Cleaning Your Carburetor

[jkason]

Hi all.

As I see this as a recurring problem all the time (and I noticed a few threads with it as well), I thought I would share my info and opinions on the subject.
Maybe this post will become "sticky", maybe not.

1) - Spray cleaners in an aerosol can DON'T WORK. The chemicals in the product are not strong enough to clean all the junk out of the small passages. Keep some on hand anyway. More on this later.

2) - DON'T use picks, pins, wire or torch-tip cleaners on the small passages. Those things are precision drilled (sometimes with a laser). If you make them larger, your equipment won't run correctly.

The first step to not haing the problem with carburetors is (you guessed it) FUEL.

Gasoline is not gasoline anymore, but a mixture of gasoline, chemicals, extenders and additives. Blame the politicians. But, that's another thread.
What we can do about it, is USE STABILIZER. Put it every can or tank of fuel you buy. Put it in at the pump if you can. Don't wait a month, the fuel will be junk by then.
I have spoken to a number of people in the repair business (including engine rep. guys), and we are all of the opinion that fuel starts to degrade the day you buy it (oxidization), and will be useless between 30-60 days thereafter.
If you must store your fuel in cans (tanks, whatever), make sure they are NOT open to the air. What I'm saying is put the caps back on and make sure they are tight. The alcohol in the fuel is a moisture magnet.
Ever get water in a fuel can and wonder how the hell it got to be so much? Alcohol is pulling moisture out of the air and into your tank. Metal cans aggravte the condensation problem.

If you get to the step where you need to clean the carb, don't go halfway and think it will work. Do the job once, the right way. It will save you time and aggravation later.

Turn off your fuel spigot or remove the fuel from your tank. Remove the carb from the engine. Gotta be done. Wether it takes 5 minutes or an hour.
If you are going to do it yourself, disassemble and remove as many plastic parts as you can and ALL RUBBER/VINYL parts.

If the inside of the carb is coverd in a white powder and the metal looks pitted at all, junk the carb and get a new one. It's oxidizing, and it won't stop once it starts.

If you are bringing the carb to a dealer to do it, for God's sake, have the numbers of your machine and engine on hand. Without numbers, the carb is just so much paperweight.

A Product I have used and has never failed me for cleaning carbs is HYDRO-SEAL II from the Gunk company. It comes in a 2 gallon bucket with a dunk seive. It's a mild acid (very mild) that will strip just about anything off your carb, including paint. Put the parts in the seive and let it sit for about an hour.

Remove the parts from the Hydro Seal and spray the hell out of it with the aerosol cleaner that you have now. Get into all the passages with the spray.
Install your carb kit. DON'T PLAY AROUND WITH THE OLD PARTS. Putting a kit in is the only way to go.

That being said, sometimes a kit is not economically feasable, or even available (Honda is notorious for not having carb kits). Buy individual parts if you think it's worth it. Some kits cost just as much as a new carb. If it's within a dollar range that you can handle, just replace the carb.

Reassemble your stuff, fill it up with (stabilized) fuel and go. Another thing to do if you can is put a fuel shut-off on the equipment if it doesn't have one.
Nothing worse than pulling a carb and getting gas all over yourself or on the ground. Not to mention wasting money on spilled fuel.

If you got this far, thanks for listening and good luck rebuilding.

[topsites]

Other notes; Do NOT leave fuel cans sitting in direct sunlight.
The heat makes the fuel boil, and cap or not this degrades it as well.

[Jay Ray]

I try to use stabilizer all season but sometimes neglect it. Your post will help me to stay with the program.

[Restrorob]

Spray cleaners in an aerosol can DON'T WORK



jkason,

That's a pretty bold statement there ^^^^^^ but I guess everyone has their own opinion.....

The average person does not need to spend money on a 1 or 2 gal can of soak just to clean one carb, I have a 5 gal bucket (not purchased by me) and hardly ever use it because I get better results from the spray cleaner (Gunk brand is junk) with a straw shot thru passages under pressure.
Thanks to the good Ole EPA no carb soaks work as they did 20 or so years ago.

