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americanlawn
02-12-2008, 08:01 PM
It will be a cold day in hell before my company buys foreign trucks over AMERICAN.:usflag:

Recent news stories show that Jap trucks are becoming more popular than "American" trucks. Well.........Count me out for foreign vehicals. We'll buy AMERICAN every time!

Anybody else sticking up for our Country? rscvp, americanlawn:usflag::canadaflag:

Lawnworks
02-12-2008, 08:20 PM
How about a chevy w4500?

Jason Rose
02-12-2008, 08:30 PM
Best of luck buying an "American made" Truck or car... Even if it's assembled here, the majority of the parts are from foreign countries. I read/have heard that the Toyota Tundras are more American made than the Chevy or Ford trucks. Dodges are just made in Mexico, lol.

goodbeus
02-12-2008, 08:43 PM
My wife's 2003 Honda Odyssey was built in Alabama...sure the profits may go to Japan, but it was American workers that built it...and all car manufacturer's are inter-twined...Ford/Mazda, Chevrolet/Isuzu/, Dodge/Mitsubishi..

jsaunders
02-12-2008, 09:16 PM
Dude you need to chill out and have a beer- Everything is a world maket now- All of my Fords have so many 'Made in Mexico' parts.

SimonCX
02-12-2008, 09:37 PM
Where have you been living? I don't think there is one american car, truck, motorcycle that is all american parts.

MJK
02-12-2008, 09:42 PM
You guys have no idea, I'm from Detroit MI and you can see the effect on the area from people like you that are buying from none American companies. Everyone that wants to argue about it should come see in it SE MI for themselves. It’s not just the auto makers them selves, it’s the thousands of other companies that make and design parts for the big three. I won't drive foreign, if my clients aren't working, I'm not working. I'm with you American Lawn, we all should buy american.

MJK
02-12-2008, 09:47 PM
Where have you been living? I don't think there is one american car, truck, motorcycle that is all american parts.

Now why do you think that is? Let’s think about it for minute. The big 3 can no longer afford to make the parts in America, thus the hundreds and thousands of shops/machine shops in my area closing, causing thousands of people to lose great paying jobs.

Total Landscape Solutions
02-12-2008, 09:57 PM
MJK
Thank your local union

Lawnworks
02-12-2008, 10:00 PM
MJK
Thank your local union

BINGO!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Lawn Enforcer
02-12-2008, 10:07 PM
Best of luck buying an "American made" Truck or car... Even if it's assembled here, the majority of the parts are from foreign countries. I read/have heard that the Toyota Tundras are more American made than the Chevy or Ford trucks. Dodges are just made in Mexico, lol.

Mexico, last time I checked, St. Louis, Missouri is not in Mexico. My truck was assembled at the St. Louis Assembly Plant, not in Mexico.

MJK
02-12-2008, 10:10 PM
LOL why, they have done nothing but allow people to make a decent living.

QualityLawnCare4u
02-12-2008, 10:12 PM
I was going to throw my .02 cents worth in but I'm leaving this one alone:waving:

KTM
02-12-2008, 10:13 PM
Thank your union is right on! There is a GM plant in my town, We always call it Generous Motors. I like to buy American too but, the big three did it to themselves. I love talking to the honest retirees around here and all the good slack off stories like, clocking in and going home or to one of the 4 bars within walking distance doing nothing on GM's money and time

MJK
02-12-2008, 10:14 PM
The Unions only made it safer for workers to work in the plants, allowed these workers to get benefits and make a decent wage. This worked for years and years before, until everyone started to buy the Toyotas and such.

MJK
02-12-2008, 10:15 PM
Thank your union is right on! There is a GM plant in my town, We always call it Generous Motors. I like to buy American too but, the big three did it to themselves. I love talking to the honest retirees around here and all the good slack off stories like, clocking in and going home or to one of the 4 bars within walking distance doing nothing on GM's money and time

Dude, there are bad apples every place you go. For every bad guy or took advantage, there were 5 more working honest.

Jason Rose
02-12-2008, 10:21 PM
Mexico, last time I checked, St. Louis, Missouri is not in Mexico. My truck was assembled at the St. Louis Assembly Plant, not in Mexico.

Well, Mine (Dodge) has "made in mexico" on it... and I have not researched it further than that... I was also told that's where their plant is. Perhaps there's more than one plant?

barefeetny
02-12-2008, 10:24 PM
my DD toyota was built in the usa

so was the s10 i owned prior

Sad but true the tacoma is 3 times the truck that s10 rattlebox ever was... gets better mileage, and is built more solid....

i own 3 1 ton trucks for the buisness... 2 fords and a gmc

if toyota ever makes a 1 ton they will steal alot of the market and force the big 3 to stop being stupid

HERE IS A FACT THAT MOST DON'T KNOW

toyota learned efficiency from GM Ford and Dodge during the late 60s

they took what they saw at detriot and went back to japan and fixed all the shortcomings in the system and went to work

do a search for TpS a lean manufacturing process... they are lean and efficient and the big 3.... waste like there is no tommorow...

my ford was built in the usa with parts made in mexico and canada.... that was 18 years ago.. do you think its more or less in 2008

KTM
02-12-2008, 10:30 PM
MJK, There are good unions out there a good freind is a UPS driver I would say that is a fair union. I grew up in this town GM used to be the biggest employer now I think it is 2nd There are many hard working people that work or have retired from GM but, A big majority are spoiled by the job. Now that they don't get the overtime like they used to the job is not as good paying. I want GM to make money when they do I do. they are always threatening to leave town and if they did it would not be good. BTW there is a bar in the parking lot down there!!!

SimonCX
02-12-2008, 10:34 PM
Now why do you think that is? Letís think about it for minute. The big 3 can no longer afford to make the parts in America, thus the hundreds and thousands of shops/machine shops in my area closing, causing thousands of people to lose great paying jobs.

Not all of that is true, most of the big corp's are too greedy. Look at some the the wages the top guys get, 5-10 million bonus for the ceo and 5 others like him that do nothing but they can't afford to give workers insurance, that's BS. The problem is the top guys don't care what happens as long as it brings them a bigger check and if that means out sourcing then thats what they will do. I support all the factory workers, and yes I drive a ford and will replace it with another ford but I am getting tried of all the china half A$$ products.

GravelyGuy
02-12-2008, 10:35 PM
People are buying foreign for a reason. Vehicles are a big investment these days and people want to spend there money the best way that they can.

I think it's terrible that people are losing their jobs, but you have to look out for yourself. Oh and another thing, my dad was union for a while and he told me some great stories about about what "a days work" consisted of for some of the guys he worked with.

mverick
02-12-2008, 10:41 PM
Well, I buy American.

But, I like to hire Mexicans to cut my grass. They work harder and don't goof off as much as the kids that want to cut my lawn. They actually do a quality job for less money.

So, keep buying the Toyota's boy's.

jsaunders
02-12-2008, 11:04 PM
Gm $3+BILLION in losses this last quarter. Don't blame people for buying other vechiles and people losing they jobs- GM did it from the inside out (+ they had UGLY cars for how long now?)

cutbetterthanyou
02-13-2008, 12:11 AM
Not all of that is true, most of the big corp's are too greedy. Look at some the the wages the top guys get, 5-10 million bonus for the ceo and 5 others like him that do nothing but they can't afford to give workers insurance, that's BS. The problem is the top guys don't care what happens as long as it brings them a bigger check and if that means out sourcing then thats what they will do. I support all the factory workers, and yes I drive a ford and will replace it with another ford but I am getting tried of all the china half A$$ products.

I really don't want to get into this debate, but how can you call stuff made buy the Chinese half A$$. A ford is dead by 150k when most foreign stuff runs 300k w/ nothing but a oil change. My opinion isn't really one way or another but i wouldn't call the foreign 1/2 A$$ if anything I would think they are built better

GSPHUNTER
02-13-2008, 12:25 AM
No offense to anyone who has done it, because I have, but assembly line jobs are not meant to be extremely high paying jobs. It doesn't take much to run a line, which I have done. Like many unions, they try to over value the employees working in lower skilled jobs.

