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View Full Version : Ford V-10 vs 6.4 Turbo Diesel


wintergreenlawn&landscape
03-09-2008, 05:59 PM
I am currently looking to buy an F350. However with the economy the way it is, specifically fuel, should I pay less ( approx $8K) for the V-10 or pay out the cash for the diesel?

Marek
03-09-2008, 06:08 PM
How many miles do you put on a truck a year and how long do you plan on keeping it? I used to buy a truck and say I was going to keep it forever, now I know that in a couple years I will be buying a new one and the current one will be gone. From everything I have seen diesel will stay higher than gas from now on since the ULSD is more expensive to refine.

J&R Landscaping
03-09-2008, 06:10 PM
From what I have heard about the new 6.4L fuel economy, I would go with the V-10 engine. You might actually get better mpg than the diesel. I've heard some people struggling to get 11mpg with the 6.4L.

nosparkplugs
03-09-2008, 06:12 PM
I would go with the Diesel if your budget allows, I sold my 02 F-350 7.3L powerstroke for the Cummins powered Dodge's in-line 6, stronger engine, easy to maintain. I am saving even more in Diesel fuel with the 3/4 ton over the 1 ton dually. The 6.4 is a twin turbo, and their are problems with overheating, and the cab must be lifted off the frame to do most work$$$$. I keep my diesels maintained, so it's worth the intial cost.

fishmagnet
03-09-2008, 06:24 PM
Wow!

Are you pulling a cattle-horse trailer, hauling round bales, or heavy farm equipment?

F-350 is kinda overkill for yanking lawn equipment around town.

That V-10 is a gas pig and the 6.4 diesel has known 'issues', but if those are your only choices, I'd probably opt for the V-10.

Best of luck whatever you decide!:drinkup:

customcurbdesigns
03-09-2008, 06:32 PM
Go with the diesel, resale, towing, performance, are much better in the diesel.

I have an 06 with the 6.0 and I like it, no issues so far (knock on wood)

customcurbdesigns
03-09-2008, 06:33 PM
Just so you know, all of them come with the bumper to bumper 36k mile warranty but the diesel has a powertrain warranty to 100k miles...

ProStreetCamaro
03-09-2008, 06:34 PM
Chevy 2500HD with the 6.0. More power than the V10, better fuel mileage then the V10and diesel and less problems being it is a GM truck. Also the duramax stomps all over the powerstroke offerings and is the most powerful diesel on the market today in stock form and holds its own when modified.


I am biased on this topic because of all our ford problems and my relatives problems. No more ford for us ever again. Plus GM engines have always made more power than ford.

mowerbrad
03-09-2008, 06:54 PM
I would get the diesel, you'll love the towing capacity.

Weekes
03-09-2008, 07:25 PM
Are these your only two options do you need that much power? A V8 will save a ton and they have lots of power.

nosparkplugs
03-09-2008, 07:58 PM
The duramax is a cast iron block, with aluminum heads, and weak connecting rods, a tuner/high boost psi will blow the head gaskets, and bend the connecting rods, also the Durmax or duracrap is prone to overheating or the "limp" mode when it gets hot. The 7.3L powerstroke is buy far the most durable V8 diesel iron block & iron heads, the HEUI/cat injectors require high oil pressures or twin oil pumps for heavy mods.
The holy grail of diesels is the Cummins ISB inline 6 cylinder diesel, iron block & iron head 24 valves, all forged internals, inline six is easy to maintain, realiable, and can accept twin turbos easliy, lots of room in the engine bay with a inline engine
With that being said, I am bias towards Cummins 5.9L ISB; because I have owned a Powerstroke, and have friends blown their Duramax's, the Cummins 5.9L ISB is hands down the strongest most reliable, and easy to maintain diesel on the market. Im talking about the diesel engines, not the trucks they are put in

grassman177
03-09-2008, 08:17 PM
i have the v-10, it gets great mileage and has way more power than the v-8. in fact, it gets the same mileage as our v-8's on my fleet. i pull a 22 ft trailer loaded and it is a beast. the diesel is way more $ and i think the fuel eco is better actually with the v-10. the old 7.3 diesels were great from what i hear, but you cant get one now!

wintergreenlawn&landscape
03-09-2008, 08:29 PM
Im going to pull an 18 ft'r. Winter, I'm going to install a 9 foot Fisher with sander so im going to need the load capacity to the point where I might opt for the f450 or 550. In addition I will be delivering cord wood and pellets in the fall.

specialtylc
03-09-2008, 08:38 PM
I bought a 2008 F450 this past october with the V10. The diesel option costs $6000 more than the gas truck.My truck gets about 8 mpg at best.
If you are going to put at least 10,000 miles a year on this truck you should get the diesel. I think by about 50,000 mile of use the diesel is cheaper to own.

ProStreetCamaro
03-09-2008, 09:25 PM
i have the v-10, it gets great mileage and has way more power than the v-8. in fact, it gets the same mileage as our v-8's on my fleet. i pull a 22 ft trailer loaded and it is a beast. the diesel is way more $ and i think the fuel eco is better actually with the v-10. the old 7.3 diesels were great from what i hear, but you cant get one now!

