Blancing mower blades

[bridges]

What do guys use to balnce your mower blades?

I use to use those little $2.00 plastic balancers. Every time i used that, all the baldes came out balanced.

Now i tried the magna-matic balancer. Man this thing is real nice. Looks better in person than on the website.

So i checked my blades and they were way out of balance. I can't see how you can balance blades with the $2.00 plastic balancer.

What are you guys using?

[Guido]

looks like a great investment........

but if you can't afford it, the plastic balancer has to be better than nothing, right?

Have you tried using the MM and then putting it on the plastic one and vice versa?

[bridges]

i used both the plastic showed balance when the other show it was out of balance.

[Eric ELM]

What I like about the Magna Matic is it will also check blades for being bent.

[Runner]

Right now, I'm just using one of those stell cone shaped things. I would love to have the Magnamatic, but I just can't justify it right now. Oh well, maybe if I'm good,.....Santa Claus, are you listening?:rolleyes:

[captdevo]

they have one on auction at ebay for cheap!!
$99 + $25 s/h save over $50

Magna-matic auction (http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=1664966945)

Dave

[LAWNGODFATHER]

$2 one

[Evan528]

Im with Mike! I also use a 2 dollar metal conical one! Does me fine!

[keifer]

I also have a metal cone by briggs but a good stright nail in the shop wall will work just as good.

[Davis TLC]

Mine is a pair of small bearings. Price $ 0.00, got them off a scrapped out optical lense of some type, they work until I can get the Magna Matic.

[point]

Go down to your local bearing supply
get a small ball bearing ( with NO seals ) that has an OD the same as the center hole of your blade,
and has an ID of 1/4 or 3/8, bolt it to the wall with a lag and washers.
Slide blade on like a propeller and presto .... very accurate balancer.
work's great for me.
mark

[Magna-Matic]

Hi all .... bridges emailed me about your discussion here. I would like to address a couple things.

First, the plastic or metal cone ($2). We, as many other have tested these against our balancer, and have always found it to be in-accurate. One of the main factors why it is in-accurate, is because of its cone, which is not perfectly concentric. In general, becuase of the inconsistant quality of a $2 tool, you may be better of not using it at all. With the cone you may be worsening the balance of the blade.

Second the old nail in the wall. This is the MOST problematic way to balance a blade. Please stop doing this, you are making the balance far worse than it was when you started. Here is why. The balance of a rotating object is based on its center point. Now there is no way you can get the blade to float in the air in the middle of the mounting hole, that is why a cone is used. The cone must be concentric to be able to measure from the middle (or center) point of the blade hole. SEE picture to view the center point of the mounting hole.

http://www.magna-matic.com/images/top-view-lawnmower-blade.jpg

Third the bolt & bearing approach. This is not bad, but it depends highly on the closeness of the fit of the bearing OD to the blade hole ID. It is common knowledge that lawn mower blades are STAMPED items. Meaning to make the mounting hole, they use a large punch press to punch out that middle hole. You will notice this by one side of hole having a rounded end (inward) and the other side having a sqaure edge. Steel punching is not accurate. Punches create a taper (inside the hole), because they force the ram the hole in the steel with shear force. So, that hole that you put the bearings INSIDE is not accurate, throwing off you measurement. So if the hole in the mower blade is tapered from the punch, and your bearings are straight, you will not have an accurate match. The next problem is the quality of the bearings and their ability to spin freely. Lastly the bearing and bolt arrangement is only good for ONE type of blade hole size. But of all the homemade balancing methods this one still has problems, but is better than a nail or $2 cone.

As for the BALANCERs on EBAY, there was a mis-type in the last auction, we start the bidding @ $99, there is a BUY IT NOW option that we list @ $145, and shipping is $5 in the contigious USA. The retail price of the balancer is $175. Also note everything in Magna-Matic's online store has FREE SHIPPING.

Thank you,

[captdevo]

soooo.....$25 s/h was a typo?

bidding starts at $99, s/h is only $5 no matter what the auction gets to?

[Double D]

Balancer on Ebay is sold.

[Magna-Matic]

Yes the shipping is $5 for anywhere in the contigious USA (this excludes Alaska, Puerto Rico, & Hawaii)

Keep an eye out .. i will list another balancer SOON ... and more grinders ... sweet off-season deals for internet crazed landscapers ... lol :D

Check back at our site under promotions.


http://www.magna-matic.com/promotions.html

Click on the MAGNA-MATIC AUTHORIZED AUCTIONS button

[Mid Rivers]

I purchased a Mag-Matic balancer at the St. Louis picnic. I took it home, mounted it on the wall and checked the blades I had balanced on the $2 balancer. My blades were not that far out of balance. I do like the new balancer better though. I am looking forword to getting one of their sharpeners as soon as I get rid of my RBG I bought this year. The sharpener impressed me much more than the balancer.:D

[HOMER]

So what is a Harley rider if not a "people"?