Another fact about unions, is that in the end more people end up unemployed because of them. Companies are forced to pay more than they would to current employees due to union pressure. This keeps them from hiring more employees. This is an economic fact.

Scag48
02-13-2008, 01:31 AM
Toyota is assembling a large number of their vehicles in the US.

Cooter
02-13-2008, 02:47 AM
The foreign cars that you say last 300k are not even the same or comparable to what the big 3 are making. They are now making cars that are comparable. Lets see how long they will last.

SpruceLandscape
02-13-2008, 02:47 AM
No offense to anyone who has done it, because I have, but assembly line jobs are not meant to be extremely high paying jobs. It doesn't take much to run a line, which I have done. Like many unions, they try to over value the employees working in lower skilled jobs.

Another fact about unions, is that in the end more people end up unemployed because of them. Companies are forced to pay more than they would to current employees due to union pressure. This keeps them from hiring more employees. This is an economic fact.

Unfortunately I have to agree with this statement to a certain extent. I myself am a union man, but I agree that the auto unions are paying certain jobs way more than they should. I've been a full time professional firefighter and paramedic for almost 8 years. I've worked for the auto suppliers on lines that made sheet metal blanks for the big 3 to turn into fenders, doors, floor pans, etc. In the 8 years I have been in the IAFF, I have NEVER made as much money as a lot of the guys working at the Ford engine plant or the GM assembly plant near us. I'm not complaining about what I make, it was my choice and I'm happy with it. But I do think there is something smells a little foul when I work 50 hours per week plus upwards of 190 hours per year in overtime and don't even come close to what these guys are pulling... Couple that with all the training and Continuing Education I have to keep up on to keep my certifications, its kind of a slap in the face... I'm not saying that none of those guys earn their money, I'm just saying it kinda makes these guys look greedy.

Blyth
02-13-2008, 11:13 AM
I believe there is a Toyota plant in San Antonio.. fwiw.

KTM
02-13-2008, 11:27 AM
A person working on the line at GM in this town makes enough to support A family that lives very well. That is all changing now, there trying to buy out all the people That have been there at least a few years and replace them. If you get hired in now you don't make near the money or the benefit's that they were offering just a few years ago, and I think this is a long time coming. The hole that the big 3 are in are there own fault's I just hope they all pull out of it. Yes, Toyota has plants in the U.S. but there not near the jobs that the big 3 union job's are. Sad but true, there learning from Toyota.

MarcSmith
02-13-2008, 11:52 AM
The foreign cars that you say last 300k are not even the same or comparable to what the big 3 are making. Your right. the foreign companies were making much better products then. I'll put an 87 Sentra/civic/Camry up against a 87 cavalier/escort/omni. foreign will come out ahead every time.

Light trucks....I loved my s-10 until it threw a rod A 180k....I'll take a toyo any day...

of course I currently own a Chevy tracker(Suzuki) and a Pontiac Montana...both under 100K so time will tell....

DA Quality Lawn & YS
02-13-2008, 11:54 AM
I'm on board with americanlawn. Will always buy vehicles (incl. my work vehicle) made by American companies. All of my GM vehicles have always held up very well, all over 150K miles, with regular maint. Yes I know there are foreign parts in American made vehs, but its the concept that I want to support American companies. I don't like to 'ride the wave' and let the media manipulate my thinking.

MarcSmith
02-13-2008, 12:54 PM
I don't like to 'ride the wave' and let the media manipulate my thinking.But you'll let an "american" company manipulate your thinking.....I don't see the difference.

gm has 110 plants world wide 57 of which are outside the USA.....and thats not counting, plants from other companies they own. Please don't let gm fool you into thinking that they are "all american" they'd sellout all their american employees faster than you be be able to cash their buyout check. OOPS already happening

"Troubled by sliding U.S. sales and the subprime lending crunch, General Motors Corp. yesterday announced a new buyout offer to all 74,000 of its unionized workers to cut costs.

The company will offer payments of as much as $62,500 for employees who leave their positions and $140,000 for those who agree to surrender their future retirement benefits. Under terms of the new United Auto Worker contract reached last fall, GM can replace departing workers with significantly lower-priced laborers."

And a bit over one year ago ford offered to buy-out 74000 employee's, and last year chysler offered up buy-out to 50K employee's

If they are so american, they'd shut down or kick folks out of the plants that are not on US soil....


I do have some background in GM as a GM dealership has been in my family since the 30's.

a little toyota history....Toyota directly employed around 34,675 people in the United States, invested USD $15.5 billion, produced 1.2 million vehicles using US and foreign auto parts, sold 2.54 million vehicles, and donated USD $340 million to nonprofits. [18] It has in total 10 plants, USD $2.9 billion per year payroll, purchased USD $28 billion in parts and supplies from 30 states. It created around 386,000 jobs in the United States as result of Toyota's spending and demand from suppliers. It celebrated its 50th year anniversary in the United States in 2007 [19]

I don't here much of forgein companies laying off folks or buy them out of the retirement packages....

SimonCX
02-13-2008, 01:24 PM
I really don't want to get into this debate, but how can you call stuff made buy the Chinese half A$$. A ford is dead by 150k when most foreign stuff runs 300k w/ nothing but a oil change. My opinion isn't really one way or another but i wouldn't call the foreign 1/2 A$$ if anything I would think they are built better

Yes most china products are half A$$, foreign cars like honda, nissan, subura, mazda, toyota are all Japan not china. Japan has a high standard of living compared to china. I was not saying all foreign cars are half a$$ I was stating most products from china are, just take a look at how many toys were recalled because of lead all were from china. When it comes to getting a hd truck I would go with the big 3, but cars I would go foreign.

mowing grass 1111
02-13-2008, 02:42 PM
if toyota started making a 3/4 - 1 ton diesel i would trade my f 250 in a heartbeat

Scag48
02-13-2008, 03:25 PM
I don't understand why some folks cannot grasp the Japanese way of doing business. They are better business people than we, as Americans, are by a long shot. We introduced them to ISO 9000 but they have perfected it to a level that we didn't, good for them. I'm all for American, I'm a union heavy equipment operator, you can't outsource my skills and I'd fight to defend this country. But, the Japanese haven't done anything wrong. The big three did this to themselves in the 80's when Japanese became popular, nobody thought they would ever make it anywhere. Instead, we should have spent more time raising our standards. That Japanese just did it for us, now the big three has to catch up in a race they've been losing since the mid '90s.

If you need a 3/4 ton or 1 ton diesel truck, obviously Toyota will not cover your needs, yet. But, in the 1/2 ton and compact truck class, they build some of the nicest trucks around. I'll be buying a Tacoma soon, I love my '94 Ford, but Toyota builds a great truck. Obviously, if you buy new, who cares, you're covered under a warranty. I will not have that pleasure, I will be buying used and it's known fact that most Toyota trucks will go to 200K very, very easily with only regular maintenance. Only a select few American made trucks could ever say that.

Stillwater
02-13-2008, 03:44 PM
I really don't want to get into this debate, but how can you call stuff made buy the Chinese half A$$. A ford is dead by 150k when most foreign stuff runs 300k w/ nothing but a oil change. My opinion isn't really one way or another but i wouldn't call the foreign 1/2 A$$ if anything I would think they are built better

Dude the chinese can't even make pet food with out killing our beloved pets 14,000 American pets were killed last year due to wheat gluton imported from china. do you not read or listen to the news? where have you been?

Toys, Millions have been recalled in the last 6 months alone to prevent our children from being poisoned. Date rape drugs found in plastic toys made for 3 year olds sure the chinese can make stuff but it is CRAP don't even try to defend them

KTM
02-13-2008, 04:05 PM
In Japan's defense I think we need to separate Them when we are talking about Japan and China, China does build a lot of sh*t, Japan does not. You might as well call Japan west America. I always here about how there economy is struggling too.

MJK
02-13-2008, 04:28 PM
There is no point in chiming in anymore because most people are completely oblivious to the situation.

