are the best way to close sales and to up sell jobs. Now you give the homeowner something tangible to look at vs. a bunch of dots on a plan or them thinking Disneyland or a casino when you are telling them why they need 4 or 5 lights around one tree or in one area. Now they can visually see what you or I as professionals can easily imagine. They however cannot.

Doing a demo does not have to be an all night chore. That is the biggest argument with guys not wanting to do them is that it takes up so much time and they are a pain to set up and take down. (If you don't want to work at night then you shouldn't be doing lighting.) If you are using a well put together demo kit and you understand how much time it takes to set one up then you can pretty much get it down to a science and not spend your entire evening on-site.

If I have a large 100 light potential job does that mean I am going to set up 100 demo lights. Probably not. What I like to do in a situation like that is pick out an area front or back, maybe just the home, maybe an awesome gazebo or water feature area and really buff it out. The idea is to blow them away with a demo so that they trust you to do the rest of the property. You explain and show them what you are now capable of doing. An average demo for me would be around 2-3 demo kits which works out to be about 48 lights give or take. 48 lights takes me about 20 minutes to set up when using our Unique kits which are all color coordinated and pre wired. It takes a bit more time to adjust and to dial in the lighting concept.

Now when will I set up more kits? When I have a situation where the homeowner is already willing to buy say 80 lights but I know they need 120 lights thats when I whip out the big demo's. A job like that when I know I got the homeowner int he bag and I am trying to up sell it is worth the extra time and effort to make the extra thousands of dollars. I have no problem spending an entire afternoon at that point to show the homeowner what it would look like with he extra 40 or 50 lights. It also gives em an opportunity on a large project like that to see for myself exactly what it is I want to do. I might think 2 lights is enough on this tree but after the demo I realize it only needs one and I can use this other light over here now or that the tree actually needs 3 lights. So demo's are a great way for us as designers to really perfect our craft as well as make more money.

So downsides to the demo. Initial investment in the demo kits. You can make your own but it costs about the same usually to buy one completely done for you. Time, well it takes time to make money and usually the more you put into a job the more you get out of it. Stolen designs, this can happen. I have had situations as most who have done demos have that you do this unbelievable demo, the homeowners tell you they love it and will think about it only to drive by the home 3 weeks later and see they have installed Malibu in every spot you put a light at the demo. It can happen. But the positives far outweigh the negatives.

I think you owe it to yourself to see how demo's can help you make more money and increase your closing ratio. I don't think you need to demo every job, if you got them in the bag why waste the time. But in most cases a demo can and will almost always make you more money then if you don't do one. I know so many of you don't need them because of your Superior selling skills and your word of mouth references, but even you guys if you set up demo's would find that the homeowners who you are already putting 100+ lights on the property for would now understand and see why they need 120, 140, or even 200 lights because now they visually can understand what it is you are trying to do.

There's my $.02. OK maybe $2.00.

Let me know if you guys want details of our demo kits which are for sure the best out there.

Joey D.

Mike M
11-16-2007, 12:51 PM
Nice post, Joey. While it can be argued that the experienced, seasoned, proven, successful lighting biz with lots of referrals can save time eliminating demo's altogether, it's guys like me that play with demo's to build techniques and confidence (look at all the mock set-ups J Moyer has her students do in her book), as well as "turning on" prospects to getting lights and upselling.

I use tricks I learned here plus my own to make the demo's quick and efficient. I have color-coded fixture wires for bulb wattage, etc.

I enjoy doing the demo's, and I only light around 3-6 fixtures at a time for mini scenes.

JoeyD
11-16-2007, 01:11 PM
Thanks Mike! All around, experienced or not demo's will and can make you more money if you choose to use them.

Wlak throughs are nice but nothing is better then showing homeowner on their own home what the lights will do!

Joey D.

irrig8r
11-16-2007, 01:17 PM
Nice post, Joey. While it can be argued that the experienced, seasoned, proven, successful lighting biz with lots of referrals can save time eliminating demo's altogether, it's guys like me that play with demo's to build techniques and confidence (look at all the mock set-ups J Moyer has her students do in her book), as well as "turning on" prospects to getting lights and upselling.

I use tricks I learned here plus my own to make the demo's quick and efficient. I have color-coded fixture wires for bulb wattage, etc.

I enjoy doing the demo's, and I only light around 3-6 fixtures at a time for mini scenes.

I have labels on my demo fixtures noting wattage and beam spread where applicable.

I've never seen the Unique demo kit, but I got a new one this past year from Vista that I thnk would be hard to top. It comes with a 250 W portable transformer on sort of a tripod, and lots of cable and three way splitters. It comes with six MR-16 bullet uplights, with room for more in the sturdiest hard plastic rolling case you've ever seen.

And what it uses for connectors are a two wire flat molded trailer type connector, readily available at NAPA auto parts stores so you can add your favorite fixtures from whatever brand you prefer. Add a little grease and you could keep the setup on the job for a couple of nights (I have).

This kit was well conceived and executed. The fact that I have to add my own fixtures is a plus for me. Nothing else in the kit that I don't put there myself.

I carry the rest in two Gatemouth tool bags from Bucket Boss, and a Stanley rolling toolbox I got at a garage sale. Most of them stay in the truck and I just take out the ones I want to demo, but I like to be prepared...

JoeyD
11-16-2007, 01:37 PM
The Demo Kit (SUPERDEMOKIT_HC) includes:

1 840SS with quick connects. All taps are cordinated by color to go with the according 12/2 wire run.

3 sets of 4 F125 Well Lights w/ Qucick connects

4 Brass Lights (Solaris, Starburst, Stellar, Pulsar or Probe)

1 Additional hub pigtail for additional lights you want to add to your kit.

1 Bundle of marking flags for marking you fixture locations when picking the kit up

3 Home Runs of 12/2. 30ft, 50ft, 75ft all wired with quick connects and color cordinated to match up tot he right tap.

Lamp Box w/ 2 extra MR 16 and a Par 36

1 50ft commercial extension cord

Velcro straps for winding up and storing cable runs. Also velcro on each bundle of well lights for the same reason

1 roll of Duct tape for taping taping down wire to concrete areas to prevent a tripping hazard.

You get all of this in a STANLEY hard rolling tool case. VERY NICE CASE!

You can customize your kit to add more specialty fixtures, you can make the kit all specialty lights. This kit I described above runs about $1200 to the contractor.

I will try and post some pics of one here soon.

INTEGRA Bespoke Lighting
11-16-2007, 06:44 PM
Demo's without a doubt are the best way to close sales and to up sell jobs. Now you give the homeowner something tangible to look at vs. a bunch of dots on a plan or them thinking Disneyland or a casino when you are telling them why they need 4 or 5 lights around one tree or in one area. Now they can visually see what you or I as professionals can easily imagine. They however cannot.

