Do I start blowouts in early spring or early summer????

[hoskm01]

HAHA, just kidding. Thought I'd boil some blood for a jiff! Cheers!:drinkup:

[FIMCO-MEISTER]

Good time to be installing pigtails for fall blowouts.

[Tom Tom]

HAHA, just kidding. Thought I'd boil some blood for a jiff! Cheers!:drinkup:


You may have so many to do, that you might want to start in early summer :laugh:

[hoskm01]

You may have so many to do, that you might want to start in early summer :laugh:
One can only hope.

[DanaMac]

Have you ever winterized before? Not sure if you've only worked in Arizona. If not, try making a mental note or a written note for that matter, about where you will hook up the compressor in the spring. You'll probably find a lot of homes here with no blow out tee or other hook up. And yes, we will then discuss again in the late summer/early fall about blowing through the testcocks. I don't care how many of you say it doesn't work, IT DOES.

[Mike Leary]

Have you ever winterized before? Not sure if you've only worked in Arizona. If not, try making a mental note or a written note for that matter, about where you will hook up the compressor in the spring. You'll probably find a lot of homes here with no blow out tee or other hook up. And yes, we will then discuss again in the late summer/early fall about blowing through the testcocks. I don't care how many of you say it doesn't work, IT DOES.

What a crock pat on the back...don't you think this guy has paid
attention? Only flatland fools blow out thru testcocks.:hammerhead:
Geez Dana, I thought you were somebody.:nono:

[hoskm01]

To answer both questions...

I have only ever been in the Phoenix area. Never a single blowout.

The systems that I have seen thus far are all over the place. The HOA's are set up pretty sweet, so Im told and it seems, for blowouts and service.

Saw one today that has 3 WM's right next to each other, figured Wingfield would crap his pants in joy! It was lackluster for me, my first in-field sighting.

[DanaMac]

What a crock pat on the back...don't you think this guy has paid
attention? Only flatland fools blow out thru testcocks.:hammerhead:
Geez Dana, I thought you were somebody.:nono:

Listen Mike, I'm not getting into a big debate about this now. I can blow 3 resi zones out at a time through the TC. If the homeowner doesn't have a blow out port, I don't have the time to put one in at that time of year. And honestly, I don't have time when we're doing start ups either, unless we are already fixing the copper. I've done most of them that way for 15 years now and have NEVER seen a problem - no melted pipe, no melted diaphragm, no broken bonnet, nothing.

[DanaMac]

The systems that I have seen thus far are all over the place. The HOA's are set up pretty sweet, so Im told and it seems, for blowouts and service.


Most HOA and commercial you will find a blow out port/tee or a QC to hook to.

[Tom Tom]

What a crock pat on the back...don't you think this guy has paid
attention? Only flatland fools blow out thru testcocks.:hammerhead:
Geez Dana, I thought you were somebody.:nono:

Been sounding like hosm01 is Mike's Son

[hoskm01]

Been sounding like hosm01 is Mike's Son
I was adopted from a pack of Dubai'n immigrants.

[Mike Leary]

I was adopted from a pack of Dubai'n immigrants.

So your knowledge of Yaks & Llamas should come in handy in the Rockies.

[hoskm01]

So your knowledge of Yaks & Llamas should come in handy in the Rockies.
Efficient transportation at least.

[Ferti-man]

Listen Mike, I'm not getting into a big debate about this now. I can blow 3 resi zones out at a time through the TC. If the homeowner doesn't have a blow out port, I don't have the time to put one in at that time of year. And honestly, I don't have time when we're doing start ups either, unless we are already fixing the copper. I've done most of them that way for 15 years now and have NEVER seen a problem - no melted pipe, no melted diaphragm, no broken bonnet, nothing.

I am installing blowout fittings at many of my customers properties right now. Sold them on it during blow out in prior year. I have disclaimer about not being responsible for back-flow internal component damage. I agree I have not damaged any as well (best I can tell), but the manufacturers do not recommend. I also do replace poppet sets often and wonder how much of this is due to blow outs. It is easier to use dedicated port as some test cocks are facing the houses. :dizzy: Just my two cents.

