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View Full Version : lets not get off subject on this one.


3day240sx
02-29-2008, 10:49 PM
The truck thing is getting old I know but I kind of want to do this another way. I am needing a new truck and don't know about diesel or gas. This is all going to be based on running the truck for 150k miles with fuel being 3.20 for gas and 3.55 for diesel and the truck being run empty bed 14' trailer loaded with 4k pounds and both 3/4 or 1 ton of any brand.

Diesel pros are that you will get 15mpg which means you would pay 35,500 in fuel total over the 150k miles. More power which is always a plus.

Cons are that it is going to cost an average of 5k more for the truck. The truck is built a little heavier costing more for parts(bigger driveshaft, mounts, few others). The front suspension is going to have more problems b/c of the extra weight. Tires cost more. Oil is every 5k miles but cost 45 bucks b/c of more oil and bigger filters which totals 1350 or the 150k.

Gas pros are lower initial cost. Lower weigh for getting stuck off of the road with 2wd(rare but always in the back of my mind). Tires can be lower weight range. Oil change cost 20 bucks every 3k miles which total 1k.

Cons are that fuel is going to be 48,000 total for 150k miles at 10mpg. Your only going to have the weight rating for what your doing which leaves no room to grow for the small guys. The truck is almost spent and the diesel is still going strong after 150k.

With all that and not talking about brands would you want diesel or gas? Your going to pay 12,500 more in fuel for gasoline. You would pay 5k or so more up front for the diesel truck. The diesel is going to cost 350 more for oil changes or even 500 more. So in total your paying 7k more for a gas truck.
MORE FOR A GASER.

cutbetterthanyou
03-01-2008, 09:00 AM
Not sure what to tell you, but when i pull 6000 pounds with my duramax crew cab i don't get 15 mpg, i get 12 checked it 4 times this fall on different routes and always the same. And before it was broke in i got 9. I Don't know if it is my driving habits or if they just get 12, but you may look at that number for figuring rather than 15

wski4fun
03-01-2008, 09:37 AM
As far as I know, which I admit is not much on the subject, diesel gets the benifit on the highway. I owned a diesel and used it to pull a trailer around town and was surprised at how poor the fuel milage was. I was however able to pull the trailer with 6yds of mulch on the truck no problem. If you are thinking of having the truck for 150k, you have to look at resale value. If you assume your figures are correct, the gas will be close to nothing. The diesel could still be worth quite a bit. The maintenance on a 150k gas could be a bit more also. I won't tell you which way to go because it seems I always make the wrong choice. Just some other things to think about.

J&R Landscaping
03-01-2008, 10:06 AM
You figured you would run the truck until 150k miles, how many years does that take? Trade in value will be a heck of a lot different based on the age of the truck when you attemp to trade or re-sell.

slowleak1
03-01-2008, 10:18 AM
your crazy if you think you can change your oil for $20 in a gasser.when i first got my tahoe, i was getting between 8-10 mpg, now i have a powerstroke and im getting over 15 easily. and just because the truck is built heavier doent mean it costs more for parts, unless its a GM. all my ford parts, which i seldom buy, cost way less than parts did for my tahoe. diesel is the way to go.
another thing to think about is, as summer comes around gas prices are going to go up. diesel prices will either come up a little bit, or fall, either way by mid-summer diesel will be cheaper than gas. right now they are still making winter fuel, which cost more because of additives and all that other b.s.
hth

J&R Landscaping
03-01-2008, 10:54 AM
your crazy if you think you can change your oil for $20 in a gasser.

FWIW, there are SEVERAL places around me that do lube, oil and filter services for either $14.99 or $19.95. Yes, I've gone to some of them. I have friends that work at 2 of the places and they are honest and reputable!

jlawnservice
03-01-2008, 11:07 AM
your not gonna get over 12 mpg average pulling with a diesel, i dont care what....i have 5 diesels all makes

nosparkplugs
03-01-2008, 01:53 PM
Rudolph Diesel's compression Engine is far superior to a Gasoline engine, diesel fuel burns more complete than gasoline 147,000BTU diesel or 125,000BTU gasoline, although diesel fuel costs more per gallon your getting about 40% more BTU or heat energy, this equals to unsurpassed low end torque where you need it for towing & hauling loads. Weight penalty is a hot topic also, but the Compression cycle diesel is built heavy duty from the factory, the noise a diesel engine produces is the more powerful explosion of diesel fuel, and the energy it produces is cancaled out buy the laws of recepicating masses, meaning that a diesel just powers through each crank rotation were a gasoline engine is burning more fuel do do the same work a higher rpm is it's only advantage. Extensive modificaion must be done to modify a Gasoline engine to out perform a diesel. Cost of ownership, unless you keep your Diesel for the life of the truck/engine, you could loss some money, but the lower routine maintance equals out, nosparkplugs, no sparkplug wires or tune ups. There are some specific routine maintance or PM that must be done more often Ie: fuel filters EGR puke bottles, diesels are turbocharged, so oil quality is very important. I have ran diesels since I was 16years old, I have had bad ones & goods ones. It makes me sick when folks start bashing the Diesel, it is the future of transportation, Cummins, Duramax, Ford are all introduction (CGR) Compacted graphite Iron blocks & heads you diesel hater will be the first ones in line for the newer diesel powered 1/2 tons, that are to cheap to invest in a medium duty diesel. Hybrids manufactures will be replacing their small gasoline motors with lighter CGR diesels, therfore increaseing the fuel economy of Hybrids.