Currently I use the cone......one day I'll move up to the big time.

[65hoss]

I'm with Homer, one day I step up to the 'big time'. Until then a cone type does the job.

[gorrell]

I suppose I'm in the minority on this one, but I've never balanced a blade in my life and haven't had a spindle bearing fail in years. Just my $.02 worth..................Lynn

[Eric ELM]

Lynn, you should try it some time. :)

New blades can be WAY out of balance. I had a new blade this season that the center hole was off by 1/4" and that is enough to throw them off a lot. Someone posted that they bought a new blade that the center hole was off by 1".

This is why I sharpen and balance every new blade I get.

[dhicks]

I use the Magna-Matic balancer. Top of the line IMHO.

[G.Williams]

We have a foley-belsaw shrpener and it has a metal rod with metal cone on top. balances perfect every time. Saves a lot of wear. better cuts.

[gene gls]

Walker Owners:

Do you balance your blades with the debris cone guard on or off the blade?????????

Gene

[Flex-Deck]

When I had the Flex-Deck trimming attachment ANSI tested, they cut 2" off one end of the blade and made me run it full blast for 1 hour. You cannot imagine the vibration and noise involved with a blade that out of balance. The spindle and bearings and deck came out of it fine. After the impact test, which bends things slightly, I brought the deck home, straightened the areas compromised by the impact test, and am still mowing with that deck. (4 yrs.)

The Point being, -- Since that experience, I only balance blades about every 4th sharpening - I do try to take the same number of swipes with the angle grinder which has flexi disks on it (no heat buildup - get them at truevalue - red in color and a fiber of some kind)

[Tvov]

For better or worse, I use the nail hammered into the side of the workbench balancing system. Been doing that for 16 years, never had a bearing failure (one of my mowers is going on 14 years of regular commercial use). I would like to have a fancy expensive balancer, but with my experience I cannot justify the cost.

Now, one thing to note is that I, the company owner, do the sharpening, so I am very careful. If and when I have employees do the sharpening, the expensive balancers may very well be worth it.

[scott's turf]

I'm with gorrell. I have never balanced a blade and have never worn out a bearing. Seems like extra work if there are no repercussions. But maybe I am just lucky.

[leeslawncare]

I use the cone also ...then i double check it with a screwdriver!!! LOL just kiddin ...rember my dad doing it an swearing by it!!

[TLS]

I always balanced mine, or had them sharpened and balanced. But let me tell you, if you ever get a new blade that isn't balanced, you WILL know it. It liked to make my feet go numb! Had to stop and put on a dull pair to finish. Sure, WAY out of balance for a period of time for testing purposes probably didn't hurt much, but hours and hours, days and weeks and years, of just slightly out of balance will make a difference! I dont know to what degree of accuracy the cone jobs are, but I had one and in theory it works, but the nail in the wall is definately NOT accurate to any degree of accuracy.

[1grnlwn]

Magimatic is the way to go, use it every day with 4" angle grinder ($300 rgb grinder on bench with stuff piled on it ) if it was fast I would use it.
Yea everybody knows somebody that has beat the system, cheated death, beet the odds, never seams to be me though. I certainly hope these double blade guys are using percision ballancers. 2cents

[GreenQuest Lawn]

1grnlwn,

Throw that grinding wheel away and purchase a softer finer grit one. Either a ruby red or white wheel. They cut faster and dont heat up. They do wear faster but are cheaper. I have a white wheel on mine now and love it.

Once you get a good wheel it goes super fast.

[1grnlwn]

GQL I have the Ruby red wheel. I was considering getting the blue (I think rgb said it would grind faster) I just didn't want to spend the bucks for no change in performance. Where did you get a white wheel? I use rgb for first sharpening of the year because I have winter to sharpen. Have you tried the blue?

[gunputt]

Another rookie question.

How do you know when they are unbalanced?

How often does this need to be checked?

If they are not balanced, can they be balanced or do you replace them?

Who's on first?

John

[1grnlwn]

If you haven't ballanced them they are unballanced.

You should check them after you sharpen them.

Unballanced blades can cause vibration, wear in bearings and a rough cut.

You ballance a blade by removing metal from the heavy end by sharening it more or removing metal from the end(not at blade bevel)

[gunputt]

Even on a new mower?

[1MajorTom]

Yes, even on a new mower they can be unbalanced.

[1grnlwn]

New blades are the worst ballance condition. THEY DO NOT BALLANCE new blades. Once they are ballanced the first it takes only a little metal removal to bring them back.