All of you guys who drive foreign cars and trucks and say that the big 3 brought it on themselves, I laugh at you when you complain about Landscapers lowball you. Think about that for a little bit.

barefeetny
02-13-2008, 04:39 PM
i don't want to fight

but a tacoma is more expensive then a ranger, a colorado and dodge.....

thats right dodge dosn't even make a small truck

lowballers....You pay for quality.....

the big 3 have to start offering a better product.... not what they think people want but what people need

a half chevy ton pickup with 345 horse.... yeah gas is 3 dollars a gallon
a hemi thats really not a hemi

at least ford still makes a real work truck.....and ford used to be my least favorite brand.. now i buy every 1988-1996 non powerstroke1 ton i can get my hands on cheap

if Toyota builds a real 1 ton with work truck options... no rosewood and leather... they will destroy the big 3 and they will never get that market back

I would buy a new big 3 truck if they would just offer what i want...

Idealtim
02-13-2008, 08:33 PM
Just a few thoghts....


#1-The big 3 have to stop building some of the ugliest trucks in history.(2008, all of them IMO.)
#2-The big 3 should come out with some new ideas other than new trim and 30 more hp than last years model.
#3-When the toyota diesels come out, and i'm sure they will, the big 3 has to offer some knock out incentives.



Too many people drive pickups like cars, I think it dilutes the market for people that actually work a truck. Prime example, chev 2500's, extremely popular truck that rides like a damn car. They have nice light springs for an easy ride, great untill dust settles in the bed and makes it sag lol.

Stillwater
02-13-2008, 11:20 PM
There is no point in chiming in anymore because most people are completely oblivious to the situation.

All of you guys who drive foreign cars and trucks and say that the big 3 brought it on themselves, I laugh at you when you complain about Landscapers lowball you. Think about that for a little bit.


:drinkup::drinkup::drinkup:

Lawnworks
02-14-2008, 08:37 AM
There is no point in chiming in anymore because most people are completely oblivious to the situation.

All of you guys who drive foreign cars and trucks and say that the big 3 brought it on themselves, I laugh at you when you complain about Landscapers lowball you. Think about that for a little bit.

When did Toyotas and Hondas become cheaper than the big 3?

cutbetterthanyou
02-14-2008, 09:29 AM
In Japan's defense I think we need to separate Them when we are talking about Japan and China, China does build a lot of sh*t, Japan does not. You might as well call Japan west America. I always here about how there economy is struggling too.

When i posted earlier i didn't know this. i thought they were one in the same. so disregard my comment from earlier. My thought was when i heard "the Chinese is 1/2 a$$" i took it as anything made over there. I wasn't aware there was a difference, but i do know that alot of the cars and trucks from over there(asia) run forever when when alot from over here can't make it out of warranty before they blow up.

TXNSLighting
02-14-2008, 09:58 AM
i don't want to fight

but a tacoma is more expensive then a ranger, a colorado and dodge.....

thats right dodge dosn't even make a small truck

lowballers....You pay for quality.....

the big 3 have to start offering a better product.... not what they think people want but what people need

a half chevy ton pickup with 345 horse.... yeah gas is 3 dollars a gallon
a hemi thats really not a hemi

at least ford still makes a real work truck.....and ford used to be my least favorite brand.. now i buy every 1988-1996 non powerstroke1 ton i can get my hands on cheap

if Toyota builds a real 1 ton with work truck options... no rosewood and leather... they will destroy the big 3 and they will never get that market back

I would buy a new big 3 truck if they would just offer what i want...

have you never seen the dakota? and yes the hemi is really a hemi...your not all there are ya?

AI Inc
02-14-2008, 10:00 AM
I really don't want to get into this debate, but how can you call stuff made buy the Chinese half A$$. A ford is dead by 150k when most foreign stuff runs 300k w/ nothing but a oil change. My opinion isn't really one way or another but i wouldn't call the foreign 1/2 A$$ if anything I would think they are built better

Realy? I just sold a f 250 with 186k on it. Still a great work truck. Have a f 350 with 160 on it that I work for another 2 yrs.

TXNSLighting
02-14-2008, 10:01 AM
And yes im with an american lawn. you will never see me on a nissan dealer lot toyota or any of those. Ford GM and dodge, are the only companies that will ever get my money, why? because they build a quality product!!! Ive never had a ford let me down! even if it broke some how, it never left me stranded! Now my gm is looking quite positive, 20 mpg! cant beat it!

AI Inc
02-14-2008, 10:02 AM
But you'll let an "american" company manipulate your thinking.....I don't see the difference.

gm has 110 plants world wide 57 of which are outside the USA.....and thats not counting, plants from other companies they own. Please don't let gm fool you into thinking that they are "all american" they'd sellout all their american employees faster than you be be able to cash their buyout check. OOPS already happening

"Troubled by sliding U.S. sales and the subprime lending crunch, General Motors Corp. yesterday announced a new buyout offer to all 74,000 of its unionized workers to cut costs.

The company will offer payments of as much as $62,500 for employees who leave their positions and $140,000 for those who agree to surrender their future retirement benefits. Under terms of the new United Auto Worker contract reached last fall, GM can replace departing workers with significantly lower-priced laborers."

And a bit over one year ago ford offered to buy-out 74000 employee's, and last year chysler offered up buy-out to 50K employee's

If they are so american, they'd shut down or kick folks out of the plants that are not on US soil....


I do have some background in GM as a GM dealership has been in my family since the 30's.

a little toyota history....Toyota directly employed around 34,675 people in the United States, invested USD $15.5 billion, produced 1.2 million vehicles using US and foreign auto parts, sold 2.54 million vehicles, and donated USD $340 million to nonprofits. [18] It has in total 10 plants, USD $2.9 billion per year payroll, purchased USD $28 billion in parts and supplies from 30 states. It created around 386,000 jobs in the United States as result of Toyota's spending and demand from suppliers. It celebrated its 50th year anniversary in the United States in 2007 [19]

I don't here much of forgein companies laying off folks or buy them out of the retirement packages....

Toyota isnt carrying the retirement weight that GM is.GM has 3.7 retirees in the backseat for every 2 working. No company can handle that bill.

MarcSmith
02-14-2008, 10:16 AM
The current-production "HEMI" combustion chamber is not truly hemispherical; it is flatter and more complex than the 1950s-'70s Hemi V8 chamber.

and the dakota is not a smallpickup truck....it is a mid size, with nearly 20" in extra length and 5" in width over the smaller pickup trucks. so its lik saying a chevette is a station wagon....Oh and the dakota has a twin sister the Mitsubishi raider.....so even if you buy mistu-you are buying dodge, or if you are buying dodge are you buying mistu....

GravelyGuy
02-14-2008, 12:52 PM
And yes im with an american lawn. you will never see me on a nissan dealer lot toyota or any of those. Ford GM and dodge, are the only companies that will ever get my money, why? because they build a quality product!!! Ive never had a ford let me down! even if it broke some how, it never left me stranded! Now my gm is looking quite positive, 20 mpg! cant beat it!

You went and test drove a tundra a couple of weeks ago, remember?

Shopkeeper
02-14-2008, 01:20 PM
You went and test drove a tundra a couple of weeks ago, remember?

lol you got him. My tundra gets 20 mpg also... :hammerhead:

Eclipse
02-14-2008, 03:57 PM
I would like to comment but I don't even want to get into this debate. It is obvious there are some very opinionated contributors to this thread, and rightfully so. However it is unfortunate that some appear to lack the open mindedness to see this problem in it's entirety.

georgiagrass
02-14-2008, 05:23 PM
There is no point in chiming in anymore because most people are completely oblivious to the situation.

All of you guys who drive foreign cars and trucks and say that the big 3 brought it on themselves, I laugh at you when you complain about Landscapers lowball you. Think about that for a little bit.


MJK: That is just not the same thing. If a lawn care competitor offers a product that is just as good as, or better than, mine, on every level, for a cheaper price, he deserves to get the work. Same with vehicles. The Japanese vehicles are simply better. I'm not choosing to buy foreign, I'm choosing to buy the best vehicle for the money. We run Isuzu NPR lawn trucks, and they are fantastic -- show me an American made product that can even hold a candle to that truck, in terms of quality and value, and I'll buy it.