Doing a demo does not have to be an all night chore. That is the biggest argument with guys not wanting to do them is that it takes up so much time and they are a pain to set up and take down. (If you don't want to work at night then you shouldn't be doing lighting.) If you are using a well put together demo kit and you understand how much time it takes to set one up then you can pretty much get it down to a science and not spend your entire evening on-site.

If I have a large 100 light potential job does that mean I am going to set up 100 demo lights. Probably not. What I like to do in a situation like that is pick out an area front or back, maybe just the home, maybe an awesome gazebo or water feature area and really buff it out. The idea is to blow them away with a demo so that they trust you to do the rest of the property. You explain and show them what you are now capable of doing. An average demo for me would be around 2-3 demo kits which works out to be about 48 lights give or take. 48 lights takes me about 20 minutes to set up when using our Unique kits which are all color coordinated and pre wired. It takes a bit more time to adjust and to dial in the lighting concept.

Now when will I set up more kits? When I have a situation where the homeowner is already willing to buy say 80 lights but I know they need 120 lights thats when I whip out the big demo's. A job like that when I know I got the homeowner int he bag and I am trying to up sell it is worth the extra time and effort to make the extra thousands of dollars. I have no problem spending an entire afternoon at that point to show the homeowner what it would look like with he extra 40 or 50 lights. It also gives em an opportunity on a large project like that to see for myself exactly what it is I want to do. I might think 2 lights is enough on this tree but after the demo I realize it only needs one and I can use this other light over here now or that the tree actually needs 3 lights. So demo's are a great way for us as designers to really perfect our craft as well as make more money.

So downsides to the demo. Initial investment in the demo kits. You can make your own but it costs about the same usually to buy one completely done for you. Time, well it takes time to make money and usually the more you put into a job the more you get out of it. Stolen designs, this can happen. I have had situations as most who have done demos have that you do this unbelievable demo, the homeowners tell you they love it and will think about it only to drive by the home 3 weeks later and see they have installed Malibu in every spot you put a light at the demo. It can happen. But the positives far outweigh the negatives.

I think you owe it to yourself to see how demo's can help you make more money and increase your closing ratio. I don't think you need to demo every job, if you got them in the bag why waste the time. But in most cases a demo can and will almost always make you more money then if you don't do one. I know so many of you don't need them because of your Superior selling skills and your word of mouth references, but even you guys if you set up demo's would find that the homeowners who you are already putting 100+ lights on the property for would now understand and see why they need 120, 140, or even 200 lights because now they visually can understand what it is you are trying to do.

There's my $.02. OK maybe $2.00.

Let me know if you guys want details of our demo kits which are for sure the best out there.

Joey D.

Joey, in all seriousnes I don't know what to say here. Do I jump right in and reply with how I feel about the points you make in your post? Or do I just let it go and relax? Is anyone interested in a opposite point of veiw? You guys tell me.

JoeyD
11-16-2007, 07:04 PM
Joey, in all seriousnes I don't know what to say here. Do I jump right in and reply with how I feel about the points you make in your post? Or do I just let it go and relax? Is anyone interested in a opposite point of veiw? You guys tell me.

Go ahead James. Here is your other post to save you time...... "I did a lighting demo once, about 9 years ago. After that I swore I would never ever do another one again. I think you will find that there are people who are firm believers in this technique and there are people like myself who really don't like it at all.

I find it cumbersome, time consuming, and not very effective at increasing my sales. I also think it isn't the best use of my client's precious time or attention. Since over 90% of my business comes from referrals, I don't really need to spend that type of time required to do a demo. The prospects have already seen the effect of my work. If they haven't, I would much rather take them to a property for a walk through. Walk throughs are very efficient and very effective at showcasing your work.

I'm sure that there are a wide variety of opinions on this and an equally wide variety of techniques that work in different markets for different contractors. You simply have to try and find the best mix for you and your clients."

I think everyone understands that you have the ability to out sell your competition without the use of a demo kit. We know most of your jobs are by referral so their is no need. We understand that you like walking your clients through another job. We also know that you did ONE demo 9 years ago and it was a nightmare so you hate them.

Well I can tell you that I have probably done over 300 demo's and still learn on each one. I can also tell you that a demo will always make you more money. I can also tell you that sometimes it isn't too convenient to ask a customer to meet you at another project to walk through. I also understand that demo's don't ALWAYS work, but for those upstarts and for those who are not superior in their communication or selling skills a demo does the talking for them. It allows the homeowner to try the lights on for size. Now for every positive there is a negative you can find but you cant argue a demo being a GREAT way to make more money and to increase your close ratio. You can argue that they can be a nightmare but you cant argue that done properly they sell jobs and make money.

END OF STORY, I AM GOING HOME EARLY TODAY!!!!!!

Joey D.

INTEGRA Bespoke Lighting
11-16-2007, 07:24 PM
Well I can tell you that I have probably done over 300 demo's and still learn on each one. Excellent Joey, I am a firm believer in life long education. I too am constantly learning and creating new techniques.

I can also tell you that a demo will always make you more money. Sorry Joey, a Demo cannot "always" make you more money. With certain prospects it can be viewed as an inconvenience, and mis-interpreted as lacking confidence.

I can also tell you that sometimes it isn't too convenient to ask a customer to meet you at another project to walk through. Those clients who are interested in walkthroughs will generally accept the offer to attend one. Mostly, I find that the best clients prefer to find a personal connection to what you propose and present on their site.

I also understand that demo's don't ALWAYS work, but for those upstarts and for those who are not superior in their communication or selling skills a demo does the talking for them. There is no doubt that a demo can be a powerful learning and marketing tool. I am not wholesale discounting the value of a demo. There are however other alternatives to sucessful sales and installations.

It allows the homeowner to try the lights on for size. Now for every positive there is a negative you can find but you cant argue a demo being a GREAT way to make more money and to increase your close ratio. I think I just did.
You can argue that they can be a nightmare but you cant argue that done properly they sell jobs and make money. Old maxim: Work Smarter, Not Harder.

END OF STORY, I AM GOING HOME EARLY TODAY!!!!!!

Enjoy!
Joey D.

Have a great day.

JoeyD
11-16-2007, 07:46 PM
LOL...

Believe me James I have heard it all. I am sure your competition will appreciate you not doing a demo. I am still a bit confused on how a demo at their own home can be viewed as an inconvinience yet asking them to drive to another property at night and walk it isnt.

I am not saying that is a poor way of demonstrating your ability but I think that would be far more of an inconvinience then them walking into their front or back yard.

And you are correct with the point that a demo is not the only way of making a sale. We all know and understand that. But regardless of how hard you try to argue it the demo is one of the most powerful sales tools a lighting guy can have. I cant begin to tell you how many succesfull demo stories I have. I can count the bad ones on one hand!