Man you better go outside right now and kiss your truck because your results are not normal. My friend sold his V-10 because he got about 4-6mpg with a trailer behind it and 8 or so empty.

YardBoss Lawncare
03-09-2008, 09:49 PM
Go with the diesel, and when you do, Cummins is the only way to go. I've owned the 7.3 Powerstroke, 6.0 Powerstroke, 6.8 V-10, 6.5 Chevy diesel, and I now have an 07' 5.9 Cummins. The only other thing that could even compare with it is the good ol 7.3 Powerstroke. That was a good engine and in my opinion Ford has went downhill every since they did away it. I know it was due to emissions, the fact that it was louder than alot of people cared for, and it couldve used a tad more horsepower (turbo). Still, it was a legend. Mine was a 95'. The 6 liter I had was a 04'. I traded it in on the 07' Cummins last March.

lawnman_scott
03-09-2008, 09:57 PM
I bought a 2008 F450 this past october with the V10. The diesel option costs $6000 more than the gas truck.My truck gets about 8 mpg at best.
If you are going to put at least 10,000 miles a year on this truck you should get the diesel. I think by about 50,000 mile of use the diesel is cheaper to own.I have a 2008 F250 with the 6.4 deisel. It gets about 11 pulling a trailer, barly any highway miles at all. I guess the mileage could be better, but the power is unreal. You can hardly notice that you have a trailer on.

nosparkplugs
03-09-2008, 10:04 PM
Wintergreen, Get what you can afford 2500,3500,4500,5500?, just make sure it's a diesel you will be happier in the longrun.

Tscape
03-09-2008, 10:14 PM
Man you better go outside right now and kiss your truck because your results are not normal. My friend sold his V-10 because he got about 4-6mpg with a trailer behind it and 8 or so empty.
RIDICULOUS! Absolutely untrue. I have a V10 and get 11mpg pulling an 18 ft. trailer around town. Look at the guy's screen name and that will tell what he is all about. Ford with a V10 is a winner!

clay duncan
03-09-2008, 10:16 PM
Man you better go outside right now and kiss your truck because your results are not normal. My friend sold his V-10 because he got about 4-6mpg with a trailer behind it and 8 or so empty.

alot of ford v-10 owners from the ford truck website report 14 mpg empty and 10 to 12 towing. i have a f-250 5.4 and i get 15.5 at 65mph on the interstate and not so good towing, maybe 7 to 10. i would take the v-10 over the diesel anyday of the week. the v-10 will do anything the diesel will do except drain your wallet........

stuvecorp
03-09-2008, 10:29 PM
I have been told it all depends on how many miles per year and if you are towing big. I have looked at the 450/550 with a V10 because they are so much cheaper and I don't hear good things about the 6.4. For the resale, if you spend 8,000 less new you will get 8,000 less come time to sell but that is a smaller loan payment. If I was to set up a back up truck I think I would get the V10.

riverwalklandscaping
03-09-2008, 10:30 PM
Its not a ford, but my dodge has a v10. I get about 5 plowing or towing, 6 city an 7or8 highway

nosparkplugs
03-09-2008, 10:31 PM
tscape, 10 to 12MPG ford V10 you better keep that truck, the Pipe line I do right of way mowing for the Dupont pipe line, they are currently selling off their fleet of Ford V10 trucks nationally, why cost of maintenance, and the V10 sucks gasoline, switching to Cummins diesels. Hate to burst your party, but I have walked away from the pipeline's ford F-250 V10 both of us hauling the same 13,500GTWR gooseneck trailer & Kubtoa MX6800 tractor, the V10 was just screaming high 6,000rpm's I was running 2,500rpm tops with the Turbo just whistleing walked right away no struggle for the diesel. It's not even a fair tow-off to compare a Cummins 5.9L 24 valve Turbo diesel to a F-250 V10. I was getting maybe 9MPG when we were having the tow-off on the overhead the Ford F-250 V10 was 2MPG @ 6,000rpm.

nosparkplugs
03-09-2008, 10:36 PM
A standard gasburner will always be cheaper than a diesel engine option. What are you all thinking the diesel should be cheaper? God bless us all. No wonder folks around here complain about fuel prices you all run gasburnes, It' hurts with diesel, but I am sure at the pump less than my competition, gosh? that might make sense.

stuvecorp
03-09-2008, 10:37 PM
I would agree that the 5.9(now 6.7) has monster performance and likely the best mileage. Now that the Dodge/Sterling is out with the Cummins in the 450/550 class imho that is the best option for a truck.

nosparkplugs
03-09-2008, 10:46 PM
Stuvecorp, Know some guys with the Sterling and the 6 auto speed Asia tranny 4:10 gears just a gorrilla, when it comes to towing& hauling. I still like the 5.9L 2nd & 3rd generation engines mine are stock with 4" straight pipe's & cold air intakes no chips allowed.

TXNSLighting
03-09-2008, 10:55 PM
Go with the diesel, and when you do, Cummins is the only way to go. I've owned the 7.3 Powerstroke, 6.0 Powerstroke, 6.8 V-10, 6.5 Chevy diesel, and I now have an 07' 5.9 Cummins. The only other thing that could even compare with it is the good ol 7.3 Powerstroke. That was a good engine and in my opinion Ford has went downhill every since they did away it. I know it was due to emissions, the fact that it was louder than alot of people cared for, and it couldve used a tad more horsepower (turbo). Still, it was a legend. Mine was a 95'. The 6 liter I had was a 04'. I traded it in on the 07' Cummins last March.

all powerstrokes have turbos big guy..

