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View Full Version : welcome to a summer of BS


csl
04-28-2008, 12:00 AM
so this summer already sucks. weather has been awful, but then we landed a huge bid. we beat the other 2 bids by 20k or more, and i wasnt cutting any corners. we had a company that was going to come in and do all the streets in pavers because thats all they do, and we had a seperate contractor that was building all of our out buildings and decks. THEN, we get a call saying they are going with another company. basicly the other company bad mouthed us enough that we werent do it all in house, and that we probably didnt know what we were doing. the crappy part is that we already agreed on the price and when to start the install, cleared out our schedule for the month. i feel like going to this other guys office and knocking him out. anyone else have such a great start to the year?

Military Lawns
04-28-2008, 12:10 AM
so this summer already sucks. weather has been awful, but then we landed a huge bid. we beat the other 2 bids by 20k or more, and i wasnt cutting any corners. we had a company that was going to come in and do all the streets in pavers because thats all they do, and we had a seperate contractor that was building all of our out buildings and decks. THEN, we get a call saying they are going with another company. basicly the other company bad mouthed us enough that we werent do it all in house, and that we probably didnt know what we were doing. the crappy part is that we already agreed on the price and when to start the install, cleared out our schedule for the month. i feel like going to this other guys office and knocking him out. anyone else have such a great start to the year?

Too bad! A physical memo sounds just about right. However, that would be stooping too there level. There are other options I am sure.

Best Wishes,

DJ-

Isobel
04-28-2008, 10:27 AM
I work in an area with many other Landscape companies around. We're constantly competing with one another on getting jobs. If I found out that a competing company was bad mouthing me, I would take action. I agree with MilitaryLawns, don't stoop to their level. Go find your self a lawyer, and sue them for lost wages.

Sunscaper
04-28-2008, 12:26 PM
I doubt you could sue them. Freedom of speech.

FLAhaulboy
04-28-2008, 12:56 PM
I doubt you could sue them. Freedom of speech.


Not if its slander or defamation of character.

Isobel
04-28-2008, 12:59 PM
I doubt you could sue them. Freedom of speech.

Defamation & Slander.

You can't go around saying whatever you want about someone else's character, or a business, or other group without proof, or backing it up somehow.

In the same way, if I turned around and started calling all of my neighbors telling them Mr. Jones across the street is a rapist, I could get sued.

AGLA
04-28-2008, 01:06 PM
So you had a contract and they broke it? Or you thought you were going to get the contract and you did not?

If you had a contract, you can take action. If you had a promise, it is really your fault for making so much of a commitment without having it wrapped up.

csl
04-29-2008, 12:13 AM
verbal contract, which as we all know, really holds no water. now, i have to go to the other jobs i set up for later and come up with some lame excuse as why we can start early. yeah i dont think i will try anything legally, and i wont stoop to this guys level, but i will make sure he gets his. (nothing illegal). oh well, hope others are having more positive times.

Isobel
04-29-2008, 12:21 AM
Stooping to their level would involve, in my opinion, saying slanderous things about their company and work ethic.

I would take them to court, sue them for slander, show them that you are a professional and live in the world of adults--not high schoolers. There's nothing dishonorable about taking someone to court over slander & defamation.

In the end its your good name that they are tarnishing.

FLAhaulboy
04-29-2008, 11:33 PM
Have a lawyer write them a "cease and desist" letter warning them that if they continue to slander your good name, He will sue them for slander. you could write it yourself but it would be taken more seriously if a lawyer wrote it instead.

csl
04-30-2008, 12:08 AM
yeah i have thought of all these things, but its just something i should put behind me and get him back in the end. he does this to everyone, even those who he tries to buy out. anyone else have to deal with all this BS???

AGLA
04-30-2008, 07:07 AM
Welcome to reality. Life is just like a school yard. There are kids that play fair, some that sit quiet, some that play rough, some bullies, some smart ones who use brains over brawn, some athletes, some that cheat, some that make agreements outside of the rules, some that tell you what you want to hear,..... Nothing is a given.

Someone promised to pick you for their team and then picked someone else. It happens all of the time. Learn from it and get over it. Telling the teacher isn't going to change that and is not going to change it for the positive the next time.

PS. Don't home school you kids!

Isobel
04-30-2008, 08:41 AM
Someone promised to pick you for their team and then picked someone else. It happens all of the time. Learn from it and get over it. Telling the teacher isn't going to change that and is not going to change it for the positive the next time.