At any rate, regardless of how PRO DEMO I am I do respect your opinion and rest assured plenty of others agree with you. I however will disagree and will say that I think everyone can and should benefit from demo's.

Have a great weekend!!

Joey D>

YardPro
11-16-2007, 07:49 PM
i also have not had the need for a demo. almost all my work is also from referral, and most of my lighting packages are sold with other work.

JoeyD
11-16-2007, 08:01 PM
i also have not had the need for a demo. almost all my work is also from referral, and most of my lighting packages are sold with other work.

Dont take this the wrong way YardPro this is not a challenge or even an argument. But have you ever been on a job or done a job that you knew the homeowners needed another bunch of lights but they refused to see the need?? If so then you needed a demo. Again it is not a 100% close rate but it sure does give you a better chance to upsell when you have those homeowners who are on the bubble.

Even those who say they dont have the money for more, sometimes when you show them what it would look like 100% lit like you want it then you shut down the lights on the demo showing them what they think they need the effect usually causes them to find the extra money. Or at minimum they now know they will need to add more in the future.
Example: Mrs. Jones thinks she needs only 40 lights. After walking the job and doing a design in my head I realize she needs 60 to make the job right. So I set my demo up with the 40 lights she wants on a few transformers. I then insert the remaining 20 lights I think she needs and I put those on a seperate unit. When she comes out to see the lights and to hear my dissertation I show her the 60 lights I think she needs without telling her how many lights are on. SHE LOVES IT, "Oh Yardpro you are the best, I want it!!" well Mrs. Jones thats with the 60 lights I origionally designed, but here is how it would look with the 40. I then shut down the other unit. Now she goes "OH, it looks good but turn the other lights back on". DONE DEAl.

Doesnt always work but you have a whole lot better chance. Worse case scenario, youjust install the 40 but now she knows what she really needs to add in the future.

I will say this, there is usually always a need for a demo. Weather you want to do it or not is another question.

INTEGRA Bespoke Lighting
11-16-2007, 08:18 PM
Joey, I thought you were going home early? :laugh:

I stand fim in my convictions but I will concede to you the last word on demos...

JoeyD
11-16-2007, 08:22 PM
LOL.......You know how it is. Trying to leave early is like peeing sitting down. You can do it but you look like a girl!! LOL
It sounded good. I really am leaving!!

mowtime
11-16-2007, 09:23 PM
I did not have a dedicated demo package either, But a kind soul from a distributor on this site sent me a kichler low voltage hub and 5 25' leads. I purchased another one and now I can do 12 lights very quickly with a single transformer. I sold 2 lighting jobs last week doing a demo, it gives a customer a chance to give some input on the design and really makes the sale.

NightScenes
11-16-2007, 11:43 PM
I'm with James all-the-way here!! There are those that need to show and tell and there are those that don't. I'd rather spend my evenings making final adjustments than setting up demos.

INTEGRA Bespoke Lighting
11-17-2007, 08:59 AM
I'm with James all-the-way here!! There are those that need to show and tell and there are those that don't. I'd rather spend my evenings making final adjustments than setting up demos.

Nice to see someone who understands. :) Thanks Paul.

I would rather spend my evening work time...

A: Relaxed and proudly walking through a completed installation at a nearby property to the prospect, where everything is just as it should be.

B: Doing a 'lighting ceremony' with a new client at their freshly completed installation.

C: Entertaining the prospects over a fabulous meal and great wine at a restaurant / dinner club (that I have lit).

The other factor to keep in mind when determining whether or not to do demos is property size. In a market filled with traditional suburban lots demos might be a feasible option. When property sizes get up into the multiple acres and there are multiple buildings (Home, Guest House, Coach House, Boat House, Bunkies) on each property things change.

Bottom line, all markets are different and all lighting contractors are different. If demos work for you then all the power to you.... enjoy! But to say that you must do demos, or that you will always increase your sales by doing a demo, or any other catch all regarding the need to do demos... well the proof is in the pudding. There are other alternatives.

(Sorry Joey, I guess I didn't give you the last word after all)

Chris J
11-17-2007, 10:48 AM
I've been on both sides of this fence, so I can honestly say that I agree with both sides of this argument. I no longer do demos, but when I did it was much easier to sell the client on an idea or a concept. I can't tell you how many times in the past I have had people tell me they hated "path lights" before I set up the demonstration. Of course, I would still set up the path lights in strategic areas and the client would almost always fall in love with the appearance of the project.
Another reason that I don't do demos is because you are limited to how many sales calls you can make every week. I actually like seeing my family, so I really didn't want to do more than one demo on any given night. During the summer months, I still wouldn't get home till 10 or 11PM. Although a beginner could close more sales with a demo, you are limited to the number of sales call in which you can go on. By doing daytime estimates, you can do 5 or 6 per day. Yes, your closing percentage may go down without the demo. But the number of closes goes up because you're able to get in front of more people.
I would suggest keeping a demo kit on hand just in case. I'd try to sell them without the demo, but If I were you I'd probably offer to come back with the demo if I didn't close the deal on the first go-round. All in all, I do believe the customer feels they are getting more if you give them a demonstration. And I do know this much: when I did demonstrations, I stole jobs from other contractors on a daily basis (even when their price was much, much lower).

JoeyD
11-17-2007, 12:19 PM
"And I do know this much: when I did demonstrations, I stole jobs from other contractors on a daily basis (even when their price was much, much lower)."

Important statement there Chris. This is exactly what the new competiton will be doing to steal jobs from you. Demo's arent for everyone and that is understood. But I know guys who do massive jobs all the time (80 lights would be a small job) and they still do demo's. It is easy to not do demo's when you are your only competiton but in areas like so california they are a real life saver to ensure closing the deal.

NightScenes
11-17-2007, 01:00 PM
"And I do know this much: when I did demonstrations, I stole jobs from other contractors on a daily basis (even when their price was much, much lower)."

Important statement there Chris. This is exactly what the new competiton will be doing to steal jobs from you. Demo's arent for everyone and that is understood. But I know guys who do massive jobs all the time (80 lights would be a small job) and they still do demo's. It is easy to not do demo's when you are your only competiton but in areas like so california they are a real life saver to ensure closing the deal.

I quit doing demos when I kept stealing jobs from guys who put in their sweat to set up a demo and I walked in and said that I would do something completely different. I would do twice as much lighting, I charged more and still would land the job. The guys who set up the demos would have to come back and take out their stuff (more wasted time) and not get the job.

I think that if I'm going to work at night, I'm going to be completing a project instead of trying to sell a project. I do see both sides of the fence though and there are good points on both sides.