TXNSLighting
03-09-2008, 11:00 PM
my advice go with diesel. the 6.4 single wheels are getting around 15-16 highway. not 10 like some are saying. the job 1 6.4's werent gettin good fuel mileage but job 2's are. And v-10 is very good. 05+ get pretty decent fuel mileage. the older ones didnt. and they tow very well. alota people dont know they made them better in the 05 years. Its a very good engine. Either way youll be fine.

YardBoss Lawncare
03-09-2008, 11:00 PM
the v-10 will do anything the diesel will do except drain your wallet........

:laugh::laugh::laugh: It'll do everything except climb hills and pull loads at 2,000 RPM like my Cummins (and all other diesels ive owned) will. I've owned a V10 man. I pulled a 16 ft landscape trailer with 2 ZTR's in it 22 miles to the town I mow in everyday there and back. That thing would downshift and have to rap up the RPM's 5 or 6 times every time I did. A diesel will just keep right on lugging hands down without ever dropping speed or raising RPM's. Everyone knows that.:hammerhead:

YardBoss Lawncare
03-09-2008, 11:04 PM
all powerstrokes have turbos big guy..

Do you really think I don't know that? What I meant was it could have used a little more turbo. A little more horsepower, etc... I know they all have turbos. On the 7.3 it was right on top of the engine. You miss read that.

TXNSLighting
03-09-2008, 11:09 PM
you scared me man! it sounded like that tho. They were alotta fun with a banks turbo on em. I agree they were a little lacking in power. But thats their max from the factory. o well.

clay duncan
03-09-2008, 11:13 PM
tscape, 10 to 12MPG ford V10 you better keep that truck, the Pipe line I do right of way mowing for the Dupont pipe line, they are currently selling off their fleet of Ford V10 trucks nationally, why cost of maintenance, and the V10 sucks gasoline, switching to Cummins diesels. Hate to burst your party, but I have walked away from the pipeline's ford F-250 V10 both of us hauling the same 13,500GTWR gooseneck trailer & Kubtoa MX6800 tractor, the V10 was just screaming high 6,000rpm's I was running 2,500rpm tops with the Turbo just whistleing walked right away no struggle for the diesel. It's not even a fair tow-off to compare a Cummins 5.9L 24 valve Turbo diesel to a F-250 V10. I was getting maybe 9MPG when we were having the tow-off on the overhead the Ford F-250 V10 was 2MPG @ 6,000rpm.

nosparkplugs i know you are diesel no matter what and i am not trying to disrespect you at all but, you really cant believe you can sell off a fleet of trucks to reduce cost of maintenance (i have a diesel) and buy new diesel trucks to save fuel. also triton v-8 and v-10 engines like to rev and i know it was not struggling to pull that kind of weight. i pulled 12,500 of rip rap with my wimpy v-8 the other day and although very overloaded it did just fine. most people find that it takes about 100,000 miles just to break even on the diesel purchase alone. one other thing i would like to throw out there is a diesel out of warranty can be very hazardous on your finances when it breaks. i would be more worried about killing someone towing that kind of weight racing than fuel mileage........clay

YardBoss Lawncare
03-09-2008, 11:15 PM
Mine was in a 95' F-250, 2wd, standard. It was the truck that taught me a valuable lesson.....never buy a 2wd diesel. They're as useless as the tits on a boar. Okay on the pavement, but helpless off the road. It was all stock. I don't chip and never have.

clay duncan
03-09-2008, 11:31 PM
:laugh::laugh::laugh: It'll do everything except climb hills and pull loads at 2,000 RPM like my Cummins (and all other diesels ive owned) will. I've owned a V10 man. I pulled a 16 ft landscape trailer with 2 ZTR's in it 22 miles to the town I mow in everyday there and back. That thing would downshift and have to rap up the RPM's 5 or 6 times every time I did. A diesel will just keep right on lugging hands down without ever dropping speed or raising RPM's. Everyone knows that.:hammerhead:

well i stand corrected then. i didnt know a v-10 wouldnt pull 3000 lbs down the interstate. i just thought it might because my 5.4 will and i live in WNC where we have hills......

nosparkplugs
03-09-2008, 11:35 PM
Clay, Yes I dreed the day my Bosch VP44 fuel injection pump goes 2K just for the pump, I have a emergency fund just for those consumables, the lower maintenance cost should be put away for those expensive parts. Most large fleet owners, Truegreen included are selling their gasburners for diesels they now realize they can purchase, and use B20blends in diesel mowers and purchase it in bulk, do you read Lawn & landscape magazine? diesel switch is everyware in this industry. Although we many not have the financial ability to switch a fleet it is true. At 16yrs old my first car was a diesel been hook ever since a 36 year love affair you could say I believe diesel can overtake the gasoline engine, and will. Hey no disrespect taken either, I love to debate, it's good for you.

