Compost Tea/Backpack Sprayers

[Phazeekus]

Does anyone use a Shurflo SRS-600 to spray compost tea? Can compost tea be sprayed through any regular backpack sprayer or must you get one specifically designed for that? Thanks.

[lawncuttinfoo]

I plan to use a brand new (no chemicals ever used in it) Lesco (Solo) diaphragm backpack sprayer this year.

[cspaugh]

If I understand correctly a piston pump will put to much pressure on the organisims, therefore go with the diaphram type mentioned above.

[ICT Bill]

The piston vs diaphram pump is especially true if you are spraying AACT as the piston tends to chew up the hyphi of the fungi. I am not sure of there would be any difference if you were applying an extracted or mostly dormant biology compost tea

I do know that it makes a difference on the type of nozzle that you are using, you want something that puts out a good volume as a spray not a mist. You want to put down 40 to 50 gallons per acre.

Typical instructions are "spray til drip" which is normally around 1.5 gallons per 1000

We have not done SFI testing yet to see which brand delivers the best results in the field. Note to self, SFI test sprayers

Hopefully Barefoot James will chime in here, I know he uses a 4 gallon electric backpack sprayer for his applications. I don't remember the manufacturer

[Phazeekus]

Well, apparently the company doesn't even know if compost tea can be sprayed through their backpack. I emailed them to ask and this is the reply I got back:

"This is a tough call as compost tea can vary so wildly in its composition and chemical make-up. You might buy a used standard SLV Pump and set-up to spray such compounds to see how it works long term before investing in the backpack"

The shurflo srs-600 does use a diaphragm pump so I'm tempted to try it out but I wish there was somebody who has one that has tried it. Where are you Barefoot James?

So otherwise, what does everyone use to spray compost tea? What are the definite tested and tried units that do the best job?
Thanks.

[ICT Bill]

The start up model is typically a 30 gallon with hose reel that you can easily put in and out of your truck
Some people like a pull behind

Backpack sprayers will exhaust you by the end of the day. Could you imagine pumping the sprayer all day long, I was just talking with a buddy. The typical acre takes antwhere from 80 to 130 gallons of water to spray.

OK let me do the math here 4 gallon backpack sprayer and I need to apply 100 gallons of water mix with.............I'm exhausted just thinking about it

I believe Barefoot uses a hudson 12V electric backpack sprayer

[Phazeekus]

The start up model is typically a 30 gallon with hose reel that you can easily put in and out of your truck
Some people like a pull behind

Backpack sprayers will exhaust you by the end of the day. Could you imagine pumping the sprayer all day long, I was just talking with a buddy. The typical acre takes antwhere from 80 to 130 gallons of water to spray.

OK let me do the math here 4 gallon backpack sprayer and I need to apply 100 gallons of water mix with.............I'm exhausted just thinking about it

I believe Barefoot uses a hudson 12V electric backpack sprayer

Hey thanks for all the good info Bill, appreciate it. I know if I'm going to get serious about going organic(which I am) I will have to go to a setup as you described. Thing is, I only have a couple customers with tiny little lawns that have signed on for organic this year, so I figured a backpack would be a lot cheaper and do the job until I can get a few more customers to "see the light". haha I'm going to look into that hudson, see if there's anything diiferent than the shurflo. I really want a shurflo, heard they're the cats a$$.
Thanks again.

[nadgnik]

ICT Bill, I have visited your website and am interested in learning more about compost teas. I too am interested in offering organic programs and have been reading everything from organic fertilizers to corn gluten to compost teas (most of which I have never heard about). I have owned a full service landscape maintenance company in Boise, Idaho for 18 years, and will be dedicating this season to understanding the benefits of switching from synthetics to organics. After I have educated myself, I will then begin offering the services to my clients. Convincing my residential clients to make the switch will be easy, but I am not sure about my commercial accounts, which are more concerned with competitive pricing. I am also interested in other ideas anybody might have about being "socially responsible". This year we are implementing a mulching program with the debris we remove from our properties. We have a 30 week mowing schedule in Idaho, and during the dry months (20 weeks) we will be mulching the grass clippings (in the past we removed all clippings because it improved the appearance of our sites). I am learning that with the use of organic fertilizers (less topgrowth) mulching is the better option. We have also recently purchased several blowers/trimmers/edgers that meet current emission standards. I am already dedicated to making a difference, and welcome any and all ideas.