Lite4
11-17-2007, 01:30 PM
I don't particularly like doing the demos, but for me and considering the young stage of my business it is all about exposure. For the last two weeks I have been calling land developers who are building subdivisions, and pitching to show them an alternative to the standard HID hosedown they usually use to 'light' their entryways and common area structures. So far I have done 1 demo for 1 developer (the demo picture is posted on the live demo thread), He was blown away. I sent a picture to his office which he blew up and passed around the office. Everybody loved the effect of the light on the potted structures (see pic). Even though they weren't exactly the same light I would use for the permanant install, he got the sense and idea of the effect I was trying to accomplish. He was just planning on placing 5 HID lights around the outside and blasting it (which is what all the developers do here, they rely completely on the electricians to light things up for them). Without offering a free demo to show them an alternative to the 'normal' way of thinking about lighting, I probably would never have gotton in with them, let alone make the sale. Our architects here are the same way. I don't think any of them have seen anything but HID lighting. So I am happy to re-educate, and change some minds. I have 3 more demos for developments set up for the next 2 weeks. I don't care what anybody says, demos are effective. "It is one thing to see a nice picture of lighting and admire it's beauty, but it is something completely different to walk through that picture and experience it and interact with it."
I'm sorry James and Paul, I can appreciate that you have built your business up to a point to where you "think" you no longer need to do demos. But I have to agree with Joey on this one. This is just one tool I am not willing to take out of my toolbox.

The Lighting Geek
11-17-2007, 02:37 PM
I just sold a 75 light job because I did a demo and so did the other 3 bidding contractors. I just did a better lighting design and proved it with a demo.

On the other hand, I also sold a 100 light job the same week without a demo.

Everyone is right. Earlier on in career, i needed demo's to sharpen my skills. Now, I just do them because I like them and I have a blast with the customers. I roll up in my geek mobile, wearing a swat vest, a tactical headlamp and carry a laser so big it looks like a light saber...LOL! But I am a geek, what would you expect? (oh trust me, it gets worse)

Seasoned designers/installers, we all have an opinion on this it seems. For the newer people (my humble opinion), do demo's and learn from them. Later, it is just another tool in your 'toolbox' and sometimes you dust it off. In this forum we all want to help one another. Explore all the possibilities and decide for yourself.

JohnNewton
11-17-2007, 03:57 PM
As a brand new guy in the business, I don't have a lot to offer yet (except to be quiet and learn). But after lurking here for a year, I have to say that I am kind of proud of you guys. Here is a issue where lots of guys disagreed, but everybody kept their powder dry and respectfully stated their case. Nobody questioned the other guys' expertise, professionalism or parentage. Nobody got defensive and resorted to insults. In fact, the guys with the strongest opinions ended up acknowledging that the other guys had a point. I learned a lot more from that kind of exchange than from the usual brawl. Not that I don't enjoy an occasional brawl.... But thanks.

irrig8r
11-17-2007, 03:59 PM
Glad you spoke up John.

extlights
11-17-2007, 05:55 PM
We get most of our business from referrals, but 95% of the time we do demo's on those homes anyway. We've actually talked people into demo's when they didn't want one only to have them thank us at the end of the night for the demo while handing us a deposit. Here is the thing with demo's in my mind. It is very much a strong sales tool for newbies in the industry and seasoned veterans. With the amount of competition starting to flare up, design, quality fixtures, and quality installation needs to be shown and proven to the potential customer.

Also...each home is different. Just having nice pictures of past projects to show a consumer isn't always enough. Sure, they can see that you do good work, and that 1 million dollar home looks nice lit up on your flyer, but what about their home and landscape? Seeing first hand is believing, and with the amounts of lighting contractor "hacks" out there...I think it's important to show why you are the best choice for your potential customer....and what better way is there than to show your lighting design skills first hand. No picture or anything on paper could even come close to matching that.

Chris J
11-17-2007, 07:20 PM
I quit doing demos when I kept stealing jobs from guys who put in their sweat to set up a demo and I walked in and said that I would do something completely different. I would do twice as much lighting, I charged more and still would land the job. The guys who set up the demos would have to come back and take out their stuff (more wasted time) and not get the job.

I think that if I'm going to work at night, I'm going to be completing a project instead of trying to sell a project. I do see both sides of the fence though and there are good points on both sides.

With all due respect Paul, I've seen the process you go through to put together a presentation for a potential client. It is a very impressive computer generated presentation, but I would be willing to bet that it takes you much, much longer to lay it out on your computer (then make a second trip back to the clients home to make the presentation) than it would to do a demo and give them the proposal in one trip. Your presentation looks extremely professional, and I commend you for what you do and how you do it. However, I can't help but wonder what the overall outcome would be if you and I were in the same market. You and your computer vs. me and a demo (if I still did them). I would think that some would be impressed by your method, while others would be flattered and astonished by what I could do with a demo kit. In the end, I would assume that we both would be profitable. If it weren't for all the other no name contractors out there just "throwing in lights", we could all probably do much better regardless of the method we use.

Chris J
11-17-2007, 07:37 PM
We get most of our business from referrals, but 95% of the time we do demo's on those homes anyway. We've actually talked people into demo's when they didn't want one only to have them thank us at the end of the night for the demo while handing us a deposit. Here is the thing with demo's in my mind. It is very much a strong sales tool for newbies in the industry and seasoned veterans. With the amount of competition starting to flare up, design, quality fixtures, and quality installation needs to be shown and proven to the potential customer.

Also...each home is different. Just having nice pictures of past projects to show a consumer isn't always enough. Sure, they can see that you do good work, and that 1 million dollar home looks nice lit up on your flyer, but what about their home and landscape? Seeing first hand is believing, and with the amounts of lighting contractor "hacks" out there...I think it's important to show why you are the best choice for your potential customer....and what better way is there than to show your lighting design skills first hand. No picture or anything on paper could even come close to matching that.

Dave,
You hit the nail on the head. I really don't know why I go on so much about it because, as I said, I don't even do demos! However, the value in them is tremendous. The customer gets invested in the project and it shows that you are willing. It also allows the customer to critique the lighting plan before final install and let you know if they want an extra light here or there; or possibly path lights where they didn't think they wanted them before; or maybe some downlights out of some trees, etc.... How many guys here have gone back to a job after their nighttime adjustment to find that the client wants a couple more lights here or there? This could have been taken care of with the demo! WHY DON'T I DO DEMOS ANYMORE?

Chris J
11-17-2007, 08:07 PM
"And I do know this much: when I did demonstrations, I stole jobs from other contractors on a daily basis (even when their price was much, much lower)."

Important statement there Chris. This is exactly what the new competiton will be doing to steal jobs from you. Demo's arent for everyone and that is understood. But I know guys who do massive jobs all the time (80 lights would be a small job) and they still do demo's. It is easy to not do demo's when you are your only competiton but in areas like so california they are a real life saver to ensure closing the deal.