YardBoss Lawncare
03-09-2008, 11:42 PM
Oh hell, the V10 will pull, don't get me wrong. It just doesn't have the twisting power (torque) at the drive tires that the diesel does. It'll be screaming to high heaven with a load on it everytime you encounter just the smallest hill in the road. There's a reason that 18 wheelers are using diesel engines. It's the pulling power and longivity.

YardBoss Lawncare
03-09-2008, 11:45 PM
My Cummins has 610 foot pounds of torque whereas the V10 has mid 400s.

PerfiCut L&L
03-09-2008, 11:49 PM
I think the point has been made several times.

Diesel has more power, maintains lower RPM's thus less wear and tear, costs more up front, holds it value in the end. Fuel costs more.

V-10, lower MPG, higher RPM's leading to potentian problems later, uses more gas but gas is cheaper than diesel. Up front costs are less, and sometime more difficult to get out of later.

So lets say the operating costs are even if used less than 15k miles a year. Otherwise in the long run (over several years) diesel is the way to go.

So whats the question again?

DuraCutter
03-10-2008, 01:07 AM
i have the v-10, it gets great mileage and has way more power than the v-8. in fact, it gets the same mileage as our v-8's on my fleet. i pull a 22 ft trailer loaded and it is a beast. the diesel is way more $ and i think the fuel eco is better actually with the v-10. the old 7.3 diesels were great from what i hear, but you cant get one now!

Well said. Realistically you don't need a diesel unless you pull really very heavy loads. Don't need it in "most" cases. We have an 02 and 06 f350 with v10 and it does all the towing you ask of it and more. It's good on gas, easy to maintain, lasts forever... not hard to start in cold, what more could you want. One truck has 200,000 miles and showing no signs or quitting.

:)

Looking Good Lawn Service
03-10-2008, 01:21 AM
hmmm, around here, 87 gas 3.07, diesel = 4.09, if you dont need 15k towing capability you dont need the diesel. I sold my powerstroke, and I got a real nice gm with the 6.0 gas, all niced up, I have no regrets, it pulls my large enclosed trailers with ease and has a smoother ride. Plus I will be saving almost $100 a month on fuel doing the same rounds. I miss my powerstroke, but I got out when I saw it coming.

stuvecorp
03-10-2008, 01:21 AM
Nosparkplugs, some day I will have a Sterling.:clapping:

Back to the question, everyone's business setup is alittle different so thats why you have to sit down and really run the numbers for the cost of truck, fuel, maintenance and how the truck may be upfitted.

GravelyNut
03-10-2008, 02:42 AM
tscape, 10 to 12MPG ford V10 you better keep that truck, the Pipe line I do right of way mowing for the Dupont pipe line, they are currently selling off their fleet of Ford V10 trucks nationally, why cost of maintenance, and the V10 sucks gasoline, switching to Cummins diesels. Hate to burst your party, but I have walked away from the pipeline's ford F-250 V10 both of us hauling the same 13,500GTWR gooseneck trailer & Kubtoa MX6800 tractor, the V10 was just screaming high 6,000rpm's I was running 2,500rpm tops with the Turbo just whistleing walked right away no struggle for the diesel. It's not even a fair tow-off to compare a Cummins 5.9L 24 valve Turbo diesel to a F-250 V10. I was getting maybe 9MPG when we were having the tow-off on the overhead the Ford F-250 V10 was 2MPG @ 6,000rpm.

Wish I'd been there to show you what you guys did wrong, so I'll start at the RPM rating you quote for the V-10. 6,000+? Who chipped the engine to run that RPM. Factory specs say that the V-10's max HP is at 4750 RPM. Anyone out there with the V-10 want to chime in with what the factory tach is marked for the redline? . So if the V-10 had to hit 6K it was past the max HP point and that was a major problem. Top torque for the V-10 should have been in the 3200 RPM range. If you try for speed, you want the RPM near the max HP. It you want acceleration, you want the RPM near the max torque rated speed at the point of the upshift engagement.

And now for a little fun fact about the difference in cost on a gasoline Vs Diesel engine. For the extra cost of the Diesel, I can get an extra, brand new, 8.1L Vortec delivered and ready to drop in. With no core charge. With a 12 month/ no mileage limit warranty.

Also don't try the lugging down the Diesel story and pulling without downshifting on an upgrade story on me. I see Diesels go thru the gears on long grades just like a gasoline engine will do. Just the gasoline ones do it and are at the top of the hill sooner.

YardBoss Lawncare
03-10-2008, 05:37 AM
Well, I was just speaking from my own experiences with the 5.4 I had, the 6.8 I had, the 6.5 diesel I had, the 7.3 diesel I had, the 6.0 diesel I had, and the 5.9 that I have now. I've pulled with everyone of them. Everything from livestock trailers, to car haulers that were loaded down with fencing lumber and pallets of 80lb sacks of concrete, to landscape trailers with ZTRs on them. I've also pulled my boat with all of them as well as the travel trailer. Out of my experience, and yours may be different, but out of my experience, the diesel does not down shift when lugging a loaded down trailer up a hill or a 5th wheel camper (that catches some serious wind drag). The 5.4 and 6.8 gas engines I had would down shift and rap up higher than a kite at just the slightest little hill. Sure, if you want something snappy and quick, gas engines are the thing for you. But if youre after serious torque and pulling power, power that will lug down the interstate at 2K RPM with 8 or 10 thousand pounds hooked on behind ya stickin way up in the air like a big parachute, then diesel is the only way to go.