Lawnworks
02-14-2008, 05:25 PM
MJK: That is just not the same thing. If a lawn care competitor offers a product that is just as good as, or better than, mine, on every level, for a cheaper price, he deserves to get the work. Same with vehicles. The Japanese vehicles are simply better. I'm not choosing to buy foreign, I'm choosing to buy the best vehicle for the money. We run Isuzu NPR lawn trucks, and they are fantastic -- show me an American made product that can even hold a candle to that truck, in terms of quality and value, and I'll buy it.

You can run a Chevy w4500 and still be a patriot.

Ric3077
02-14-2008, 05:25 PM
I have a nissan titan and love it

AI Inc
02-14-2008, 05:29 PM
Ive always owned fords and just bought an 08 in December. So Ill make a deal with all you guys from MIchigan and other auto manufacturing states. Ill continue to buy Fords and when you go to the grocery store always use paper insted of plastic.

barefeetny
02-14-2008, 05:29 PM
have you never seen the dakota?

the dakota does not offer anything less then a 6cyl and no regular cabs...only comes with leather seats.... i dis not mention it because it is not a truck.... its a glorified passenger car with a bed... like an avalanche, honda ridgeline, whatever they call those crew cab rangers with the tiny beds


and yes the hemi is really a hemi...your not all there are ya?


The current-production "HEMI" combustion chamber is not truly hemispherical; it is flatter and more complex than the 1950s-'70s Hemi V8 chamber. It uses a coil-on-plug distributorless ignition system and two spark plugs per cylinder to shorten flame travel leading to more consistent combustion which helps reduce emissions. There is one coil for every two cylinders which allows the engine to continue running with one failed coil. Like most of Chrysler's past-model hemi-head engines, it develops approximately one horsepower per cubic inch.

ITS just a fancy sticker and funny commercial to sell trucks.....If i paint it orange and put a confedetate flag on the roof is it the general lee...

I'll paint a bee on the bed in a racing stripe and call it a super bee

its just advertising,,,,

I used to rate ford at the bottom of the big 3
ugly slow and unrealiable

they are the only choice anymore if you want a real 3/4 or 1 ton.....

chevy and gm want to make ugly trucks with way to much horse and not enough backbone

dodge... as discussed above.... show trucks with weak ass trannys

i'm running two older fords because of a lack of choice...


Nate

georgiagrass
02-14-2008, 05:31 PM
You can run a Chevy w4500 and still be a patriot.

Hi Lawnworks. Your claim shows just how slippery this issue is. We both know who makes the Chevy W4500; yep, you guessed it ... Isuzu! By the way, your dig about patriotism is uncalled for, imho.

mrusk
02-14-2008, 05:41 PM
The big 3 screwed themselves. The only thing they having going for them is the trucks.

I think its ridicoulous the benifits the unions make them give their workers. Pensions should be eliminated. People should learn to save for their own retierments.

Lawnworks
02-14-2008, 05:48 PM
Hi Lawnworks. Your claim shows just how slippery this issue is. We both know who makes the Chevy W4500; yep, you guessed it ... Isuzu! By the way, your dig about patriotism is uncalled for, imho.

Easy there... I guess you didn't cetch the saracasm! I own a couple Chevy w4500s. I will never buy new, so my opinion really doesn't matter.

cutbetterthanyou
02-14-2008, 06:44 PM
.. 80%+ fords are still on the road well after 150k. you need to look around better.

if fords are so great why did you just buy a gm and why did you have a dodge before that .

The only thing that makes my a idiot is that i didn't sell my f 250 when the warranty ran out instead i dumped over 5,000 into it last spring and it only had 80,000 miles on it i don't want to even want to get into the problems under warranty. Chevys arn't and better my dads 95 was bought new and blow the head gasket at 34k got it fixed then the turbo blew then he sold it. And yes i am back to a duramax again, it has a 6 year warranty and after that i will trade it in on another POS that really is my only option to have something semi reliable.

And why is it that you can get 3,4,5,600k miles out of izuzus,hinos,mistu fusos with nothing but oil changes.

cutbetterthanyou
02-14-2008, 06:46 PM
Realy? I just sold a f 250 with 186k on it. Still a great work truck. Have a f 350 with 160 on it that I work for another 2 yrs.

I am sure it is a nice truck. Why did you sell it? How much have you spent keeping them on the road.

AI Inc
02-14-2008, 06:50 PM
I am sure it is a nice truck. Why did you sell it? How much have you spent keeping them on the road.

I sold because 1 of my other trucks has over 160k on it. I didnt want to have to replace 2 trucks next yr.I realy dont like to keep em over 200k.
As far as money goes , it was just basic maitanance. oil every 3k, every fall and spring I serviced trannys, inspected brakes and front ends , changed differential fluids bi anually.
The f 350 with 160k on t still has the stock exhaust and 3 stock ball valves.

These are trucks that tow a landscape trailer spring summer and fall , Air compressors daily in the fall .

coolluv
02-14-2008, 06:53 PM
Type this in and take a look http://daimlerchryslervehicleproblems.com. or http://fordlemon.com or http://gmproblems.com or www.consumeraffairs.com/automotive/toyota_engine.html

All vehicles have problems and some have more than others. I myself have owed a 94 dodge truck that I purchased brand new, first new truck for me at that time. I just traded it a month ago for a new leftover 2007 new body style chevy silverado 2500 HD Duramax Diesel Allison trans.

This is my first new Chevy Truck and my first diesel truck. I will say this I don't have the energy or the time to tell you all the problems I had with my 94 Dodge right from the get go. Just about every other month it was in the shop for something. After the first couple wks the first heavy rain the cab flooded 2 to 3 inches of water in the cab from the rear window leaking.

Under the steering wheel caught fire while driving because of a short in the overloaded wire harness. Intermittent fuel pump problems leaving me stuck by the side of the road and the dealer saying we cant duplicate and sending me on my merry way. The constant vibrations at highway speeds when traveling for longer periods of time, again sorry cant duplicate. In other words because are mechanics are being ripped off by paying them flat rate and they are unwilling to loose money to help you when they can go to the next job and make money. We cant duplicate that sir and send you on your merry way.

To the motor throwing a bearing at 56 thousand miles and my month long fight with Chrysler and finally paying $ 1000 dollars in labor to get a new engine put in. I could go on and on about that truck but I just don't have the energy. By the way always was serviced at the dealer and every, and I mean every thing done by the book.

That truck was 14 years old this year so years on the road mean nothing if you have to keep fixing it to keep it there. If you read the fine print when ford boast about longest lasting truck on the market, you will see in very very tiny words Based on vehicle registrations. So What. By the way the transmission started to not want to shift out of 2nd when it was cold out. Truck had 126000 miles on it at trade in. I babied the **** out of that truck, even the dealer could not believe how nice that truck looked inside and out. I have had a company truck for years so that is why the mileage was so low. (Always a Chevy Company Truck) not my choice theirs. I just drive it.

I have worked in the construction industry for over 20 years and been around alot of truck owners and I like to research things before I spend my hard earned money. I have spoken to people who own fords and Chevy's and Toyota and just about every toyota owner I talked to over the years had nothing but great things to say about them and not having any problems with them other than some minor things every now and then. I have seen with my own eyes Mexicans driving Honda's and Toyota's with 300 or more thousand miles on them and they just change the oil. (loaded to the hilt by the way)

But that has been over the years and Toyota has gotten alot bigger and quality is starting to suffer. You guys who own businesses understand that.
I think at one time Toyota was known for long running engines with very little problems but times have changed and now they are becoming just like the rest.

I would never own another Chrysler product again, but that is just me. As far as quality go I think Toyota had the best and probably still holds the edge but is losing it as demand gets higher. Chevy is second, Ford is third and Chrysler is last. I don't say that based on my own experience with a Dodge but with many Dodge owners and Ford owners and Chevy owners over the years.

As far as the reasons for the big three losing to Toyota I think It has to do with many things like Unions and the big three monopoly over the years and their quality issues that have gotten progressively worse until recently when they all have taken notice to Toyota and the big three losing millions. Now they are looking at quality issues. Why do you think Chrysler has a (limited) lifetime warranty on the drive line, and Chevy has a 5yr 100,000 mile drive line warranty. Its to give people confidence with the purchase. Notice how that just recently came along. Build a solid tuck, don't cheap out because you can and you are the only games in town, and you wont need to make people feel all warm and fuzzy inside when they make a purchase.