Joey,
Believe me, you are preaching to the choir here. I know the value of the demo, I just simply do not have the time to do them anymore. I can only do one demo per night, but I can do as many as 8 sales presentations on any given day. Even if my closing percentage is 75%, getting 6 jobs in one day is better than getting 6 jobs in a week by doing demos 6 nights/week. Again, I like being home with my family at night but I fully understand what the demo can do.

YardPro
11-17-2007, 08:47 PM
JoeyD,

i totally understand your point.
I am not in the lighting business exclusively. When i design a landscape project i include the lighting it needs, they take it as a whole package or they get nothing.
I do install a lot of standalone lighting systems, but a large lighting package here is only $12K. Our average install is about $6K. We do not have large properties. Also this area is very tight nit... i just tell them to go over and look at mr. X's house after dark....
More than likely they know people that we have done work for.,

so for my situation I have never needed a demo. It has been a long time since i have "needed" the job, and it seems like the less i need the job, and the less i compromise with the clients the more work i book....so I cannot justify the expense and setup time of a demo.

The Lighting Geek
11-18-2007, 02:15 AM
Here a couple of my demo's

Mike M
11-18-2007, 08:46 AM
Tommy, those are excellent photo's.

I'd love to know what you use for portable roof mounts (see my "roof rig" post).

Please tell us more about how you do your demo's, how many people help you vs. solo, and the transformer/fixture set up.

Thanks,

Mike

Lite4
11-18-2007, 10:04 AM
Nice work Tommy. It would be hard for any homeowner to say no to those portraits.

pete scalia
11-18-2007, 12:07 PM
If I was the homeowner of the home in the top photo. During the demo I would be focusing not on the lighted building but the big gaping dark hole on the left side of the frontyard. IMHO demos can work for some who can't visualize for others who have a trained eye it can be detrimental. For instance the hot spots on the house can be mitigated with lenses or different lamps but I'm turned off by it. This is too involved and time consuming for a demo to work out all the warts so to speak. If demos work for you and you don't mind spending your nights working on speculation with no guarantee of a job then more power to ya. Lotsa luck.

The Lighting Geek
11-18-2007, 01:04 PM
I put these up for a reason. Everyone immediately thought each was one homeowner. The first one took 6 hours and a helper. I did it for a custom home builder who had an open house for pre-qualified home buyers and people who he is currently in progress with. There was 200 people over 2 nights at this function. So I did one demo for 200 prospects who want that kind of house. I met the architech and have been referred all of his jobs since and the builder is including me in hi proposals if there is landscapes. I think out of the box and I wanted to show different ways to use a demo. Commercial works too as we saw from other photos. I am only saying for those who choose to do demo's, maximize your efforts. 45 lights by the way.

The second one is 4 lights and it took me 10 minutes. I saw that pergola and skipped the rest of the yard. It now is in the catalog for the manufacturer. I use the bottom one in my ads.

Lite4
11-18-2007, 03:09 PM
I don't care what any of you think about demos, I know for a fact I would not have been able to get in front of some builders/developers without cold calling them and offering a free demo on their property. I know this because they have flat out told me this. They would never have considered anything other than their poorly placed HIDs unless someone would have personally taken the time to show them the difference.

YardPro
11-18-2007, 09:16 PM
lighting geek...

i love the second pic.... that is stunning, and very simple.


I do not doubt the power of the demo.

I do not use them because they have not been necessary for me. If things slow, and i don't have more work than I can do, i will probably put together a demo kit. I totally think they will increase sales.

Chris J
11-18-2007, 09:51 PM
Unless your a complete idiot, I think we would all have to agree that a demonstration will not hurt your sales presentation. You can still do all of the things that you normally do, but if the client is still sceptical........why not do a demo? Bottom Line: use all of your sales tools. If you don't sell it at first, keep on going until you exhaust all of your resources. Don't be such an arrogant prick like me that you will turn your back on money just because the client doesn't "know who you are" and doesn't already have an appreciation for your work.

Mike M
11-18-2007, 10:44 PM
Chris, it sounds to me like you are mulling over revisiting the demo. You write alot about competition eating into your market share. Why not burry them with a classy demo set like the geek guy? Or maybe use them to promote more commercial work, like firefly and the developers?

I mean, I know you don't have to, but maybe Joey is right, it's easy for you seasoned and successful guys to rationalize your way out of it.

Yours truly,

Corona Mike

The Lighting Geek
11-18-2007, 10:55 PM
Chris, you made me laugh outloud. BTW, Mark carlson of Avalon Lighting said hi when I spoke to him yesturday

NightScenes
11-18-2007, 11:32 PM
I need to call Mark, I haven't talked to him in quite a while.

The Lighting Geek
11-18-2007, 11:36 PM
Ok, you guys convinced me to join aolp and get certified...you guys have to much fun at those annual shindigs and want to have fun too :rolleyes:

NightScenes
11-18-2007, 11:51 PM
Come on in Tommy, the water's fine!!

JoeyD
11-19-2007, 03:45 PM
WOW, I was out playing baseball at a tournament all weekend so i couldnt check in on my current favorite topic. I think this was a great discussion. I think we ahve all agreed except for James and Paul (stubborn ol'...LOL) thatthe demo is a great way to make mroe money and to increase close ratios. Tommy presented some awesome points in using the demo to showcase not to just homeowners but to builders, HOA's, and other commercial opportunities that could lead to multiple jobs.

I have an unbelieveable kit easy to use and easy to build on that I think you should all check out!!!

Joey D.

JoeyD
11-19-2007, 04:04 PM
http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb97/ulsjoeyd/BarndemoDennisF.jpg

Here is a Demo photo I just got over the weekend from our rep in Colorado.

Chris J
11-19-2007, 04:40 PM
Chris, it sounds to me like you are mulling over revisiting the demo. You write alot about competition eating into your market share. Why not burry them with a classy demo set like the geek guy? Or maybe use them to promote more commercial work, like firefly and the developers?

I mean, I know you don't have to, but maybe Joey is right, it's easy for you seasoned and successful guys to rationalize your way out of it.

Yours truly,

Corona Mike

Once you stop doing demos, it's very hard to start doing it again. As I said before, I can only do one demo per night, but I can do multiple sales calls in one day. If I run into a potential client who is serious, I'll whip out the demo kit for them if they wish. As for leaving them there for days at a time, I've never tried this. I'm sure it has its merits, but I don't think this would be for me due to the long distances that I have to drive.

Tommy,
Tell Mark I said hello if you talk to him again.

JoeyD
11-19-2007, 04:43 PM
WOW, I was out playing baseball at a tournament all weekend so i couldnt check in on my current favorite topic. I think this was a great discussion. I think we ahve all agreed except for James and Paul (stubborn ol'...LOL) thatthe demo is a great way to make mroe money and to increase close ratios. Tommy presented some awesome points in using the demo to showcase not to just homeowners but to builders, HOA's, and other commercial opportunities that could lead to multiple jobs.