YardBoss Lawncare
03-10-2008, 05:43 AM
You see, my Cummins provides max torque (610ft lbs.) at 1600 RPM. At just a whisper above idle, my engine will clean break over 10 tons of rolling weight, and all you'll ever hear is just a soft little wistle from the turbo. My 325 horses come at 3200 RPM. My oil changes are at 7500 miles. My life expectancy before major over hauls is 350,000 miles (which we all know is alot more than that)

GravelyNut
03-10-2008, 08:40 AM
You see, my Cummins provides max torque (610ft lbs.) at 1600 RPM. At just a whisper above idle, my engine will clean break over 10 tons of rolling weight, and all you'll ever hear is just a soft little wistle from the turbo. My 325 horses come at 3200 RPM. My oil changes are at 7500 miles. My life expectancy before major over hauls is 350,000 miles (which we all know is alot more than that)

So your Cummins peak HP is at 3200 RPM. And your peak torque is at 1600 RPM. With those ratings at peak torque ( what your engine would be needing ) you'd be down around 45 MPH max on a long grade of 5% Or it would have shifted down to keep the RPM up. You won't be pulling the 5% 7 mile long grade on I-77 loaded at 70MPH for sure without it shifting.

Now to compare apples to apples. A 2001 Chevy 8.1 V-8 vs Dodge 8.0 V-10 vs Ford 7.3 liter gasoline engines of the same vintage with the same trailer loaded to 10K on a bumper hitch and all auto equipted dually crew cabs. All geared with axle ratios of about 4.10:1. The grade that a Chevy can still pull without downshifting, will cause a Ford and a Dodge to downshift. How was that possible? The Chevy made more torque at road speed. The Ford did win the 1/4 mile time empty. By one tenth of a second. Dodge didn't win any of the categories.

Life expectancy of 325k for your Cummins as compared to 250K for my 8.1. Not much difference when you get that high in mileage. Most people will have a new truck by that time. But even if I replace my engine at 250K, I still would be a couple grand ahead on cost. Even more so now that Diesel is costing 50 cents or more than regular gasoline and smog legal Diesels are dropping in MPG..

Monte22
03-10-2008, 09:40 AM
I would go with a V-10. I just bought another gas motor. I own 2 diesel motors and 2 gas. Diesel is 80 cents more a gallon and over 8K to buy. I would need to keep a diesel truck 8 to 10 years to break even. I never keep trucks that long. Further, you will pull anything with a V-10. Also, if a diesel breaks down out of warranty, it seems like you will pay no less that $1,000.00 to fix anything.

POPO4995
03-10-2008, 09:52 AM
Just the cost of diesel fuel makes me answer: the V-10.

grassman177
03-10-2008, 10:12 AM
like i said, the v-10 is really awesome. you have to be really pulling some serious @#%$ to justify the diesel to have the pay the extra for the extra low end torque. we really get good mileage out of ours as i said, but i never count it, no use. i just know it seriously gets the same as the v-8 i used to use and the ohter trucks on our fleet have. it is a good engine!

wintergreenlawn&landscape
03-10-2008, 11:27 AM
Thanks for all your input, The Boss - Wife has read your posts and we decided to go with the V-10. Ill post it when we get it...Thanks again!

dbear
03-10-2008, 12:10 PM
Chevy 2500HD with the 6.0. More power than the V10,...

I do believe this is the first thing I've read from you that is blatantly wrong.

According to their respective websites:

GMC Vortec 6.0 V8 is rated at 353 HP and 373 lbs of torque.
Ford Trition 6.8 V10 is rated at 362 HP and 457 lbs of torque.

TXNSLighting
03-10-2008, 12:27 PM
I do believe this is the first thing I've read from you that is blatantly wrong.

According to their respective websites:

GMC Vortec 6.0 V8 is rated at 353 HP and 373 lbs of torque.
Ford Trition 6.8 V10 is rated at 362 HP and 457 lbs of torque.

exactly!!!!

GravelyNut
03-10-2008, 01:57 PM
I do believe this is the first thing I've read from you that is blatantly wrong.

According to their respective websites:

GMC Vortec 6.0 V8 is rated at 353 HP and 373 lbs of torque.
Ford Trition 6.8 V10 is rated at 362 HP and 457 lbs of torque.

And the 8.1 L stock was rated at 340 HP and 454 lbft of torque. But the 8.1 developed the torque at a lower RPM than the V-10. The 6.0 has been a gas hog from day one.

wintergreenlawn&landscape
03-10-2008, 11:09 PM
Heres an update, I just traded in the F-150 Screw for a Dodge Cummins Quad Short Bed
Thanks for all the help and advice...

A-Cut-ABOVE
03-11-2008, 12:17 AM
I am in the same boat. Trying to decide between the v10 and a diesel. the difference in up front cost is driving me to the v10. but I have wanted a diesel for awhile.