I disagree with the analogy. Not only was he not picked for the team, but the other players started spreading rumors and lies about him. That's damaging on the schoolyard, and its damaging in real life too--in this case he lost a very large bid.

but we don't live on the schoolyard, we live in the world of adults and professionals. For example, if you started telling my clients rumors about me and my company, god knows I would take you court. and I would sue you for any wages for bids lost due to your rumors.

just my $.02.
:usflag:

Tom Tom
04-30-2008, 09:17 AM
I disagree with the analogy. Not only was he not picked for the team, but the other players started spreading rumors and lies about him. That's damaging on the schoolyard, and its damaging in real life too--in this case he lost a very large bid.

but we don't live on the schoolyard, we live in the world of adults and professionals. For example, if you started telling my clients rumors about me and my company, god knows I would take you court. and I would sue you for any wages for bids lost due to your rumors.

just my $.02.
:usflag:

Recent story where I live about 2 dueling psychiatrists. The court thought the one went to far defaming the other to the tune of 1.45 mil

AGLA
04-30-2008, 01:12 PM
I don't know any general contractor who will dump a $20k savings based on someone bad mouthing someone else. There is more to this story.

Fordsuvparts
04-30-2008, 09:13 PM
I don't know any general contractor who will dump a $20k savings based on someone bad mouthing someone else. There is more to this story.

I agree, tell us the rest of the story, I would go in and ask straight out why they went with a higher bid.

csl
04-30-2008, 10:17 PM
i am not going to just get over this. so they picked the other guy, the guy lied. this has got to stop in our industry. you dont have to like me, but you do have to play fair. their is way too much cuthroat, too much illegal activity, and to many people getting screwed. there really isnt more to the story, he got the bid, he was 20k higher and he lied. what am i leaving out? if you tell the right lie you can get what you want, easy as that. i talked again with homeower, expressed my concern about what was happening. the wife is totally upset they arent going with us, the husband is using the other guy still because theres now a contract. i know that all i have to do is wait for this to bight them in the A$$. all i got is time...

AGLA
05-01-2008, 07:23 AM
How do you know that they decided to spend $20k more because the guy lied? You know that to be a fact?

If you bid $20k over someone else, can you tell the GC that the other guy sucks and then they'll say "OK, he's fired and here is $20k"? That does not sound fishy to you?

There are lots of things that qualify or disqualify subcontractors on bigger jobs that have nothing to do with price or the quality of their work. $20k can be eaten up very quickly when one operation conflicts with another on a big job. Crew size and ability to get in and get out in critical windows of time is huge. Going with an unknown sub is a risk for that reason. If you are a GC and over the years you have tried out many subs with mixed results, but you have familiarity with some that worked well with you, you'd tend to spend more knowing how the sub will work with you rather than spending less for someone with potential to work well with you. It is just a learned practicality.

If it went down like you think it did, I'd be pissed at the guy who told me I got the job rather than the contractor he gave it to.

Step back and look at what you are saying and how childish it sounds. You are mad because someone else got a job that you never had a contract for. You decide that the general contractor made up his mind to hire him because he lied about you. Instead of being mad at the GC, you are mad at the guy who got the job. You somehow decide that this means that the whole summer is a "summer of BS and it is only May first!

This stuff happens everyday.

topsites
05-01-2008, 08:01 AM
It's too much bs for me so I would let this one work itself out.

big acres
05-01-2008, 08:44 AM
I agree that there must be more to the story, but the bottom line is that this guy outsold you, will profit more, and succeeded in getting a signed contract. How he did it me be dirty. Most people know the first rule is NEVER badmouth the competition -sell yourself. However... this is business, and I have learned that you can cleverly draw distinctions between what you do and what "others" do without directly implying or naming "Company X" as shoddy or otherwise.

On the bright side, last fall we were awarded a contract for complete installation of two banks. Shortly after, the bank recinded on one of the banks to give it to one of their other customers... to share the business, which, is how we ended up installing the first of four that we've done for them. I politely questioned this, even the builder did, but it was the banks decision to give it to the other company.

Long story short, we just completed ours in a matter of days. The builder is one of the biggest commercial developer in the nation, and the super was so impressed he went back to tell the whole office to make sure we are included for all local bids. The other bank was supposed to be on the same timeline, and open for business next Monday -the landscapers have not even started. "We're not quite geared up yet" the job sup. was told. The builder is furious and we are 95% sure we will get that one too. The bonus is that another big developer noticed our work and actually called us to talk about our company.

Moral of the story... stay professional and question (politely) the lack of professionalism of the guy who sold the job out from under, and the guy that badmouthed you. Let your work do the real talking and it will pay off in the long haul.

csl
05-02-2008, 09:15 AM
what in the hell is childish about all this. i was simply just voicing my frustration. i have evey right to be pissed about being badmouthed. we have tons of business lined up, i just cherish my reputation.

Isobel
05-02-2008, 11:02 AM
what in the hell is childish about all this. i was simply just voicing my frustration. i have evey right to be pissed about being badmouthed. we have tons of business lined up, i just cherish my reputation.

You do have every right to be pissed about this situation.

But what I believe some of the people on here are thinking is childish, stems from this statement:

yeah i dont think i will try anything legally, and i wont stoop to this guys level, but i will make sure he gets his.

Your reputation is being badmouthed, but you don't want to take legal action.
aand you make some reference to this guy "getting his." Which seems a bit vague, and a little sketchy.

just my $.02

richonsa
05-12-2008, 09:00 PM
Slander must be in public. Words spoken in private don't matter.