I have an unbelieveable kit easy to use and easy to build on that I think you should all check out!!!

Joey D.

I just re read my post, I am officially buying hooked on Fonix or Phonix?? Screw it, I'm going back to school! LOL Sorry for the errors I will try to us that spell check thing more often!

Chris J
11-19-2007, 04:47 PM
Hey Joey,
Did your Chargers make it back yet? They looked pretty tired yesterday when they left my stadium. GO JAGS!

JoeyD
11-19-2007, 05:39 PM
I knew when I saw you Nextel'd me yesterday that it had to be to give me crap. My team has taken a major turn for the worst and I blame it all on our GENIOUS COACH!! Norv Turner is a BUM and he has taken our star team and drove them into the ground that now we have no confidence and no chemistry. I was a born a Charger fan and I will die one but geez it is looking like it is going to be a long and painful death. Funny thing is if Denver loses we remain in first place. SO much for the strong AFC West. LOL........BOOOOO JAGS....GO BOLTS!!

BTW I didnt ignore your call yesterday I was just to busy being named MVP of our baseball tournament thank you very much!!!

Mike M
11-19-2007, 06:22 PM
As for leaving them there for days at a time, I've never tried this

I never even heard of it until now. This might be an opportunity for me...

We have strict ARB rules in every community about not being able to leave signs, but whose to say I can't leave a demo up? Worth considering.

JoeyD
11-19-2007, 06:42 PM
As for leaving them there for days at a time, I've never tried this

I never even heard of it until now. This might be an opportunity for me...

We have strict ARB rules in every community about not being able to leave signs, but whose to say I can't leave a demo up? Worth considering.

A great demo technique is to set the kit up on Thursday night or Friday night then leave it for the weekend. This way the neighbors will see it, maybe guests will see it, and the homeowners get a chance to soak it up. I encourage them to feel free to move the ligths around just to get them involved. Obviously you always want to time the demo around the gardner or landscaper coming by to do maintenenace as there will be some wiring exposed.

Joey D.

INTEGRA Bespoke Lighting
11-19-2007, 06:47 PM
I think we ahve all agreed except for James and Paul (stubborn ol'...LOL) thatthe demo is a great way to make mroe money and to increase close ratios.
Joey D.

Joey... I just checked my 'close ratio' for 2007.... It was 95%. As for making more money, well I do just fine thanks.

Chris J
11-19-2007, 07:13 PM
You guys that claim 95-97% closing rates: Do you ever get calls from people who are just "inquiring" about lighting and have no idea what the cost is? Do you ever get calls where you are asked what the average cost is? Do you ever get calls from people, but after they get a little more info, they don't schedule an appointment?
If so, do you factor these people into your closing ratio? Or are your percentages based entirely on people who have been prequalified before you meet with them?

JoeyD
11-19-2007, 07:33 PM
Joey... I just checked my 'close ratio' for 2007.... It was 95%. As for making more money, well I do just fine thanks.

James I am glad to hear you are doing fine. I was wondering if I was going to have to send you left over turkey on Friday!!! LOL

INTEGRA Bespoke Lighting
11-19-2007, 07:59 PM
You guys that claim 95-97% closing rates: Do you ever get calls from people who are just "inquiring" about lighting and have no idea what the cost is? I get one or two of these types of calls per year. Do you ever get calls where you are asked what the average cost is? I rarely have anyone ask me on the phone what an average cost is. Do you ever get calls from people, but after they get a little more info, they don't schedule an appointment? Again, perhaps one or two times a year this happens.If so, do you factor these people into your closing ratio? Or are your percentages based entirely on people who have been prequalified before you meet with them? These few calls per year are figured in...

Keep in mind. I do not have any type of display ad in the yellow pages, and I only run a few print ads in very targeted media and when I do they are usually 1/2 to full page, process colour ads that speak quite well to the market that I am targeting. I do not do mailings, bulk distribution or any other type of mass marketing. I focus solely on referral generation and network marketing.... this really keeps the price shoppers and tire kickers at bay.

Have a great day.

Mike M
11-19-2007, 08:28 PM
James, you are a lighting celebrity. Asking you to do a demo is like asking Mel Gibson to do an audition.

Chris J
11-19-2007, 09:14 PM
I guess I must be drawing too much attention to myself with my truck graphics and the sort. I get more of these calls than I care to, but I usually don't rule anyone out until I have had the chance to meet with them and share my presentation. Maybe one day I'll figure it out like you guys have, and somehow get only the people that are going to hire me to call. I must be too optimistic at times. I sometimes believe I could sell ice to an Eskimo...:dizzy:

INTEGRA Bespoke Lighting
11-19-2007, 09:49 PM
James, you are a lighting celebrity. Asking you to do a demo is like asking Mel Gibson to do an audition.


Well I don't really know about being any type of celebrity Mike, but thanks for the thought.

As for being likened to Mel Gibson.... Dontchya think you could have picked a better celeb? I'm thinking Pierce Brosnan or maybe George Clooney! :cool2: (I'm sure my wife would like that anyways... :laugh:)

Mike M
11-19-2007, 10:03 PM
I couldn't think of any Canadian actors other than comedians so I picked another English speaking foreigner, from Australia.

It was the best I could do. It's important to note, by the way, that you are west of the Ottawa River. You are one of us.

Hey, James, by the way, how are the pike and bass biting?? Are they filling up for winter?

eskerlite
11-19-2007, 10:50 PM
Demos are how I make my living. I have never moved or changed a fixture i have demoed. I show one fixture at a time with a battery pack. I do it at their house with their focal points and landscape. The demo is the only way for you to know what these people want. They say too bright or too dim. Then they say just right. 95 % close rate. The 5% werent going to buy my expensive ,long lasting, lifetime warrantied fixtures anyways.
Seriously, the demo has gotten me to were i am. Dont knock it till you tried it. You will learn something on every demo. Your close rate will increase. If you dont like demos, You think you are better than you are. Your ego and confidence better sell your jobs. Pictures of other peoples property has not excited my customers at all.
The demo is all about pulling out the special fixtures that really cure the lighting problems of our customers. I cant boast enough about the demo. I think alot has to do with the area You live in. Im in Mass and these people are passionate about their lighting.People around here get into the demo and have me running all over the yard. It accounts for many extra fixtures. It also confirms what their $275.00 per fixture will look like. When I throw the switch to get the check, They have already seen the effects and are in awe because they had something to do with the design.
Ill bet that those of us who do demos get larger fixture numbers per job than the "leave it up to me maam, I know just what you want" guys.
Demos, Did I tell You I love em?
Sean C.:laugh:

Lite4
11-19-2007, 10:59 PM
As far as demos go here is my method. I will set up the demo then I will go through the neighborhood (4-5 block radius) and knock on each door and try to introduce myself to the homeowner. I simply tell them I am holding a lighting demonstration in their neighborhood and then proceed to tell them where it is. It gives me a few minutes to visit with them and most of them seem pretty excited to see it, as well as the services I offer. I find this a lot more effective than just hanging a door hanger on their door. When you can meet and talk to a neighbor face to face, chances of a sale or a follow up call seem better. For those that do not answer their door, I put a sticker on the door hanger that shows the address and dates of the showing. I will leave the demo up for about 4 nights. This also lets the homeowner spend a little more time trying it on for size. These pics are of one I set up 2 nights ago. I will take it down tuesday and put up another on wed. or thur. through the weekend for another house. In the top picture on the very right you can see the edge of my sign. This gets lit up as well so prospects can easily see where the reported demo is.