YardBoss Lawncare
03-11-2008, 06:42 AM
That's almost 100 ft lbs of difference. A guy would easily be able to notice that difference in the 2 when towing. IMO anyway.

easycareacres
03-11-2008, 07:33 AM
wait untill youre fuel goes up like in aust hee ya wouldnt bother with the pretty truck. 7 litres to tow what 2 diesel zero turns, come on. and they so ugly get a truck jethrull.

TXNSLighting
03-11-2008, 09:54 AM
Heres an update, I just traded in the F-150 Screw for a Dodge Cummins Quad Short Bed
Thanks for all the help and advice...

Now you didnt listen to anyone did you? O well good luck with it...what year?

wintergreenlawn&landscape
03-11-2008, 10:38 AM
Now you didnt listen to anyone did you? O well good luck with it...what year?

2005 with 50,000 on it - just broken in. It came with a Curtis plow and is loaded. I needed the quad inorder to throw the kids in from time to time. And yes, I value everybodies input , and made the best decision regarding the information given. The difference between gas and diesel is about 60 cents a gallon, thats $12 every fillup, $48.00 per month, thats $576 a year. At this point I'd rather have the capacity and power for $576 a year. In addition the truck get anywhere between 15 and 19 miles per gallon. Better then my 5.4 ltr that averages 10-12. You cant beat that Cummins engine. Ive been a Ford guy all my life, but after driving a Dodge with the Cummins, Ill never go back.

Tscape
03-11-2008, 11:15 AM
tscape, 10 to 12MPG ford V10 you better keep that truck, the Pipe line I do right of way mowing for the Dupont pipe line, they are currently selling off their fleet of Ford V10 trucks nationally, why cost of maintenance, and the V10 sucks gasoline, switching to Cummins diesels. Hate to burst your party, but I have walked away from the pipeline's ford F-250 V10 both of us hauling the same 13,500GTWR gooseneck trailer & Kubtoa MX6800 tractor, the V10 was just screaming high 6,000rpm's I was running 2,500rpm tops with the Turbo just whistleing walked right away no struggle for the diesel. It's not even a fair tow-off to compare a Cummins 5.9L 24 valve Turbo diesel to a F-250 V10. I was getting maybe 9MPG when we were having the tow-off on the overhead the Ford F-250 V10 was 2MPG @ 6,000rpm.


This has devolved into a stupid discussion where people who have time to sit and type long answers with unsubstantiated claims are ruling. 2 mpg in a v10? You would have to be STEWPID :dizzy: to buy that line of crap. SO now that you have said it, nospark, your credibility is simply dismissed. Thanks for lending 3 thousand meaningless words to the discussion.:laugh:

DK lawn care
03-11-2008, 05:36 PM
Wish I'd been there to show you what you guys did wrong, so I'll start at the RPM rating you quote for the V-10. 6,000+? Who chipped the engine to run that RPM. Factory specs say that the V-10's max HP is at 4750 RPM. Anyone out there with the V-10 want to chime in with what the factory tach is marked for the redline? . So if the V-10 had to hit 6K it was past the max HP point and that was a major problem. Top torque for the V-10 should have been in the 3200 RPM range. If you try for speed, you want the RPM near the max HP. It you want acceleration, you want the RPM near the max torque rated speed at the point of the upshift engagement.

And now for a little fun fact about the difference in cost on a gasoline Vs Diesel engine. For the extra cost of the Diesel, I can get an extra, brand new, 8.1L Vortec delivered and ready to drop in. With no core charge. With a 12 month/ no mileage limit warranty.

Also don't try the lugging down the Diesel story and pulling without downshifting on an upgrade story on me. I see Diesels go thru the gears on long grades just like a gasoline engine will do. Just the gasoline ones do it and are at the top of the hill sooner.


Theirs no way he can be pullin 6k. Ive tryed to redline mine a couple times and the most i can get out of her is 5200. EVEN if the engine did rev at 6k, why would u rev it at that? Ur outta the Peak hp range and ur farrr out of the peak tq range.

GravelyNut
03-11-2008, 06:00 PM
Theirs no way he can be pullin 6k. Ive tryed to redline mine a couple times and the most i can get out of her is 5200. EVEN if the engine did rev at 6k, why would u rev it at that? Ur outta the Peak hp range and ur farrr out of the peak tq range.
That is exactlly my point. Rev limiters and such kick in or it just plain runs out of power. Newer vehicles even prevent you from running the engine to the redline in Park or Neutral. Shift point on my 8.1 is right at peak HP. Sounds like yours might be too. An example of the HP being a limiting factor was a Detroit Diesel engine we had on a water pump. Max no load RPM was 4500. Max the engine attached to the pump could pull was 1900 RPM. And I don't think I ever want to go to the redline in high gear. The 3rd to 4th upshift WOT is at 90 MPH. 4th to 5th I never got too. Call me chicken.

DK lawn care
03-11-2008, 07:51 PM
ya but then u gotta thnik that the 8.1 and 6.8 are different engines. THe 6.8 loves to rev and the 8.1 doesnt like to rev at all. Personally i have hear of great stories of ppl useing the 6.8 as generators etc. I have heard of ppl usin the 6.8 in katrina to up some water out of smaller parts of the city. They say they run those 6.8s for months at high rpms. Only to turn them off to change oil and do maintenance. To me reving a v-10 at 4500+ rpms for long periods of time is nothing. Its SOHC design is reliable.