[phasthound]

ICT Bill, I have visited your website and am interested in learning more about compost teas. I too am interested in offering organic programs and have been reading everything from organic fertilizers to corn gluten to compost teas (most of which I have never heard about). I have owned a full service landscape maintenance company in Boise, Idaho for 18 years, and will be dedicating this season to understanding the benefits of switching from synthetics to organics. After I have educated myself, I will then begin offering the services to my clients. Convincing my residential clients to make the switch will be easy, but I am not sure about my commercial accounts, which are more concerned with competitive pricing. I am also interested in other ideas anybody might have about being "socially responsible". This year we are implementing a mulching program with the debris we remove from our properties. We have a 30 week mowing schedule in Idaho, and during the dry months (20 weeks) we will be mulching the grass clippings (in the past we removed all clippings because it improved the appearance of our sites). I am learning that with the use of organic fertilizers (less topgrowth) mulching is the better option. We have also recently purchased several blowers/trimmers/edgers that meet current emission standards. I am already dedicated to making a difference, and welcome any and all ideas.

I think you're going to find that more commercial clients are going green in many ways. You can most likely service them with natural products and save them money, water and make life better for their employees. PepsiCo has taken this route.

[ICT Bill]

There are several national (and international) companies that have organic lawn franchises now taking care of their properties
At one national fastfood place you will soon see a little sign in all of the mid atlantic and northeast by the speaker that says

THIS PROPERTY IS ORGANICALLY MAINTAINED BY SO AND SO ORGANIC LAWN CARE. WE WANT YOUR CHILDREN TO BE SAFE

Think Ronald, national hotel companies, international car companies, etc.

they are all going organic, it is just too good of a story to pass up.

We get calls from these types of companies every week.

[growingdeeprootsorganicly]

after further review on small sprayers(3g and less) and back packs
I doesn't really matter what pump you use(i use diaphragm my self) as long as you can get the tea out.(Think about it the tea contains billions of organisms, will the pump style maybe kill some? maybe but theres BILLIONS of organisms still ALIVE and ready to do their thing.

things to considers though
1. how easy to clean

2. spray tip, bigger the better(take out screens), biggest fan or shower type head or even a large soft strait stream will do the trick(smaller nozzles styles don't put out enough water fast enough

3. holding capacity, average lawn trees and shrubs ete.you will fill up 10+ times with 1-4 tea to get a good soaking with 4g back pack(can go lighter on the water if rain is coming just remember using enough water is key to get the biology down in the soil(if soil drenching that is)

4.if doing large yard maybe a battery powered pump on a back pack would be better but you will still have to fill up with tea every 5 min.

5. any thing bigger then 3 yards a day you need a real spraying system
cause back pack spraying ct takes forever to get larger areas covered

[ICT Bill]

Growing you make a good point
Some of the latest testing we have done on our stuff there are

72 Billion Bacteria and 12 Billion Fungi per gram, there are 28 grams in an ounce, an ounce is the size of a shot glass so there are 2016 Billion bacteria in an ounce divided by, so there are 672,000,000 bacteria per square foot applied

So you kill a couple who's counting

I am not an expert on this but I believe it is the PSI that is most damaging in spray rigs to live beneficials not the type of pump, as Dr E would say try it and test it

[Toddo]

The piston vs diaphram pump is especially true if you are spraying AACT as the piston tends to chew up the hyphi of the fungi. I am not sure of there would be any difference if you were applying an extracted or mostly dormant biology compost tea

I do know that it makes a difference on the type of nozzle that you are using, you want something that puts out a good volume as a spray not a mist. You want to put down 40 to 50 gallons per acre.