Customer service after the sale and their unwillingness to fix known issues that are caused by them cheeping out on things to save a buck at the consumers expense. Anyway I don't have any loyalty to any brand and I buy what I think will last and be the best decision for my money. I really get a kick out of the guys that say I only buy Ford, or Chevy and you will never see me in a rice burner. Come one give me a break are you that weak minded that you let advertising tell you what to buy. I guess most are because that's why advertising is at the eighth grade level and if Micheal Jordon or Britney Spears or Garth Brooks drives it then it must be true. :hammerhead:

Down here in Atlanta most people are Ford people because Ford had, you notice I said had.. assembly plants down here. I guess the Mexicans in Mexico will be die hard Ford fans.:laugh: When the unions stop using strong arm tactics and allow the big 3 to compete with Toyota and the government keeps taxing companies to death (State and Federal) making companies move south of the border(you cant blame them), then this will keep happening. Enact the fair tax and you will see businesses start coming back to American soil.

Anyway enough of that, time for me to get off the soap box.

Dave...

cutbetterthanyou
02-14-2008, 07:01 PM
I sold because 1 of my other trucks has over 160k on it. I didnt want to have to replace 2 trucks next yr.I realy dont like to keep em over 200k.
As far as money goes , it was just basic maitanance. oil every 3k, every fall and spring I serviced trannys, inspected brakes and front ends , changed differential fluids bi anually.
The f 350 with 160k on t still has the stock exhaust and 3 stock ball valves.

These are trucks that tow a landscape trailer spring summer and fall , Air compressors daily in the fall .

You for the most part you just supported what i said earlier "that they are wore out buy 150". You just stated that you idealy don't like to keep um past 200k that isn't to far off from the 150 that i said when compareing them to trucks that run 300 on up would you really feel comfortable driveing cross country in the truck you just sold? Honsetly if not i would say it is wore out and unreliable

As far as the money invested i am glad you had good luck with them just curious what years were they?

AI Inc
02-14-2008, 07:06 PM
I wouldnt drive cross country in either , the sold truck was a 97 f 250 4x4 hd, the other is an 00 f 3350 4x4. That one I still drive to northern Maine 350 each way every other week in the winter.
On the same token I wouldnt take any vehicle with 200 k cross country.
Depends how you take care of em . My ex brother in law killed a yots before it hit 50k Blown cluth , blown motor , He didnt take care of it and would have killed any vehicle like that.

barefeetny
02-14-2008, 07:10 PM
check this out http://www.minerich.com/dodge_ram.htm

hundreds of short e-mails of ram owners desribing how they are on the 4th tranny at 80,000... blown trannys at 20,000 mile marks and a host of other tranny related issues all while another one bites the dust plays in the background

one broad said here 1998? looked like new because shes never able to put any miles on it......

this was a bad deal for dodge.... i know lifelong mopar men that are driving something else after that purchase

Nate

cutbetterthanyou
02-14-2008, 07:24 PM
I wouldnt drive cross country in either , the sold truck was a 97 f 250 4x4 hd, the other is an 00 f 3350 4x4. That one I still drive to northern Maine 350 each way every other week in the winter.
On the same token I wouldnt take any vehicle with 200 k cross country.
Depends how you take care of em . My ex brother in law killed a yots before it hit 50k Blown cluth , blown motor , He didnt take care of it and would have killed any vehicle like that.

Im not really talking toyotas as i really know nothing about them, as much as the flat nose jap trucks. I live in a town that has alot of seafood bussness and alot of them run these trucks ever day all day long many going from maryland to nc, fl ,louisana and so on they run them a MIN of 3/400k and many have told me the reason why is the don't break they just don't. Most of the time they get wreaked or rust out, that is when they get taken out of service. I think some of you guy take offense to my saying that the otheirs are junk because that is what you know and love, but they are. I said earlier that a ford was wore out at 150k and you disagreeded. Now you just said that it wasnt reliable enough to drive that far. Sorry if i hit a nerve but that is the way it is.

TXNSLighting
02-14-2008, 07:31 PM
lol you got him. My tundra gets 20 mpg also... :hammerhead:

haha o yeh you got me :nono:

AI Inc
02-14-2008, 07:34 PM
Im not really talking toyotas as i really know nothing about them, as much as the flat nose jap trucks. I live in a town that has alot of seafood bussness and alot of them run these trucks ever day all day long many going from maryland to nc, fl ,louisana and so on they run them a MIN of 3/400k and many have told me the reason why is the don't break they just don't. Most of the time they get wreaked or rust out, that is when they get taken out of service. I think some of you guy take offense to my saying that the otheirs are junk because that is what you know and love, but they are. I said earlier that a ford was wore out at 150k and you disagreeded. Now you just said that it wasnt reliable enough to drive that far. Sorry if i hit a nerve but that is the way it is.

Your talking medium duty trucks, big differance there.Ford medium duty will run 1/2 a mill miles too.
Trust me, you will never want to et hit head on in a topover, almost cost me my life. Ill never step foot in one again.

TXNSLighting
02-14-2008, 07:39 PM
if fords are so great why did you just buy a gm and why did you have a dodge before that .

The only thing that makes my a idiot is that i didn't sell my f 250 when the warranty ran out instead i dumped over 5,000 into it last spring and it only had 80,000 miles on it i don't want to even want to get into the problems under warranty. Chevys arn't and better my dads 95 was bought new and blow the head gasket at 34k got it fixed then the turbo blew then he sold it. And yes i am back to a duramax again, it has a 6 year warranty and after that i will trade it in on another POS that really is my only option to have something semi reliable.

And why is it that you can get 3,4,5,600k miles out of izuzus,hinos,mistu fusos with nothing but oil changes.

cuz i look for deals. and this truck was the deal i found. im only going to have it a year. so thats fine. im not saying every ford is perfect. just the majority are better than the rest. all the ones ive had never cost me a penny to run. just oil changes. i had to do a tranny in one but that was my fault. and ive seen plenty of isuzus, hinos, fusos, with problems. their not as perfect as you seem to think.

cgaengineer
02-15-2008, 07:54 AM
My mifes uncle worked for GM, he told us everyone begged for the janitor job as it was easy work...whats wrong with this picture?

I tried my luck with Chevy and Fords. Started buying Hondas and Toyotas and have not looked back. I have already said that when I have more accounts a Tundra will be pulling my trailer.

As far as being made in the USA, just looks at the parts content on the Toyotas, most parts made here and the trucks built here. Sure there is some money going back to Japan, but do you know how many jobs are provided in the US do to Toyota and Honda building plants here.

Stillwater
02-15-2008, 09:02 AM
I hear what you are saying CGA, But the big picture is it doesen't matter if they are building plants hear and employing Americans It is still a foreign company. The trend is the deindustrializing of America. And that is dangerous to Americas super power and economic status and damage can already be measured. Foreign owned industry in America is not counted as Americas industrial capacity. Deindustrialization is the natural outcome of the process of successful economic development of foreign countries NOT Americas, and America is not doing anything meaningfully to protect and save herself. The nice shiny new Toyota plants in America does nothing but Damage in the long run to Americas economic and industrial future. Do you want foreign company's having increasingly more and more control over Americas industry? this has some serious national security issues as well

Capemay Eagle
02-15-2008, 10:24 AM
It will be a cold day in hell before my company buys foreign trucks over AMERICAN.:usflag:

Recent news stories show that Jap trucks are becoming more popular than "American" trucks. Well.........Count me out for foreign vehicals. We'll buy AMERICAN every time!

Anybody else sticking up for our Country? rscvp, americanlawn:usflag::canadaflag:

I am with you, boycott Japan. Ford has been building cars and trucks in the USA for 100 years but everyone forgets that. If Toyota had a union in their Texas sweat shop, they would move to Mexico tomorrow. Ford builds and sell lots of cars and trucks in Mexico, so why would they not have a plant there..

Itzkcatz
02-15-2008, 10:33 AM
I wouldnt mind buying american if they didnt make TRASH!

cgaengineer
02-15-2008, 10:38 AM
Aside from cars, do you know how much stuff is built in the USA...I know cars are a big part of our industry but there are so many other things we rely on everyday that are built here. Most of the stuff I am proud its built here in the US and I look for "made in the USA" on the label, but when it comes to cars its different. I just cannot give my hard earned money to second rate junk.