Mimowerman
03-01-2008, 02:02 PM
not to burst your bubble, but if you are only towing 4,000 lbs and don't have any payload in the bed , whats the need for a 3/4 or 1 ton truck... If you are like me its because i'm a truck guy and 3/4 ton trucks are a whole lot better .... but if you really want to save money, a 1/2 ton truck will pull that any day! current truck is a 250 5.4l next truck will be a gmc 2500 duramax no matter the cost , I want a oil burner!!!

nosparkplugs
03-01-2008, 02:19 PM
I only change my oil once a year, less cost to operate a diesel. The AMSOIL Dual-bypass filtration system, and do oil analysis at set intervals have over 23,450 miles on oil, A diesel is not for a person who is only hauling 4,00lbs it's like towing with a Peterbuilt.

LB1234
03-01-2008, 03:45 PM
If you really want to go nuts than truly forcast the money savings of diesel versus gas. In other words, $1.00 today might be worth $1.25 in the future. You are also stating the truck will last 150k miles...what's the end of life value for the gas vs. the diesel?

topsites
03-01-2008, 05:17 PM
I would seriously consider getting the gasser then spending $2000 on one of these:
http://www.lawnsite.com/showthread.php?t=211016

I personally think for all but hauling (leaves, mulch, etc) that would be the biggest petrol saver...
I would think you can almost get your unloaded mpg but certainly far better than when trailered.

lets not get off subject on this one.

We don't do that, do we? http://www.yahoofreak.com/emoticons/Angel%20Emoticons/innocent.gif

nosparkplugs
03-01-2008, 09:21 PM
Diesels maintain there retail value, more than a gasoline truck fact. The average factory torque now of a modern diesel is 650ftlbs, and a chip & exhaust your over 1,000fltlbs. A gasoline just cannot compete, Torque is what gets you moving, not HP. With a truck you can always unhook from the trailer with engine problems

LawnBasher
03-01-2008, 10:22 PM
"The truck is almost spent and the diesel is still going strong after 150k."

I love the Duramax but you said it all with that statement. Either engine (gas or diesel) will outlast the truck and tranny if properly maintained. I'd put cab design and transmission sturdiness over engine selection any day. Want and need are two different things....questions is, can you be happy buying only what you need?.....to each his own!

Eclipse
03-01-2008, 11:59 PM
"The truck is almost spent and the diesel is still going strong after 150k."

I see this a lot. My last Dodge Cummins was a work truck it's entire life and was a great truck when I sold it with 290k miles on it. I own a Dodge Cummins now that has 260k and has been a work truck it's entire life and it is still a great truck.

I agree that our industry is hard on truck but if the owner is also the primary operator the life of our work truck can be greatly extended vs. having an employee as the primary operator.

For me my personal work trucks will be diesels. If I am going to put an employee in a truck it will be a gasser just for the reason mentioned above.

I hope these comments might help the OP also. If you are going to grow and add a 2nd crew sooner than later you might want to buy the cheaper truck not and buy the diesel the next time around.

LawnBasher
03-02-2008, 12:14 AM
You make an excellent point.

Krehling's Prop. Maint.
03-02-2008, 08:16 PM
i don't know what you've been told... but there is no diesel thats going to get 15 mpg towing 4000 lbs. 12mpg at best

Eclipse
03-02-2008, 08:47 PM
i don't know what you've been told... but there is no diesel thats going to get 15 mpg towing 4000 lbs. 12mpg at best

Hmmm..... I owned one so I know there is at least one out there :) 4k is nothing so it certainly does not seem like I probably had the only one out there that would.

slowleak1
03-02-2008, 11:41 PM
i don't know what you've been told... but there is no diesel thats going to get 15 mpg towing 4000 lbs. 12mpg at best

mine does, easily. 4000 lbs is nothing for the good old 7.3. 20,000 lbs i see a little over 10. maybee you should have your truck checked out:confused: