Replacement drive lugs for ASV/Cat

[Lawnworks]

I just bought an rc30(to sell), and I am thinking of installing some new lugs to replace a few lugs that are missing. The outside of the track is in great condition... these just might do the trick. What do yall think?

http://bairproductsinc.com/products/part_ll.html

[74inchShovel]

Just out of curiosity, how many hours on the clock? I own a 30, and didn't think it would have the power to tear out lugs. All in how the machine is ran I guess. If you do buy the repair lugs, keep me posted as to the quality, and durability. Thanks in advance.

[Lawnworks]

It has just under 2000hrs. I imagine if the tracks wern't aligned or at the correct tension at one point or another they could get excessive wear.

Do you know how much aftermarket tracks are? An asv dealer quoted me 1500 per track.

[kklick]

here are some i ran across the other day while reading up on the rc 30

http://dallas.craigslist.org/bfs/570598039.html

might be a good investment for resale

[BIGBEN2004]

Also as the lugs begin to dry rot some they become brittle and can snap off easier. Running at the wrong tension is a sure way to also shorten the life out of them.

[grassmanvt]

If I remember right Cat states that lug wear/ breaking is most often caused by hard side hilling. Lots of side pressure, although thats one reason you buy a track machine, to work in the more adverse conditions that a wheeled loader won't work in.

[Digdeep]

If I remember right Cat states that lug wear/ breaking is most often caused by hard side hilling. Lots of side pressure, although thats one reason you buy a track machine, to work in the more adverse conditions that a wheeled loader won't work in.

I think is caused by running the tracks too loose and the lugs try to drive up over the sprocket when you turn the machine. I've tested this on my RC50. Running the tracks too tight only robs hp and stresses drive components. I will reach 2000 hours soon and my lugs are still in good shape however I do have some wear on the outside of my tracks where the rollers are. I know a guy who owned a CAT 257 and he had trouble with his lugs before he bought and RC85. FABCO the CAT dealer up here said they thought it was because the machine was too heavy for the undercarriage and I agree with that.

[BIGBEN2004]

Digdeep you almost have 2000 hours on one set of tracks? That is amazing. Do you keep it out of rocky environments? I have seen Cat's last only at most 900 Hours before they were trashed. I have never seen a set go past 1000 Hrs. The Cats though had everyone and anyone running them and they were abused to no end. Some were only lasting as long as 300 Hrs. so I guess it says allot on who runs them and what they are running in.

[Digdeep]

Digdeep you almost have 2000 hours on one set of tracks? That is amazing. Do you keep it out of rocky environments? I have seen Cat's last only at most 900 Hours before they were trashed. I have never seen a set go past 1000 Hrs. The Cats though had everyone and anyone running them and they were abused to no end. Some were only lasting as long as 300 Hrs. so I guess it says allot on who runs them and what they are running in.

I've run it many different applications including spreading gravel in garages for pads, leveling and shaping driveways, excavating for retaining walls, sod removals and installation, rented a low flow DAVCO to do trail maintenance for a buddies deer hunting property, removed tons of snow, etc. It's seen everything from nice friendly turf, to stone/dirt, gravel, stumps, slash, etc. I think there are two main reasons why I've been able to get good life out of them 1) the machine was built for this undercarriage and does not have the majority of the machine weight at the rear like the CAT 247/257(almost 75% in the back for the 257), I can run with less track tension than the CATs due to the balance of the machine, and the machine weighs over 2000lbs less than the 257 (I have the old loader arms on my machine) and its operating weight is around 5300lbs. 2) I operate and maintain it like a track machine and not like a skid steer. I clean the undercarriage when necessary, minimize counter rotating when I don't need to and this keeps rocks and debris out of the undercarriage unnecessarily, I maintain proper track tension, etc. I sold many many Bobcat track machines and the horror stories are endless on the things that customers did/didn't do to get good life out of the machine. I've always maintained that the 257s and 287s had no business being on an ASV undercarriage because they had way too much weight over the rear of the tracks and they were too heavy. Look at the track wear on a 247 and look at the track wear on a 257. They have the same undercarrige but the wear on the 257 is always much worse. I think this is why "Larry Lug" is in business.

By the way, I've been told by different people that its not uncommon to see 2000 hours out of RC30, RC50 and RC60 tracks. The track is just as thick as ASV larger machines attached to a frame that is much lighter.

[bobcat_ron]

The Bair lugs and roller sleeves will increase the fuel economy, they don't say what type of plastic it's made of, but I suspect Delrin, it's a self lubricating plastic with huge amounts of strength with out being brittle.

[Construct'O]

Has anyone here with the new C seris Cat MTL seen this.It is called the Advanced MTL Undercarriage.

It is the 18"inch-wide tracks,that has three rows of lugs,which create a larger area for the track to engage with the gude system.The additional row of lugs enhances guiding when working on side slopes.

I took this info out of the Cat Ground Breaker magizine they send me.

So is this an option,if so work this be worth the extra money for the guy that is doing a lot of slope work with the MTL machines.Might evey be able to convert over older machine to the three row system?

I was mainly just wonder who has seen any or already knows about the three row lug system???? Is this new or old news? :usflag:

[bobcat_ron]

The B series only has 2 rows, inside and outside, but there is no inside row on the track on the underside of the machine, there is not enough room for clearance.

[Lawnworks]

I've run it many different applications including spreading gravel in garages for pads, leveling and shaping driveways, excavating for retaining walls, sod removals and installation, rented a low flow DAVCO to do trail maintenance for a buddies deer hunting property, removed tons of snow, etc. It's seen everything from nice friendly turf, to stone/dirt, gravel, stumps, slash, etc. I think there are two main reasons why I've been able to get good life out of them 1) the machine was built for this undercarriage and does not have the majority of the machine weight at the rear like the CAT 247/257(almost 75% in the back for the 257), I can run with less track tension than the CATs due to the balance of the machine, and the machine weighs over 2000lbs less than the 257 (I have the old loader arms on my machine) and its operating weight is around 5300lbs. 2) I operate and maintain it like a track machine and not like a skid steer. I clean the undercarriage when necessary, minimize counter rotating when I don't need to and this keeps rocks and debris out of the undercarriage unnecessarily, I maintain proper track tension, etc. I sold many many Bobcat track machines and the horror stories are endless on the things that customers did/didn't do to get good life out of the machine. I've always maintained that the 257s and 287s had no business being on an ASV undercarriage because they had way too much weight over the rear of the tracks and they were too heavy. Look at the track wear on a 247 and look at the track wear on a 257. They have the same undercarrige but the wear on the 257 is always much worse. I think this is why "Larry Lug" is in business.

By the way, I've been told by different people that its not uncommon to see 2000 hours out of RC30, RC50 and RC60 tracks. The track is just as thick as ASV larger machines attached to a frame that is much lighter.

I think what you said about the weight and balance of the machine makes sense. That blows my mind that your tracks have lasted 2000hrs. I have always thought these suspended undercarriages were a money pit from what I have researched... but maybe the ASV machines are different. Have you had to replace any undercarriage components? How are your rollers and bogie wheels doing?

I am betting the tracks on my asv rc30 w/ almost 2000hrs may be the originals. The bogie wheels might be original as well. They are a little bit chipped up but still serve there purpose.

Sounds like the asv is probably a much better machine than the cat since it is specifically engineered for tracks.

[Lawnworks]

The Bair lugs and roller sleeves will increase the fuel economy, they don't say what type of plastic it's made of, but I suspect Delrin, it's a self lubricating plastic with huge amounts of strength with out being brittle.

So you think if I replace the broken lugs w/ Larry's it will be as good as new? On there website it says they can be removed when you wear out the tracks, so it sounds like you can't go wrong. They also say you can do it w/ the track on the machine... might be kind of tight on the rc30... I guess we will see.

[Digdeep]

I think what you said about the weight and balance of the machine makes sense. That blows my mind that your tracks have lasted 2000hrs. I have always thought these suspended undercarriages were a money pit from what I have researched... but maybe the ASV machines are different. Have you had to replace any undercarriage components? How are your rollers and bogie wheels doing?

I am betting the tracks on my asv rc30 w/ almost 2000hrs may be the originals. The bogie wheels might be original as well. They are a little bit chipped up but still serve there purpose.

Sounds like the asv is probably a much better machine than the cat since it is specifically engineered for tracks.

I have replace all four of my rear idlers and a few other things and most of my wheels do have some chips and grooving from stone especially the front idlers. I sold over 200 Bobcat track loaders and went up against ASV and CAT many many times. I can honestly say without any exageration that the difference between the wear on the undercarriage of an ASV and a CAT MTL is huge especially the 257 compared to the RC50/60 and the 287 compared to the RC100. The 247 wear is much better than the 257 which was way too heavy and underpowered in my opinion.

[Lawnworks]

I have replace all four of my rear idlers and a few other things and most of my wheels do have some chips and grooving from stone especially the front idlers. I sold over 200 Bobcat track loaders and went up against ASV and CAT many many times. I can honestly say without any exageration that the difference between the wear on the undercarriage of an ASV and a CAT MTL is huge especially the 257 compared to the RC50/60 and the 287 compared to the RC100. The 247 wear is much better than the 257 which was way too heavy and underpowered in my opinion.

Wow so really in 2000 hours you probably have only spent $500-1000 in undercarriage components? That seems pretty reasonable. How is the wear on the outside of your tracks now?

I know how long the undercarriage lasts has alot to do w/ the operator, but I just re-sold a T190 w/ 1240hrs that had new tracks($3600) and many new undercarriage components($8000). I was kind of surprised at that... I thought the fixed tracks were supposed to be more reasonable. It was a FL skid... maybe the sand has something to do with it.

[Digdeep]

Wow so really in 2000 hours you probably have only spent $500-1000 in undercarriage components? That seems pretty reasonable. How is the wear on the outside of your tracks now?

I know how long the undercarriage lasts has alot to do w/ the operator, but I just re-sold a T190 w/ 1240hrs that had new tracks($3600) and many new undercarriage components($8000). I was kind of surprised at that... I thought the fixed tracks were supposed to be more reasonable. It was a FL skid... maybe the sand has something to do with it.

The outside of my tracks have a wear pattern over where the rollers are in the undercarriage and quite a few nicks and small cuts but it hasn't affected the traction or performance. I have seen enough Bobcat undercarriages over the years that I both sold and see in the field and the cost you talk about doesn't really surprise me. I am surprised that you didn/t have drive motor problems though. Of course Bobcat would sell their system as being more reasonable just like ASV would. Everyone ultimately needs to make their machine choice based on their needs. I personally went out and searched for the RC50 I own even after over 8 years of selling Bobcat. The ASV salesman that I used to sell against just about fell over when I walked into his dealership and told him what I was looking for.

[Lawnworks]

The outside of my tracks have a wear pattern over where the rollers are in the undercarriage and quite a few nicks and small cuts but it hasn't affected the traction or performance. I have seen enough Bobcat undercarriages over the years that I both sold and see in the field and the cost you talk about doesn't really surprise me. I am surprised that you didn/t have drive motor problems though. Of course Bobcat would sell their system as being more reasonable just like ASV would. Everyone ultimately needs to make their machine choice based on their needs. I personally went out and searched for the RC50 I own even after over 8 years of selling Bobcat. The ASV salesman that I used to sell against just about fell over when I walked into his dealership and told him what I was looking for.

Will an rc50 lift a pallet of sod? if not will an rc60? off a semi?

[Lawnworks]

I would love to see a pic of your tracks. I wrote off a track machine b/c I always thought they would a huge money pit... but it sounds like w/ asv it really might be quite affordable. Especially w/ these replacement lugs. It seems like the drive lugs are the real wear items, but for $25 a pop you can't beat it. I might have to keep an eye out for an rc50/60... my only requirement is that it lift a pallet of sod.

[Cooter]

There is a guy on plowsite saying his RC30 will lift a pallet of fert/ice melt at 2000# with the correct counterweight.

