Property Size

[rcreech]

As you have seen by my posts recently I am looking at taking my business to the next step and growing.

That means all I do is think and worry about it. :dizzy:

That brings me to my question:

What property size do you like to shoot for? I have picked up a majority of my lawns by word of mouth so I have no way of picking the size of the property. But if I am marking I can have more say over the size of the lawn.

I love big lawns....but know there can be more money in the smaller ones. I have several $1200+ customers...but if a couple of them would leave me it would hurt. I would like to spread out my risk and get more smaller lawns.

I have mostly larger property sizes with my avg being 25K. That is over about 240 customers. A lot of my lawns are an acre+, but I do have some 7K, 15K and so on to bring my avg down.

I am thinking about trying to market more in the sub division like homes where lawns are 7 to 10K. Just about all my lawns are within 7-10 miles from my home...but I would like to get in town and get VERY concentrated.

More money, get more lawns done in a day and less supplies!

What do you guys think? What is your favorite size lawn? Where do you feel the most money can be made?

Thanks,

RC

[Shades of Green LService]

As you have seen by my posts recently I am looking at taking my business to the next step and growing.

That means all I do is think and worry about it. :dizzy:

That brings me to my question:

What property size do you like to shoot for? I have picked up a majority of my lawns by word of mouth so I have no way of picking the size of the property. But if I am marking I can have more say over the size of the lawn.

I love big lawns....but know there can be more money in the smaller ones. I have several $1200+ customers...but if a couple of them would leave me it would hurt. I would like to spread out my risk and get more smaller lawns.

I have mostly larger property sizes with my avg being 25K. That is over about 240 customers. A lot of my lawns are an acre+, but I do have some 7K, 15K and so on to bring my avg down.

I am thinking about trying to market more in the sub division like homes where lawns are 7 to 10K. Just about all my lawns are within 7-10 miles from my home...but I would like to get in town and get VERY concentrated.

More money, get more lawns done in a day and less supplies!

What do you guys think? What is your favorite size lawn? Where do you feel the most money can be made?

Thanks,

RC

My biggest lawn is 12,000 and the rest are 1,000 -8,000 on average. i set a minimum charge, tell the small ones that i will put them at the minimum and they are usually happy with that. I'm there 5-10 mins or so and on to the next one. I think the small ones are more profitable and easier to stay on top of.

[beano]

I personally love the individual homeowners that have 2 or 3 acres. I can ride, usually dont have more than 15 minutes of trimming to do and they pay pretty well. Thats where i make most of my money. Not a lot of overhead and usually maximum profit.

[RigglePLC]

Numerous small lawns--not good. Time consuming--spend more time driving, writing the invoices, doing the sales, bookwork and collecting. Min charge should be at least 25 to 30 per ap. True--the fertilizer usage is low--but the time consumed is high--unless they are really concentrated. You have to do about 30 to hit production sales of $750 per day.

[ampeg76]

Numerous small lawns--not good. Time consuming--spend more time driving, writing the invoices, doing the sales, bookwork and collecting. Min charge should be at least 25 to 30 per ap. True--the fertilizer usage is low--but the time consumed is high--unless they are really concentrated. You have to do about 30 to hit production sales of $750 per day.

i suddenly feel good about being able to charge $40 for 3-4,000 sqft.:)

[rcreech]

Numerous small lawns--not good. Time consuming--spend more time driving, writing the invoices, doing the sales, bookwork and collecting. Min charge should be at least 25 to 30 per ap. True--the fertilizer usage is low--but the time consumed is high--unless they are really concentrated. You have to do about 30 to hit production sales of $750 per day.

I don't really don't want the small $30 lawns as I use a PG...I was thinking of in the 7-10K range where I would be in the $45-55 range. Most of the new plat homes around here are in that range I think.

[MStine315]

I guess I like a mix. I don't know if I'd actually pick one or the other, as they all have their own unique circumstances. Acre+ lawns are great. Lower customer count, fewer people to "deal with." But....lower profit margin. Just the opposite with smaller lawns. Higher profit margin, true, but higher customer count, more customer service. The smaller the lawn, the more picky the people, too. In other words, don't put all your eggs in one basket.

[GrazerZ]

Size is not an issue for me. I look for route density. Thats how you will make the most of your time.

[rcreech]

Size is not an issue for me. I look for route density. Thats how you will make the most of your time.

Totally agree, as we don't make money driving around, and I think everyone knows that...but that isn't the question here!

First you have to get into new neighborhoods before you can grow density! That is where I am now and why I asked the question.


Once you get into a new neighborhood, and they see you, the lawn improve, plus some cloverleafing that is the way to grow density! But we can't put the cart before the horse!

[Ric]

Creech

I believe you have the cart before the horse with your question. Business is Business and Mickey D's is the most successful franchise because they do their Market research first before opening another store. Study the Demographics of your Marketing area as well as the Expendable income of those areas before deciding which market to approach. There can be a good profit margin in both big lawns and small if approached in a business like manner. Small lawns require a higher density but can be very profitable.

In my own case I service two different markets with success in both. One is the smaller fine lawn in upscale water front neighborhoods at a premium price. The other is straight Fire Ant control in working class neighborhoods at a low ball price. I use two different trucks but the company name is the same. Fire Ant control has low material costs but high competition because of the profit margin. Low ball pricing means more clients with less advertising cost and therefore higher profits. Fine Lawns is higher material cost, more head aches, but better customer retention when TG/CL low balls my price. I realizes you don't have the Fire Ant Problem in Ohio that we have in the South. However I use my own experience to make my point about researching your market's demands. Study the DEMAND of your market and then design a program that fills that need at a profit in your pocket. Be PROACTIVE not REACTIVE in your quest to increase your business.