Capemay Eagle
02-15-2008, 12:32 PM
I wouldnt mind buying american if they didnt make TRASH!
I guess you have not seen all the problems with the Tundra not to mention all the recalls and service reports. Toyota leads the list in recalls in 07. American car companies lead the list again in 08 in reliability and toyota in at the bottom again. Ha: usflag:

http://www.caranddriver.com/news/car_news/ford_passes_toyota_in_j_d_power_initial_quality_rankings_car_news

Ford, lioncoln Mercury at the top.

Itzkcatz
02-15-2008, 12:42 PM
I guess you have not seen all the problems with the Tundra not to mention all the recalls and service reports. Toyota leads the list in recalls in 07. American car companies lead the list again in 08 in reliability and toyota in at the bottom again. Ha: usflag:

http://www.caranddriver.com/news/car_news/ford_passes_toyota_in_j_d_power_initial_quality_rankings_car_news

Ford, lioncoln Mercury at the top.


Of course it has its problems, every new car has its problems. ever hear the saying never buy the first year production? Ive owned every brand of truck. Now i agree the older american trucks are very well built but the new stuff is junk. Try not to be ignorant because your redneck and have to suck fords nuts Btw i have 2 dodge ram 2500's one with a 360 one with a v10 and i have a 08 tundra 5.7 crewmax

MarcSmith
02-15-2008, 12:50 PM
one thing I have noticed about the japenese automakers. they don't hide behind Silent recalls, and dealer option TSB, and other crap like the american companies. usually with the Jap companies there is good service after the sale in regards to warranty claims and such.

We are fighting with Ford right now over one of our vans. 6K miles toasted engine, Ford blamed the filter (wix) but the ford tech also cut the filter open, which means that we can't go after wix for an analysis (after we told them not to touch the filter)...Basically a broken lifter...but still...round and round we go....

KTM
02-15-2008, 12:57 PM
Another thing to think about is if we lose to many factories what would ever happen if there was another BIG WAR, we would be screwed. What would we do? have the country that is attacking us (i.e. China) supply us with supplies needed? Think of how many factories during the world war's switched to making supply's for the military.

Capemay Eagle
02-15-2008, 01:10 PM
Another thing to think about is if we lose to many factories what would ever happen if there was another BIG WAR, we would be screwed. What would we do? have the country that is attacking us (i.e. China) supply us with supplies needed? Think of how many factories during the world war's switched to making supply's for the military. I would not worry about that, If China were to attack, we would just flash em. There is no way we could fight them.

MarcSmith
02-15-2008, 01:16 PM
the next big war wont be like all the other wars....It will be electronic, no amount of factories will help. and by and large the US controls the computer chip market.... Control "1" and "0" you can control everything.

And the Us military can do much more now with much less as a result of technology. Places like Newport News, Lockheed-martin, Boeing....We can still build our own war machines.. I dont think I'd want ford mass producing a tank or a bomb....oh wait they already have...the excursion and the explorer, and the pinto...:)

Shopkeeper
02-15-2008, 01:24 PM
Explain to me why Tundras are junk? (Mine as 140k and runs like its brand new). Also, Tundras have not been out for 10 years. On that note, you can 't compare the new (07-08) tundra to the old one (00-06) because they are completely different trucks.

Why are we traitors for buying toyota? We buy the best bang for our buck. I don't want anything to do with a car that is going to break down and cost me a lot of money to keep running. I don't like fixing my vehicles.

AI Inc
02-15-2008, 01:28 PM
the next big war wont be like all the other wars....It will be electronic, no amount of factories will help. and by and large the US controls the computer chip market.... Control "1" and "0" you can control everything.

And the Us military can do much more now with much less as a result of technology. Places like Newport News, Lockheed-martin, Boeing....We can still build our own war machines.. I dont think I'd want ford mass producing a tank or a bomb....oh wait they already have...the excursion and the explorer, and the pinto...:)

Pinto a bomb yes, the explorer was and is the most succesful SUV in the history of thwe automobile. I had 1 that I sold at 145 thing still ran like new . Put 65k on it with nothing but 1 set of brakes and oil changes , oh yeah and a set of tires.

Eclipse
02-15-2008, 01:47 PM
Places like Newport News, Lockheed-martin, Boeing....We can still build our own war machines..

Careful because not every piece of all the "war machines" is produced in an American facility.

MarcSmith
02-15-2008, 01:51 PM
Pinto a bomb yes, the explorer was and is the most succesful SUV in the history of thwe automobile. I had 1 that I sold at 145 thing still ran like new . Put 65k on it with nothing but 1 set of brakes and oil changes , oh yeah and a set of tires. why sell if it still ran like new? later model explores had suspension issues that ford tried to cover up by recommending lower air pressure in tires...lower than what was safe by the tiremakers standards....

After years of turning a deaf ear to reports of fires in unattended F-150s and other trucks and SUVs, Ford Motor Co. is finally recalling nearly 4 million of the vehicles to replace a faulty speed control deactivation switch that may cause underhood fires.

I loved my 94 f150 until it torched, and I loved my 98 2500 CK, and my grand prix, and my s10, and my impala, and my montana, but once you hit the magic 100K its like theres a time bomb, squeaks rattles, stuff that you don't get with foreign car makers. my father in laws 90 civic with 225k is in near perfect condition. yeah it smells like an old car inside, but no rattles, no squeaks. Its darn near perfect. I have a 87 Escort with 95K on the clock, and its in perfect running condition and the interior is flawless, but agian, squeaks rattles, sloppy drive train....its night an day.

look at the two wheeled vehicles....up until the last 5 years may be 10 tops, harley has not been producing anything great quality wise. Don't get me wrong I love thew way the harley looks, but...the build quality was lacking....

toyota, bmw, honda, all have proven that the american worker is capable of assembling a quality automobile. The big three have to start designing them...

MarcSmith
02-15-2008, 01:54 PM
Careful because not every piece of all the "war machines" is produced in an American facility.
agreed, but what good is a radar if you don't have a ship or a plane to put it in...Still have to have the "hardware" to make the software work.

cgaengineer
02-15-2008, 02:00 PM
the next big war wont be like all the other wars....It will be electronic, no amount of factories will help. and by and large the US controls the computer chip market.... Control "1" and "0" you can control everything.

And the Us military can do much more now with much less as a result of technology. Places like Newport News, Lockheed-martin, Boeing....We can still build our own war machines.. I dont think I'd want ford mass producing a tank or a bomb....oh wait they already have...the excursion and the explorer, and the pinto...:)


Dont forget to add the Crown Victoria with the fuel tank in front of the rear axle!

MarcSmith
02-15-2008, 02:02 PM
chevy with th fuel tank outside the frame rails....Its not a "ford or "chevy" problem its a design issue. and we are slipping....

Eclipse
02-15-2008, 02:05 PM
agreed, but what good is a radar if you don't have a ship or a plane to put it in...Still have to have the "hardware" to make the software work.

Sorry I was not more specific. I am actually referring to some of the hard parts, not the electronics. You might be surprised to hear where some of the steel parts on some of these ships are coming from.

MarcSmith
02-15-2008, 02:15 PM
You might be surprised to I would not be surprised....and it does upset me that we "offshore" some of our military stuff....

Capemay Eagle
02-15-2008, 03:50 PM
Explain to me why Tundras are junk? (Mine as 140k and runs like its brand new). Also, Tundras have not been out for 10 years. On that note, you can 't compare the new (07-08) tundra to the old one (00-06) because they are completely different trucks.

Why are we traitors for buying toyota? We buy the best bang for our buck. I don't want anything to do with a car that is going to break down and cost me a lot of money to keep running. I don't like fixing my vehicles.Toyota has been building a somewhat full size truck for 10 years, actually over 10 years if you count that joke of a T-100 that started this disaster. So I guess your saying if you cannot compare older Toyota's to the new ones, so I guess you cannot compare older Fords and Chevy's to older models from the 90's??.. And I don't know what your talking about cars breaking down, I have a Lincoln and a Ford F 250 and I have never broke down, or repaired anything..But then again Lincoln has outscored Toyota in quality for the last 5 years..