[TLS]

I find new blades to be real close in balance 90% of the time. Especially the OEM blades. The mail order specials...well, they have their bad ones and their good ones. The cheapie "Gator" immitations are almost always way off. Just too many cuts to go wrong. On your solid foils, things are usually OK. You are usually going to see it in the bevel machining, and length of bevel. I just throw the new ones on the Magna-Matic and it lets me know real quick.

Makes me wonder if I could start a "QUALITY" blade company that would provide "sharpened" BALANCED blades at a premium price.??? Oh well enough dreaming.

[1grnlwn]

Gunputt,

I'm assuming that you have 1 main mower. Find your hole size and get a free wheeling bearing that just slides into the hole. Might be hard to find but the looking can be learning experience. Try: farm store bearing supply skate supply McMaster Carr.com (they have everything) You may have to grind/sand the outer dia a little to make a snug fit. Mount this to a post or whatever with mounting screw parallel to level(floor). place your new blades on the bearing and watch them spin. When they stop the heavy portion will be at the bottom. A perfect blade will look like this----o----. Just for giggles get one of those chepo cone things and compair yourself. You just spent $5 and have Maga percision with bearing. Where the Magna-Matic is great is when you have many mowers and all the holes are different sizes.

[awm]

this is a most interesting thread. we have pro saying it has to be done w a precise instrument,to save the spindles. other experienced pros saying they use a nail,and still others saying
they just dont worry about balancing, all haveing successful results. hmm ,me thinks the answer ,at least for once is not here on lawnsite.YET

[GreenQuest Lawn]

1grnlwn,

Ok I got the scoop from my wife(she is an abrasive specialist)

There should be a some letters and numbers on the wheel.

The one that came with the RBG is a p hardness and 36 grit. these wheels are made to last many years but are made for rough grinding. They gring slow, make alot of noise, and produce a lot of heat.

I have two wheels that are ruby red (one is the one that came with the grinder) and they are both very different.(and by the way she said the color only indicates what material the wheel is made out of)

the other is a J hardness 46 grit. The lower the letter the softer the wheel.

The one I have on my grinder that I like the best is also J hardness 46 grit. the difference is it is white and seems to heat less.

You want a letter some where in the middle and a grit around 46.

The way it reads is "28a46 j8v" I would never know what it meant if she had not explained it to me.

Now the ONLY problem is the only white ones she carries are 1/2" thick. So I just "sandwiched" two together and they work just fine.

If you can"t find anything softer that works well E-mail me and I can put you in contact with her.

[point]

An out of balance bearing puts very little load , stress or strain on the bearings
nothing compared to the belt tension and 5 or more horse power loads.
balance for comfort not bearing life.
keep them greased and dry and they will last forever. ( like a car wheel bearing even with an out of balance tire )

1GRNLWN - if the blade is balanced and you spin it, it will stop at a different position each time.

mark

[1grnlwn]

Point

It's obvious you are not an Engineer and you are not a lawn profesional. What are you?

[1grnlwn]

GQL

What is white material? Where can I get catalogue for grinding stones, or what type of supplier would carry different types? My ruby does build a lot of heat and is very slow. Most home stores and catalogues just say grinding wheel. Even the descriptions from RBG are not specific. I would love to use it again if it weren't so slow.

[point]

1grnlwn - I am an aircraft mechanic ( 25 years ) I work on business jet engines exclusively
Many mission critical small and large bearings turning between 1000 and 40000 rpm.
I have extensive experience in bearing vibration analysis and trouble shooting.

On weekends myself and my partner take care of 18 lawns

sorry if I offended you

Thanks for asking
mark

[Albemarle Lawn]

bought from landscaper's supply.

[1grnlwn]

Point

Not offended, just confused why people fight the best way to do something.(cost is an issue) I must disagree with your ballance hypothsis of spinning a ballanced blade and it stoping in any position. This hypothsis is fact for anything circular, like a wheel or engine parts. Mower blades are straight across when ballanced. I can't prove its bad for bearings because I ballance my blades . But if you look around any dealer shop you will find a bearing style ballancer. They don't want to do the job twice. Enough serious talk, I have some things I thought of the last 24 hours.

1. If your friend jumped off of a building would you?
2. Everybody has that friend that insist that seat belts are unsafe and thats why he doesn't wear them. Send him flowers the next time he is in the hospital.
3. The motorcyclist that refuses to wear a helmet. Help build that ramp for his house.
4. I aways start that fire with gas.

Mark out!

[GreenQuest Lawn]

1grnlwn,

Go to a place that specializes in abrasives. Look mabey in the phone book under abrasives or industrial supply companys. A hardware store probably would not have anything but the generic ones. I will try to look up on the web and see if i can find anything.