[BIGBEN2004]

Must be one heck of a counter weight. Also I can't see how the hydraulics could possible have enough power to lift that much weight. I guess that is why when you get on these sights you will hear everyones opinions and lyes.

[KRtraxx]

I have replace all four of my rear idlers and a few other things and most of my wheels do have some chips and grooving from stone especially the front idlers. I sold over 200 Bobcat track loaders and went up against ASV and CAT many many times. I can honestly say without any exageration that the difference between the wear on the undercarriage of an ASV and a CAT MTL is huge especially the 257 compared to the RC50/60 and the 287 compared to the RC100. The 247 wear is much better than the 257 which was way too heavy and underpowered in my opinion.

Used to sell Cat skids and still am on many deals against them.The 247 is probably the best MTL unit they sell.I agree 100% with what your saying Digdeep,seen it many many times..And even though the 247 is a great medium MTL its interesting to demo a RC 50 or 60 against them.The balance of the 50 or 60 is still better than even the 247.And that is why the UC will last longer.Less stress on them.
I would have to say though that the newer RC 50 (same loader arms as the 60,no turbo) is not as productive of machine as it used to be.To much added weight with the same power.The 60 is a much better choice if your going to use the unit at close to its maximum capabilities..The HP helps alot.

[74inchShovel]

2000 pounds with the right counter weight? I'm not going to say impossible, but this is very very doubtful. Love to see it done if true......:rolleyes:

[Cooter]

Here is the link to the thread saying that his RC30 will lift 2000#

http://www.plowsite.com/showthread.php?t=48260

I would like to see this also, who knows?

[bobcat_ron]

"will lift a 2000lbs pallet of ice melt into the dump trailer with 400lbs in the hitch"

"mine is a bracket off the front of a tractor welded to a drawbar mount for a pintle hitch, then you just add suit case weights until you have enough. makes it easy on and off"


That makes sense, he's got a 400 lb counter weight that slips into the hitch on the rear of the RC-30, some of the ASV's have a hitch receiver on them.

[DiyDave]

From my experience with my RC 30, with 4k weight in the back, you might be able to lift the pallet, but you would probably manage to kill both your front idlers, and rear idlers, simultaneously. The warranty is void if the machine and attachment weighs more than 4K lbs, I think. I use mine to move logs onto the sawmill, occasionally, when the forklift is down, it'll roll 4k lb logs, but I'd never try to lift one!:weightlifter::weightlifter:

[Lawnworks]

Will an rc50 or 60 move a pallet of sod? I take it they cannot lift one off the back of a semi or overdeck trailer.

[Digdeep]

Used to sell Cat skids and still am on many deals against them.The 247 is probably the best MTL unit they sell.I agree 100% with what your saying Digdeep,seen it many many times..And even though the 247 is a great medium MTL its interesting to demo a RC 50 or 60 against them.The balance of the 50 or 60 is still better than even the 247.And that is why the UC will last longer.Less stress on them.
I would have to say though that the newer RC 50 (same loader arms as the 60,no turbo) is not as productive of machine as it used to be.To much added weight with the same power.The 60 is a much better choice if your going to use the unit at close to its maximum capabilities..The HP helps alot.

I agree the wear between the ASV machines (especially the RC50) and the CAT MTLs is night and day. That is why I bought the old style RC50. It is much quicker and more nimble without the extra weight. The 400lb increase in ROC was not a big enough advantage for me to buy the newer style and I didn't have the cash for a RC60 at the time. I do think the new PT60 is sweet machine with the new two speed at 11mph.

[Digdeep]

Will an rc50 or 60 move a pallet of sod? I take it they cannot lift one off the back of a semi or overdeck trailer.

I know that my old RC50 will not because it only has 1500lb ROC. I can pick one up on the ground and move it around but I couldn't get one off of the truck. I think the PT50/60 could do it but it would be close. I have seen the ASV SR70 do it easily though.

I can't see how and RC30 could lift 2000lbs either. They are workhorses of a little machine but no way will it lift 2000lbs.