Also, If a fuel container is stored in a enclosed building/trailer the last thing one wants to do is seal the container air tight. My 1 gal. container now holds almost 1 1/2 gals.......

[Breezmister]

A Product I have used and has never failed me for cleaning carbs is HYDRO-SEAL II from the Gunk company. It comes in a 2 gallon bucket with a dunk seive.


Okay, what does a can of this stuff cost ?
How many carbs can you do with it, average ?
How long would you say is the average time to soak a small 2 cycle carb ?
I'm not a fan of Gunk, sell me on this stuff.

[Jay19LM]

I use an aerosol cleaner 99% of the time. If your equipment was used last year, cleaning is not much of an issue. But, just this week I got a generator in that sat for 3 years with gas in it. I was going to replace the carb it was that bad. I soaked it in Hydro-Seal for 3 days and got the carb working fine. Different circumstances require different cleaners. I have never had a problem with plastic in Hydro-Seal, but rubber will swell up 10 times its size.
BTW. As for Honda carbs. You can buy a complete carburetor for about the same price as the bowl, float and float valve cost. Sometimes cheaper.....than the parts.

J19LM

[jondcoleman]

Any mechanics out there that would disagree with the statement about always using fuel stabilizer? Just curious. Thanks!

Thanks for the post by the way. I have the Hydro Seal stuff too and it works great!

Jon

[jkason]

Restro: I'll agree that the soaking chemicals are not as good as 20 years ago (even 10 years ago), and that it's not really cost effective unless you are a repair shop, or do a lot (a real lot) of carb rebuilds.

Breez: The can I bought this weekend cost $85.00, and you can do a butt-load of carbs in it before the fluid is too contaminated. (And the bucket is big enough to do a Holley 4-barrel.)

I have found that 2-cycle carbs can be cleaned with the spray cleaners (I have never had one bad enough to soak in the dunk cleaner), usually because the 2-cycle oil has stabilizer in it.

Jay: Yeah, I've had that happen too. Had a B&S carb from a Twin II that had to sit for a week, but it finally came clean. And yes, whole Honda carbs ARE cheaper than complete rebuild parts.

[LarryF]

I have an Exmark with a 23HP Kawasaki engine, Model No FH680V, Serial A32283. I also have the Exmark Operator's and Parts manuals and the Kawasaki Owner's manual; however, none of those documents show the carburetor parts or an exploded diagram of the carburetor. I'd like to have that info before I attempt all of the good things suggested in this thread. Can any of you gents direct me to a website that will provide them?

Thanks

[StevieZ]

www.buykawpower.com This website has parts breakdowns for the kawasaki engines, Just watch the spec number after the model. I used this site to figure out I had the wrong carb.

[Breezmister]

Breez: The can I bought this weekend cost $85.00, and you can do a butt-load of carbs in it before the fluid is too contaminated. (And the bucket is big enough to do a Holley 4-barrel.)

:laugh: Holley or not, 85 bucks isn't as bad as I thought. But for me to tell a customer it maybe 3 days to clean his carb, or a week for that matter, that won't float if all he has is that one trimmer or walkbehind.
Now for the commercial landscapers, this might be even more then cost effective because they could down a machine for a few days....and if they have a mechanic, he could spend the time on a carb. Most of the guys that come in here are one truck operations who can not afford 75 to 95 dollars an hour at the big dog shops. they need it fixed "now" :rolleyes:



I have found that 2-cycle carbs can be cleaned with the spray cleaners (I have never had one bad enough to soak in the dunk cleaner), usually because the 2-cycle oil has stabilizer in it.

I would agree with you if the problem is from fuel going bad, and I have very few 2 cycle units come in that have a fuel/carb problem. In fact, the carb is the last thing I check. I get a chuckle every time I see a post where someone tell someone to clean the carb on a trimmer or blower when it has a problem. A good quality 2 cycle oil will prevent a "stale" fuel problem.