[Mike Leary]

I am installing blowout fittings at many of my customers properties right now. Sold them on it during blow out in prior year. Just my two cents.

Damn good post..are you installing quick-couples for winterize?

[Wet_Boots]

Damn good post..are you installing quick-couples for winterize?
Quick Couplers?!! And what pattern and size, pray tell? Single lug? Double lug? Acme thread? :hammerhead:

[Mike Leary]

Quick Couplers?!! And what pattern and size, pray tell? Single lug? Double lug? Acme thread? :hammerhead:

Well picky picky...MY way..3/4" q.c...RB 33DLRC dual lug, two piece,
12" downstream of backflow assembly, brass tee off main line, sch 80
m.p.t.s in and out of main...brass tee to 3/4" brass ell w/ 6" brass
nipples to brass swing joints to quick couple.
All this is to absorb the the compressor heat.

[Wet_Boots]

By the time you fit all the systems with QCVs, you could buy and install an aftercooler on your tow-behind.

[DanaMac]

Damn good post..are you installing quick-couples for winterize?

Of course I read it. Nice way to silently post that :)

here's the thing, when you take you're vehicle in for an oil change, do you go with the options they tell you for your vehicle? Do you get your brakes/fuel filter/wipers/tranny fluid/air filter replaced even though they recommend it but everything works fine? Yes it is easier to blow out a system using a 1/2" tee. I can do 4-6 sometimes 8 zones. Or I can blow out 2-4 zones at a time with the TC the same way it has been done on the system the last few years and they don't have to spend anymore money. If my mechanic told me, that he could add a larger size drain port and plug, which would take a slightly shorter time for him, but cost extra, even though it's been done that way forever, I'd tell him to go pound sand.

We will always go round-and-round on this one. Yes I want a tee on every system. Am i going to make them put one in? No. If we do a copper repair or backflow repair and need to cut into the outgoing copper or PVC, we put in a tee for blow outs.

Whew!! and I said I wouldn't get into a big debate about it!!:laugh:

[Ferti-man]

By the time you fit all the systems with QCVs, you could buy and install an aftercooler on your tow-behind.
I agree, for residential, I install copper tee w/ 1/2" threaded port. This keeps the cost down to the customer and still does a great job for blow outs, yet quick enough that heat build up is not a concern. With my HOA accounts, I have brass fittings as far away from back flow as possible for heat issues as it takes some time to blow them out. I do not attach the quick disconnect coupler until blowout, as back flow thefts are still high around here. Threading them in takes a few moments anyway.

[AI Inc]

We stub out of the house with 1" copper, from there into a t that is 1"sweat x 1/2 female thread x 1" sweat.Backflow sits on top of 1" sweat , boiler drain gets threaded into 1/2 thred. Blow it out thru the boiler drain. We also dont use airhose for blowouts , we use garden hose.

[Wet_Boots]

....and how much does that 'heel tee' cost this year? :(

[Tom Tom]

We will always go round-and-round on this one. Yes I want a tee on every system. Am i going to make them put one in? No. If we do a copper repair or backflow repair and need to cut into the outgoing copper or PVC, we put in a tee for blow outs.

Whew!! and I said I wouldn't get into a big debate about it!!:laugh:

Trying to stay out of this one too. But, gotta agree with Dana on this one.

I'd like to put the proper connection on the downstream side of every backflow on every blow out I do, but it is a time issue in the fall.

[Tom Tom]

We stub out of the house with 1" copper, from there into a t that is 1"sweat x 1/2 female thread x 1" sweat.Backflow sits on top of 1" sweat , boiler drain gets threaded into 1/2 thred. Blow it out thru the boiler drain. We also dont use airhose for blowouts , we use garden hose.

Why not install a tee on the downstream side of backflow instead?

[DanaMac]

Why not install a tee on the downstream side of backflow instead?