Typical instructions are "spray til drip" which is normally around 1.5 gallons per 1000

We have not done SFI testing yet to see which brand delivers the best results in the field. Note to self, SFI test sprayers

Hopefully Barefoot James will chime in here, I know he uses a 4 gallon electric backpack sprayer for his applications. I don't remember the manufacturer

I have read " 1 Gallon of compost tea will cover approximately 3000-4000 sq. ft."

What are the advantages/disadvantages of a mist lawn application as opposed to a soil drench for lawn? I am at a cross road as to the type of spray rig to invest in...50 gls, 100 gls, 200 gls...trying to do 10 lawns a day and knowing I would be unable to fill the tank with water at customers locations...chlorine in the "City" water.

[growingdeeprootsorganicly]

soil drenching is what ur tring to do, get the biggest spray rig tank you can
to do 10 yards(5000sf avg) right you will need more then 300g

[DeepGreenLawn]

you can do a foliar spray and then have your customers water it in real well. The water your mixing with your tea is just a carrier to help get all the good guys to the soil. Having your customers water after you leave is the easiest most effective way to get it where you want it to go, otherwise you will use a 200 gallon tank on a 3K lawn and who knows how much time trying to get the ground wet enough.

[Toddo]

soil drenching is what ur tring to do, get the biggest spray rig tank you can
to do 10 yards(5000sf avg) right you will need more then 300g

since 1 gallon of water weighs 8.34 lbs I would be towing 2.5K extra lbs...ouch!

[Toddo]

yea...that makes a lot of sense...do you think there is any problems if the water is chlorinated? I am going to a lot of trouble making sure the water is dechlorinated when I "brew" the tea and would hate to backtrack when the customer waters in.

[treegal1]

you need to dust off some old posts, chlorine is a sanitizer??? not what tea needs, any back PAC sprayer will work you out, you can do it but one arm is going to be a lot larger than the other.LOL you need a tank and some hose to get this going the fast and profitable way!!

knowledge will save you and your customers $$$$$$$

what brewer and how large? what kinds of compost??? please share

[DeepGreenLawn]

chlorine hurt the herd? You don't want to make your teas with chlorinated water but at the same time how do you expect your customers to water it in? They are going to either use their hose or a sprinkler system, either way there is going to be chlorine in that water, I am pretty sure by the time it all gets to where it is going the chlorine will have little effect on the herd at that point. Unless you just wait and rely on rain water, then treat while it is raining. Other than that you just got to do what you can.

[JDUtah]

I read once that most the chlorine evaporates while in the air from a sprinkler, befor it hits the ground.. take it for what you want.

[ICT Bill]

I read once that most the chlorine evaporates while in the air from a sprinkler, befor it hits the ground.. take it for what you want.

JD that is true for chlorine, because its actually pretty unstable and can be gassed off pretty easily

Not true for chloramines which are much more stable and cannot be gassed off. many municipalities have moved to chloramine for that fact alone, it stays in the water system better. You must use some type of dechlorinator to get rid of it, it is an oxidizer so you can also add something that will use up the chloramaine like humate, basically anything organic, some folks use citric acid

[DeepGreenLawn]

what effect would chloramine have on the beneficials if you were to water it in? Would it make it that far?

[treegal1]

ok did some leg work on this one, took a sample from the tap, then used a Kpro POP up head 3.5 gpm stock nozzle, and collected a sample, the 2 samples went to water wise and got tested( i need salt for softener anyways)

1) no sprinkler.82 ppm
2) sprinkler water .63ppm

ITS still in the water!!!!!!

[JDUtah]

good to know tree. thanks

[DeepGreenLawn]

so... what do you suggest we do to fix the problem?

[treegal1]

just hold on, we are trying to figure out how to get a readout of the grass and the soil, that way we can better guess what the chlorine residual is, we are also trying to figure out what % is chlorine and chloramine. we will post asap today or when we finish the test..................

we are also going to try and find out if it is night does this affect the water?????

