Is this a good deal on a mini excav-cat

[Russ5879]

Hi, going to buy a mini in the next few days
Is this a good deal

http://www.equipmenttraderonline.com/find/listing/2005-CATERPILLAR-304CR-90775616

Why is this $10,000 more then the first one, it has more hours--what's the difference

http://www.equipmenttraderonline.com/find/listing/2005-CATERPILLAR-304CR-91478023

Something looks funny about the bucket on the first one
Is this a quick exchange system for easy bucket exchange
Would a Bobcat 435 be more powerful with it's 49hp

Thanks
Russ

[joesimoes2]

Bobcat Ron can answerer that.:drinkup:

[cat2]

Demo. Thats the best way to tell




o and welcome to this great site

[bobcat_ron]

The only difference between the two other than hours is the model year. Try them both and look for the obvious signs when starting the engines like odd smoke color and leaks.

[Gravel Rat]

You have to go physically look at the machines there is no way of telling the condition by pictures. The first one it is hard to tell if its had a new paint job.

For only 572 hours the tracks look like they have more use than that.

[ksss]

[QUOTE=Russ5879;2171414]Hi, going to buy a mini in the next few days
Is this a good deal

http://www.equipmenttraderonline.com/find/listing/2005-CATERPILLAR-304CR-90775616

Why is this $10,000 more then the first one, it has more hours--what's the difference

http://www.equipmenttraderonline.com/find/listing/2005-CATERPILLAR-304CR-91478023

Something looks funny about the bucket on the first one
Is this a quick exchange system for easy bucket exchange
Would a Bobcat 435 be more powerful with it's 49hp"

HP is not as big of a factor in mini excavators or any excavators for that matter. The motor turns a series of pumps. The make and arrangement of those pumps is what matters the most (other things like cylinder size and pressures are also important). The Bobcat at 49 hp which is high for a mini in that size has some of the worst breakout numbers in the industry. Engine HP and "power" in an excavator are not a direct correlation. The 28K machine is more in line with would you should expect to pay. The other for 10K more is out of bounce. 40K for a machine with that kind of hours and no cab and no thumb and apparently one bucket is too high.

[bobcat_ron]

Bobcat is all bark but very little bite.

[ksss]

Here are some numbers

CASE CX50B
arm digging force 5912
bucket breakout 7892
drawbar pull 12170

Deere 50D
arm digging force 5401
bucket breakout 8273
drawbar pull 11674

Bobcat 435
arm digging force 5262
bucket breakout 7936
drawbar pull 10489

TK 145
arm digging force 5027
bucket breakout 10,825
drawbar pull 11674

The Bobcat has 10 more hp than Deere or CASE and 12 more than TK. As you can see the 10 more hp is not buying you anything except more fuel costs.

[mrsops]

i always look at the bucket break out when i compare the minis. but wut does the arm break out mean

[ksss]

i always look at the bucket break out when i compare the minis. but wut does the arm break out mean

It is also refered to as crowd force. It is the sticks ability to pull material toward the machine. It is expressed in pounds like breakout.

[mrsops]

It is also refered to as crowd force. It is the sticks ability to pull material toward the machine. It is expressed in pounds like breakout.

oohhh ok i got it now but dont you think more people go by the bucket breakout force

[ksss]

oohhh ok i got it now but dont you think more people go by the bucket breakout force


It depends, most peole look at hp in specing a skid steers but hp is not as important as torque. The method of excavating will dictate which is most important. If your trenching, crowd force is important in being able to pull grade. Bucket digging strength has its advantages as well. I see it in digging in frost and pulling up concrete. Both I think are important, to what degree depends on the application. I have said this before, but some machines are much better bucket diggers than arm diggers. The TK machines are an example of strong bucket diggers and average arm diggers. Just check the specs of some machines and you can see where the engineers put their emphasis. Which is most important is dependant also on the operators style of digging.

[P.Services]

i saw the first machine in the paper last week and thought "dang thats a good deal". get the ser. # of it and call cat, they can tell you what kind of work has been done and the hours should line up with there records. if cat says a computer was replaced at 1500 hours then you will know those hours are not real. if i had to bet i would say they are real, its in good shape. if it had a cab i would have called on it. as for the second machines price.....well some people are just a little to proud of what they own,thats a bs price. offer the guy 25k on the first one and i think you will never regret it.

[Russ5879]

Thanks, does anybody know if the first one has a bucket exchange that is easy...did only BC supply this feature in 2005
I will be using different size buckets often, it's not a deal breaker but I would like to know.
Also I am going to be installing septic tanks and drain fields' and also sewer pipes to the street,,doesn't the BC perform better in 'tight quarters'
I can handle it being a bit tipsey, I'm looking for a big powerful machine that is capable of handling small spaces and soft soils

[ksss]

Thanks, does anybody know if the first one has a bucket exchange that is easy...did only BC supply this feature in 2005
I will be using different size buckets often, it's not a deal breaker but I would like to know.
Also I am going to be installing septic tanks and drain fields' and also sewer pipes to the street,,doesn't the BC perform better in 'tight quarters'
I can handle it being a bit tipsey, I'm looking for a big powerful machine that is capable of handling small spaces and soft soils

I would go up a size. The 305C/ TK 153. All of the zero tails work well in tight quarters. The 153 especially as it is with inches of being zero house swing as well.

[ksss]

I would also add that making connections at the street requires a mini that can go deep. We have connections that go 16'. Thats hard to dig with any mini. Most are in the 10-12 foot range. Go big if thats the type of work you do. Septics if similiar to ours are not difficult with a 304 size but bigger is always better as long as you can get into the job. The width on my TK is 6.5' and so if I can get it into the job I can work.

[Russ5879]

Thanks for the help so far, I am currently going ahead with the deal, the seller has come down to 28,500 ($1000 off) and he has a towmaster trailer T12 2001 model for $3750
I plan on flying out of here and buying a F450 dump truck and then driving to and purchasing an excavator with trailer and coming home. I currently own a BC 325 with trailer that I've had for some time now.
Thanks for the HP info, that helps understand hydraulics better and I will run the serial # tomorrow and the tracks do look cut-up for this machine (the seller said the unit came from a Cat dealer) not sure what that means.
I will check for excesive smoke when testing the unit, (the bucket still looks cheap to me) and for the one who said it looked painted...bravo...the seller said the area where your feet set was bent and they re-shaped this area and painted it. It was kinda-of a weird way for him to explain it, it lead me to believe that he was not familar with exactly what happened and was just quoting what was done to the machine.
Overall I don't yet see any deal breakers, but if anybody else does, please let me know. It is a decision I have to live with once the deal is done
Thanks
Russ
251-455-7975