Pro-Scapes
11-20-2007, 12:13 AM
I guess I must be drawing too much attention to myself with my truck graphics and the sort. I get more of these calls than I care to, but I usually don't rule anyone out until I have had the chance to meet with them and share my presentation. Maybe one day I'll figure it out like you guys have, and somehow get only the people that are going to hire me to call. I must be too optimistic at times. I sometimes believe I could sell ice to an Eskimo...:dizzy:


I have found out more than once prequalifying via demographics is a no no. We have done over 50 fixtures for some clients you guys would never market to. Take the calls as they come Chris. It keeps your name out there. At least the phone is ringing. In the last 3 days we have gotten more inquiries than we have in the last 3 months.

pete scalia
11-20-2007, 12:53 AM
Joey... I just checked my 'close ratio' for 2007.... It was 95%. As for making more money, well I do just fine thanks.

To steal a line from one of my favorite Tv programs in the 70's- Get Smart

I find that very hard to believe.

sprinkler guy
11-20-2007, 03:44 AM
A great demo technique is to set the kit up on Thursday night or Friday night then leave it for the weekend. This way the neighbors will see it, maybe guests will see it, and the homeowners get a chance to soak it up. I encourage them to feel free to move the ligths around just to get them involved. Obviously you always want to time the demo around the gardner or landscaper coming by to do maintenenace as there will be some wiring exposed.

Joey D.


Something I've done couple of times, back when I did demos, was leave the lights up for 3 nights, then come back in the middle of the day and remove everything. Don't tell the client that they were going to be removed, just come and take them out. The minute they get home you'll get a phone call asking when the lights can be put back in.

I haven't needed to do a demo for the last year or so, but I will get right back out there with the old kit the minute work starts to slow down.

For you newer guys, Joey is offering a great resource. Talk with your local supplier, or manufacturers sales rep about helping you with a demo or two. These guys can offer you many years of experience to help get the ball rolling. Some suplliers might even have a demo kit that they rent out. This can help minimize some of your early costs as you grow your business.

Mike M
11-20-2007, 08:58 AM
The gears have been spinning since you guys started talking about multiple day demo's. I'm putting a portable weather-tight kit together. Thanks for the tips.

JoeyD
11-20-2007, 11:05 AM
Mike you dont need to worry about putting the kit togeather. My kit is exactly that. The units take the weather abuse and when they start to show signs of failure at the quick connects I can supply more or refurbish the unit. Mind you this will take years to happen. You can customize the kit for the fixtures you want but my Demo Kit is a great starting point. It is everything you need. I will start a thread over in my Unique forum that posts the flyer. I will also try and make a video of the demo kit so you guys can better see how it works.

Our sales reps have demo kits that they can loan and assist with setting up demos.

irrig8r
11-20-2007, 11:25 AM
To steal a line from one of my favorite Tv programs in the 70's- Get Smart

I find that very hard to believe.

Pete, knowing James as I do, he's not really one to boast or inflate the truth... I take what he says at face value...

And so what if it was only 90%?

I get the feeling that he is well prepared for any potential sales opportunity that comes his way. He does his homework, prequalifies his prospects in some fashion, and most of his work is from referrals...

James has a passion for this stuff that might even surpass that of our old buddy Mike G. :laugh:

JoeyD
11-20-2007, 12:20 PM
http://www.lawnsite.com/showthread.php?t=207046

INTEGRA Bespoke Lighting
11-20-2007, 12:29 PM
You gotta have PASSION for what you do man! Without it you are just another tin-man selling your wares in a cluttered marketplace.

An aside: Earlier this year my Wife and I were hosting some clients to a rather special dining experience.... I had stepped away from the table for a few minutes to speak with another client who was there... as I returned to the room and towards our table, Our guest (the Mrs.) leaned over to my Wife, touched her arm and whispered into her ear: "You just have to love the passion that James brings into the room."

It's all about the Passion!

Do you find yourself discretely walking around your friends homes during parties adjusting their dimmers, lights, lamps, shades? Then you just might have the passion.

Do you find yourself re-aiming light fixtures at public monuments? Then you might have the passion.

Have a GREAT day!

JoeyD
11-20-2007, 12:37 PM
James, you are unbelievable!

What is that a Canadian Stop Sign??

LOL

bmwsmity
11-20-2007, 08:18 PM
I would suggest keeping a demo kit on hand just in case. I'd try to sell them without the demo, but If I were you I'd probably offer to come back with the demo if I didn't close the deal on the first go-round. All in all, I do believe the customer feels they are getting more if you give them a demonstration. And I do know this much: when I did demonstrations, I stole jobs from other contractors on a daily basis (even when their price was much, much lower).

It's funny. I offer free demos online and in the yellow pages, but I've never had anyone ask for one.

Also, to date I've only lost one job to another contractor...any other estimates that didn't get sold were due to lack of financial ability on the customer's part.

Even the best demo can't sell someone that doesn't have the money, so that's wasted time.

In the case of the one job I lost to another contractor, it was because the other contractor came up with the idea of lighting the driveway from the trees, and I'm not gonna set up demo lights in trees, especially when that design idea wasn't prudent to begin with - the contractor was just a pure salesman.

I can see how a demo MAY sell someone on more lights, but I'm still leaning toward sticking with my current approach.

I should also add that I take good pics of all of my work, so I have a strong portfolio that usually hits all the design elements that the customer wants to see beforehand.

With that said, one thing I do believe in is showing customers the fixtures I will use in person. Nothing quite illustrates the quality of my products like personally handing a customer a Malibu accent and then a Unique solid brass accent.

Thanks for everyone's input thus far. Much appreciated.

bmwsmity
11-20-2007, 08:30 PM
You gotta have PASSION for what you do man! Without it you are just another tin-man selling your wares in a cluttered marketplace.