YardBoss Lawncare
03-11-2008, 08:18 PM
wait untill youre fuel goes up like in aust hee ya wouldnt bother with the pretty truck. 7 litres to tow what 2 diesel zero turns, come on. and they so ugly get a truck jethrull.

Don't guess I could make heads or tails of this statement. Who has a 7 liter engine? Also, what is a "truck jethrull"??:confused:

YardBoss Lawncare
03-11-2008, 08:29 PM
Heres an update, I just traded in the F-150 Screw for a Dodge Cummins Quad Short Bed
Thanks for all the help and advice...

Smart boy.:drinkup: I've got an 07' that I bought in March last year. I already put 63,000 miles on mine. It's the 5.9 block, not the new 6.7 liter because at the time I bought mine they were only putting them in the cab/chassis. I get 19 on the highway with nothing but me and my ol lady in it. 12 pulling the red landscape trailer with 2 ZTRs and all my stuff in it. I get about 15 or 16 putting around town. My highway dropped to 17 when I put some all-terrain tires on it. Im going back to the street tires once I wear them out. Im on the pavement more than I am the mud, so it only makes since to go back to them and gain my mileage back. The all terrains do look tougher though.:rolleyes: Mine is not chipped or anything. It's all stock, other than I cut the cad. conv. off as soon as I bought it. Still got my stock muffler on and everything. Good luck with your's. I know you'll like the Cummins.

LawnBoy89
03-11-2008, 09:35 PM
Heres an update, I just traded in the F-150 Screw for a Dodge Cummins Quad Short Bed
Thanks for all the help and advice...

It's going to be tough to make the difference you paid for the truck back with diesel at $4 a gallon and the extra probably $8k you spend for the diesel motor.

YardBoss Lawncare
03-11-2008, 10:00 PM
Yeah, that may be true. However, you're sure gonna love the torque and just the pride you'll feel by being in the diesel club. Sometimes you just have to treat yourself, even if you know you wont break even.

Construct'O
03-11-2008, 11:00 PM
Heres an update, I just traded in the F-150 Screw for a Dodge Cummins Quad Short Bed
Thanks for all the help and advice...

Score one for the Cummins team !!!!!!! v/10 zero:):usflag:

YardBoss Lawncare
03-11-2008, 11:28 PM
:weightlifter::weightlifter:

GravelyNut
03-12-2008, 08:47 AM
ya but then u gotta thnik that the 8.1 and 6.8 are different engines. THe 6.8 loves to rev and the 8.1 doesnt like to rev at all. Personally i have hear of great stories of ppl useing the 6.8 as generators etc. I have heard of ppl usin the 6.8 in katrina to up some water out of smaller parts of the city. They say they run those 6.8s for months at high rpms. Only to turn them off to change oil and do maintenance. To me reving a v-10 at 4500+ rpms for long periods of time is nothing. Its SOHC design is reliable.

If you concider 3600 RPM as high. That is about the fastest that gensets are made to run. Longer lasting ones run at either 1800 or 1200 RPM. Or really long lasting ones at 900 or 600 RPM. Onan sells all sorts of natural gas/propane powered generators that run Ford engines.

And there is a place, here in Florida, that will install a 10KW generator on an Allison tranny for you. Allison T-1000s have a PTO connection and with a remote throttle, the 8.1 or Duramax becomes a mobile power source.

TXNSLighting
03-12-2008, 10:04 AM
2005 with 50,000 on it - just broken in. It came with a Curtis plow and is loaded. I needed the quad inorder to throw the kids in from time to time. And yes, I value everybodies input , and made the best decision regarding the information given. The difference between gas and diesel is about 60 cents a gallon, thats $12 every fillup, $48.00 per month, thats $576 a year. At this point I'd rather have the capacity and power for $576 a year. In addition the truck get anywhere between 15 and 19 miles per gallon. Better then my 5.4 ltr that averages 10-12. You cant beat that Cummins engine. Ive been a Ford guy all my life, but after driving a Dodge with the Cummins, Ill never go back.

Trust me, i said the exact same thing. and i loved the cummins. i had an 05 also, but after the truck started falling apart at 40k i gave up.. maybe youll have better luck. and i hope yours gets between 15 and 19, cuz mine didnt get anywhere close.

TXNSLighting
03-12-2008, 10:08 AM
o and welcome to the diesel club!!! youll never go back to the crappy gas club...

Marek
03-12-2008, 10:52 PM
Does anyone have a new 450-550 with the 6.4 or V 10? What kind of mpg are you getting with them. I'm looking at new ones and for the first time in yrs thinking gas may be ok .

TXNSLighting
03-13-2008, 12:30 AM
gas is never ok... if its a 450 crew cab long bed truck then 8, but if its a cab and chassie you can expect a little better.

supercuts
03-13-2008, 01:32 PM
for the record, my 08 f350 single rear wheel has been consistantly getting 13-14 mpg a tank, mixed highway and around town miles. the problems ive had were, it need an alignment immediately, chrome grille flaked and was just replaced, and its going in tommarow for a turbo noise. with that said, im fairly happy with it.it has lots of power, rides nice, starts and runs like a gas engine in the cold, and has a great resale value. when i bought mine sticker was $44,600 and i got it for $35,500 plus tax, reg, plow, etc. it was not 0% financing like it is now, so im sure the price will be several thousand more.