I'm not sure, but he might mean a tee after BF, with a boiler drain already installed above ground. Easiest way ever. I wish they were set up this way so that this doesn't happen - - - oops, forget wrench to take out plug, dammit plug broke, left the correct fitting in truck, forgot thread tape to re-install, where did I set the darn plug!, etc.

but he may mean a drain in valve box, not sure

[AI Inc]

....and how much does that 'heel tee' cost this year? :(

$10.79 can booger it with a reg tee and a reducing male adapter , but I like the expensive one.

[AI Inc]

Why not install a tee on the downstream side of backflow instead?

Because then you are not blowing out the backflow.

[Tom Tom]

Because then you are not blowing out the backflow.

True, but (and I'm playing the devils advocate here) ideally you don't want to blow out thru the backflow. And since your installing your tee before the backflow on your new installs, why not just install one AFTER and take the backflow out of the equation? The backflow can then simply be drained.

Also, you shouldn't have a boiler drain before the backflow. You'll encourage someone to hook up a garden hose.

[Mike Leary]

Also, you shouldn't have a boiler drain before the backflow. You'll encourage someone to hook up a garden hose.

In any well run backflow program, any drain before backflow is a cross-
connection and not permitted. ::::calls Jim Phelps back, hope it's not too
late:::::.

[Wet_Boots]

In any well run backflow program, any drain before backflow is a cross-
connection and not permitted. ::::calls Jim Phelps back, hope it's not too
late:::::.Your statement describes the first testcock on a backflow preventer as a cross-connection, thereby making any backflow preventer a cross-connection.

Better wear some kevlar socks if you're going to shoot yourself in the foot.

[AI Inc]

True, but (and I'm playing the devils advocate here) ideally you don't want to blow out thru the backflow. And since your installing your tee before the backflow on your new installs, why not just install one AFTER and take the backflow out of the equation? The backflow can then simply be drained.

Also, you shouldn't have a boiler drain before the backflow. You'll encourage someone to hook up a garden hose.

To properly drain a backflow one has to take out the guts ( bonnet , poppet ect) why do that when blowing thru it your done.
Yes , In theory a boiler drain before the backflow is ilegal with a screw on pressure breaker, but in these parts it is SOP.
A few years back I was having the local plumbing inspector do the tie in at the building inspectors house . I told him to put a plug there. He responde " dont ya want a draw off?" I looked at him and smiled and said " yes actualy I do" We both know it is Ilegal but SOP.

[DanaMac]

Also, you shouldn't have a boiler drain before the backflow. You'll encourage someone to hook up a garden hose.

Boiler drain before BFP does not meet code here. And if everyone is going to beat me up about using testcocks to blow through the BFP, I think AI needs a good roughing up as well. It COULD possible damage the internals by blowing through it. And the manufacturers recommend against it, and I believe some void warranty if so. But what kind of warranty is there really.

But I'm with you AI. blow though it. i just don't like blowing back into the house in case the home owner left the interior drain open.

[AI Inc]

Boiler drain before BFP does not meet code here. And if everyone is going to beat me up about using testcocks to blow through the BFP, I think AI needs a good roughing up as well. It COULD possible damage the internals by blowing through it. And the manufacturers recommend against it, and I believe some void warranty if so. But what kind of warranty is there really.

But I'm with you AI. blow though it. i just don't like blowing back into the house in case the home owner left the interior drain open.

We dont put interior drains on around here.

[DanaMac]

We dont put interior drains on around here.

But, it's SOP here. Different regions, different install practices.

[Mike Leary]

Your statement describes the first testcock on a backflow preventer as a cross-connection, thereby making any backflow preventer a cross-connection. .

How are you going to hook a hose to the #1? :hammerhead:

[Tom Tom]

We dont put interior drains on around here.

A typical system here has a little drain on the main ball valve thats inside the house. A drain at the 90 degree fitting that exits the house. And a drain in the MANIFOLDED valve box.