[GrazerZ]

To answer you more directly, I would have to say that I like the lawns in the 20k range. They pay close to as much as an acre but use half the materials.
My favorites are the lawns that we do a full and I mean full program on.
Example:
4 ferts
2 crabs
broadleafs as needed
surface insects
grubs
pre emerg in beds
post emerg in beds
lime app
aeration & overseeding
gypsum (coastal salt- on the ocean)
2x fert trees and shrubs
See what I mean. There is alot more at a house than grass. Upsell what you have and you may not need more customers.

[rcreech]

Ric,

Good to hear from you! Its been a while!

Not sure how I put the cart in front of the horse with my question...but my question isn't real clear as I was just wanting to get you guys take on different lawn sizes. I talk to so many people that do ALL small lawns and I pretty much do ALL big lawns.

I will take any size lawn as it is all good money...but was wanting to focus more on smaller lawns. Feel I can make more $$$/hour.

Thanks for your input!


Grazer Z,

Good points on the upsell! This is something that I have not pushed. I put info in my newsletters, but don't try to "push" added services. Could probably to a better job there!

[Grandview]

I agree with GrazerZ. Density is more important than size. I have a couple dense routes. One the lawns average 7-8K. The other averages 20-25K. I also have some high density areas in the acre range. They are all very profitable routes. I also think the 20-25K lawns are my most profitable. They only take a couple more minutes than a 10K, but close to twice the money.

[Ric]

rcreech

You are backward in your question Because you are asking what to SUPPLY not what your area DEMANDS. Everyone here has a different market and each market has a different demand. By studying your market's demands you can then supply a service that best fills that demand. If you feel small yards are unprofitable because of lack of density, Then either work on increasing density or drop those accounts.

Case in Point was my marketing Fire Ant Control in working class neighbors. For years I only serviced FINE YARDS. Fire Ant Control is a very large market that is very competitive. However because there is so much DEMAND for Fire Ant Control, the Market is still open. Advantages to this type of service is the lack of training required for employees. The Lack of large diverse inventories of chemicals. The down side is competition and high advertising costs. My Education and years of Experience might be wasted doing Fire Ant Control, But this is a business and profit is the bottom line.

So Back to my Original point. WHAT DOES YOUR MARKET DEMAND, Big or Small Yards. BTW I am still doing Fine Yards, I just targeted a NEW market to increase my bottom line.

[GrazerZ]

I agree with ric about looking closely at your market. I have a friend who ran a apps business up north and their average lawn was 1 acre and over. The area was just more rural with folks who like nice lawns. They would do pallet after pallet in a day with a tractor and vicon and did great with it. It would'nt work for me though, just a different market.
I would also note that if you can, in targeting a specific market also isolate your competition you are also better off as well. For example, what if you were the go to guy for large lawns and were set up to do what others could not do well. If all the other guys in your area can only do smaller stuff them you could have the ticket. Or you are the only one that also does flea and tick apps. But you will have to do some hard thinking on that one. One of the very reasons we started doing apps was that everyone was mowing. Every year I would see more and more of them like ants. But I did'nt see more guys doing apps. Now we do less and less maintenance every year and feed off the guys doing the mowing.

[MStine315]

Great point Grazer. I see a few more guys offering perimeter pest control as well as mosquito control. These niche services have the potential to be very highly profitable and not many offer these services. In 5 years many more will, but the forward thinkers will keep finding those niche markets, and most importantly, marketing those specialty services to their existing client base, as an earlier poster mentioned.

[rcreech]

Ric and Grazer,

Thanks for your input! I agree with you totally! And I know that one needs to know their market, and I understand what you are saying about the specializing!

I guess my question wasn't as clear as I thought it was!

I guess what I was asking is say you have a neighborhood of 300 4K homes, a neighborhood of 300 10K homes or a neighborhood of 300 20K homes....which one would you do for?

Guess maybe it was a stupid question, but just wanted to see what you all were doing and having the most success with!


Thanks,
RC

[GrazerZ]

I did answer you in that I would want the 20k lawns. But I would look at it a little no, alot closer than that. I would see which group of homes had in it people who cared about their houses or which on was saturated by competition, or othe factors like those.

[Angel Garcia]

I like small yards, usually 20 to 30 min doing the lawn, but I don't like the ones with small gate in the back takes more time , and yeah small yard in the same neighborhoods means moneyyy $$$$

[whoopassonthebluegrass]

Rodney:
I suspect you already know what my answer is, but I'll spell it out anyhow.

Density is key, definitely. That being present, the smaller the better. There's nothing better than charging full price for a half sized yard.

That being said, you're over-equipped for such tactics. But there's always that Model 75 Spyker!! :clapping::clapping::clapping:

[Ric]

Rodney:
I suspect you already know what my answer is, but I'll spell it out anyhow.

Density is key, definitely. That being present, the smaller the better. There's nothing better than charging full price for a half sized yard.

That being said, you're over-equipped for such tactics. But there's always that Model 75 Spyker!! :clapping::clapping::clapping:

Whoop


BINGO