[Go-Green Lawn Care]

I have read " 1 Gallon of compost tea will cover approximately 3000-4000 sq. ft."

I thought a soil drench was more like 1g to 1000sqft. Am I wrong?

[ICT Bill]

There are no hard rules and it depends on the strength of the CT, typically you take 5 gallons of straight tea no dilution and put it into 15 gallons of water, this should cover 1 acre

application rates vary on diluted tea, some spray at 2 gallons per 1000, other at 5 to 10 gallons per 1000. If the property is irrigated or rain is imminent the lower rate is fine.

There are couple lawn companies that love compost teas because they spray in the rain. We get calls " we used to sit on our butts or go home on rainy days now we can make money"

[treegal1]

Bill when it rains I have not payed attention to my app rates.LOLOL:laugh:

[growingdeeprootsorganicly]

poor soil apply at LEAST 1 g strait tea to 4-8g water per 1000sf of turf, more water the better, if you use less then 5 g total per 1000sf, IMO you don't get good deep soil penetration . if you irrigate immediately or in the rain you can use less water

if your only foliar spraying you should and can use less water, but for turf i think the best way to apply is with lots of water.

(multi tank setup, 3 tanks needed on large truck bed or trailer))you can refill from a customers house,use yours or their hose and connect to a carbon filter declorinater at your sprayer and fill a second tank (IBC)for water only, while you apply, just watch out for overflow!

1 tank pure tea "aerated ofcourse", second water, 3 rd mix tank . with this set up you can apply liquid amendments as needed also with out tea

maybe add some vit c and humic acid to play is some what safe to that water also?

Ive never used that set up my self yet, i have a 300g sprayer tank and a 30g mix tank, just add my food sorces to the tea at time of app in the 30g mix tank if needed most of my customers are some what close to my shop, i have well water source and can refill quickly if needed

more strait tea you use the better IMO per1000sf lay it on if you can!
I go with a 1-4 ratio for most of my apps 4-8 houses turf shrub,trees ete.

[wallzwallz]

Growingdeep what are you aerating your tea w/ in the sprayer tank? I have a 12 volt air pump and a pond airstone, but I am going to try a disc diffuser. I also have an electric portable air pump that I plug in at my big lawn and run another stone, I figure it buys me a couple hrs to get it down. I mix my tea 1:1 put 2gal/K down and irrigate w/ well water immediately.

[Barefoot James]

Since this thread started in March??? I'm finally chiming in.

ICT - correct I use a Hudson Backpack sprayer (great for all the spot spraying and small ict jobs) - but like treegal says invest and get some hoses and make money. 200 gallon rittenhouse sprayer with Honda engine. Listening to treegal again get a hydroseeder and really spray some tea - Turbo Turf - 300 gals in 10 mins.

What about flourine (flouride) - I hear this is even worse for the herd and it is in most city water to help kids teeth (I guess the ones that dont brush?).

they should take it out as it does more harm than good for small urban farms, lawns, etc. I say buy some Crest and brush.

[Barefoot James]

Spray in the rain. Start making money on rain days. I check weather like crazy and when it rains I have tea ready to go. Remember Caddy Shack and the guy who is playing golf like crazy in the rain and holing everything - laughing like a crazy man - that's me and son when it rains and we are spraying tea - I would think this is IDEAL for the herd. So spray away and have lots of ICT on hand for when you run out of your aact and it is still raining - keep spraying.

[DeepGreenLawn]

thats great until your in a drought like we are, then you get stuck at the FD when it rains on top of that. But... if we get rain I am happy no matter where I am.

[treegal1]

deep do you sell any rain barrels, they cost 35 $ to make and sell for 75$ retail, installed 125 $

[DeepGreenLawn]

hmmm, haven't thought about it, seen a few that customers had. What do you make them out of? Same blue plastic barrels? I think I can get those for cheap. Got any plans? Shouldn't take much should it? Just a hole in the top and a spicket at the bottom? Would want it to look good though so nicer homes would use them.