So, most of the time your stuck blowing thru the $%&# TC.

[DanaMac]

How are you going to hook a hose to the #1? :hammerhead:

Like this....

Didn't attach. I'll try again

[Wet_Boots]

How are you going to hook a hose to the #1? :hammerhead:The adapter I carry in my jacket pocket will do just fine, so nyahhhh.

[Tom Tom]

How are you going to hook a hose to the #1? :hammerhead:

bush it down to 3/8 or is it a 1/4? hell, i'm talking to myself now.........*trucewhiteflag*

[DanaMac]

By the way, Tom Tom GAVE me an electric hose reel recently. Thanks Tom. He had 2 or 3 sitting out in the backyard for a few years. Gotta get it hooked up now.

[Tom Tom]

Like this....

Didn't attach. I'll try again


man, you could build a jet pack with that

[AI Inc]

Like this....

Didn't attach. I'll try again

With that little air , doesnt it take forever? Ive done them that way servicing accounts I didnt install. Second yr blowout I brought along a book and a pillow.

[DanaMac]

With that little air , doesnt it take forever? Ive done them that way servicing accounts I didnt install. Second yr blowout I brought along a book and a pillow.

No. I tell you guys, it takes me longer to say hi to the home owner, drag the hose, get hooked up, drag and the hose back and put in the back of a truck, than it does to do the actual blowing out of a 1-8 zone system. I can do 2-3 zones at a time and it takes 1-3 minutes of air before their done.

[Tom Tom]

By the way, Tom Tom GAVE me an electric hose reel recently. Thanks Tom. He had 2 or 3 sitting out in the backyard for a few years. Gotta get it hooked up now.


your welcome. The funny part is (maybe I told ya?) They sat in the backyard for a couple of years before it even dawned on me that I could use
them as blowout hose reels. I'm sorta smart that way:hammerhead:

[Mike Leary]

Yep, It's got typically mis-construed..again. Reminds me of a MAD magazine quote:
"By the way, how's your mom, Ed?".

[DanaMac]

Yep, It's got typically mis-construed..again.

Whatchoo talkin' bout Willis?

[DanaMac]

Hey at least hoskm01 is working, unlike the rest of us.....

Must not be as bad up north

[Mike Leary]

Whatchoo talkin' bout Willis?

I thought the witness protection plan would hide me.

[Mike Leary]

Whatchoo talkin' bout Willis?

I thought the witness protection plan would hide me.

[Wet_Boots]

I thought the witness protection plan would hide me.You're filed under the Witless Protection Program :hammerhead:

[AI Inc]

We stub out of the house with 1" copper, from there into a t that is 1"sweat x 1/2 female thread x 1" sweat.Backflow sits on top of 1" sweat , boiler drain gets threaded into 1/2 thred. Blow it out thru the boiler drain. We also dont use airhose for blowouts , we use garden hose.

Ignore the wire, this is a system we installed at the shop. We used a used interior Rain Dial. Typicaly they are ext with conduit aroun the wire.

[Mike Leary]

Hey at least hoskm01 is working, unlike the rest of us.....

Must not be as bad up north

As soon as he saw spring weather in the rockies, he bailed.

[AI Inc]

No. I tell you guys, it takes me longer to say hi to the home owner, drag the hose, get hooked up, drag and the hose back and put in the back of a truck, than it does to do the actual blowing out of a 1-8 zone system. I can do 2-3 zones at a time and it takes 1-3 minutes of air before their done.

Thats pretty much my answer when people ask me why I charge the same for any system between 1-12 zones.

[DanaMac]

Thats pretty much my answer when people ask me why I charge the same for any system between 1-12 zones.

Exactly. Same here.

[Mike Leary]

You're filed under the Witless Protection Program :hammerhead:

And your previous name was? Ever see "My Blue Heaven"?

[Wet_Boots]

And your previous name was? Ever see "My Blue Heaven"?my name is Alastair Cookie, and I'm the host of Monsterpiece Theater