DK lawn care
03-13-2008, 01:43 PM
Can we see a pic of ur 08? How do u like the 6.4?

supercuts
03-13-2008, 08:26 PM
Can we see a pic of ur 08? How do u like the 6.4?

http://www.lawnsite.com/showthread.php?t=211974&highlight=nite+shot
thats one, im trying to find the day pics

supercuts
03-13-2008, 08:29 PM
http://www.lawnsite.com/showthread.php?t=205918&highlight=08&page=3

and the day pics

supercuts
03-13-2008, 08:32 PM
Does anyone have a new 450-550 with the 6.4 or V 10? What kind of mpg are you getting with them. I'm looking at new ones and for the first time in yrs thinking gas may be ok .

my 00 f550 with the 7.3 PSD gets low, i dont even keep track anymore, i think under 10mpg. my 00 f350 PSD is still getting better milelage than my 08 f350 PSD. with that being said, an 08 6.4L is going to get less than my 10mpg. the 00 f550 has the 4.88 gears in the rear too.

ProStreetCamaro
03-13-2008, 08:42 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bLOtnMSOCMI&feature=related

Marek
03-13-2008, 08:54 PM
My one 02 550 has the 488 rear too and gets bad MPG and has always seemed to be low on power. Come to find out there was a bad o ring on the injector. Might do a new truck 02 was paid for but I can get over 50 percent of what I paid for it. Would like to hear more from guys that have them .

TXNSLighting
03-14-2008, 10:01 AM
I just talked to a guy at the pumps yesterday. He had a job 2, 6.4 powerstroke. had a 6 inch lift and 36" tires. Hes averageing 15 mpg. Hid company has 4 250's and 2 350's the 350's get around 12, and the other 250s get 15 or better, He hasnt had one problem out of any of em and flat out loves em. His previous truck was just like mine, and he said the new one was alot better. So thats good to hear.

DK lawn care
03-14-2008, 05:20 PM
http://www.lawnsite.com/showthread.php?t=211974&highlight=nite+shot
thats one, im trying to find the day pics

Nice truck! It seems like u got a good price.

Marek
03-14-2008, 07:34 PM
Tex do you guys get winter blend diesel there?

qualitylandscaping
03-15-2008, 09:00 PM
The 6.4 is the way to go if you want power. With the twin-turbo they can pull a house. I can't tell I'm towing even with my 32' gooseneck loaded. Love the engine brake, less strain on the brakes.

Only downside, I'm average 11-12mpg not towing. Hook up the plow or put a trailer behind and shes down around 9-10. Overall, worth the money if you really want something that can pull.

Our V-10's are getting 12-13mpg unloaded and 9-11 loaded.

Our V-8's get 12-15 unloaded, and 8-12 loaded.

Other than diesel is $4.50+ per gallon here, I feel its worth the extra money.

TXNSLighting
03-16-2008, 12:16 AM
Tex do you guys get winter blend diesel there?

i honestly have no idea... i think we do, but couldnt tell you for sure.

YardBoss Lawncare
03-16-2008, 01:07 AM
I used to date a lady who owned a Conoco gas station around here and I asked her that question a long time ago. She told me they put the non-gel additive in, but personaly I don't think they put enough in. I had my 04' 6.0 liter PSD gel up on me last Winter. Ever since then I always add Powerservice (white bottle) when I fill up. About 15oz. per tank, and my Dodge holds 34 gallons. Powerservice also makes the red bottle that says "911" on it. It works great when you're already gelled up. It'll have you running in about 2 to 3 minutes.

dirtybiz
03-16-2008, 10:36 PM
Diesels are starting to lose their advantage over gassers, other than the raw power/torque that are unmatched by gassers. I have all diesels right now but with it being $.80 higher than gas i would probably consider a gasser for a work truck next time. I just bought an 08 F-350 6.4L Powerstroke and so far average about 12mpg (only 400 miles on ticker), hopefully gets better as my dodge gets 20mpg! I wouldn't go back though, this truck is an all around better truck by far!!!

TXNSLighting
03-17-2008, 09:55 AM
Diesels are starting to lose their advantage over gassers, other than the raw power/torque that are unmatched by gassers. I have all diesels right now but with it being $.80 higher than gas i would probably consider a gasser for a work truck next time. I just bought an 08 F-350 6.4L Powerstroke and so far average about 12mpg (only 400 miles on ticker), hopefully gets better as my dodge gets 20mpg! I wouldn't go back though, this truck is an all around better truck by far!!!

I just noticed in your sig you have a 03 7.3!! very nice! i want one of those so bad!

dirtybiz
03-17-2008, 10:40 AM
Just bought it about 2 months ago, the last of the best! I have been driving it around ever since i bought it (until i got the 08 anyhow), partly why i had to have an 08, plus the 0% financing helped push me over the edge.

TXNSLighting
03-17-2008, 11:20 AM
Very nice! i think you will really like that 08. Their really turning out to be good engines.