With that being said :) I've seen some strange stuff in carbs, and the bigger carbs for walkbehinds/riders are easyer to clean and I will spend the time on those. 2 cycle carbs on the other hand, with passages that are alittle more then a **** hair wide, 1/2 an hour tops when it comes to cleaning them, for those that can wait, then it gets a new carb that I know will solve the problem.
I had a back pack blower come in last fall with a carb that had something akin to plastic in the carb. What ever it was, it dissolved in the fuel to get by the filter and then when it sat, it congealed. I have no idea what it was, but it did't take me long to think about just replacing the carb vs cleaning it.:rolleyes:

[LarryF]

www.buykawpower.com This website has parts breakdowns for the kawasaki engines, Just watch the spec number after the model. I used this site to figure out I had the wrong carb.

Thanks Steve,

I had some other literature that came with the mower that indicated my FH680V is a BS10. But after getting into that website, the dash number after FH680V were S01 through S36 so I chose S10. And then, to my surprise there were two categories of "carburetors", and within each category there are 3 different choices. So that means that I've narrowed the search down to 6 different carburetors that all look alike but are comprised of parts with different numbers. Kawasaki sure doesn't make it easy does it? How did you ever decide you had the wrong carb?. Well, this is ok, because I hope I don't have to order any parts. All I really wanted was to see how everything was assembled. When I looked at mine earlier today (but still mounted on the engine), I was puzzled because I didn't see a bowl under the carb. Now that I see the exploded views, it doesn't look like there is one. But there is a rectangular-shaped float chamber, so that answers at least one question that was in my mind.

[StevieZ]

I found I had the wrong carb by accident. The guy I bought the mower from said he replaced the carb and it still wouldn't run right. After checking some other things I pulled the carb apart to make sure it was clean, and on the jets are some numbers. I have an fb460v-ms14, so when I pulled up the breakdown there were 2 carbs on one sheet and by checking the spec number I saw the jets I had were for the ls-14 vs. ms-14.

It takes some time, but If you pull up the carb sheet for example, click on the part and it will pull up the effectivity. If those parts aren't for your spec number, try the other carb sheet. Now if you order from your dealer let him look up the parts because my dealer came up with a different number than what was on the website. My carb super seceded a few times.

Keep messing with the website, even my dealer said he still finds it tricky.

Steve

[scottr 2006]

:laugh: Holley or not, 85 bucks isn't as bad as I thought. But for me to tell a customer it maybe 3 days to clean his carb, or a week for that matter, that won't float if all he has is that one trimmer or walkbehind.
Now for the commercial landscapers, this might be even more then cost effective because they could down a machine for a few days....and if they have a mechanic, he could spend the time on a carb. Most of the guys that come in here are one truck operations who can not afford 75 to 95 dollars an hour at the big dog shops. they need it fixed "now" :rolleyes:





I would agree with you if the problem is from fuel going bad, and I have very few 2 cycle units come in that have a fuel/carb problem. In fact, the carb is the last thing I check. I get a chuckle every time I see a post where someone tell someone to clean the carb on a trimmer or blower when it has a problem. A good quality 2 cycle oil will prevent a "stale" fuel problem.

With that being said :) I've seen some strange stuff in carbs, and the bigger carbs for walkbehinds/riders are easyer to clean and I will spend the time on those. 2 cycle carbs on the other hand, with passages that are alittle more then a **** hair wide, 1/2 an hour tops when it comes to cleaning them, for those that can wait, then it gets a new carb that I know will solve the problem.
I had a back pack blower come in last fall with a carb that had something akin to plastic in the carb. What ever it was, it dissolved in the fuel to get by the filter and then when it sat, it congealed. I have no idea what it was, but it did't take me long to think about just replacing the carb vs cleaning it.:rolleyes:

Breezemister, I've read where using a plastic milk jug for a gas can cause the plastic in the carb problem.

[Breezmister]

Breezemister, I've read where using a plastic milk jug for a gas can cause the plastic in the carb problem.

This would not surprise me. Back when I worked for TGLC , you where not allowed to carry gas in a plastic bottle (milk or soda) you had a long walk back to the truck and trailer to refuel. Another problem I've seen, is when some one loose the rubber gasket to the gas cap, they will take a plastic bag, fold it over a few times and screw the cap down on the tank to stop the fuel from leaking it out.
Considering that plastic is made from oil, I can see that gas would dissolved the plastic.