Itzkcatz
02-15-2008, 06:14 PM
And btw the older toyota tundras were on the level of a quarter ton truck like a s10/ranger and dakota not a 1500 truck. And i dont know what your talking about the t100 those trucks are almost unstopable.

TXNSLighting
02-15-2008, 06:43 PM
Im sorry, It just seems to me these people are racist rednecks that are ignorant and have no real evidence to back there claims. If you dont like overseas car makers you really dont have to make posts about it.

why dont you check your facts. the newer 6.0's werent bad. just the early two. (hmmm first year engine) the dodge transmissions are fine now. I love my gmc. well built truck. The big three are building their trucks just fine. They have very good quality. Your acting like not one toyota is ever in the shop for bad build quality. nor nissan. pull your head out of your a$$. Remember these things are machines.

Itzkcatz
02-15-2008, 06:46 PM
your the biggest idiot of them all

Why? Explain to me why people that buy toyota are traitors? Please i must hear this.

Itzkcatz
02-15-2008, 06:52 PM
why dont you check your facts. the newer 6.0's werent bad. just the early two. (hmmm first year engine) the dodge transmissions are fine now. I love my gmc. well built truck. The big three are building their trucks just fine. They have very good quality. Your acting like not one toyota is ever in the shop for bad build quality. nor nissan. pull your head out of your a$$. Remember these things are machines.

Ive never heard anything good about the 6.0, Is that why they scraped the motor? If dodge is making a good transmission this is something new to me the gmc seems to be the only truck ive heard good things about.

bill8379
02-15-2008, 06:53 PM
Fords are crap, if you buy one you're actually supporting Mexican workers. Japanese companys are trying to import as many jobs as possible to the states while the American companys are trying to export as many jobs as possible to 3rd world countrys.

Itzkcatz
02-15-2008, 06:56 PM
Fords are crap, if you buy one you're actually supporting Mexican workers. Japanese companys are trying to import as many jobs as possible to the states while the American companys are trying to export as many jobs as possible to 3rd world countrys.

I agree any ford guys have to pay 2 grand for an oil pan?

mrusk
02-15-2008, 10:19 PM
Guys you can not make bold statements about a brand based on your own personal experience! Your a biased! Your experence with 1, 2 or even 5 vehicles from a manufacture does not accuratly protray the brand as a whole.

Capemay Eagle
02-15-2008, 11:42 PM
Fords are crap, if you buy one you're actually supporting Mexican workers. Japanese companys are trying to import as many jobs as possible to the states while the American companys are trying to export as many jobs as possible to 3rd world countrys.

See you think you know everything but you are wrong. All Ford trucks including the Explorer are made in Kentucky by Americans. The beginning numbers on the Vin should say 1F which stands for made in the USA on all Ford F series , Explorer, Expedition and Econoline vans. A handful of cars are assembled in Mexico with US parts. The all new Focus is almost entirely made the US..So anything else you can add??

Eclipse
02-16-2008, 12:05 AM
All Ford trucks including the Explorer are made in Kentucky by Americans.

I would be a bit more careful with your statements. When you post incorrect information such as this it reduces the credability of your other statements.

Capemay Eagle
02-16-2008, 12:09 AM
I would be a bit more careful with your statements. When you post incorrect information such as this it reduces the credability of your other statements.

You have something to add MR knowledgeable??

Capemay Eagle
02-16-2008, 12:14 AM
I would be a bit more careful with your statements. When you post incorrect information such as this it reduces the credability of your other statements.

Here is something for you to chew on know it all. There is a slight exception to the F 150 The Canadian models are made in Canda but the US version is proudly made in the USA. The F 150 is the best selling truck in Canada as well as the US..Bite it

http://www.uaw.org/uawmade/auto/2007/index.cfm

GravelyGuy
02-16-2008, 12:21 AM
Here is something for you to chew on know it all. There is a slight exception to the F 150 The Canadian models are made in Canda but the US version is proudly made in the USA. The F 150 is the best selling truck in Canada as well as the US..Bite it

http://www.uaw.org/uawmade/auto/2007/index.cfm

Man you have like an endless supply of links, I'll give you that. Do you just research Ford in the off season? I'll be sure to consult with you the next time I purchase a vehicle.

Eclipse
02-16-2008, 12:35 AM
Here is something for you to chew on know it all. [/url]

I did not say they were not made in the US. I posted a comment to your statement of "All Ford trucks including the Explorer are made in Kentucky by Americans." This is incorrect as they are not all made in Kentucky.

Scag48
02-16-2008, 03:31 AM
In 10 years Toyota will buy out Ford, watch it happen. See how much ground the big 3 have lost in 10 years? Not going to end. Toyota will bring a diesel into the US and it will be in a 3/4 ton truck within 5 years, Ford is going to be done after that.

Not sure how some of you think Japanese trucks are junk, look at how many of them are still on the road with tons of miles on them. For 3/4 and 1 ton trucks, there is no other option than Ford/Chevy/Dodge, especially if you want a diesel. If I wanted a 1 tonner I'd buy a diesel F350 tomorrow. But, Japanese trucks aren't junk, far from it. I'll be buying a Tacoma in about 4 months, I don't need to tow anything, all my equipment is moved for me via lowboy so all I need to move around is tools and be able to do some offroading. The new Rangers aren't that great, they're cheaply built and the price reflects it. My buddy is a tech at Ford dealership and I have 2 other friends working at a Chevy dealership, the newer rigs just aren't what the old ones used to be. I have a '94 F150 with 203,XXX miles on it, great truck but I wouldn't buy a new F150, not a chance in hell.

Stillwater
02-16-2008, 09:45 AM
In 10 years Toyota will buy out Ford, watch it happen. See how much ground the big 3 have lost in 10 years? Not going to end. Toyota will bring a diesel into the US and it will be in a 3/4 ton truck within 5 years, Ford is going to be done after that.

Not sure how some of you think Japanese trucks are junk, look at how many of them are still on the road with tons of miles on them. For 3/4 and 1 ton trucks, there is no other option than Ford/Chevy/Dodge, especially if you want a diesel. If I wanted a 1 tonner I'd buy a diesel F350 tomorrow. But, Japanese trucks aren't junk, far from it. I'll be buying a Tacoma in about 4 months, I don't need to tow anything, all my equipment is moved for me via lowboy so all I need to move around is tools and be able to do some offroading. The new Rangers aren't that great, they're cheaply built and the price reflects it. My buddy is a tech at Ford dealership and I have 2 other friends working at a Chevy dealership, the newer rigs just aren't what the old ones used to be. I have a '94 F150 with 203,XXX miles on it, great truck but I wouldn't buy a new F150, not a chance in hell.



Wow you really think so? then they would have to buy all these automakers aswell seeing as how Ford owns them to. Volvo, Land Rover Porsche and jaguar.....oh.....Please

olyman
02-16-2008, 10:14 AM
i just love it when CLUELESS people follow the sheeple mandate--and believe everything the large companys and the biased nespapers tell them about the unions. not that some arent bad. but just why in h cant some of you understand that the ceos in this country are what is breaking things up??? who builds the vehicle???? it damn sure aint the executives---if you have a half mind, read lea ioccocas book sometime about his tenure in chrysler--and the trash he found in management----get a life some of you---

Stillwater
02-16-2008, 10:16 AM
2 words...... Golden Parachute

Eclipse
02-16-2008, 10:34 AM
Wow you really think so? then they would have to buy all these automakers aswell seeing as how Ford owns them to. Volvo, Land Rover Porsche and jaguar.....oh.....Please

Ford could sell separately of these other companies.

Eclipse
02-16-2008, 10:35 AM
Toyota will bring a diesel into the US and it will be in a 3/4 ton truck within 5 years,

I think I read recently that this is planned for 2010.

mrusk
02-16-2008, 10:56 AM
In 10 years Toyota will buy out Ford, watch it happen. See how much ground the big 3 have lost in 10 years? Not going to end. Toyota will bring a diesel into the US and it will be in a 3/4 ton truck within 5 years, Ford is going to be done after that.