An aside: Earlier this year my Wife and I were hosting some clients to a rather special dining experience.... I had stepped away from the table for a few minutes to speak with another client who was there... as I returned to the room and towards our table, Our guest (the Mrs.) leaned over to my Wife, touched her arm and whispered into her ear: "You just have to love the passion that James brings into the room."

It's all about the Passion!

Do you find yourself discretely walking around your friends homes during parties adjusting their dimmers, lights, lamps, shades? Then you just might have the passion.

Do you find yourself re-aiming light fixtures at public monuments? Then you might have the passion.

Have a GREAT day!

I couldn't agree more my man.

There is a restaurant by my home that has multiple wattage lights/ burned out lights, and mis-aimed lights that looks terrible. When I talked to the manager, and discovered his total lack of concern for the eyesore, I even offered to keep the lights looking good for free. I can't STAND when I see lights looking terrible.

I've not adjusted any public monument lights yet....but that's mostly due to my not having the tools on hand :laugh:

Passion is the reason I don't do christmas lights or irrigation...i feel total indifference for these things. I could make more money yes, but ultimately it would never grow because I've got no passion for those things.

Who wants to go through life being bored with their occupation? Not I.

INTEGRA Bespoke Lighting
11-20-2007, 08:33 PM
James, you are unbelievable!

What is that a Canadian Stop Sign??

LOL

That, my friend is nothing less then the "Big Nickel" in Sudbury Ontario. It is a massive re-creation of the 1951 5 cent piece. It stands above the town, over an abandoned Nickel mine shaft that now operates as a museum.

This ends my sideline career of tour guide and attractions promoter...

Have a great day.

The Lighting Geek
11-20-2007, 09:04 PM
I think that the formula for a successful landscape lighting career must include a true passion for the craft.

It could be said that a man with tremendous passion and little skill might beat out a man with tremendous skill and little passion.

Chris J
11-20-2007, 09:25 PM
The gears have been spinning since you guys started talking about multiple day demo's. I'm putting a portable weather-tight kit together. Thanks for the tips.

This is going against everything I believe in when it comes to a demo. No doubt that a multiple day demo would be a great presentation and teaser method, but if I were going to do this I would absolutely have to spend some serious cash so that I could have multiple kits going at once. It's bad enough only getting to do one demo per night. I can't imagine only having one demo kit and leaving it at ONE homeowners house for multiple days. This just seems to inefficient for my taste, but I bet it works well (just not frequently enough).

Chris J
11-20-2007, 09:30 PM
I have found out more than once prequalifying via demographics is a no no. We have done over 50 fixtures for some clients you guys would never market to. Take the calls as they come Chris. It keeps your name out there. At least the phone is ringing. In the last 3 days we have gotten more inquiries than we have in the last 3 months.

Who said anything about prequalifying by demographic? I go to see almost everyone that calls me. As I have stated before, I do lots of small jobs and I like them (especially in the summer). We did one today that was only 23 lights (front and back). Started at 7:30, out of there by 1:30. We would have finished earlier if it hadn't been for the 35' wide driveway :cry:

The Lighting Geek
11-20-2007, 10:00 PM
This is going against everything I believe in when it comes to a demo. No doubt that a multiple day demo would be a great presentation and teaser method, but if I were going to do this I would absolutely have to spend some serious cash so that I could have multiple kits going at once. It's bad enough only getting to do one demo per night. I can't imagine only having one demo kit and leaving it at ONE homeowners house for multiple days. This just seems to inefficient for my taste, but I bet it works well (just not frequently enough).

Now you know why I have so many..LOL. It really is fun to take it back during the day and to get the 'call'. 'when can you put those back?' There needs to balance in everything as you said before. I try to have a demo going all the time, I then tell the other prospects that I meet during the day to go look, thereby maximizing my demo. I also doorhang 10 houses in every direction. I also try not to demo backyards if I can for the obvious reasons.

You are right Chris, balance is the secret. .....and passion.

pete scalia
11-20-2007, 10:46 PM
An aside: Earlier this year my Wife and I were hosting some clients to a rather special dining experience.... I had stepped away from the table for a few minutes to speak with another client who was there... as I returned to the room and towards our table, Our guest (the Mrs.) leaned over to my Wife, touched her arm and whispered into her ear: "You just have to love the passion that James brings into the room."

I think I am absolutely going to be sick to my stomach now. This has got to be a joke but somehow I don't think it was meant to be. Nobody could possibly be so full of themselves. It's just not possible.

When I read over compensatory things like this I can only think of one thing. The time when my wife had her friend and her husband over . The guy was so attentive and doted on the wife's every move. The wife seemed to reciprocate. From the outside they looked like everything in their life was great AND THEY WHERE THE MOST HAPPILY MARRIED COUPLE IN THE WORLD. Not more than 6 months later they were seperated and in another six months divorced. Things aren't always what they seem as much as some would love to put on a fake front to make them appear so.

Chris J
11-20-2007, 10:47 PM
It sounds like you have a good thing going Tommy. Keep up the hard work; I may need a job one day cause I'm gettin old!

Chris J
11-20-2007, 10:55 PM
An aside: Earlier this year my Wife and I were hosting some clients to a rather special dining experience.... I had stepped away from the table for a few minutes to speak with another client who was there... as I returned to the room and towards our table, Our guest (the Mrs.) leaned over to my Wife, touched her arm and whispered into her ear: "You just have to love the passion that James brings into the room."

I think I am absolutely going to be sick to my stomach now. This has got to be a joke but somehow I don't think it was meant to be. Nobody could possibly be so full of themselves. It's just not possible.

When I read over compensatory things like this I can only think of one thing. The time when my wife had her friend and her husband over . The guy was so attentive and doted on the wife's every move. The wife seemed to reciprocate. From the outside they looked like everything in their life was great AND THEY WHERE THE MOST HAPPILY MARRIED COUPLE IN THE WORLD. Not more than 6 months later they were seperated and in another six months divorced. Things aren't always what they seem as much as some would love to put on a fake front to make them appear so.

Pete,
Why do you get so offended and jealous when others are more successful than you? Does it really affect your life if the guy is telling the truth or not? Just let it go. I believe him because I have no reason not to. Even if I didn't believe him, I'd still allow him to flatter himself, and feel good about himself, because it doesn't hurt me one little bit. You have obviously found another person to pick on, and that's good for me, but will you just please stop it short this time?

bmwsmity
11-21-2007, 10:38 AM
Pete,

Posts like that have caused me to SERIOUSLY cut down on my time reading posts on here. Hell, 8 pages later, I've just got around to reading the responses to my OP because I saw bickering early on and didn't feel like wading through the crap to get to the actual information.

If you aren't going to contribute to the actual topic at hand, then please refrain from posting anything. All it does is waste everyone's precious time and clutter up the board with meaningless garbage that brings everyone down.

I didn't realize this was a board for teenage girls.

Oh wait, IT'S NOT!