[LarryF]

I found I had the wrong carb by accident. The guy I bought the mower from said he replaced the carb and it still wouldn't run right. After checking some other things I pulled the carb apart to make sure it was clean, and on the jets are some numbers. I have an fb460v-ms14, so when I pulled up the breakdown there were 2 carbs on one sheet and by checking the spec number I saw the jets I had were for the ls-14 vs. ms-14.

It takes some time, but If you pull up the carb sheet for example, click on the part and it will pull up the effectivity. If those parts aren't for your spec number, try the other carb sheet. Now if you order from your dealer let him look up the parts because my dealer came up with a different number than what was on the website. My carb super seceded a few times.

Keep messing with the website, even my dealer said he still finds it tricky.

Steve

You indicated you could distinguish on that website you provided the difference between an fb460v-ms14 and an ls14. But on the sheet I saw for my FH680V-BS10 were numbers like
H680V-_S01

FH680V-_S04

FH680V-_S05

FH680V-_S06

FH680V-_S07

FH680V-_S08

FH680V-_S09

FH680V-_S10, etc.,

and there was also another sheet with more but similar numbers. So I had interpreted the underscore to be a wild card. But when I clicked on the FH680V-_S10, I found a couple of carburetor specs, but no mention of a BS10. So I agree with your statement that it looks like it will take some time to decipher this one. Thanks again.

[jkason]

:laugh: Holley or not, 85 bucks isn't as bad as I thought. But for me to tell a customer it maybe 3 days to clean his carb, or a week for that matter, that won't float if all he has is that one trimmer or walkbehind.
Now for the commercial landscapers, this might be even more then cost effective because they could down a machine for a few days....and if they have a mechanic, he could spend the time on a carb. Most of the guys that come in here are one truck operations who can not afford 75 to 95 dollars an hour at the big dog shops. they need it fixed "now" :rolleyes:

It is my experience that a 3-day soak would be good for something that has sat around for a few years with gas it it.
Usually, carbs are done soaking after an hour.

If my customers can't wait the hour, they are welcome to bankrupt my competition.

If they are in the business, they should have a backup unit as insurance.

[DavidR]

What kind of stabalizer do you recommend? I have been using Sta-bil, is there anything that would be more effective?

[jkason]

Sta-Bil is good. (petroleum based)
I'm partial to the stuff Brigss & Stratton sells. (mineral based)

[GravelyNut]

It is my experience that a 3-day soak would be good for something that has sat around for a few years with gas it it.
Usually, carbs are done soaking after an hour.

If my customers can't wait the hour, they are welcome to bankrupt my competition.

If they are in the business, they should have a backup unit as insurance.

Normally an hour in the soak and shake tank cleans the carbs. But on recent occasions, 2 different Kohler carbs required more than a day's soaking each. Both carbs were off of Kohler Magnum 20s. Both wouldn't run right after the first day's cleaning. #1 took 2.5 days, #2 took 2 full days. All others have cleaned up in an hour with the same fluid.

[Cooter]

Mercury Power Tune. The best carb cleaner you can buy. It will dissolve anything.

[jkason]

Normally an hour in the soak and shake tank cleans the carbs. But on recent occasions, 2 different Kohler carbs required more than a day's soaking each. Both carbs were off of Kohler Magnum 20s. Both wouldn't run right after the first day's cleaning. #1 took 2.5 days, #2 took 2 full days. All others have cleaned up in an hour with the same fluid.

I don't have that kind of patience. Nor do my customers.
I tell my customers right up front that a soak in the dunk tank might not work, and then (in addition to the carb kit) they will need to buy a new carburetor.

[GravelyNut]

I don't have that kind of patience. Nor do my customers.
I tell my customers right up front that a soak in the dunk tank might not work, and then (in addition to the carb kit) they will need to buy a new carburetor.

Nice thing about the tank is once you put the carb in and start it, you forget about it till you're ready to remove it.