[treegal1]

we get the white barrels and dress them up real nice, we have 24 at a 5 million dollar home and they work great and help a lot with the tighter water restrictions..... plans for you asap..............

[DeepGreenLawn]

awesome, thanks for the info. 24? thats a lot of gutters.

[ICT Bill]

Good to hear from you Barefoot, it is obvious that you are doing just fine. Happy to hear it

Keep up the good work

One question. Do you feel a bit different than a year ago, a little more jump in your step?

We met October 2007, it seems much longer than that. We have all come a long way in a short time

Cheers, Bill


:cool2::cool2::cool2::cool2::cool2::cool2::cool2::cool2::cool2::cool2:

[David W]

Anybody ever come with what bp sprayer works best? Looking to purchase one tomorrow to spray NPP and ICT. Currently using a 4-gal Shindaiwa sprayer and though of buying another but have also been looking on the electric sprayer from shurflo.

Any thoughts?

[Grass Happens]

I was looking for rain barrel plans as well, some of the condos that the company i work for manages, wanted them for their veggie gardens. I would love to get them on CT, but no one in my area is doing that yet, and I dont have the money to start.

[treegal1]

here is a link to a list of plans, keep it simple, water in and water out, and plastic barrels are easy to heat and mold, also NEVER USE A CHEMICAL barrel or an open top, it needs to be covered so that nothing drowns or mosquito's breed!!!

David, the npp and ict can get sprayed out of just about anything with out and problems, let your $ guide you

[wallzwallz]

I sprayed the NPP at my own yard thru an Ortho Dial a Spray hose end sprayer. Worked great. I don't know about ICT, if the chlorine would kill too much biology or not.

[ICT Bill]

They are 99.99% dormant it is not an issue they still get down into the soil, the organics in #3 use up the oxidation of the chlorine pretty quick

SFI testing from paul wagner says that the active are cut in half but it does not effect the dormant that much

Wallz, application rate is every 1 to 2 weeks or as needed, FYI

Vassar is on a 2 weeks program and it is working very well, they have had ZERO fungal issues this year, ZERO

[wallzwallz]

Thanks Bill, I keep my sprayer out where I work and it's easier to do my 1K lawn w/out trailering the beast in. I printed up a list of applications rates for your products, on it is Myco-Tea, is this still available?

[ICT Bill]

It is not on the web site right now

We have 2 totes in that are just in being bottled, I can send you a "one off" if you like check your PM

[DeepGreenLawn]

tree, no plans on the rain barrels... I saw a house on the side of the road, one of those with all kinds of junk in the yard that they have collected over the years, the stuff might look good if they would just keep a few and get rid of the rest, anyway, they had a "rain barrel" for sale.

It was a plastic trash can sitting on 4 concrete blocks with a water spicket stuck in the bottom. I am not knocking them for trying, but that is exactly what I don't want mine to be like. I thought I could do something similar with a clean 55 gal drum, I saw a dark green one at a customers that looked sharp, just have to figure out a good looking stand to put them on.

[DeepGreenLawn]

Hey Bill, you had said that the NPP needed to be constantly turned... I got me a regular metal spray can, nothing special, just picked it up at Ace because it was close and I needed something, I tried to keep shaking it from time to time, I am unfamiliar with how fast it settles... does it need to be constantly turned like an aerated sprayer or is it fine just shaking the can from time to time?

[treegal1]

007 says shaken not stirred:cool2::cool2::cool2:

[ICT Bill]

The easiest way is to use a clear jar or plastic bottle that you can look through, add the amount of NPP that you are applying and shake the jar well with water, once it is mixed well add that to the tank, stir a bit and you should be fine
This way you can visually see that it is mixed well

[DeepGreenLawn]

makes since... I guess you could also watch to see how fast it settles too... the most basic/practical ideas are the ones you never think of. Always has to be harder than that...