Not sure how some of you think Japanese trucks are junk, look at how many of them are still on the road with tons of miles on them. For 3/4 and 1 ton trucks, there is no other option than Ford/Chevy/Dodge, especially if you want a diesel. If I wanted a 1 tonner I'd buy a diesel F350 tomorrow. But, Japanese trucks aren't junk, far from it. I'll be buying a Tacoma in about 4 months, I don't need to tow anything, all my equipment is moved for me via lowboy so all I need to move around is tools and be able to do some offroading. The new Rangers aren't that great, they're cheaply built and the price reflects it. My buddy is a tech at Ford dealership and I have 2 other friends working at a Chevy dealership, the newer rigs just aren't what the old ones used to be. I have a '94 F150 with 203,XXX miles on it, great truck but I wouldn't buy a new F150, not a chance in hell.



I agree with you 100%. The japs build way better cars then the americans, it only makes sense that their trucks will be better. I really look foward to being able to buy a toyota 1 ton truck.

If i was in charge of the american automarkers i would just eliminate all the cars from the lineup and just focus on the pick ups and maybe the suvs. Face it, non of the cars are any where near the foreign cars. Only thing they have going for them is the trucks and soon they will have real compeition!

georgiagrass
02-16-2008, 03:28 PM
Wow you really think so? then they would have to buy all these automakers aswell seeing as how Ford owns them to. Volvo, Land Rover Porsche and jaguar.....oh.....Please

Are you certain that the Ford Motor Company owns Porsche?

Stillwater
02-16-2008, 03:51 PM
Are you certain that the Ford Motor Company owns Porsche?

This info is public knowldge it is not a secrete NOW? no BUT Since 1989, Ford bailed Porche out of bankrupcy and moved it to finland and since has acquired Aston Martin, Jaguar, Land Rover, from the United Kingdom and Volvo Cars from Sweden, as well as a controlling share (33.4%) of Mazda of Japan, with which it operates an American joint venture plant in Flat Rock, Michigan called Auto Alliance. It has spun off its parts division under the name Visteon. Its prestige brands, with the exception of Lincoln,they are all managed through its Premier Automotive Group. Ford is the most powerful auto maker on the entire planet they buy others they don't get bought. Ford's FoMoCo parts division sells aftermarket parts under the Motorcraft brand name. Ford's non-manufacturing operations include organizations such as automotive finance operation Ford Motor Credit Company. Ford also sponsors numerous events and constructs massive sports facilities around the nation and the world, most notably Ford Center in downtown Oklahoma City and Ford Field in downtown Detroit. The Ford Motor Company controls the following operational car marques: Daimler, Ford, Jaguar, Land Rover, Lincoln, Mazda, Mercury, and Volvo, Jaguar, Land Rover, and Volvo are currently part of the Premier Automotive Group. That ford owns and controls. this info is not hard to find......

Stillwater
02-16-2008, 04:13 PM
MORE FORD FUN FACTS !

Ford was heavily involved in Formula One for many years, and supplied engines to a large number of teams from 1967 until 2004. These engines were designed and manufactured by Cosworth, the racing division that was owned by Ford from 1998 to 2004. Ford-badged engines won 176 Grands Prix between 1967 and 2003 for teams such as Team Lotus and McLaren. Ford entered Formula One as a constructor in 2000 under the Jaguar Racing name, after buying the Stewart Grand Prix team which had been its primary 'works' team in the series since 1997. Jaguar achieved little success in Formula One, and after a turbulent five seasons, Ford withdrew from the category after the 2004 season, selling both Jaguar Racing (which became Red Bull Racing) and Cosworth (to Gerald Forsythe and Kevin Kalkhoven)

KTM
02-16-2008, 05:00 PM
I think Ford is or is in the process of selling Jaguar and Land Rover to A India company, forgot which one though.

georgiagrass
02-16-2008, 05:05 PM
This info is public knowldge it is not a secrete NOW? no BUT Since 1989, Ford bailed Porche out of bankrupcy and moved it to finland and since has acquired Aston Martin, Jaguar, Land Rover, from the United Kingdom and Volvo Cars from Sweden, as well as a controlling share (33.4%) of Mazda of Japan, with which it operates an American joint venture plant in Flat Rock, Michigan called Auto Alliance. It has spun off its parts division under the name Visteon. Its prestige brands, with the exception of Lincoln,they are all managed through its Premier Automotive Group. Ford is the most powerful auto maker on the entire planet they buy others they don't get bought. Ford's FoMoCo parts division sells aftermarket parts under the Motorcraft brand name. Ford's non-manufacturing operations include organizations such as automotive finance operation Ford Motor Credit Company. Ford also sponsors numerous events and constructs massive sports facilities around the nation and the world, most notably Ford Center in downtown Oklahoma City and Ford Field in downtown Detroit. The Ford Motor Company controls the following operational car marques: Daimler, Ford, Jaguar, Land Rover, Lincoln, Mazda, Mercury, and Volvo, Jaguar, Land Rover, and Volvo are currently part of the Premier Automotive Group. That ford owns and controls. this info is not hard to find......


You obviously know something about cars, but I believe you are mistaken about Porsche. They are not now, nor have they ever been, owned by Ford. They came close to bankruptcy in 1993, but did not enter bankruptcy. They are headquartered now, as they always have been, in Stuttgart, Germany. The Boxster is manufactured in Finland. Porsche remains one of the smallest, but one of the most profitable, car companies in the world.

georgiagrass
02-16-2008, 05:34 PM
I think Ford is or is in the process of selling Jaguar and Land Rover to A India company, forgot which one though.

I believe it is the Tata company.

Stillwater
02-16-2008, 05:50 PM
You obviously know something about cars, but I believe you are mistaken about Porsche. They are not now, nor have they ever been, owned by Ford. They came close to bankruptcy in 1993, but did not enter bankruptcy. They are headquartered now, as they always have been, in Stuttgart, Germany. The Boxster is manufactured in Finland. Porsche remains one of the smallest, but one of the most profitable, car companies in the world.

thank you, I did not know that

Capemay Eagle
02-16-2008, 05:55 PM
I think Ford is or is in the process of selling Jaguar and Land Rover to A India company, forgot which one though.
The company in Tata, Mahindra. The deal has been going on for awhile, it will happen eventually.

Stillwater
02-16-2008, 06:00 PM
The company in Tata, Mahindra. The deal has been going on for awhile, it will happen eventually.

this kind of thing takes awhile
On January 3rd, 2008, The Hindu Business Line reported that Ford Motor Company named Tata Motors the preferred bidder for Ford's British marquees Jaguar and Land Rover ... but a final decision for the sale was yet to be made

Capemay Eagle
02-16-2008, 06:05 PM
You obviously know something about cars, but I believe you are mistaken about Porsche. They are not now, nor have they ever been, owned by Ford. They came close to bankruptcy in 1993, but did not enter bankruptcy. They are headquartered now, as they always have been, in Stuttgart, Germany. The Boxster is manufactured in Finland. Porsche remains one of the smallest, but one of the most profitable, car companies in the world.
Ford/employees also own a 10% share of Kia and Mazda own a 8% of Kia. Ford and Kia are building the all new Kia which will be a global car and available in the States in 2010.

meets1
02-16-2008, 06:09 PM
I here alot of what your saying and I just bought a new GMC work truck and a 4 door GMC with everything but navigation. Big improvment thus far over my 04 & 06 models. Rode in the new ford today, Ext cab - 3/4 - one word. Awful! Toyota - I have a highlander - really nothing to say. 50k on it and milage keeps getting better. It is a no frills ride but with wife and 2 kids - it is really a great vehicle. If they come out with a diesel in 2010 - the big 3 better watch it cuz toyota will come out swinging on a 3/4 model.

Capemay Eagle
02-16-2008, 06:10 PM
this kind of thing takes awhile
On January 3rd, 2008, The Hindu Business Line reported that Ford Motor Company named Tata Motors the preferred bidder for Ford's British marquees Jaguar and Land Rover ... but a final decision for the sale was yet to be made

This is a win situation for Ford, because it will give them lots of cash to restructure their North American way forward plan. The only down fall is, this opens the door for the Indian automaker to get its small cars into a already crowded market. Like we need another automaker in the US.